F Ivan Miroshnichenko (2022, 20th, WSH)

[Caser]

 

[SoundAndFury]

I must say the kid picked it up lately, maybe not getting selected to the WJC team actually worked out for the best for him.

 

[Caser]

 

[Osakahaus]

What was even the defense doing there? He just busts right past them and has an open chance on the goalie.

 

[Atas2000]

What was even the defense doing there? He just busts right past them and has an open chance on the goalie.

If I had a penny every time people come up with this kind of a comment.

 

[Zapp]

Hope he continues the upward trend. Would like to see him put himself back in contention for top 5 but he's got a ton of competition.

 

[wings5]

Hope he continues the upward trend. Would like to see him put himself back in contention for top 5 but he's got a ton of competition.

Hockey IQ questions is a pretty big red flag to me regardless of the other tools one possesses. Sometimes they are overblown, but often they have merit. Miro is a classic boom or bust type.

 

[NHL Dude 120]

What are your thoughts on a second line of

Miroshnichenko-Stutzle-Greig

 

[Caser]

Interesting that one scout in Bob McKenzie's survey had Miroshnichenko as #1:

Nevertheless, only one scout surveyed by TSN actually took the leap and dropped Wright from the No. 1 spot, putting Russian winger Ivan Miroshnichenko at the top of his mid-season rankings.
“[Wright] was great coming out of the U-18s last year but it was a really small sample size,” the scout said. “I have concerns for his lack of dominance this season. For me, Miroshnichenko has a higher ceiling.”

Russian winger Miroshnichenko — who got the only other No. 1 vote besides Wright — is No. 6 on TSN’s list. Another scout, though, ranked him just outside the first round. No other top prospect had such a wide variance, although the other nine scouts had Miroshnichenko solidly in the top 10.
He’s a strong skater with a sturdy build and very good offensive instincts to go with an outstanding NHL-ready shot.

 

[Fantomas]

What are your thoughts on a second line of

Miroshnichenko-Stutzle-Greig

I would feel bad for Stutzle.

 

[NHL Dude 120]

I would feel bad for Stutzle.

How so?

 

[CoSi]

Has he looked as good as he's producing recently? He's getting hot and already has a goal today.

 

[Osakahaus]

From what I hear, is his "Hockey IQ" any good? That might be important to look at

 

[wetcoast]

If I had a penny every time people come up with this kind of a comment.

What he said was true though.

And at least make it worth your while and make it a dime, it's not common enough to get a penny for.

 

[Atas2000]

What he said was true though.

And at least make it worth your while and make it a dime, it's not common enough to get a penny for.

I am not greedy and I see those stupid comments all the time. They are stupid. Every goal is somebody's mistake. In the NHL or anywhere in the world.

 

[wetcoast]

I am not greedy and I see those stupid comments all the time. They are stupid. Every goal is somebody's mistake. In the NHL or anywhere in the world.

No sometimes defenses do everything they can and offensive players make great plays.


Well there were 2 men both puck watching, one could at least say it was a great burst of speed (it was) and driving to the net hard (which he did) but defensively that was just extremely poor.

The higher you go up in the level of hockey the lesser the mistakes as well.

 

[Osakahaus]

I am not greedy and I see those stupid comments all the time. They are stupid. Every goal is somebody's mistake. In the NHL or anywhere in the world.

still think it's insane seeing the defense not even covering on that side of the ice. Impressive yes, but the defense will not be that open in the NHL.

 

[Atas2000]

No sometimes defenses do everything they can and offensive players make great plays.


Well there were 2 men both puck watching, one could at least say it was a great burst of speed (it was) and driving to the net hard (which he did) but defensively that was just extremely poor.

The higher you go up in the level of hockey the lesser the mistakes as well.

Perfect defence means no goals can be scored. Every goal is somebody's mistake. Some forwards are able to force the D to make mistakes and look bad too. People who make those comments forget that too. Kharlamov was slicing through the best defencemen who looked like fools who can't defend. It does not mean those were bad defencemen or that they made an awful play every time. Sometimes when it looks like the defencemen are not covering or are out of position this is exactly because the forwards are that good.

And I do see this kind of pplay happen in the NHL. Let's not pretend like NHL defencemen aren't making mistakes.

 

[Hanji]

still think it's insane seeing the defense not even covering on that side of the ice. Impressive yes, but the defense will not be that open in the NHL.

