Player Discussion Evan Bouchard

[Broberg Speed]

He seems to have the od game where everything goes to shit and he plays very poorly. He had one recently, can't remember who it was against though. Other than that the odd mistake here and there, but overall solid.

Bouchard passed the puck into his own slot against LA for a breakout play... this is just one play but you just can't do that, ever.

You'll never win with this player playing a significant role in a 7 game series against an elite team.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Bouchard passed the puck into his own slot against LA for a breakout play... this is just one play but you just can't do that, ever.

You'll never win with this player playing a significant role in a 7 game series against an elite team.

Unpredictability is a good thing. If you always try and rim it around the boards, the opposing wings and D just have to seal off the boards at your blueline.

 

[VainGretzky]

Wonder how many more points Bouchard would have if he played the extra minute and a half a game Makar and Hughes have over him

 

[Stoneman89]

Bouchard passed the puck into his own slot against LA for a breakout play... this is just one play but you just can't do that, ever.

You'll never win with this player playing a significant role in a 7 game series against an elite team.

You need to just stop. Please.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

Bouchard passed the puck into his own slot against LA for a breakout play... this is just one play but you just can't do that, ever.

You'll never win with this player playing a significant role in a 7 game series against an elite team.

Yeah, just rimming it around the boards every team to get broken up is definitely the play.

 

[Broberg Speed]

Believe it or not there are other options available to defensemen besides clearing the puck off the wall or making the worst play in hockey.

That wasn't the first time I've seen Bouchard unexplainably pass the puck into his own slot.

Against elite teams you can only make so many mistakes before your team is de facto out of the game. Will Bouchard be responsible for 40% of the Oilers mistakes altogether, against the elite of the elite? I believe so.

Bouchard has improved but if he is going to play massive minutes in the postseason he can't be soft on the wall against contenders who will be manufacturing set plays contingent on Bouchard being soft on the wall. This is what will happen.

Great teams with astute coaches exploit weaknesses... perfectly timed with designated plays. Bouchard can't be hesitant, uncertain of a play or give up on a play or it will cost the Oilers just like when Vegas schooled the Oilers or when Colorado dominated the Oilers in respective series. Both times the Edmonton Oilers were strategically outmatched.

The great defensemen have one thing in common. They are super competitive each and every shift.

 

[Fourier]

Bouchard passed the puck into his own slot against LA for a breakout play... this is just one play but you just can't do that, ever.

You'll never win with this player playing a significant role in a 7 game series against an elite team.

How much did you watch Paul Coffey play??

 

[Giggleplex]

McDavid served up a pizza to a Duck in the slot last game... Surely that's not a guy you want either then?

 

[Broberg Speed]

How much did you watch Paul Coffey play??

I don't understand thoughtlessly passing the puck unforcedly into the primest scoring area on the ice surface.

Think about it. Who will Bouchard be playing head-to-head against Colorado or Vegas.

You're telling me Paul Coffey made it a habit of passing the puck erratically into his own slot? You'll have to provide some evidence. Can you actually remember a time when Coffey made that type of pass. I don't need video confirmation, I will take your word for it if you swear you can remember a single occurrence.

I understand Coffey was a "riverboat gambler" on the rush but you'll have to convince me he recklessly passed the puck into his own slot while the opposition was hovering around the area looking for a turnover.

I know what you guys are trying to do but it won't help the Oilers win playoff series... c'mon man, what does this glorifying Bouchard accomplish? It's fanatical delusion.

Point out his flagrant mistakes and obvious shortcomings, hope he can correct the mistakes and improve upon the shortcomings. He won't improve without critique and encouragement.

 

[bucks_oil]

But 3 months ago too many idiots on here were crying to trade him for scraps.

Not true. I started that trade Bouchard thread and it was for Saros, a top-5 goalie in the league + Barrie to replace him. Not for scraps. I'd run out of patience on him, not belief... the return reflected that. It was a value for value trade.

 

[bobbythebrain]

The guy blasting Bouchard litetally blamed him for a goal a few games back that wasn't even his fault.
The combination of lack of knowledge and bias is pretty evident

 

[Broberg Speed]

The guy blasting Bouchard litetally blamed him for a goal a few games back that wasn't even his fault.
The combination of lack of knowledge and bias is pretty evident

What goal was this bobby or are you pretending again?

 

[DynamiteKid]

Bouchard passed the puck into his own slot against LA for a breakout play... this is just one play but you just can't do that, ever.

You'll never win with this player playing a significant role in a 7 game series against an elite team.

It was mentioned earlier this year after Knoblauch took over that passing it up through the middle was actually a set play for them and they knew it would bite them from time to time, but it was a chance he was willing to take.

 

[Fourier]

I don't understand thoughtlessly passing the puck unforcedly into the primest scoring area on the ice surface.

Think about it. Who will Bouchard be playing head-to-head against Colorado or Vegas.

