Player Discussion Evan Bouchard

[Oilhawks]

Bear was getting murdered in the end trying to defend in the corners.

Bouchard's mistakes get polarized cuz it seems as if he puts in little effort on a play.

There were several games this season he only made 1 or 2 mistakes, but the effort level wasn't there so ppl turned it into a case where he was garbage all game.

Bear was pretty brutal at the end for long stretches of game, not just a play here or there

It’s odd that some think Bear should even be mentioned in the same sentence outside of “they both shoot RD and have played in the NHL”. Even with Bear being at times a bit better defensively, Bouchard is massively superior

 

[TheNumber4]

It’s odd that some think Bear should even be mentioned in the same sentence outside of “they both shoot RD and have played in the NHL”. Even with Bear being at times a bit better defensively, Bouchard is massively superior

He is. Bouch is much better. There is no comparison. But specifically talking about mistakes, is why the comparison was being made.

 

[Stoneman89]

I disagree. Bear was good at escaping pressure, it was one of the things noted as a positive in his game. He made some huge blunders in huge games and the narrative got flipped to him being a defensive liability. I agree that he was to some extent, but Bouchard to start this season made way more own errors than Bear during his worst stretch.

Bears biggest issue was and is his skating. It's why he was drafted in the 3rd round and not earlier, and even that was taking a flier on him. And that skating issue has been one of the main reasons he's bounced around to different teams and been healthy scratched so many times.

 

[Aerchon]

It’s not a comparison of players my comment was a commentary on the fact that Bear was blamed for perceived mistakes that didn’t exist. But he was blamed for being mistake prone because of a one or two very prominent mistakes made in the playoffs. I’ve always said Bear wasn’t mistake prone and had a bad rep. So my comment was a bit of a jab towards anyone who thought Bear was mistake prone. And that Bouch at the start of the season was making mistakes way more than the perceived mistake prone Bear.

I agree with the Bear and think there are some on here that are doing the same to Bouchard... but as a Bouchard fan, even I had to give credit to that anti-Bouchard group because he was making an unreal amount of Grade A mistakes to start the year.

I was wondering if Bouchard was trending towards liability despite his obvious offensive gifts.

He is young. Development of defenseman isn't linear. He had an usually bad start and hopefully has learned from it. He can score at a record breaking pace and still cause the team to lose night in and night out if he doesn't/didn't clean up the play in the defensive zone.

 

[TheNumber4]

Bears biggest issue was and is his skating. It's why he was drafted in the 3rd round and not earlier, and even that was taking a flier on him. And that skating issue has been one of the main reasons he's bounced around to different teams and been healthy scratched so many times.

I don’t disagree there. I would say his skating and add size as an issue too.

 

[Stoneman89]

I don’t disagree there. I would say his skating and add size as an issue too.

For sure, if you're small, you sure as hell better be able to skate out of trouble.

 

[TheNumber4]

I agree with the Bear and think there are some on here that are doing the same to Bouchard... but as a Bouchard fan, even I had to give credit to that anti-Bouchard group because he was making an unreal amount of Grade A mistakes to start the year.

I was wondering if Bouchard was trending towards liability despite his obvious offensive gifts.

He is young. Development of defenseman isn't linear. He had an usually bad start and hopefully has learned from it. He can score at a record breaking pace and still cause the team to lose night in and night out if he doesn't/didn't clean up the play in the defensive zone.

Yeh I’m probably seen as one of those Bouch haters around here but I’m really not. In the preseason I said I could see him leading this League in defensive scoring, I always gave him credit for his elite offensive skills. When some were worried that the Bouch bombs had disappeared during a slump last year I defended Bouchard and was confident they would be back. I also have been mostly consistent in my support of his initial drafting too with some criticisms directed there only related to his lack of progress on the defence front.

But seeing him fail us in 2 playoffs straight with defensive mistakes made me wonder if this guy was even trying to be better defensively. Then he comes into this years preseason and is still getting dominated by mid-tier forecheckers which made me a bit pissed that we have this offensive talent that we can’t even rely on in the playoffs, so what good does that do us? So I think the criticism in that front was warranted which you’ve noted you saw too so we agree on that point.

Luckily it seems the defence has taken a surprising uptick under Knob which has stabilized every D-man’s game. So you’ll probably see me lay off Bouch’s defence now, these last few games there has been nothing close to the glaring mistakes he was making to start the year.

 

[bobbythebrain]

I disagree. Bear was good at escaping pressure, it was one of the things noted as a positive in his game. He made some huge blunders in huge games and the narrative got flipped to him being a defensive liability. I agree that he was to some extent, but Bouchard to start this season made way more own errors than Bear during his worst stretch.

Dude, CHI whole gameplan that play in was to abuse Bears side on the cycle. He was detrimental defending in the corners even before those bad giveaways sealed his fate

 

[AM]

If you can’t defend play offence. Make the other team defend. It’s a great strategy if you can manage it. And it’s a coffee trade mark.

