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Prospect Info: F Isak Rosen (14th Overall, 2021), Assigned 11.26.2024

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Bendium said:
Hard to shoot when half your time will be spent on your arse. Dude is soooooooo small that he actually has negative physicality and a girls chin. He is supposedly 5'11" but he is very slight in his bone build so it could take a couple more years to put on enough weight to not get totally caved in the NHL. I hope I eat a monster bowl of crow, but I did not like this pick when it was made and it looks even worse to me now. My greatest hope for Rosen in that another team desperate for a high skill smurf prospect values him enough to get our 1st round value back out in a trade. I would trade him straight up right now for a 2023 1st and try again.
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I'm sure you're built like Brad Pitt.
 
I'd say he reminds me of a very lite Kucherov in how he plays. Puck comes on and off his stick quickly, looks lazy but does move well through all three zones. Has a really nice snap shot, and plays well from the circles.

The problem is, if Kuch wasn't a super superstar, he would be criticized to a much higher degree.

Rosen needs to consistently produce to not fall into some harsh criticism due to his overall play style. The nice thing? He has all the skill to be a top 6/top line offensive threat.
 
Dingo44 said:
I'm sure you're built like Brad Pitt.
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lol.....not anymore. :P ....but then I am not a pro hockey prospect either. If you are saying his size is not his fault, your right. If you are saying his size therefore doesn't matter, then you're wrong.

Its not like on facebook where all the millenials and Gen Y just support each other no matter what, and everyone has value and matters, and chubby whinny redheads get to be captains of starships. This is pro sports, and real survival of the fittest occurs, and there are no participation trophies. You either make the cut or you don't. You either WIN, or you don't.

Want the Sabres to win more?

Raise the damn bar!
 
Are we still talking about Isak Rosen? Because he's not burning down the AHL but he's doing well and probably won't get called up any time soon. We all love good value moves but seems early to condemn him to mediocrity.
 
Gabrielor said:
He reminds me of Olofsson, but faster.
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He does have a quality release and also has the ability to track pucks by having better speed that Olofsson couldn't/can't. A nice example is the assist on the Rosen goal in the twitter vids - the puck goes past him and he catches the defenseman by his burst to track that down and create space and time for the guys filing in on the rush behind him.

I wasn't trying to start some controversy, just wanted to acknowledge he's also had an uptick in his play often independent of Kulich if anyone thinks he's coat tailing on Kulich's increase production.

Unrelated to the complaints, I am curious at Appert's comments on working with training staff who are capable of adding lean muscle in-season. They have been rotating Kisakov in and out with mention of them working on his body to get bigger/stronger. I wonder if that is also afoot with Rosen and how much success they're having there.
 
Chainshot said:
He does have a quality release and also has the ability to track pucks by having better speed that Olofsson couldn't/can't. A nice example is the assist on the Rosen goal in the twitter vids - the puck goes past him and he catches the defenseman by his burst to track that down and create space and time for the guys filing in on the rush behind him.

I wasn't trying to start some controversy, just wanted to acknowledge he's also had an uptick in his play often independent of Kulich if anyone thinks he's coat tailing on Kulich's increase production.

Unrelated to the complaints, I am curious at Appert's comments on working with training staff who are capable of adding lean muscle in-season. They have been rotating Kisakov in and out with mention of them working on his body to get bigger/stronger. I wonder if that is also afoot with Rosen and how much success they're having there.
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One other way of doing this is stop drafting guys that are 5'10" 175 lbs or less with slight body types that is harder to put weight on. Size does not = skill, but it needs to have a place in the value assessment, because a guy that has a little less skill/production, but is 6'3" 190 lbs is much more likely to make it.
 
Bendium said:
One other way of doing this is stop drafting guys that are 5'10" 175 lbs or less with slight body types that is harder to put weight on. Size does not = skill, but it needs to have a place in the value assessment, because a guy that has a little less skill/production, but is 6'3" 190 lbs is much more likely to make it.
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In looking at the order of operations, Rosen was drafted before the rest of the small set.
 
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Bendium said:
lol.....not anymore. :P ....but then I am not a pro hockey prospect either. If you are saying his size is not his fault, your right. If you are saying his size therefore doesn't matter, then you're wrong.

Its not like on facebook where all the millenials and Gen Y just support each other no matter what, and everyone has value and matters, and chubby whinny redheads get to be captains of starships. This is pro sports, and real survival of the fittest occurs, and there are no participation trophies. You either make the cut or you don't. You either WIN, or you don't.

Want the Sabres to win more?

Raise the damn bar!
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You know there’s no swimsuit portion of the NHL right?
 
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Watched the Amerks win over Utica and Rosen was the best forward on the ice. It was pretty clear he was dialed in early - about 90 seconds in, he's calling for the puck at center ice as the Amerks break out, takes the puck and gets a clean look for a shot on Schmidt. He had 7 shots on goal for the game and while the 2nd goal was puck luck, it was him putting the puck into a dangerous area (he was trying to pass out to the net front and it struck a defender and went in). His "clean" goal was similar to the other chance - grab the puck, fly up the LW side and snap it home. Kulich's growth accelerated earlier, but these last couple of weeks, it seems like Rosen is stepping up and stepping forward as well.
 
