OT: Everything COVID19 - PART 5

[Stylizer1]

Restaurant I work at main demographic is 40-60 year olds
As soon as people are seated the mask comes off

I’ve gone out to dine with the wife.., I see it everywhere...
People are done with this all over

You work at the Zellers restaurant?

 

[Stylizer1]

Outbreaks mean at least 1 person has it.

 

[Stylizer1]

Yes, it is ridiculous to compare the flu, for which we have a cost effective means of protecting the population in vaccines, to covid 19 for which we have none. Canada would be thrilled to pay for the roughly 60% of the population that refuses to get the flu shot every year and help protect those poor souls, unfortunately there are some that don't think it's important enough for them to get that shot because they don't feel they personally are at risk.

I haven't got a flu shot in almost 28 years.

 

[FormentonTheFuture]

I haven't got a flu shot in almost 28 years.

What a SHOCK!

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDoo]

I haven't got a flu shot in almost 28 years.

Why not?

What ever the reason, I can sympathize. My 15 year old daughter has a deathly fear of needles and refuses to get the flu shot.

I'm hoping by the time she gets into her late teens or twenties she'll be a little braver.

 

[Stylizer1]

Why not?

What ever the reason, I can sympathize. My 15 year old daughter has a deathly fear of needles and refuses to get the flu shot.

I'm hoping by the time she gets into her late teens or twenties she'll be a little braver.

I used to get allergy shots every 2 weeks when I was a kid. Needles ain't a thing.

I preferred not to get it.

 

[Micklebot]

Outbreaks mean at least 1 person has it.

Sure, if nobody had it would be quite odd to declare an outbreak...

The important thing to understand is that just because one person tests positive it doesn't automatically mean it will be declared an outbreak.

 

[SPF6ty9]

Is that your restaurant's slogan?

.1% mortality is a big deal when something is highly contageous, and the rate dor those in the 40 to 70 bracket is roughly 5 times that.

All this say nothing about how many people require hospitalization, or have long lasting or permanent effects as a result of their infection. Or for that matter the people over 70.

You probably wouldn't go to a sens game if you knew 15 to 20 people in attendance (at capacity) each night wouldn't ever make it home, but that's what a .1% mortality rate looks like.

At this point I think that's a bit of a deceiving analogy. Not that I'm really on one side or the other at this point.

Just that until we know the possibility of reinfection, or the length of immunity after being infected, then it's hard to really compare to anything. If I can go to 1 Sens game knowing 15-20 people wouldn't make it home, those people being much more likely older and unhealthier than myself, and if going to that game once let me be free to get back to living a normal life then I'd probably take that risk.

Now if the timer resets for reinfection, then we'd have a big problem on our hands with reopening. Until that question has a definitive answer, I don't think anyone knows what the real "right answer" is. And frankly I hope people are researching a true scientific answer to that question rather than just listening to anecdotal tweets from people looking for attention. Florida should be serving up a big petri dish of subjects.

 

[Stylizer1]

Sure, if nobody had it would be quite odd to declare an outbreak...

The important thing to understand is that just because one person tests positive it doesn't automatically mean it will be declared an outbreak.

That's the definition. All it takes is one to be declared an out break. When people hear outbreak they think

 

[Sens]

You work at the Zellers restaurant?

A British Pub... the people do not give a f*** and they are mostly oldies

 

[Xspyrit]

It's probably worth remembering that there are many countries who have executed a successful public health strategy and have now won the benefits from that. New Zealand, Taiwan, Vietnam come to mind. If leaders can put forth a smart plan and society is overwhelmingly willing to put the common good as a priority for that task, you can avoid massive economic pain without blanket lockdowns. Lockdowns arent a tyrannical act. They are a reflection of a failed societal effort, of too many individuals failing to do the right thing, and should serve as a reminder that there are less painful ways we can work together to get through this than lockdowns if we do act within public health guidelines.

.

Great post, and IMO it shows which society has more people who are more individualistic/selfish

Sweden went with a risky approach because they know how smart their population is and that they are responsible enough to "manage". It didn't look great as first but in the end, they probably won't have a lot of "side-effects" problems from the pandemic, compared to many other countries

Most of the healthy people are asymptomatic to COVID-19. Older generations will get that shortness of breath, a soar throat and a cough. The most troubling is that the virus affects nervous system, penetrates brain. In healthy people it could be just a loss of taste and smell, when nerves and receptors are affected. And that part of the brain is inflamed by virus(it is a really walking dead stuff, no kidding). Oder people will get even muscles twitching, heart problems and spasms and crazy tearing headaches, when virus really inflames nerves in the brain. This could stay for weeks and weeks at a time. Most people just stay home and cope with the disease themselves, when little shortness of breath is present plus the rest of the symptoms. They for sure have an upper lung inflamed pneumonia. But they scared to go and present themselves to the hospital. Thyroid gland is usually get inflamed, as stomach lining and inflamed pancreas as well. Kidneys, liver....you name it. Complications all over. Virus just goes into your body as the weapon of mass distraction and inflames and affects the weakest organs. I am sure this virus is a lab designed weapon. To live through the course of this disease is mostly insane.

