ESPN top 100 athletes since year 2000

[joelef]

It's ESPN. I'd be surprised if anyone there could point to Edmonton (or even Alberta) on a map. He'd be a lot higher if he played in the US.

No he would be higher if hockey didn’t have such a stick up there butt about self promotion

 

[tarheelhockey]

It’s like ranking rap artists ahead of classical musicians in musical ability.

The whole exercise was like asking the staff of XXL to make a ranking of the overall best musicians of the past 20 years. The results are predictable.

 

[Ruggs225]

The thing with Simone Biles is, yes, she had that very disappointing Tokyo 2020 with all of the factors you mentioned, but with these "Olympic" sports, there tends to be a hyper-foucs on the Olympics. The Olympics are only one event, and only every four years.

Outside of the Olympics, Simone Biles is like something out of a video game. She has 23 World Championship golds and is a six-time all-around World Champion.

In the Olympics she was healthy for, she won four golds.

You could make the argument, and it's exceedingly difficult to compare these athletes in different sports, but I don't think that one Olympics is a fair representation of her resume at all.

Thats great she won 4 golds and dominated that olympics. She flopped in the other. That doesnt make a top 10.

She is overrated to me and others on this list are much more deserving of a top 10 including Crosby who has won 3 cups and clinched the gold at the olympics. He is a top 5 NhL player of all time. And while Biles did push the limit for women in her field, she also crumbled when all the weight was on her in tokyo unlike some other american gymnast greats who didnt.

Lets see what she does this olympics.

On a different note. This list also needs Jagr. Dude is still played at played at a high level in the early 2000’s and is still playing now.

That is in itself incredible.

 

[Hasbro]

Jokic has won a championship. Like it or not it matters in every sport. Without that Jokic might not have even made the list.

And he did it with the Nuggets. That would be like carrying the Sabres to a Stanley Cup.

 

[Tofveve]

 

[tiburon12]

Thats great she won 4 golds and dominated that olympics. She flopped in the other. That doesnt make a top 10.

She is overrated to me and others on this list are much more deserving of a top 10 including Crosby who has won 3 cups and clinched the gold at the olympics. He is a top 5 NhL player of all time. And while Biles did push the limit for women in her field, she also crumbled when all the weight was on her in tokyo unlike some other american gymnast greats who didnt.

Lets see what she does this olympics.

On a different note. This list also needs Jagr. Dude is still played at played at a high level in the early 2000’s and is still playing now.

That is in itself incredible.

Cool, Biles is perhaps the #1 female gymnast of all-time. If you want to dock her for having some legitimate issue - an issue that is universally accepted among gymnasts - then you can keep her lower on your personal list. Just make sure you dock every other athlete for missing time too.

Imagine saying Crosby should be lower on this list because of his concussion issues. That's what you're doing.

It's OK to not know about gymnastics and say nothing

 

[Else Ermine]

American football has first dibs on the bulk of the talent pool in the US. Its not like some kid in France or Latvia is likely to start playing at 16 and find their way into the NFL. Not impossible but very unlikely. This makes the point you thought you were making about the 3% somewhat inconsequential.

The most populated country thats a soccer/football power is what? Brazil maybe? China's not a soccer/football power and the US isnt a football power. Those are two countries with very large populations that arent as dedicated tp soccer/football as much as many smaller countries. But its kind of comicsl to see people crow about soccer/football being more global in reference to American football because of a few large countries (population wise) then 40 countries the size of Latvia. Nice effort though.

To add:

Current Population

www.census.gov

Depending on your source, the 5 most populated countries in the world are as follows:

1. China
2. India
3. U.S.
4. Indonesia
5. Pakistan

Nigeria is 6. They're mostly competitive. Brazil is 7. Its the most populated country that one might legitimately consider a soccer/football power. Soccer/football is global when the five largest countries in the world an at least 3.5 million in population is standing on the sidines?

The point I still think I'm making about the 3% of players not born in the USA is that outside of the US, and to a lesser extent Canada, people don't really participate in the sport. They don't care. It's a slice of Americana and not much else. We're on a hockey forum so I'm assuming the idea that a sport you and I enjoy exists within a very specific geographical niche isn't hard to comprehend.
India loves cricket. Why isn't the list full of cricketers?

 

[JunkyardKangaroo]

And he did it with the Nuggets. That would be like carrying the Sabres to a Stanley Cup.

Nuggets have one of the best rosters in the NBA. Not at all like the Sabres.

 

[Hasbro]

Nuggets have one of the best rosters in the NBA. Not at all like the Sabres.