You're telling me Paul Coffey made it a habit of passing the puck erratically into his own slot? You'll have to provide some evidence. Can you actually remember a time when Coffey made that type of pass. I don't need video confirmation, I will take your word for it if you swear you can remember a single occurrence.

I understand Coffey was a "riverboat gambler" on the rush but you'll have to convince me he recklessly passed the puck into his own slot while the opposition was hovering around the area looking for a turnover.

I know what you guys are trying to do but it won't help the Oilers win playoff series... c'mon man, what does this glorifying Bouchard accomplish? It's fanatical delusion.

Point out his flagrant mistakes and obvious shortcomings, hope he can correct the mistakes and improve upon the shortcomings. He won't improve without critique and encouragement.

You have this habit of assuming that this or that are fatal flaws for the team. Now you are taking something that Bouchard may have done on rare occasions and writing off the player while ignoring the fact that the positive things he does far out weight the negative. If I didn't know better I would think this article may well have been written just for you in mind. \

An in-depth analysis of Evan Bouchard’s game using stats and video

As for Coffey, he would regularly do things that made people cringe. He would definitely try passes that were high risk and occasionally it would backfire. But cumulatively he was far more successful than not which is why what really matters is net contribution. This year Bouchard has been a clear net positive. There is absolutely no evidence to support your claim otherwise.

Kiszla: Blunder for the ages by Avs star Cale Makar defines playoff series where bad stuff just keeps happening

Stuff happens. And it stinks, especially when it happens all at once to the Avalanche, now on the brink of NHL playoff elimination after a mind-blowing, confidence-rattling 5-4 loss to Dallas.

www.denverpost.com

 

[Broberg Speed]

You have this habit of assuming that this or that are fatal flaws for the team. Now you are taking something that Bouchard may have done on rare occasions and writing off the player while ignoring the fact that the positive things he does far out weight the negative. If I didn't know better I would think this article may well have been written just for you in mind. \

An in-depth analysis of Evan Bouchard’s game using stats and video

As for Coffey, he would regularly do things that made people cringe. He would definitely try passes that were high risk and occasionally it would backfire. But cumulatively he was far more successful than not which is why what really matters is net contribution. This year Bouchard has been a clear net positive. There is absolutely no evidence to support your claim otherwise.

I'm not writing off the player. I believe Bouchard has tremendous offensive skills and immense value. I've never stated otherwise.

Understand, I want the Oilers to win a Stanley Cup and the team will need the proper mix of players to achieve that feat.

Do we have that mix? We will see. In the meantime I see no problem with debating each and every player and their abilities or lack thereof.

Any evaluation of Evan Bouchard, positive or negative, is highly relevant as he'll likely be playing 24 minutes a night against some pretty tough competition in the playoffs. We will see how Bouchard fares soon enough.

I'll take you at your word for Paul Coffey's exploits.

It was mentioned earlier this year after Knoblauch took over that passing it up through the middle was actually a set play for them and they knew it would bite them from time to time, but it was a chance he was willing to take.

I certainly would love to see that interview.

 

[DynamiteKid]

I certainly would love to see that interview.

On the tactical side, the Oilers are more than likely to exit their zone through the middle of the ice.
Edmonton Oilers Tactics 101: Who’s The New Guy?


7. If it looks like the Oilers may be playing differently that is because they are. One key change is in the transition game from the blueline. A benefit of playing zone is that you generally know where everybody else is on the ice. That makes a quick transition up the middle an option in a high percentage of sequences. And with this set of high-octane forwards, getting the puck up to them fast is critical. Thank you, Paul Coffey.
The new Edmonton Oilers head coach is using process to help his horses win the race: 9 Things


Also heard it in the GYB podcast, but I'm not searching for that.

 

[foshizzle]

Bouchard passed the puck into his own slot against LA for a breakout play... this is just one play but you just can't do that, ever.

You'll never win with this player playing a significant role in a 7 game series against an elite team.

I would love to see your work on this. You must have some statistics to back up your take- surely you wouldn’t make a factual sounding statement on bias.

 

[foshizzle]

Wonder how many more points Bouchard would have if he played the extra minute and a half a game Makar and Hughes have over him

Bouchard has better defensive metrics than Hughes has. Much better. If Hughes played in Edmonton we would have ran him out of town. Same with Makar.

Makar is a beautiful skater where Bouchard is a better puck mover. Both play the transitional defence. I’m too lazy to look up Makar’s metric- but Bouchard is at the top of the league (or near the top) in zone denials, puck retrievals, and successful zone exits. You even see Ekholm defer to Bouchard when it comes to moving the puck out- and Ekholm is no slouch

On the tactical side, the Oilers are more than likely to exit their zone through the middle of the ice.
Edmonton Oilers Tactics 101: Who’s The New Guy?


7. If it looks like the Oilers may be playing differently that is because they are. One key change is in the transition game from the blueline. A benefit of playing zone is that you generally know where everybody else is on the ice. That makes a quick transition up the middle an option in a high percentage of sequences. And with this set of high-octane forwards, getting the puck up to them fast is critical. Thank you, Paul Coffey.
The new Edmonton Oilers head coach is using process to help his horses win the race: 9 Things


Also heard it in the GYB podcast, but I'm not searching for that.