 

[McFlash97]

Bouchard looking like Paul Coffey last game. Without the all world generational skating.

His game is positioning. His offensive side of the game is at Makar and Hughes level, however his defensive game really was his downside earlier. If Bouchard can continue putting himself in good position on the defensive end , he could really take his game to the next level. His skating isn't that bad too and his stickhandling is definitely upper tier for a dman. His shot is the best amongst all Young dmen.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

Yup. Same mentality ran Eberle outta town cuz he wasn't physical enough, despite him being a major high chance contributor.

We spent the next 3 years looking for a winger and many ppl thought the addition by subtraction was the smart play

Can't say I agree. Ebs got ran out of town because hid production dipped while failing to click with McDavid.


Bouchard's defensive play to start the year was nothing short of a tire fire that had been doused in gasoline. But the fact that he continued to put up points to start the year saved him from getting the full Jultz treatment.

The fantastic news is Bouchard has cleaned up his defensive play and is pretty much back to where he was down the stretch last season.

A good example is Hyman's second goal last night. That marker only happened because Bouchard took the extra effort to chop the puck past the rushing Canes player and back to McDavid. At the start of the year, that effort wasn't there.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Can't say I agree. Ebs got ran out of town because hid production dipped while failing to click with McDavid.


Bouchard's defensive play to start the year was nothing short of a tire fire that had been doused in gasoline.

Agreed, he really struggled, was he the only one? I think it's best to write that off for everyone's sake.

 

[TheNumber4]

Dude, CHI whole gameplan that play in was to abuse Bears side on the cycle. He was detrimental defending in the corners even before those bad giveaways sealed his fate

He wasn’t a cycle breaker or anything close, I’ll give you that. But if he got the puck on his stick in our own end he consistently navigated traffic quickly and made a snappy and reliable outlet to get the puck moving forward. In that year, he may have been our best D-man in that specific skill. That was his calling card and the reason he still has interest in this League.

CHI was the series where the narrative pretty quickly. And maybe CHInwas exposing him specifically or the team just laid up an egg and lots of players looked worse than they were. How I remembered it was a bad outlet pass lead to a game losing turnover by Bear and all of a sudden he was seen as turnover machine. I don’t think he was turnover machine, but he does have his defiencies in his own end.

 

[Aerchon]

Dude, CHI whole gameplan that play in was to abuse Bears side on the cycle. He was detrimental defending in the corners even before those bad giveaways sealed his fate

There were 2 bears. Good bear and bad bear. Good bear, previous to playoff f ups was surprisingly good at escaping pressure. Really good stick work. The playoff oops lead to a massive public flogging that was relatively unwarranted with his previous play.

After that unfortunately he dropped to the levels many unfairly claimed.

I don't know, and would be a bit surprised if true, but I think he claimed Edmonton scrutiny and racism played a role in his decline.

Personally I think his success was due to playing out of his mind great, for him. Through the roof confidence, and that fell apart with his own mistakes. His tool set put him in tough to recover from a lack of confidence. His skill set relied heavily on near perfection to execute.

Some small defenders just get it done even when neither fast nor big but I got to think the margin for error just makes it so tough to stay at the top of their game.

 

[Stoneman89]

Yup. Same mentality ran Eberle outta town cuz he wasn't physical enough, despite him being a major high chance contributor.

We spent the next 3 years looking for a winger and many ppl thought the addition by subtraction was the smart play

And rightly or wrongly, it was the playoff performance that year that ultimately led to his being traded. He didn't produce in the playoff and when things got rough and tumble, he scrambled to get out of the way, and ultimately cost them an important goal because of it. Everyone else manned up and gave up a left nut to try to win, but Ebs bailed. I know that he got crushed in front of the net earlier that year, and perhaps it made him gunshy.

 

[Aerchon]

And rightly or wrongly, it was the playoff performance that year that ultimately led to his being traded. He didn't produce in the playoff and when things got rough and tumble, he scrambled to get out of the way, and ultimately cost them an important goal because of it. Everyone else manned up and gave up a left nut to try to win, but Ebs bailed. I know that he got crushed in front of the net earlier that year, and perhaps it made him gunshy.

Eberle had some incredible moments. He is a solid middle 6 winger. But especially as the team was getting more serious his cap hit and skill set were not going to help the Oilers long term/big picture. They had a need for size especially at that time. He was at least to some extent a cap casualty. He would have demanded way too much money from the Oilers to stay as well.

It's so good to see RNH playing on the wing, set up for success, doing great out of the trio of Hall, Eberle, and RNH. His cap very reasonable.

I think it would have been Ebs or Nuge moved to open up space and I am so glad it was Nuge.

Before the Eberle is better than Cap space comments, we were at a time with McDrai becoming dominant. A decent, at the time prospect pool, and banking on growth from within and via FA. It looks like the right move big picture.