And a history of great ineptitude.

 

[John Mandalorian]

The point I still think I'm making about the 3% of players not born in the USA is that outside of the US, and to a lesser extent Canada, people don't really participate in the sport. They don't care. It's a slice of Americana and not much else. We're on a hockey forum so I'm assuming the idea that a sport you and I enjoy exists within a very specific geographical niche isn't hard to comprehend.
India loves cricket. Why isn't the list full of cricketers?

How are you making a point by saying its not glabal as compared to soccer/football is when the top 5 most populated countries in the world are only passive participants in soccer/football at best?

No one is saying American football is global. But does it really need to be? If American football didnt exist and its athletes were dispersed to other and more global sports, you can bet the sports landscape of those sports would be quite different. Or would you actually dispute this?

American football is its own ecosystem and own economy. It has a massive talent pool in the third most poplulated country in the world. Why does it have to be popular in other countries? It stands on its own.

Do people dismiss Messi for playing a sport thats not ardently embraced by the 5 countries with the largest populations in the world? Your argument can be inverted, do you see? So why the subjective and hamfisted criticisn of American football?

 

[Don'tcry4mejanhrdina]

Oleksandr Usyk should be on this list. He had a great amateur career culminating in becoming an Olympic gold medalist. Then as a professional he completely cleaned out a stacked cruiserweight division to become undisputed champ and followed that up by becoming undisputed heavyweight champion next despite being small compared to modern heavyweights. Never been defeated as a pro and hasn't ducked fighters/waited until they were past their prime to fight them.

 

[tarheelhockey]

How are you making a point by saying its not glabal as compared to soccer/football is when the top 5 most populated countries in the world are only passive participants in soccer/football at best?

No one is saying American football is global. But does it really need to be? If American football didnt exist and its athletes were dispersed to other and more global sports, you can bet the sports landscape of those sports would be quite different. Or would you actually dispute this?

American football is its own ecosystem and own economy. It has a massive talent pool in the third most poplulated country in the world. Why does it have to be popular in other countries? It stands on its own.

Do people dismiss Messi for playing a sport thats not ardently embraced by the 5 countries with the largest populations in the world? Your argument can be inverted, do you see? So why the subjective and hamfisted criticisn of American football?

I don’t disagree with your overall point, but soccer is the 3rd most popular team sport in the USA after baseball and basketball, for both youth and adults — well ahead of American football except for the specific 4-year timeframe when American boys are systematically funneled into high school football programs by the million.

But taking the full developmental system into account, the USA arguably has a much larger actual talent pool in soccer than in football. The difference in global results is due to higher competition in soccer, where there are billions of other competitors worldwide, whereas international competition in football is effectively zero. But if you look at high level outcomes in women’s soccer, where the global talent pool is less competitive, the Americans are a dominant world power because their soccer talent pool really is at a football-like level.

I’d also say that of all sports (other than sumo wrestling and basketball Cs), American football promotes players more on filling a specific physical profile rather than for overall athleticism. Some of them are Julius Peppers types who could succeed at a high level in other sports, but a lot of them are where they are because they have the quickest feet among men 6’2”-6’6”, which is quite different than competing with 90% of the population on overall athleticism and conditioning — which is the case in soccer. Release them to compete in other sports and the success stories will be the exception rather than the rule.

 

[Machinehead]

Maybe this just isn't the place, but there's not enough complaining about Chris Paul being on this list.

No team ever won with him as their best player. No team ever won with him as their second-best player.

I would take Jayson Tatum in his relatively short career over Chris Paul. Luka Doncic is already one of the 50 best players ever and deserves to be on this list over Chris Paul. That's just men who play the same sport.

If we extend it out to women, there's no way in hell he should be ahead of Lauren Jackson or A'ja Wilson. He's not a better basketball player than them. Wilson is about to win her third MVP and it should be unanimous. He shouldn't be on the list over Breanna Stewart. Four years in college, four national championships, four Final Four MVP's -- never been done.

 

[Hasbro]

I don’t disagree with your overall point, but soccer is the 3rd most popular team sport in the USA after baseball and basketball, for both youth and adults — well ahead of American football except for the specific 4-year timeframe when American boys are systematically funneled into high school football programs by the million.

Certainly not reflected in league revenues.

But taking the full developmental system into account, the USA arguably has a much larger actual talent pool in soccer than in football. The difference in global results is due to higher competition in soccer, where there are billions of other competitors worldwide, whereas international competition in football is effectively zero. But if you look at high level outcomes in women’s soccer, where the global talent pool is less competitive, the Americans are a dominant world power because their soccer talent pool really is at a football-like level.