What? If I had a dollar for every time an NHLer was caught way out of position I'd be a billionare.
Skilled NHLers make other NHLers look like baffoons all the time.

But the key here is relative skill level and projection. Here Miroshcnichenko was blowing by adults in the VHL. If he keeps developing and maintains his pace relative to his upper-tier peers, he'll likely be blowing by NHLers in the future too.

 

[Osakahaus]

What? If I had a dollar for every time an NHLer was caught way out of position I'd be a billionare.
Skilled NHLers make other NHLers look like baffoons all the time.

But the key here is relative skill level and projection. Here Miroshcnichenko was blowing by adults in the VHL. If he keeps developing and maintains his pace relative to his upper-tier peers, he'll likely be blowing by NHLers in the future too.

So long as he keeps growing that hockey IQ, he'll be a good player in the KHL, and hopefully the NHL.

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

I've seen some rankings where Miro is ranked 4th

1. Savoie
2. Lambert
3. Wright
4. Miroschichenko

I've seen some where he's ranked 6th

6. Miroschichenko

 

[SoundAndFury]

still think it's insane seeing the defense not even covering on that side of the ice. Impressive yes, but the defense will not be that open in the NHL.

Wasn't there a thread yesterday about how Severson made a similarly terrible defensive play and is the worst defenseman who has ever lived? And that's meanwhile the guy plays 25+ minutes per night for the Devils.

 

[wings5]

The thing I often wonder with Miroschnichenko is if he spent enough time in MHL juniors . He played limited games there last year . I wonder if playing in the VHL almost exclusively like he is doing this season is better for him than getting some more MHL games mixed in .

 

[Osakahaus]

Wasn't there a thread yesterday about how Severson made a similarly terrible defensive play and is the worst defenseman who has ever lived? And that's meanwhile the guy plays 25+ minutes per night for the Devils.

to be very fair, Severson is very poor but not the worst. dude just gets hung out to die on NJ

 

[JadedRandom]

Hockey IQ questions is a pretty big red flag to me regardless of the other tools one possesses. Sometimes they are overblown, but often they have merit. Miro is a classic boom or bust type.

From what I hear, is his "Hockey IQ" any good? That might be important to look at

[QUOTE="RZAty, post: 182610193, member: 332884"]So long as he keeps growing that hockey IQ, he'll be a good player in the KHL, and hopefully the NHL.[/QUOTE]

I've watched a couple of Miro's games earlier last year, also watched his four most-recent games in the VHL (courtesy of Instat) and I personally find that the "questionable hockey IQ" tag doesn't and shouldn't apply to him.

On the powerplay Miro gets primarily used either on the right point as a pass/shot option, or on the left side near the faceoffs circle to one-time the puck. His role there is primarily that of a sniper (since his one-timer is probably the draft's best) and thus he will only rarely be the primary puck distributor (just FYI, I believe he could be if it was what the team wanted out of him), which might affect how people might view him.

I also saw Miro play the PK extensively in the games I watched and he showed zero, and I do mean 0 lack of hockey sense there either. He wasn't always in good position defensively in the games I watched, nor was he overly physical, but Miroshnichenko showed a really good understanding of passing and shooting lanes as a forward and anticipated the play well during PKs. That, to me, is a sign of hockey sense.

Then you add in the plethora of good decisions Miro takes with the puck in the offensive zone, his lobbed passes that are really good and well-placed, some creative puck placement and one-touch passes in transition and you've got a player that just doesn't have "problems with hockey IQ" as some have said.

The only thing that might constitute "hockey IQ problems" with him is that he is not the most creative forward I've ever seen out there, just a sniper that likes to shoot, has nice mitts, nice puck possession and generally makes good plays with the puck. He will deke you with speed, make the subtle and important puck possession plays, will consistently use defensemen as makeshift cover to shoot, but he won't go through 2 people with god-level hands and then pass the puck to a miraculously-free teammate to get the assist ala Datsyuk. It's just not Miro's game.

And if you consider that to be "hockey IQ problems" then 99% of the players in this draft have the same problems.

I don't mean to be insulting, everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I just can't understand how people could ascribe such a weakness to a guy like Miro.

If you don't believe me then watch for yourself.



If Miro doesn't get selected in the top-10 then somebody is getting a really good deal on their draft pick investment. If he gets selected after the 20th pick then he is a borderline steal of a pick.

It might be a stretch, but I could see Miro pulling out a Tarasenko-like career when all is said and done.