This is a perfect example of Ceci playing over Stetcher makes no sense. Ceci can’t exit the zone to save his life and gives up our blue line like candy to children.

 

[Broberg Speed]

On the tactical side, the Oilers are more than likely to exit their zone through the middle of the ice.
Edmonton Oilers Tactics 101: Who’s The New Guy?


7. If it looks like the Oilers may be playing differently that is because they are. One key change is in the transition game from the blueline. A benefit of playing zone is that you generally know where everybody else is on the ice. That makes a quick transition up the middle an option in a high percentage of sequences. And with this set of high-octane forwards, getting the puck up to them fast is critical. Thank you, Paul Coffey.
The new Edmonton Oilers head coach is using process to help his horses win the race: 9 Things


Also heard it in the GYB podcast, but I'm not searching for that.

Transition from below the goal line up to the hash marks via passing into the high slot this is not. It's not the same, man.

 

[Broberg Speed]

I would love to see your work on this. You must have some statistics to back up your take- surely you wouldn’t make a factual sounding statement on bias.

You won't believe anything without it being backed by lies, damned lies, and statistics.

How much bullshit passes through the bullshit detector these days.

Turn on the news or your favorite Edmonton Oilers hockey podcast.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

You won't believe anything without it being backed by lies, damned lies, and statistics.

How much bullshit passes through the bullshit detector these days.

Turn on the news or your favorite Edmonton Oilers hockey podcast.

You mean how everyone is saying Bouchard has been elite this year?

All analytics and eye tests point to you not having a clue what you’re looking at

 

[foshizzle]

You won't believe anything without it being backed by lies, damned lies, and statistics.

How much bullshit passes through the bullshit detector these days.

Turn on the news or your favorite Edmonton Oilers hockey podcast.

So you have nothing to back up your claims. Just your bias.

You also make very little sense "backed up by lies"? Lol- what does that even mean?

Analytics just tell you what is happening. Most of my favourite podcasters like Bouchard. Stauffer, the biggest Oilers podcaster called those who don't like Bouchard "mouthbreathers". lol

Transition from below the goal line up to the hash marks via passing into the high slot this is not. It's not the same, man.

So are you counting all the good passes- or just the bad?

 

[Broberg Speed]

So you have nothing to back up your claims. Just your bias.

You also make very little sense "backed up by lies"? Lol- what does that even mean?

Analytics just tell you what is happening. Most of my favourite podcasters like Bouchard. Stauffer, the biggest Oilers podcaster called those who don't like Bouchard "mouthbreathers". lol


So are you counting all the good passes- or just the bad?

only passes into an occupied or soon to be occupied high slot, occupied by players with the wrong jerseys, passes that should get a player benched

You mean how everyone is saying Bouchard has been elite this year?

All analytics and eye tests point to you not having a clue what you’re looking at

we will see soon enough in the playoffs who is wrong and who is right, won't we

 

[Seanaconda]

only passes into an occupied or soon to be occupied high slot, occupied by players with the wrong jerseys, passes that should get a player benched

we will see soon enough in the playoffs who is wrong and who is right, won't we

I'm pretty sure every player has passed it into the slot at some point so I don't think we need to wait tbh.

Stanley cups have been won with players that do that

Malkin has three cups I'm sure he does that and I love him

 

[Fourier]

I'm not writing off the player. I believe Bouchard has tremendous offensive skills and immense value. I've never stated otherwise.

Understand, I want the Oilers to win a Stanley Cup and the team will need the proper mix of players to achieve that feat.

Do we have that mix? We will see. In the meantime I see no problem with debating each and every player and their abilities or lack thereof.

Any evaluation of Evan Bouchard, positive or negative, is highly relevant as he'll likely be playing 24 minutes a night against some pretty tough competition in the playoffs. We will see how Bouchard fares soon enough.

I'll take you at your word for Paul Coffey's exploits.

I certainly would love to see that interview.

There is no way to put lipstick on that pig. If you think that there is no way the Oilers can win with Bouchard on the team that is giving up on the player.

It's also one thing to be critical of mistakes a player makes. But to look at one rare aspect of the players game and make such a definitive statement makes no sense what so ever, especially when you are highlighting something that many players, perhaps almost everyone have been guilty of. McDavid himself made such a pass recently that was picked off and resulted in a scoring chance.

We've had this debate before when you have made claims about the team not being able to win with such and such a player. Previously it was a big third line center, something they still do not have by the way. Now its somehow a defensemen having an exceptional season. The reality is that there is no one model of what you need to win. Maybe it will turn out that Bouchard is not yet ready to carry the load. Would it surprise anyone if it turns out that a guy with only 256 NHL games under his belt might not be ready to handle the role of playing big minutes vs the NHL's best. That is a completely different thing than saying that he can't be part of a winning team because of some pass he made in one regular season game. .