The US is about 5% of the world population and an industrialized country and do we have any players in the top 100 of soccer right now? It's not because the world competition is so good, it's because our best athletes are going into other sports.

Really the last thing the rest of the world should want is a US that gives a shit about soccer.

 

[Voight]

Maybe this just isn't the place, but there's not enough complaining about Chris Paul being on this list.

No team ever won with him as their best player. No team ever won with him as their second-best player.

I would take Jayson Tatum in his relatively short career over Chris Paul. Luka Doncic is already one of the 50 best players ever and deserves to be on this list over Chris Paul. That's just men who play the same sport.

If we extend it out to women, there's no way in hell he should be ahead of Lauren Jackson or A'ja Wilson. He's not a better basketball player than them. Wilson is about to win her third MVP and it should be unanimous. He shouldn't be on the list over Breanna Stewart. Four years in college, four national championships, four Final Four MVP's -- never been done.

Hes the best PG of his era.....

 

[Machinehead]

Hes the best PG of his era.....

He's the best traditional point guard of his era.

Notice that Chris Paul, John Stockton, and Steve Nash all have something in common.

Jason Kidd, too, except he got a ring as a role player.

It's not the type of player you build around. If he can't be the best player on my team, how can he be on this list?

 

[Midnight Judges]

Simone biles… completely overrated.

She flopped and quit at tokyo. A top 10 athlete does not havr that type of disaster.

You didnt see michael phelps all of of a sudden start drowning bc he forgot how to swim.

She forgot how to land her routines, then used the mental wellness bs excuse.

Great athletes rise to the occasion and dont cop put and quit. They dont start crying and give up and claim mental wellness.

She is so god damn overrated its not even funny.

She shouldnt even be in the top 100.

This post is painfully misinformed.

 

[Else Ermine]

How are you making a point by saying its not glabal as compared to soccer/football is when the top 5 most populated countries in the world are only passive participants in soccer/football at best?

No one is saying American football is global. But does it really need to be? If American football didnt exist and its athletes were dispersed to other and more global sports, you can bet the sports landscape of those sports would be quite different. Or would you actually dispute this?

American football is its own ecosystem and own economy. It has a massive talent pool in the third most poplulated country in the world. Why does it have to be popular in other countries? It stands on its own.

Do people dismiss Messi for playing a sport thats not ardently embraced by the 5 countries with the largest populations in the world? Your argument can be inverted, do you see? So why the subjective and hamfisted criticisn of American football?

I think we have our wires crossed and are arguing over nothing. I'm not trying to criticise American football, just the notion that it's popularity in literally one particular country matters to the rest of the world in terms of deciding who the greatest 100 athletes since 2000 are. It was being compared to soccer in that context and I continued the comparison in terms of appeal and talent pool. I don't get the prickliness about that.

It's a weird list with horrible methodology that's getting way out of its lane in making an attempt to cover all professional sports across the world and doing it with predictable bias in representation. Basketball and baseball are 1 and 2 which together take up 41% of the list, while it throws in all time greats elsewhere as token representatives. It's wonky AF.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Certainly not reflected in league revenues.

Which reflects the popularity of football among everyone — old ladies, toddlers, people who have never watched a sport.

It does not reflect the amount of participation or competition in the sport.

The US is about 5% of the world population and an industrialized country and do we have any players in the top 100 of soccer right now? It's not because the world competition is so good, it's because our best athletes are going into other sports.

First, Christian Pulisic is a top 100 player.

More to the point, 90% of NFL and NBA players are not physically suited to succeed in soccer (and vice versa). You do not need a 6’6” 265lb guy on your soccer team. The selective pressures in football are geared toward the wrong body types, and eliminate superior athletes before they ever make it to top competition.

Messi is 5’7” 145lb. What college or pro football player has that frame? Guys shaped like Messi aren’t playing football, they’re off doing other things entirely. American sports don’t encourage general athleticism, they select first for body dimensions and then for refined skill sets.

Really the last thing the rest of the world should want is a US that gives a shit about soccer.

Again, the US puts less resources into its women’s team than its men’s team, and dominates in that area because most of the rest of the world isn’t trying. That’s an indicator of what’s really going on here. Simply being born in America doesn’t make someone inherently a better athlete.

 

[Hasbro]

Which reflects the popularity of football among everyone — old ladies, toddlers, people who have never watched a sport.

It does not reflect the amount of participation or competition in the sport.

It's daycare more than a sport in the US.

First, Christian Pulisic is a top 100 player.

