Proposal: Filip Forsberg to Toronto

[Deadly Dogma]

Yeah, I'm not seeing a lot here worth trading our best forward for (Robertson is nice, but Forsberg plays with size, I'd hate to swap that for a skilled undersized guy). Also, Poile is very averse to retaining on players at all, so it would be more likely we'd taken on some short-term salary in a deal. (not that I think Forsberg is likely to get traded either way).

I had a brain fart and thought it was for Rakell, OBV Forseberg would cost more than what I offered.

 

[Deadly Dogma]

Soup has requested a trade (reducing his value) and just came off a season where he scored 7 goals and 17pts (0.3 ppg) and Kase has played 88 games over the past 4 seasons. Neither player carries value in this type of deal (maybe Soup has 3rd round value). The retention alone would cost an asset then you need to pay for the player. This seems like an extremely light offer.

For what ever reason I was thinking Rakell not Forsberg

 

[Barnaby]

That's a lot to give up for TML... The only way it might make sense is if you have a deal more or less worked out to extend Forsberg then deal Marner after next season -giving you a season of both - in a sperate trade to recoup assets and shed some salary.

 

[mouser]

Toronto gets Filip Forsberg at 50% retention (3,000,000)




Nashville gets Ilya Mikheyev, Ondrej Kase,2022 1st round pick, and Nick Robertson or Amirov ( I'd personally rather trade Robertson)


This trade works for both teams Toronto wants to win the cup now and this helps them and for the Preds they should be entering a retool/rebuild so this trade should help their futures.

Toronto planning to run a 20 player roster all season?

 

[ponder]

If FF had 2 years left, I’d be down, but it’s a bit too much for a rental. Amirov and Robertson are 2 of our top 3 prospects. Giving up one of them, and a 1st, and 2 serviceable forwards (Mik/Kase) … too high a price for a rental.

It’s close, I don’t think it’s a bad proposal or anything, just a bit too costly. Amirov-or-Robertson and that 1st are going to be super important cheap-but-good pieces for us over the coming years.

I will admit that this roster looks sexy:

Forsberg - Matthews - Nylander
Ritchie - Tavares - Marner
Kerfoot - Kampf - Bunting
<arguable> - Spezza - Simmonds

But after this year, this deal leaves us in somewhat rough shape - it’s an “all in” kind of move.

 

[canuckslover10]

If FF had 2 years left, I’d be did, but it’s a bit too much for a rental. Amirov and Robertson are 2 of our top 3 prospects. Giving up one of them, and a 1st, and 2 serviceable forwards (Mik/Kase) … too high a price for a rental.

It’s close, I don’t think it’s a bad proposal or anything, just a bit too costly. Amirov-or-Robertson and that 1st are going to be super important cheap-but-good pieces for us over the coming years.

I will admit that this roster looks sexy:

Forsberg - Matthews - Nylander
Ritchie - Tavares - Marner
Kerfoot - Kampf - Bunting
<arguable> - Spezza - Simmonds

But after this year, this deal leaves us in somewhat rough shape - it’s an “all in” kind of move.

To me if Dubas wants to keep his job and really believes in this core as he has been saying all along, then right now is a time to go all in, heck they can make the move now so Forsberg can get acclimated with the team and find his spot in the lineup. Also I'd find it hard to believe that this team doesn't win atleast a round if the top 6 plays like they should, actually I'd go as far as saying if the top 6 could play to it's capabilities then I could legitimately see them winning a cup this year tbh.

 

[johnnybbadd]

How is Kase in a trade proposal when he literally just signed and hasn’t even been to camp yet? Which sane player would want to come and sign with a GM that would do that? Leafs can’t keep trading prospects and young players for rentals that they won’t be able to sign for the medium to long term. If Reilly goes and Tavares begins his decline after this year the Leafs will be Chicago post 2016 very quickly.

 

[ponder]

To me if Dubas wants to keep his job and really believes in this core as he has been saying all along, then right now is a time to go all in, heck they can make the move now so Forsberg can get acclimated with the team and find his spot in the lineup. Also I'd find it hard to believe that this team doesn't win atleast a round if the top 6 plays like they should, actually I'd go as far as saying if the top 6 could play to it's capabilities then I could legitimately see them winning a cup this year tbh.

Yeah, I do think Forsberg at 50% retained would be a very nice piece for the Leafs, the question is whether he’s worth the price. It’s rare to see an Amirov/Robertson level prospect traded for a pure rental, nevermind a prospect like that and a 1st. For example, last trade deadline Taylor Hall (50% retained) went for just Bjork and a 2nd.

I’m trying to think of the last time a pure rental returned an Amirov/Robertson level prospect AND a 1st, but nothing is immediately springing to mind. Hossa to the Pens, Jeff Carter to the Kings, Iggy to the Pens, all returned a 1st, but none returned an Amirov/Robertson level prospect. It’s a heavy price.