 

[bobbythebrain]

And rightly or wrongly, it was the playoff performance that year that ultimately led to his being traded. He didn't produce in the playoff and when things got rough and tumble, he scrambled to get out of the way, and ultimately cost them an important goal because of it. Everyone else manned up and gave up a left nut to try to win, but Ebs bailed. I know that he got crushed in front of the net earlier that year, and perhaps it made him gunshy.

You're definitely right that the playoff was the final nail, but he was being run outta town well before that.

It really started when ppl thought he would put up 100 points playing w/ McD.
Then when he didn't, it became a hilarious narrative where getting rid of him and adding a few depth guys would be equal.
Then Maroon became a hero cuz "look how well he plays with McD", yet Maroons production or defense wasn't any better than Ebs.

Kinda the same point with Bouchard. Some ppl can't think past perception

 

[Slats432]

This period is exactly what Bouchard is....three great breakout/offensive plays....and a backhand pass to the slot in his own zone and stripped of the puck in the slot because of lack of urgency.

And then another fantastic offensive play and a snipe...haha.

 

[VainGretzky]

We are very lucky we got him at 10 in the draft he is turning out to be that elite Right dman the team was looking forever a decade his defense will get better and his offense has not even peaked yet

 

[Slats432]

There are very few guys that can do what he does offensively. Accept the defensive blips and enjoy the Bouch bombs.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Allstar Bouchard. He's turned into much of what I had hoped he could become. Which doesn't always occur. Good for him to keep at it and keep getting better and taking the risks required to learn to make plays at this level. Really come around for him and now he's an elite D producer. What another night for him. 2 goals and gives goalies nightmares with his shot.

Last number of games since Coffey has been around clear that Bouchard has been green lit to do more with puck at line as well. KK has said its good that hes doing that and that he's not really making risky plays at line but shifting and taking whats there. He's walking the blue line beautifully. That, and his howitzer shot is a nightmare to defend.

My only worries about Booch is how we pay for his next contract.

 

[Drivesaitl]

You're definitely right that the playoff was the final nail, but he was being run outta town well before that.

It really started when ppl thought he would put up 100 points playing w/ McD.
Then when he didn't, it became a hilarious narrative where getting rid of him and adding a few depth guys would be equal.
Then Maroon became a hero cuz "look how well he plays with McD", yet Maroons production or defense wasn't any better than Ebs.

Kinda the same point with Bouchard. Some ppl can't think past perception

Not to rehash it too many times but Eberle is one of many players that has been impacted by the sheer physicality of NHL contact. Not sure where it started, perhaps Raffi Torres or Kassian destroying him with hits but the player started to get tentative which is only natural when you've been belted into next week a few times.

Trouble with Eberle is he's a pretty player. A guy that looks like a world beater in Junior, and then early in NHL. But then the NHL hitting and violence starts happening and he doesn't survive that like say a Ryan Smyth or a Zach Hyman. Its hard to predict too but theres some kind of metal missing in Eberles game.

Still quite an asset and if we had to trade him we should have got a lot better for him. Eberle has tremendous skill on puck, but nervousness as well by now. He could have been an allstar. Trepidation settled for less.

For any player, your sophomore year shouldn't be your best ever season, but alas it was for Jordan. Nothing since close to it.

 

[alphahelix]

Bouch is one of the most dynamic players in the league, and usually he will be a primary contributor on a goal every single game. Not a HDSC, but a goal. Or 2 or 3 on a good night.

When he makes a defensive flub, that leads to a HDSC against. Not every HDSC results in a goal. You have a goalie back there. You have another defender. HOPEFULLLY (occasionally) you have a backchecking forward/ C taking on some defensive responsibility.

An actual majority of posters here were attempting to turn Bouchard into a whipping boy this season but they dont seem to understand the above. Bouchard has been absolutely dynamic this season and if he makes a mistake, it’s not a GA it’s just a chance and there are other players out there meant to help defensively. He creates goals. McDavid and Draisaitl have had stretches of inefficacy and have posted snake eyes… Bouchard has been consistently dynamic all year.

We moved heaven and earth to get guys like Brown and Campbell here sucking the life out of this team but we couldn’t be bothered to lock this guy in long term. He’s gonna be 15M dollars when we finally get around to it.

 

[Aerchon]

I've given Holland some breathing room from my criticism but for every good thing that happens to this team he f***s up so badly as many or more. Just boneheaded moves I can't understand. Blatant stupidity.

If somehow, the Oilers make the playoffs and do well I'm the playoffs I pray it does not mean we are resigning Holland. Assuming of course we can actually get someone good for thr GM role Holland needs to go asap. Today would suit me just fine.... and not to a different role in the organization!

 

[harpoon]

Bears biggest issue was and is his skating. It's why he was drafted in the 3rd round and not earlier, and even that was taking a flier on him. And that skating issue has been one of the main reasons he's bounced around to different teams and been healthy scratched so many times.

Bear was a fifth round pick, not third. He’s already done quite well for himself considering his draft slot.

Word is that the Caps are looking to sign him now that’s he’s back healthy.