More to the point, 90% of NFL and NBA players are not physically suited to succeed in soccer (and vice versa). You do not need a 6’6” 265lb guy on your soccer team. The selective pressures in football are geared toward the wrong body types, and eliminate superior athletes before they ever make it to top competition.

Messi is 5’7” 145lb. What college or pro football player has that frame? Guys shaped like Messi aren’t playing football, they’re off doing other things entirely. American sports don’t encourage general athleticism, they select first for body dimensions and then for refined skill sets.

And never uses his hands.

Again, the US puts less resources into its women’s team than its men’s team, and dominates in that area because most of the rest of the world isn’t trying. That’s an indicator of what’s really going on here. Simply being born in America doesn’t make someone inherently a better athlete.

Nope, but more people and more resources would make them more likely to develop and 1 in the Top 100 and Team USA just lost to Panama.

 

[x Tame Impala]

An ESPN list doesn't need to reflect soccer much beyond the big names. Fundamentally I think NBA players and NFL players athletic abilities aren't appreciated worldwide as I'm sure the athletic ability of soccer players worldwide isn't appreciated by Americans.

The argument that football is only played in America and therefore not relevant or less relevant to soccer is absurd. Just because more people play it doesn't mean it's less athletic or the competition is not as intense. Football in the states is one of the pride and joys of a nation with 330+ million people. It generates as much revenue as it does for a reason. The competition is some of the toughest around. The things football players do, the size of most players, and the amount of: strength, endurance, agility, intelligence they have to play this game at is incredibly impressive.

Most americans couldn't care less about soccer (for good reason) so i'm not sure why some non-americans are suprised at an ESPN list being impartial.

 

[x Tame Impala]

You do not need a 6’6” 265lb guy on your soccer team. The selective pressures in football are geared toward the wrong body types, and eliminate superior athletes before they ever make it to top competition.

Messi is 5’7” 145lb. What college or pro football player has that frame? Guys shaped like Messi aren’t playing football, they’re off doing other things entirely. American sports don’t encourage general athleticism, they select first for body dimensions and then for refined skill sets.

Messi not being able to cut it in the NFL doesn't mean football doesn't provide top competition. I think the exclusion suggests there's even more athletic difficulty in football than in soccer.

Maybe in high school teams get away with trotting out any scrub who is 6'4" or taller to be a lineman or something but at the college level or NFL...not a chance. These guys have unique body types but they're hardly guaranteed a spot just because of their size. The level of physicality and athleticism a college or pro football player has to have is off the charts and they're competing against a wide enough talent pool, yes even exclusive to the States, justifies their placement and representation on these lists. It's the same for the NBA.

I know this is pompous but the best athletes in the world live in the United States of America. We just have more sporting options than most nations so our talent pool diverts elsewhere. If in some awful, terrible, doomsday bizzaro world scenario where hockey, baseball, basketball, and football didn't exist and Americans only played soccer it would be total domination on a worldwide scale.

 

[norrisnick]

Height of arrogance to believe a nation that is mediocre at a sport could dominate it if only they cared to.

 

[tarheelhockey]

It's daycare more than a sport in the US.

I don’t know what this means tbh.

And never uses his hands.

Upper body strength is a thing in soccer. Is it the main thing, no. But this is like saying QBs don’t use their feet. Yes they do, if you know what you’re looking at.

Nope, but more people and more resources would make them more likely to develop and 1 in the Top 100 and Team USA just lost to Panama.

Maybe, maybe not. There are an absolute shitload of sprinters in the USA, some of them world class athletes with the support of the NFL to ensure they have the best possible sprint speed. That doesn’t mean a guy from Jamaica won’t beat them. Hell, Team USA almost lost a basketball game to South Sudan the other day. Talent comes from all countries and there are important factors other than population and money.

 

[John Mandalorian]

I think we have our wires crossed and are arguing over nothing. I'm not trying to criticise American football, just the notion that it's popularity in literally one particular country matters to the rest of the world in terms of deciding who the greatest 100 athletes since 2000 are. It was being compared to soccer in that context and I continued the comparison in terms of appeal and talent pool. I don't get the prickliness about that.

It's a weird list with horrible methodology that's getting way out of its lane in making an attempt to cover all professional sports across the world and doing it with predictable bias in representation. Basketball and baseball are 1 and 2 which together take up 41% of the list, while it throws in all time greats elsewhere as token representatives. It's wonky AF.

It was established that the 5 largest populations in the world don’t care that much about soccer/football and you still persist with this “no one cares about American football”. It’s comical.