I think the Leafs would wait until closer to the deadline to make a deal like this - make sure that the team is healthy and playing at a high level before committing. And even then, I think the price would have to be a bit lower. For example, someone like Liljegren or Knies instead of Amirov or Robertson. At the deadline, if we’re looking like a legit contender, I’d do Liljegren-or-Knies, 1st, Mikheyev and Kase for Forsberg (50% retained).

 

[McJedi]

I don't really have strong enough interest to go any higher than that

That’s good because Neither does Anaheim.

 

[TheScandal89]

The Leafs shouldn't be trading any more 1sts, or if they did, it should at least be conditional on playoff games played by the player or rounds won.

Can they even trade Kase after signing him? That'd be a dick move to trade a guy who just signed and probably bought property here now. Not really encouraging for potential future signings.

 

[Boondock]

For what ever reason I was thinking Rakell not Forsberg

But even for Rakell, the return needs to make sense for the Ducks. In your proposal, the Ducks take on Soup (1.645), Kase (1.25) and 50% retention on Rakell (1.89) so this deal costs the Ducks $4.789, so the Ducks increase their cap by $1million and don’t get any real assets other than the first. In return they get a late 1st and 2 worse wingers that don’t actually improve the team. If this is the deal, the ducks are better keeping Rakell until the deadline and trading him for just a 1st or with retention for additional assets

 

[Tarmore]

Toronto gets Filip Forsberg at 50% retention (3,000,000)




Nashville gets Ilya Mikheyev, Ondrej Kase,2022 1st round pick, and Nick Robertson or Amirov ( I'd personally rather trade Robertson)


This trade works for both teams Toronto wants to win the cup now and this helps them and for the Preds they should be entering a retool/rebuild so this trade should help their futures.

Dear got that is horrible for the Leafs

 

[Adam da bomb]

Yeah, I do think Forsberg at 50% retained would be a very nice piece for the Leafs, the question is whether he’s worth the price. It’s rare to see an Amirov/Robertson level prospect traded for a pure rental, nevermind a prospect like that and a 1st. For example, last trade deadline Taylor Hall (50% retained) went for just Bjork and a 2nd.

I’m trying to think of the last time a pure rental returned an Amirov/Robertson level prospect AND a 1st, but nothing is immediately springing to mind. Hossa to the Pens, Jeff Carter to the Kings, Iggy to the Pens, all returned a 1st, but none returned an Amirov/Robertson level prospect. It’s a heavy price.

I think the Leafs would wait until closer to the deadline to make a deal like this - make sure that the team is healthy and playing at a high level before committing. And even then, I think the price would have to be a bit lower. For example, someone like Liljegren or Knies instead of Amirov or Robertson. At the deadline, if we’re looking like a legit contender, I’d do Liljegren-or-Knies, 1st, Mikheyev and Kase for Forsberg (50% retained).

On the other hand Taylor Hall had a move clause you’d be competing with the rest of the league for Forsberg. Better to compare to the Stone trade where Stone made it clear he wouldn’t resign in Ottawa. Forsberg hasn’t. Which returned a second and Brannstrom. Now add 50% retention so upgrade that 2nd to a 1st.

 

[ponder]

On the other hand Taylor Hall had a move clause you’d be competing with the rest of the league for Forsberg. Better to compare to the Stone trade where Stone made it clear he wouldn’t resign in Ottawa. Forsberg hasn’t. Which returned a second and Brannstrom. Now add 50% retention so upgrade that 2nd to a 1st.

Good point about Hall, but Stone is/was quite a bit better than Forsberg. Stone was coming off back-to-back seasons over 1PPG, Forsberg has never hit 1PPG. More significantly, Stone is absolutely elite defensively, arguably the top defensive winger in the league, while Forsberg is more average. The year Stone was dealt, he came in a fairly close 2nd in Selke voting, and was the only winger in the top 13 in Selke votes, elite defensive prowess like that is very valuable. They’re different level players - Stone is one of the top handful of wingers in the league, Forsberg is really good, but not THAT good.

I think Forsberg with retention is worth at most the same as Stone, probably a bit less. “The same” would be something like Amirov-or-Robertson and a 2nd, or Liljegren-or-Knies and a 1st. I think that’s roughly the upper end of what Forsberg with retention would be worth in a trade.

Also, as a more minor point, Vegas had space to re-sign Stone, which would make them feel much better about giving up a quality prospect like Brannstrom. For Toronto, Forsberg would definitely be a pure rental.

 

[Ciao]

Well considering the leafs are in a win now mode I think this would be worth it for them even if it is for a year, especially if they win the cup which they would have a better chance of doing if they have Forsberg.

No thanks.

