Drouin vs Nylander vs Ehlers

[WingsMJN2965]

Why is Drouin here?

 

[jetsforever]

Still prefer Ehlers (who gets fewer opportunities) but Nylander is great as well

 

[rubikscube]

Over the course of their careers, they've been pretty close, but coming off a 31 goal season in a shortened season, I'll keep that guy. There isn't a huge difference, at this point, but if Nylander starts to repeat his most recent season, he'll pull ahead by a good margin, and based on that, I wouldn't trade them 1 for 1.

Drouin? Well, distant third in this group.

It's interesting because the Jets wouldn't trade them 1 for 1 either.

Ehlers has virtually no PP time, and is a top 3 player in thr NHL in zone entries. He's good for 30 goals a year.

It's just rare that 2 players are so interchangeable. The odd HF actually good poll.

 

[joe dirte]

It's interesting because the Jets wouldn't trade them 1 for 1 either.

Ehlers has virtually no PP time, and is a top 3 player in thr NHL in zone entries. He's good for 30 goals a year.

It's just rare that 2 players are so interchangeable. The odd HF actually good poll.

Sure, but I suspect nearly every other team's GM would take Nylander.....

 

[rubikscube]

Sure, but I suspect nearly every other team's GM would take Nylander.....

I don't.

 

[joe dirte]

I don't.

Okay.

 

[McVespa99]

If you want to pick a player that is the most selfish, annoying and the biggest puck puck hog in the NHL, you pick Ehlers
If you want to pick the safest bet, you pick Nylander.
If you want to pick the wild card, but who has the highest potential offensive upside, you pick Drouin.

Im going to have to dissagree with everything you posted....

 

[DRW204]

Ehlers and Nylander are a toss up for me, and likely for everyone. i voted for Ehlers, but might change to Nylander given his versatility being able to play C.

 

[Atoyot]

 

[Albus Dumbledore]

Ehlers is a an amazing transition player, hes faster then willy who is fast and a premier puck carrier in his own right. I think we are beating a dead horse here guys.

We need to compliment ehlers in other ways here folks lol.

 

[Albus Dumbledore]

It's interesting because the Jets wouldn't trade them 1 for 1 either.

Ehlers has virtually no PP time, and is a top 3 player in thr NHL in zone entries. He's good for 30 goals a year.

It's just rare that 2 players are so interchangeable. The odd HF actually good poll.

They're so close in many areas.

They're avg toi in there careers.
Ehlers: 16:26, avg pp 1:55
Nylander: 16:37, avg pp 2:21

 

[Dache]

Sure, but I suspect nearly every other team's GM would take Nylander.....

This is blind jets hate. So typical on HF

 

[biturbo19]

I'd take Nylander. But between Ehlers and Drouin for second choice, i really don't think it's as far off and absurd as many in this thread are making it sound. Certainly not, "in a completely different league" or "Drouin doesn't even belong here" sort of gap for me. I'd give Drouin pretty serious consideration and honestly probably take him over Ehlers and his complete disappearing act when the checking gets tighter and the game gets more physical.

The talent and potential is clearly there with Drouin to match, or even best the others production. Heck, even right now...if you put Drouin in the situation of those other guys, with the opportunity, and caliber of linemates and especially Centers they've had, i'd bet Drouin is right there with them. On a solid contract. He just hasn't really had a top quality Center to play with, since he got to Montreal.

It's not a big sample size, but over ~a quarter season's worth of playoff games for each, Drouin is actually up there just ahead of Nylander even, while Ehlers has scored at ~0.36PPG rate like a mediocre 3rd liner in those scenarios. And the eye test corroborates it, where he doesn't look as effective when the game gets heavier and more locked down defensively. Just feels like every time i see Ehlers putting up a flurry of points, he's piling them on in some "run 'n gun" shootout type game, full of loose hockey and open ice to skate into. He's obviously still a talented, productive, valuable player, and firmly belongs in this sort of strata of comparables...but it's a pretty big wart to just ignore. To where i really do think all three justifiably belong in this poll together.

Drouin just seems to get a bad rap. He's far from a perfect player, but people generally seem harsher on him than they probably need to be. Maybe as some sort of overcorrection to him not really living up to his draft hype? Whatever it is, it seems pervasive, and i don't really get it.