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Granted he's had a solid developmental year (and very good second half) - does anyone else think Rosen ends up the odd man out from the Savoie/Kulich/Rosen group?

I'm just not sure how or when he breaks into our lineup as we all hope it becomes better, tougher, and more experienced from here on out.

He'd be a top two prospect in the majority of pools around the league and might crack the NHL next year on a lesser team. I imagine packaging him with a 2nd could get us the top 4 D we all want.
 
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HOOats said:
Granted he's had a solid developmental year (and very good second half) - does anyone else think Rosen ends up the odd man out from the Savoie/Kulich/Rosen group?

I'm just not sure how or when he breaks into our lineup as we all hope it becomes better, tougher, and more experienced from here on out.

He'd be a top two prospect in the majority of pools around the league and might crack the NHL next year on a lesser team. I imagine packaging him with a 2nd could get us the top 4 D we all want.
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It kind of does seem like the case for him. I bought the AHL TV pass to watch Rochester this year and for my money Rosen has been their best player (yes, over Kulich). He can be frustrating at times but he oozes skill. There’s an argument to be made that he’s the best skater and has the best shot on the team. Plus he has a very high hockey IQ. But I’m still always left wanting more - tough to put my finger on it. I guess the best way to put it is that he doesn’t have much “dog” in his game. When the puck finds its way to his stick, he’s incredible with it. But he’s not going to do much of the work to get that puck on his stick, if that makes sense.

I remember reading the Black Book scouting report on him, and the conclusion was pretty much that he will be a productive, point producing guy at the NHL level but his game is not made at all for the playoffs. Which - to your point - makes me wonder if he’s the odd man out. I wouldn’t want to give him away for nothing though, he is and should be viewed as a valuable trade piece.
 
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RefsIdeas said:
It kind of does seem like the case for him. I bought the AHL TV pass to watch Rochester this year and for my money Rosen has been their best player (yes, over Kulich). He can be frustrating at times but he oozes skill. There’s an argument to be made that he’s the best skater and has the best shot on the team. Plus he has a very high hockey IQ. But I’m still always left wanting more - tough to put my finger on it. I guess the best way to put it is that he doesn’t have much “dog” in his game. When the puck finds its way to his stick, he’s incredible with it. But he’s not going to do much of the work to get that puck on his stick, if that makes sense.

I remember reading the Black Book scouting report on him, and the conclusion was pretty much that he will be a productive, point producing guy at the NHL level but his game is not made at all for the playoffs. Which - to your point - makes me wonder if he’s the odd man out. I wouldn’t want to give him away for nothing though, he is and should be viewed as a valuable trade piece.
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Here comes the playoffs - let's see what he brings. Maybe this is where he'll surprise you.
 
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RefsIdeas said:
It kind of does seem like the case for him. I bought the AHL TV pass to watch Rochester this year and for my money Rosen has been their best player (yes, over Kulich). He can be frustrating at times but he oozes skill. There’s an argument to be made that he’s the best skater and has the best shot on the team. Plus he has a very high hockey IQ. But I’m still always left wanting more - tough to put my finger on it. I guess the best way to put it is that he doesn’t have much “dog” in his game. When the puck finds its way to his stick, he’s incredible with it. But he’s not going to do much of the work to get that puck on his stick, if that makes sense.

I remember reading the Black Book scouting report on him, and the conclusion was pretty much that he will be a productive, point producing guy at the NHL level but his game is not made at all for the playoffs. Which - to your point - makes me wonder if he’s the odd man out. I wouldn’t want to give him away for nothing though, he is and should be viewed as a valuable trade piece.
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...so Petr Bondra?
 
RefsIdeas said:
It kind of does seem like the case for him. I bought the AHL TV pass to watch Rochester this year and for my money Rosen has been their best player (yes, over Kulich). He can be frustrating at times but he oozes skill. There’s an argument to be made that he’s the best skater and has the best shot on the team. Plus he has a very high hockey IQ. But I’m still always left wanting more - tough to put my finger on it. I guess the best way to put it is that he doesn’t have much “dog” in his game. When the puck finds its way to his stick, he’s incredible with it. But he’s not going to do much of the work to get that puck on his stick, if that makes sense.

I remember reading the Black Book scouting report on him, and the conclusion was pretty much that he will be a productive, point producing guy at the NHL level but his game is not made at all for the playoffs. Which - to your point - makes me wonder if he’s the odd man out. I wouldn’t want to give him away for nothing though, he is and should be viewed as a valuable trade piece.
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Solid points. I like that he's putting in the work on his side of the puck, not blowing the zone early and he's very dedicated in his own zone to being back. They may not keep to firm roles, but the amount of times he is the deep forward in their own zone, collapsing to cover the net front as the defense is under pressure puts him in disruptive positions that only one other of their prospect forwards does and that's Kozak who we would expect it from. Kulich has a long way to go in regards to his defensive responsibilities on wing, even more so when he's lined up at center. Rosen is the more complete player in that regard right now.