Not interested in selling the future for another flash in the pan. Been there. Done that more than enough times already

 

[Ciao]

i know but i'm a habs fan and i love seeing toronto hand out firsts and their good prospects for 10-15 game stints . eventually i would think the leafs would stop that but they keep doing it

You would think so, wouldn't you?

The Leafs are much too far away from the Stanley Cup to do short-term boosts.

They need to buckle down and get back to building the team with long-term success in mind.

 

[Adam da bomb]

Good point about Hall, but Stone is/was quite a bit better than Forsberg. Stone was coming off back-to-back seasons over 1PPG, Forsberg has never hit 1PPG. More significantly, Stone is absolutely elite defensively, arguably the top defensive winger in the league, while Forsberg is more average. They’re different level players - Stone is one of the top handful of wingers in the league, Forsberg is really good, but not THAT good.

I think Forsberg with retention is worth at most the same as Stone, probably a bit less. “The same” would be something like Amirov-or-Robertson and a 2nd, or Liljegren-or-Knies and a 1st. I think that’s roughly the upper end of what Forsberg with retention would be worth in a trade.

Also, as a more minor point, Vegas had space to re-sign Stone, which would make them feel much better about giving up a quality prospect like Brannstrom. For Toronto, Forsberg would definitely be a pure rental.

All good points but the Toronto management's moves the previous years suggest that they are trying to go all in. I'd personally rate Brannstrom ahead of both of those guys at the time. Many may disagree, but that is my take. As well Brannstrom played the more valuable position. So Robertson a second and a late pick like a 5th. I pretty much made the post to suggest Stone was the better comparable in terms of situations.

 

[ponder]

All good points but the Toronto management's moves the previous years suggest that they are trying to go all in. I'd personally rate Brannstrom ahead of both of those guys at the time. Many may disagree, but that is my take. As well Brannstrom played the more valuable position. So Robertson a second and a late pick like a 5th. I pretty much made the post to suggest Stone was the better comparable in terms of situations.

Yeah it was a quality post, my disagreement is very minor. I’d strongly consider something around Robertson-or-Amirov + 2nd or Liljegren + 1st. Just feel that Robertson-or-Amirov + 1st is a bit too high.

As for Brannstrom vs. Robertson vs. Amirov, I can see rating Brannstrom (at the time of the trade) 1st in that group … or 2nd, or 3rd. They’re all on very similar levels IMO, very hard to predict how that group shakes out.

 

[AvroArrow]

Forsberg is great but that price is way too high for a rental. Robertson helps the leafs compete this year and for the next few. Forsberg is a rental, that's a massive price for a rental player. Leafs need Robertson more than they need Forsberg. Good young player on a cheap contract for the next couple years, that helps this team compete more than Forsberg at 3M for one year.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

Not too many Nashville voices here... but I'd also defer on the OP offer. A 1st+Amirov at least gets you to the table. Don't bother offering us any of the rest of the stuff. But that 1st+Amirov doesn't automatically win, I'd still shop around.

 

[dredeye]

Toronto gets Filip Forsberg at 50% retention (3,000,000)




Nashville gets Ilya Mikheyev, Ondrej Kase,2022 1st round pick, and Nick Robertson or Amirov ( I'd personally rather trade Robertson)


This trade works for both teams Toronto wants to win the cup now and this helps them and for the Preds they should be entering a retool/rebuild so this trade should help their futures.

Teams generally don’t sign a player and trade him before the season even starts.

 

[Stimpythecat]

Toronto is at 23 contracts and almost $1.4 million over the cap. Including roster players in a trade means they will have to be replaced or with the trade as is, go with a 20 man roster or get another team to retain 50% again to make the cap hit $1.5 million.

 

[Jerkbait]

Toronto gets Filip Forsberg at 50% retention (3,000,000)




Nashville gets Ilya Mikheyev, Ondrej Kase,2022 1st round pick, and Nick Robertson or Amirov ( I'd personally rather trade Robertson)


This trade works for both teams Toronto wants to win the cup now and this helps them and for the Preds they should be entering a retool/rebuild so this trade should help their futures.

Meh...not bad. One of the better proposals in a while. Toronto would accept even though its a high price tag.

 

[GoldOnGold]

If Forsberg isn't going to re-sign with us I would definitely consider a trade centered on Robertson.

 

[Guttersniped]

But even for Rakell, the return needs to make sense for the Ducks. In your proposal, the Ducks take on Soup (1.645), Kase (1.25) and 50% retention on Rakell (1.89) so this deal costs the Ducks $4.789, so the Ducks increase their cap by $1million and don’t get any real assets other than the first. In return they get a late 1st and 2 worse wingers that don’t actually improve the team. If this is the deal, the ducks are better keeping Rakell until the deadline and trading him for just a 1st or with retention for additional assets

Why would the Ducks, of all teams, take Kase back when they dumped his ass because they knew he couldn’t stay healthy? And were right?