 

[rubikscube]

I'd give Drouin pretty serious consideration and honestly probably take him over Ehlers and his complete disappearing act when the checking gets tighter and the game gets more physical

You typed A LOT to show you know very little about Ehlers playstyle

 

[biturbo19]

You typed A LOT to show you know very little about Ehlers playstyle

Implying what...? You assert that Ehlers really thrives in tight checking, grinding, heavy, physical contests?

 

[MardyBum]

I'd take Nylander. But between Ehlers and Drouin for second choice, i really don't think it's as far off and absurd as many in this thread are making it sound. Certainly not, "in a completely different league" or "Drouin doesn't even belong here" sort of gap for me. I'd give Drouin pretty serious consideration and honestly probably take him over Ehlers and his complete disappearing act when the checking gets tighter and the game gets more physical.

The talent and potential is clearly there with Drouin to match, or even best the others production. Heck, even right now...if you put Drouin in the situation of those other guys, with the opportunity, and caliber of linemates and especially Centers they've had, i'd bet Drouin is right there with them. On a solid contract. He just hasn't really had a top quality Center to play with, since he got to Montreal.

It's not a big sample size, but over ~a quarter season's worth of playoff games for each, Drouin is actually up there just ahead of Nylander even, while Ehlers has scored at ~0.36PPG rate like a mediocre 3rd liner in those scenarios. And the eye test corroborates it, where he doesn't look as effective when the game gets heavier and more locked down defensively. Just feels like every time i see Ehlers putting up a flurry of points, he's piling them on in some "run 'n gun" shootout type game, full of loose hockey and open ice to skate into. He's obviously still a talented, productive, valuable player, and firmly belongs in this sort of strata of comparables...but it's a pretty big wart to just ignore. To where i really do think all three justifiably belong in this poll together.

Drouin just seems to get a bad rap. He's far from a perfect player, but people generally seem harsher on him than they probably need to be. Maybe as some sort of overcorrection to him not really living up to his draft hype? Whatever it is, it seems pervasive, and i don't really get it.

This entire post is, frankly, embarrassing garbage.

 

[Hisch13r]

Nylander and Ehlers are 2 of the most comparable players in the league. It's pretty much always been splitting hairs between the 2. I'll go Ehlers because he's ~1mil cheaper with an extra year on his deal. They're both considerably better than Drouin.

 

[biturbo19]

This entire post is, frankly, embarrassing garbage.

Strongly disagree.

Just calling a post "embarrassing garbage" without actually refuting anything in particular, is more actually garbage imo. Childish, "nuh uh, that's wrong" energy.

 

[Dache]

Implying what...? You assert that Ehlers really thrives in tight checking, grinding, heavy, physical contests?

Are you implying Nylander does?

 

[rubikscube]

Strongly disagree.

Just calling a post "embarrassing garbage" without actually refuting anything in particular, is more actually garbage imo. Childish, "nuh uh, that's wrong" energy.

Honestly, it's so bad it doesn't really dignify a response. You can prefer Nylander, sure. Cool, totally understandable. But your assessment on Ehlers is just plain bad.

 

[heretik27]

Implying what...? You assert that Ehlers really thrives in tight checking, grinding, heavy, physical contests?

I thought he looked really good against Calgary in the playoffs. If anything, Ehlers has a bit of a mean streak and isn't afraid to mix it up with teams that get overly physical.

 

[biturbo19]

Are you implying Nylander does?

Not particularly, no. Just more so than Ehlers. Obviously it's an issue with all three of these guys, which is part of what makes them all good comparables. It's just a bigger issue with Ehlers, in my estimation.

 

[MardyBum]

Strongly disagree.

Just calling a post "embarrassing garbage" without actually refuting anything in particular, is more actually garbage imo. Childish, "nuh uh, that's wrong" energy.

I'd take Nylander.

How can I refute this? You provided no context for your answer, though I suppose it's a bit better than the dozens of people who voted who didn't post.

But between Ehlers and Drouin for second choice, i really don't think it's as far off and absurd as many in this thread are making it sound. Certainly not, "in a completely different league" or "Drouin doesn't even belong here" sort of gap for me. I'd give Drouin pretty serious consideration and honestly probably take him over Ehlers and his complete disappearing act when the checking gets tighter and the game gets more physical.

