Speculation: Elite things will come...

[arso40]

Under no circumstance is it a viable option to have Mitchell Tyberious Marner on line 3, especially when he's been our best skater all year...not happening.

Put nylander there doesn’t matter they’re still getting there minutes

 

[conFABulator]

Under no circumstance is it a viable option to have Mitchell Tyberious Marner on line 3, especially when he's been our best skater all year...not happening.

Couldn't the argument be made that our best skater can carry a line? If he carries it well then they will get better than third line ice time.

 

[Larcos_Unal]

Put nylander there doesn’t matter they’re still getting there minutes

Couldn't the argument be made that our best skater can carry a line? If he carries it well then they will get better than third line ice time.

Marner/Nylander woudn't be as effective playing with guys that lack the hands/brain to make plays with them. Other teams don't expect their stars to play with scrubs on a 3rd line, neither should we...regardless of their cap hit.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Marner/Nylander woudn't be as effective playing with guys that lack the hands/brain to make plays with them. Other teams don't expect their stars to play with scrubs on a 3rd line, neither should we...regardless of their cap hit.

Good players will produce more with other good players, that's true. It's also true that some players still produce at a high rate even without quality linemates, maybe not quite as high as they would if they had those quality linemates, but still pretty good. Nylander is one of those players, he has always produced no matter who he plays with.

Many have said that no matter who Marner plays with, they have great seasons so I see no reason Marner shouldn't be able to produce without Matthews. If we have M&M both playing with "scrubs", they both might produce less individually, but maybe overall the team produces more.

I've wanted to spread out the scoring for ages. Matthews with Domi, Marner with JT and Nylander with whoever. Might mean less points individually for Matthews and Nylander, but I don't see why we would score any less as a team.

 

[conFABulator]

Marner/Nylander woudn't be as effective playing with guys that lack the hands/brain to make plays with them. Other teams don't expect their stars to play with scrubs on a 3rd line, neither should we...regardless of their cap hit.

These are fair points, but

(a) The individuals may be less effective without other stars on their lines, but isn't the goal the TEAM being more effective? Isn't three lines each scoring 70 goals better than two scoring 90 and one scoring 30? It's the same number of goals but I believe it helps us come playoff time to have better offensive distribution and balance.

(b) We still have PP and third period juggling when we need goals to give our stars time with each other.

(c) We are not really talking about "scrubs" at we. We are talking about five spots in the top nine to be filled by Knies, Domi, Paccioretty, McMann and one of Minten, Robertson, Grebenkin, A. Nylander, Jarnkrok, Holmberg, or a TDL pickup. One of these guys. We have offensive depth and we need to spread it out and don't forget what this means from a match up perspective...every night one of Matthews, Marner, Nylander or Tavares will be up against a third line.

Knies Matthews Domi
Paccioretty Tavares Nylander
McMann Minten Marner

There are 48 ES minutes a night. Give these three lines 42 of those EV every night and let them figure out the balance on a given night, ride the hot hand, etc.

 

[Menzinger]

Marner/Nylander woudn't be as effective playing with guys that lack the hands/brain to make plays with them. Other teams don't expect their stars to play with scrubs on a 3rd line, neither should we...regardless of their cap hit.

On one level I don't disagree, but the counter to that is how the Pens ran things during their last two cup runs where Kessel drove his own line with lesser guys

 

[colchar]

We have one of the highest PDOs at 5v5 and are playing close to 50% hockey at 5v5 by expected stats.

Expected What a pathetically stupid stat.

And before anyone complains about expected stats, this whole thread is built on "don't believe reality, we expect to be better", which I think is a valid thread, just don't want to hear people complain about play driving stats.

Stop using stupid metrics like 'expected' and you won't get called out for it. Use them, and accept being called out.

And yes, the thread is based on expectations and it is stupid too.

 

[notbias]

Expected





Stop using stupid metrics like 'expected' and you won't get called out for it. Use them, and accept being called out.

And yes, the thread is based on expectations and it is stupid too.

They are play-driving metrics based on real stats, if you don't like them or understand them, close your eyes when shots happen and only watch the goals.

Why do you post in threads?

Just post the score after a game and stop analyzing anything, it is just silly to critique people discussing the games when you do the same.

 

[notbias]

Marner/Nylander woudn't be as effective playing with guys that lack the hands/brain to make plays with them. Other teams don't expect their stars to play with scrubs on a 3rd line, neither should we...regardless of their cap hit.

Marner would struggle more than Nylander here, he relies on teammates much more, just his style.

I want Nylander on line 3 really bad, he can be a one-man scoring machine, he has insane puck possession and he plays a simple game at an insanely high level, off the rush he is very effective.

He can still get 20 minutes a night from the PP and double shifting.

This also only works if Domi can be a Marner replacement on line 1 and Marner can shift to Tavares' wing on line 2 effectively.

I think it is worth a look.

 

[Dekes For Days]

On one level I don't disagree, but the counter to that is how the Pens ran things during their last two cup runs where Kessel drove his own line with lesser guys

They only did that in 2016. They rode the hot streak and then abandoned it soon after, because it's not a great long-term strategy. Kessel played with Malkin for the 2017 cup.

 

[Mess]

The stench of the clueless Dubas years are essentially behind us now as we have graduated from Soo Management to real management in positions of consequence, but the damage inflicted still impacted the current team.

Sadly the team is still locked in CAP HELL , due to those bloated overpaid 2nd contracts and the JT signing that started it all with 4 players currently in the top 12 overall and consuming 53% of the teams entire cap. Leafs having 4 of 12 highest paid players and the other 31 teams sharing the other 8 just amplifies this illogical team building strategy.

Leafs are still a very much Kings or Peasants (no middle class) team build with little secondary support coming from the bottom 6 of Leafs roster roster, due to lack of prospects and lack of cap space to fill positions with higher end players. Dubas scorched earth with Leafs draft picks lost and not made has made the overall struggles greater with limited high end ELC young players on the team offsetting the

This team will only ever go as far as those 4 core forwards will carry them and hopefully with better goaltending, coaching and improved Dcore the Leafs can overcome their own self-inflicted Salary Cap handicap system and find success. Sadly I see it more a house of cards then a true Cup contender, knowing that opposition teams need really on keep the core 4 in check to produce early exits.

I'm a realist, however when I see the defending Cup Champion Florida Panthers having 8 players named to the upcoming 4-Nations Cup, it shows how much REAL depth a team can have when you spread out the salary Cap over more of the team.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Leafs 2
Devils 1

Elite things do happen...

 

[Ianturnedbull]

!etile

 

[Petrus]

Cheer up my dude. This team has been winning despite late starts for Woll, many injuries to key players, learning a new system, adjusting to a new coach, managing the bottom 6, etc.

There are still many things this team has that's a formula for winning in the playoffs: goaltending, defense, and a good PK.

Losing 2 regular season games is not the end of the world.

Give them a chance. Elite things will come...

Thank you for keeping the spirits up in here!