I prefer to read your non-hockey posts.

But about the highlighted, the scientific world has confirmed it wasn't made in a lab.

Conspiracy theorists usually go with "corrupted people" but you'd need to corrupt A LOT of people to have all of them lie about the same thing. There are very reputed sources that confirms this.

"But the vast majority of scientists who have studied the virus agree that it evolved naturally and crossed into humans from an animal species, most likely a bat."

I have been told during the pandemic that it was a fake virus and that all the people were "paid to lie". I was like... "what? You think millions of people are on Bill Gates payroll?" lol

I mean, think about all the medical staff in the whole world, all the people who caught it and suffered from it, all the others who are related to these people, etc and that's a LOT of people who have witnessed this thing first hand.

I talked to a long time friend who has been working in the same CHSLD for 20 years and he told me "people who haven't seen it first hand have no idea how bad it is"

 

[Dingle]

Sorry, what alternative reality are you selling?

One where a new disease rips through society uncontrolled and overloads hospitals while everyone goes on their merry way, keeping the economy humming?

or the reality that 1) this thing is now another flu...one that sadly will kill some 3500 or so people per year. And since it attacks the elderly and vulnerable, just like the flu, those that may succumb to the flu will succumb to this and we will not double up.

But an economic collapse will destroy a social structure that keeps us all alive. Like say health care, education, farming/agriculture, medicine/pharmaceuticals, etc.

Now add social services; pensions, social aid, food banks, etc. and you end up with a possible 10 to 20 times more people dying than the 3500 that this may take.

So yes, we can continue to hide. Continue to set our economy aflame and we will indeed save a few hundred lives. Then we can sit and watch layoffs in hospitals and waiting times that will get a few thousand people killed. Fair trade.

The initial actions taken by government was correct. We feared a cataclysmic situation and hid and took precautions. That is no longer the case and what we are doing now is wrong.

The humming economy is not about allowing us to buy toys, it pays for us to survive. If you enter a cave to hide from a bear, you better bring food in there with you. Otherwise, you may be better off outside and taking your chance on the bear.

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

That's the definition. All it takes is one to be declared an out break. When people hear outbreak they think

Once again, you're misinformed. Province of Ontario defines outbreak as two or more lab-confirmed cases within a 14-day window where one of the infections could reasonably have been acquired at the location where the outbreak is called (typically elderly care homes, schools and hospitals but clearly now sports teams, too.)

 

[Micklebot]

That's the definition. All it takes is one to be declared an out break. When people hear outbreak they think

Can you point to where you found this definition?

Because here in Ontario, an outbreak at a school is defined as follows

An outbreak in a school is defined as two or more lab-confirmed COVID-19 cases in students and/or staff (or other visitors) in a school with an epidemiological link, within a 14-day period, where at least one case could have reasonably acquired their infection* in the school (including transportation and before/after school care).
*Examples of reasonably having acquired infection in school include:

• No obvious source of infection outside of the school setting; OR
• Known exposure in the school setting

Which is decidedly different than your claim.

 

[Xspyrit]

And remember it's not because someone does not value life, that he has the right to impose that carelessness to somebody.

If you are under 70.., you have a 99.9% of recovery

Every source reports that death rates are significantly higher starting at 40 y/o.

Is that your restaurant's slogan?

.1% mortality is a big deal when something is highly contageous, and the rate dor those in the 40 to 70 bracket is roughly 5 times that.

All this say nothing about how many people require hospitalization, or have long lasting or permanent effects as a result of their infection. Or for that matter the people over 70.

You probably wouldn't go to a sens game if you knew 15 to 20 people in attendance (at capacity) each night wouldn't ever make it home, but that's what a .1% mortality rate looks like.

Thank you

One of the biggest problem during this pandemic is the misinformation. Even if what you quoted was true, the big problem is that you could still KILL somebody by rebound...

"ok good I have very low chances of dying so let's continue living a normal life!"

So that person becomes a carrier and what if she gives it to somebody who actually dies from it? how would she feel about it?"

And not only that, the more people get hospitalized for Covid, the more people won't go to the hospital to detect something that would have been preventable earlier. There's already a lot of people suffering from the side effects of the pandemic in the health department.

Restaurant I work at main demographic is 40-60 year olds
As soon as people are seated the mask comes off

I’ve gone out to dine with the wife.., I see it everywhere...
People are done with this all over

You can't be done with something that affects absolutely everybody.