The talent and potential is clearly there with Drouin to match, or even best the others production. Heck, even right now...if you put Drouin in the situation of those other guys, with the opportunity, and caliber of linemates and especially Centers they've had, i'd bet Drouin is right there with them. On a solid contract. He just hasn't really had a top quality Center to play with, since he got to Montreal.

Hey, so, the first part of this isn't you providing anything but your personal opinion. Great. But you're on an internet forum, so a little more would be nice.

The second part you start to try and grasp at something tangible, and then bolded.

Ehlers played ~16% of his 5v5 ice time with Mark Scheifele last year. The rest he played with Andrew Copp, Blake Wheeler, Jack Roslovic, Cody f***ing Eakin, and Bryan Little as his C. Would just like to confirm with Habs fans how much better those last 5 are than all of the Habs C's. Must be big!

It's not a big sample size, but over ~a quarter season's worth of playoff games for each, Drouin is actually up there just ahead of Nylander even, while Ehlers has scored at ~0.36PPG rate like a mediocre 3rd liner in those scenarios.

And you posted it right there. Sample size.

Ehlers played on a line with Stastny and Laine for a lot of the 2017-18 playoffs.

Stastny had 15 points in 17 games played and shot 26%.

Laine had 12 points in 17 games played and shot 9%.

Ehlers had 7 points in 15 games played and shot 0%.

This is why, when you're talking about a sample size that small you need to look a little deeper than just ppg. It especially helps if you've actually watched the games, which less be honest you haven't considering your following opinions.

Ehlers had terrible puck luck in the 17-18 playoffs. He was absolutely pedestrian in the 18-19 playoffs like a lot of Jets players, but also like a few other Jets he was injured. He also again, went 0/26 in shots, making some "special" Jets fans wonder if he'd ever score a goal again.

And the eye test corroborates it, where he doesn't look as effective when the game gets heavier and more locked down defensively. Just feels like every time i see Ehlers putting up a flurry of points, he's piling them on in some "run 'n gun" shootout type game, full of loose hockey and open ice to skate into. He's obviously still a talented, productive, valuable player, and firmly belongs in this sort of strata of comparables...but it's a pretty big wart to just ignore. To where i really do think all three justifiably belong in this poll together.

No, your eye test does. Ehlers is always one of the more engaged forwards in the top 6 for the Jets. People seem to think "engaged" means chasing the play and putting yourself in bad positions trying to hit. This isn't the 1990's. Even when he's not scoring points he's transitioning the puck at an elite level, or making plays to draw penalties at an elite level that he rarely gets to benefit from. He also gets frustrated and acts out physically, throwing out hits and picking fights with people who he really shouldn't. "He doesn't look effective" is another word for "I read the game summary and he didn't score so he sux"

This is where the disconnect comes in. We see these half-brained articles from NHL.com, TSN, SC etc calling Connor or Laine or Wheeler or all 3 top 20 wingers, we see the same from posters on here who only scoreboard watch, when they are all worse than Ehlers currently. We have large portions of part-time Jets watchers telling us how good our players are and it's frankly embarrassing. They all may have things they do better than Ehlers, but overall it's not close at the moment.

Drouin just seems to get a bad rap. He's far from a perfect player, but people generally seem harsher on him than they probably need to be. Maybe as some sort of overcorrection to him not really living up to his draft hype? Whatever it is, it seems pervasive, and i don't really get it.

He "gets a bad rap" because he was drafted higher than both of them, and in a better draft, and gets consistently compared to them, especially Ehlers as they were both Mooseheads. He's not a bad player, and in the right offensive situation he could be better than he currently sits imo. I don't know if that's going to be under a Julien system but at least no one is laughably calling him a bust anymore. But he's not in the Nylander/Ehlers tier at the moment.

 

[wabagee]

I’d love to see the same chart with the other two.

 

[biturbo19]

I thought he looked really good against Calgary in the playoffs. If anything, Ehlers has a bit of a mean streak and isn't afraid to mix it up with teams that get overly physical.

He can be a little bit chippy, and his fuse can be a little bit short at times. But most of what i've seen from him in that realm, is more the sort of ticky tacky stuff after the whistle, behind the play, low key dirty sort of stuff, etc. Rather than effective "grit" within the hockey play. Often seems to come out when he is frustrated trying to slog through a game that isn't playing into his style, and isn't scoring. Don't really see it as a lack of willingness to try to play through that (which is more Nylander's issue at times), so much as limited effectiveness in doing so.