Luckily, we're about to see how they fare in the North Division playoffs which is a war physically. We'll have a better feel for where they stand when this run ends.
 
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I never would have thought Krebs would evolve into the player that he is. I'm sure the ROC staff is working with him. So, he might not be showing like the 2022's but I don't know if it's a foregone conclusion that any of them are out. Not that I would be apposed to filling a hole now for one of them.
 
RefsIdeas said:
It kind of does seem like the case for him. I bought the AHL TV pass to watch Rochester this year and for my money Rosen has been their best player (yes, over Kulich). He can be frustrating at times but he oozes skill. There’s an argument to be made that he’s the best skater and has the best shot on the team. Plus he has a very high hockey IQ. But I’m still always left wanting more - tough to put my finger on it. I guess the best way to put it is that he doesn’t have much “dog” in his game. When the puck finds its way to his stick, he’s incredible with it. But he’s not going to do much of the work to get that puck on his stick, if that makes sense.

I remember reading the Black Book scouting report on him, and the conclusion was pretty much that he will be a productive, point producing guy at the NHL level but his game is not made at all for the playoffs. Which - to your point - makes me wonder if he’s the odd man out. I wouldn’t want to give him away for nothing though, he is and should be viewed as a valuable trade piece.
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Thanks for the good reply. I absolutely think he is a valuable piece and between AHL/WJC has done a lot this year to cement his value that may have wobbled a bit since his draft. I guess in my mind, he's the opposite of Mitts in that he might hold more value around the league than he does here, considering fit and timing. He likely has some real admirers in FO's across the league dating back to his draft who would pay significantly to acquire him.

Given that we have holes at D and bottom 6 F, and an unprecedented glut of skilled forwards on roster and knocking on the door, it makes sense to explore shipping him out (ideally to the West) this summer for help now. Kind of like the next step up in quality version of the Bloom trade. We're going to need to strategically thin out waves of prospects for a couple more seasons still.
 
I have not seen Rosen play except a few TV games at the WJC. But everything I've read throught the season and especially lately - including comments upthread and the Bill Hoppe piece linked upthread lead me to believe that this guy's got what it takes in terms of hockey IQ, speed, shot and attitude to be a success in the league.

Seth Appert said in the Hoppe article that he's been as good as or better than Kulich the last three months, that he's a driver on the team, and that he's attacking the hard areas of the ice as opposed to looking for the easy areas. He will certainly need to get stronger, but that type of attitude is not something to be simply disregarded and discarded. Rosen has faced an uphill battle around here because of his relative anonimity and obscurity when he was drafted - strike one. Therefore he was drafted with others on the board who posters preferred - which is strike two. Then strike 3 - his D+! year was totally FUBAR over in Sweden leaving stat watchers to see his numbers and consider him a bust and the top guy to be traded now that Mitts is off that list. So he comes over to NA, is learning the North American game and ice surface, is doing well and improving, and for a completely different reason - that he's one of our best prospects - is at the top of the to be traded list.

I just think it's way too early for that as we still don't know how good this guy can/will get. Neither does anyone else. So why would he bring a big return? He needs another year in the AHL, IMO - and as far as I'm concerned - hopefully as part of the Sabres organization.

All that said, no one is untouchable.
 
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Dex said:
I have not seen Rosen play except a few TV games at the WJC. But everything I've read throught the season and especially lately - including comments upthread and the Bill Hoppe piece linked upthread lead me to believe that this guy's got what it takes in terms of hockey IQ, speed, shot and attitude to be a success in the league.

Seth Appert said in the Hoppe article that he's been as good as or better than Kulich the last three months, that he's a driver on the team, and that he's attacking the hard areas of the ice as opposed to looking for the easy areas. He will certainly need to get stronger, but that type of attitude is not something to be simply disregarded and discarded. Rosen has faced an uphill battle around here because of his relative anonimity and obscurity when he was drafted - strike one. Therefore he was drafted with others on the board who posters preferred - which is strike two. Then strike 3 - his D+! year was totally FUBAR over in Sweden leaving stat watchers to see his numbers and consider him a bust and the top guy to be traded now that Mitts is off that list. So he comes over to NA, is learning the North American game and ice surface, is doing well and improving, and for a completely different reason - that he's one of our best prospects - is at the top of the to be traded list.

I just think it's way too early for that as we still don't know how good this guy can/will get. Neither does anyone else. So why would he bring a big return? He needs another year in the AHL, IMO - and as far as I'm concerned - hopefully as part of the Sabres organization.

All that said, no one is untouchable.
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Ultimately, there are only so many spots on the NHL roster for scoring wingers.

Skinner, Tuch, Quinn, and Peterka are going to be tough to knock out of their spots. If Mittelstadt stays on the wing, that is another spot taken. That leaves the inevitable VO replacement as the one potential opening this summer at the earliest and next summer at the latest. And you seem to have a three way battle between Savoie, Kulich, and Rosen for that one spot.

And further down the pipeline, you have other wingers coming.

I also wonder if the right trade is there and the feel confident about the guys that are coming, that a guy like Peterka gets moved for an upgrade elsewhere.
 
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