It's like if my great-grand parents were like "you know what? I am done with this world war"

Uh it just doesn't go away like that. And in covid's case, the less you take care of it, the more it will affect people. There is no choice to take it very seriously.

The flu is much less deadlier and already has a vaccine. Covid is a "new" virus. We are still learning how to deal with it.

 

[Sens]

Aside from wearing a mask and checking Halton numbers I’ve stopped caring about the covid news.

when I work I don’t need to wear a mask... only effects me when I shop

Done with it

 

[Dingle]

And remember it's not because someone does not value life, that he has the right to impose that carelessness to somebody.



Every source reports that death rates are significantly higher starting at 40 y/o.




Thank you

One of the biggest problem during this pandemic is the misinformation. Even if what you quoted was true, the big problem is that you could still KILL somebody by rebound...

"ok good I have very low chances of dying so let's continue living a normal life!"

So that person becomes a carrier and what if she gives it to somebody who actually dies from it? how would she feel about it?"

And not only that, the more people get hospitalized for Covid, the more people won't go to the hospital to detect something that would have been preventable earlier. There's already a lot of people suffering from the side effects of the pandemic in the health department.



You can't be done with something that affects absolutely everybody.

It's like if my great-grand parents were like "you know what? I am done with this world war"

Uh it just doesn't go away like that. And in covid's case, the less you take care of it, the more it will affect people. There is no choice to take it very seriously.

The flu is much less deadlier and already has a vaccine. Covid is a "new" virus. We are still learning how to deal with it.

Safe to assume you are a retiree. I understand fear guy. My 83 year old Mom is petrified. I have to calm her down. All this BS is fear mongering and is impacting the elderly and vulnerable in a bad way.

rather than assure people, the government and media is inflaming fears. This is a shame.

Yes this virus is real and yes it kills people and yes the elderly and those with health issues are at a way higher risk of death. But the numbers show that the death rate is no where near what was originally feared and even in the most extreme periods, it rarely approached the 2% they predicted and even that number was down from the original 3% they first forecast.

we need to respect this thing, not fear it. We need to take precautions, not run and hide. We need to be sensible, follow protocols (wear mask, social distance, wash hands, etc.,) but not burn ourselves as we are doing.

They are closing gyms, studios, etc. heck it is the young that go. their risk factor is minor. Any vulnerable person is smart enough to not go to a gym and is smart enough to not take any risks. Sue is a two time cancer survivor, with diabetes, is 68. Has a ton of issues (overweight, arthritis, sight problems, etc.). We are careful, we do not take risks, but we are not petrified and do not hide under the bed.

It is difficult on me to appease her, my Mom, a plethora of Aunts and Uncles, because governments and media are scaring them to death. My Eldest Aunt's husband is 90 and slowly decaying in nursing home in Quebec. No one can visit him. He will most likely die broken hearted and alone. How are we doing him a favour by saving him from Covid??? so that he may die alone. Similarly with my other Aunt, she has been locked down for 7 months and my Mom tells me, she may be at an end. Has not seen her kids or grand-kids in 8 months!!! She won't die of covid, but will die alone as well.

We need better solutions, we need to stop fear mongering. We need to make sure the economy is okay, so that in a year or two when my Mom needs a nursing home, there is money to pay for it. We need an economy to pay for Sue's next trip to some health care institution which is an inevitability.

This hiding in a cave until the bear goes away will not work. We will run out of food and water. So that when are are forced to get out, we will be too weak to run or fight.

 

[Sens]

Only to talk about how stupid this is

at least the government continues to pay me money on top of my job as I Enter EI after Cerb... Trudeau is literally supporting my marijuana habit

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDoo]

Safe to assume you are a retiree. I understand fear guy. My 83 year old Mom is petrified. I have to calm her down. All this BS is fear mongering and is impacting the elderly and vulnerable in a bad way.

.... Any vulnerable person is smart enough to not go to a gym and is smart enough to not take any risks....

I appreciate and agree with many of your economic and societal concerns. But the bolded just simply isn't true, as evidenced by @Sens quote about his workplace:

A British Pub... the people do not give a f*** and they are mostly oldies

The simple reality is that many people -- young, old, diabetic, whatever -- will assume that they are taking the appropriate precautions, right up UNTIL they actually catch the thing. And after that, they will assume / expect that our healthcares system will be able to treat them. Which may not be true.

 

[Xspyrit]

Safe to assume you are a retiree. I understand fear guy. My 83 year old Mom is petrified. I have to calm her down. All this BS is fear mongering and is impacting the elderly and vulnerable in a bad way.

rather than assure people, the government and media is inflaming fears. This is a shame.

Yes this virus is real and yes it kills people and yes the elderly and those with health issues are at a way higher risk of death. But the numbers show that the death rate is no where near what was originally feared and even in the most extreme periods, it rarely approached the 2% they predicted and even that number was down from the original 3% they first forecast.

we need to respect this thing, not fear it. We need to take precautions, not run and hide. We need to be sensible, follow protocols (wear mask, social distance, wash hands, etc.,) but not burn ourselves as we are doing.

They are closing gyms, studios, etc. heck it is the young that go. their risk factor is minor. Any vulnerable person is smart enough to not go to a gym and is smart enough to not take any risks. Sue is a two time cancer survivor, with diabetes, is 68. Has a ton of issues (overweight, arthritis, sight problems, etc.). We are careful, we do not take risks, but we are not petrified and do not hide under the bed.

It is difficult on me to appease her, my Mom, a plethora of Aunts and Uncles, because governments and media are scaring them to death. My Eldest Aunt's husband is 90 and slowly decaying in nursing home in Quebec. No one can visit him. He will most likely die broken hearted and alone. How are we doing him a favour by saving him from Covid??? so that he may die alone. Similarly with my other Aunt, she has been locked down for 7 months and my Mom tells me, she may be at an end. Has not seen her kids or grand-kids in 8 months!!! She won't die of covid, but will die alone as well.

We need better solutions, we need to stop fear mongering. We need to make sure the economy is okay, so that in a year or two when my Mom needs a nursing home, there is money to pay for it. We need an economy to pay for Sue's next trip to some health care institution which is an inevitability.

This hiding in a cave until the bear goes away will not work. We will run out of food and water. So that when are are forced to get out, we will be too weak to run or fight.

lol I'm 40 father of 3. Sorry if I think like older people

I'm sorry for your mom, I can understand if older generations are more subject to "fear mongering" but at the same time, if they weren't, many more would have gotten the virus from their coffee gatherings at McDonald's, at least here in Quebec. My grandmother is 83 and she is not scared at all, she has just modified her way of living temporarily. I guess it really depends on people but I don't know anybody who is "scared by the virus" and I know many older people through relatives and community work.

And thank God the death rates are not as bad as it was first anticipated. The world would be literally crumbling right now.

It's not about "respecting" this thing or even "fear it", it's about taking every possible measure to stop the spreading. It's as simple as that, but it seems that for some people it's taking a crazy amount of time to figure it out. I mean, how long do they need? It was totally possible to see this coming at the beginning of the year, It was evident right from the start that the only way to counter a virus was to "flatten the curve"

Personally, I still played hockey when it was allowed, I'm going to Costco and post office regularly, I'm still doing voluntary work to help out people, I don't have a "job" so I control my schedule and I'm just avoiding direct contacts. I'm still advancing, maybe slower than usual but still progressing working on various projects. I haven't been hiding at all, but at the same time I don't depend on social events like some might do. Even before covid, we are people that like to be with our family and close friends. I'm not somebody that likes big crowds and being close to "strangers". I don't trust people and their hygiene. How many times have I seen people go to the bathroom and not wash their freaking hands? Really disgusting. Personally, I find social distancing pretty easy and even welcome.

When you say young people's risk factor is minor, you may not look at the whole situation correctly. It's not about them getting it and dying from it. It's about them becoming carriers and then continuing the spread. I don't think everybody realize the chaos it would have been without social distancing and masks, and other public health rules.

I also wish we could go full Sweden but I don't think everybody would be smart/responsible enough for that, unfortunately. Putting the health of your whole population in the hands of the youth is SILLY (and not just the youth, some adults are terribly irresponsible too). I don't know how it is in Ontario, but I can assure you that here in Quebec it wouldn't work at all. Too many are careless or just selfish. Do you need videos?

I used to think I was invincible too. I used to think that nothing will ever happen to me. I came close to potential death a few times but somehow it didn't happen like if angels were watching me. But it's not about that, it's not about ourselves, it's about everybody. If someone can't sacrifice himself for the good of others, then he should probably be living in the woods and not in society.

Remember, there's no perfect solution. If everybody would sacrifice what is necessary to get rid of this thing, the faster we could go back to a normal life, but it won't happen. Some people don't have the mental fortitude and resilience to do that.

Link : Do you really want to put your public health in these people's hands?



There's one guy who says "I have nothing against the mask, but it should be on a voluntary basis"


I mean what's the point of the mask if people randomly choose to wear it or not? lol

 

[Stylizer1]

I don't think it's as contagious as it's let on to be. Some are just more prone to getting it for whatever reason.

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

I don't think it's as contagious as it's let on to be.

Science doesn't give two flying f***s what you think.

 

[Sens]

Science doesn't give two flying f***s what you think.

Ford thinks all you need to do is pray

 

[FormentonTheFuture]

I don't think it's as contagious as it's let on to be. Some are just more prone to getting it for whatever reason.

Maybe the reason is its contagion

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

Ford thinks all you need to do is pray

A comprehensive and exhaustive list of pandemics that have been resolved through the power of prayer:
1.