Prospect Info: Draft 2025 - Everyone is trading up, but no one seems to be trading down edition

[Ryder71]

All of those players are ranked in that range, so just accept it.

Absolutely not, if one of those players are taken at 11th OA it would be a mistake as all have significant flaws and better alternatives will be available.

 

[Turin]

Absolutely not, if one of those players are taken at 11th OA it would be a mistake as all have significant flaws and better alternatives will be available.

There’s a good chance there are no better alternatives. You listed every player ranked in that area except Eklund and said they are unacceptable. That’s dumb.

 

[Zirakzigil]

Any player in our range is going to have flaws. Id personally rather "reach" on Kindel than take a defenseman. At least 1 of the top 10 is going to drop. Just a matter of which one and if Dubas takes them.

 

[Ryder71]

Any player in our range is going to have flaws. Id personally rather "reach" on Kindel than take a defenseman. At least 1 of the top 10 is going to drop. Just a matter of which one and if Dubas takes them.

Reschny or Kindel would be much better picks than the players I mentioned. Their respective skillsets and ceilings are higher IMO. You can teach a defensemen better positioning, structure and such, you can't teach vision or skill though.

There’s a good chance there are no better alternatives. You listed every player ranked in that area except Eklund and said they are unacceptable. That’s dumb.

Clearly you haven't researched the draft that much.

 

[Zirakzigil]

Reschny or Kindel would be much better picks than the players I mentioned. Their respective skillsets and ceilings are higher IMO. You can teach a defensemen better positioning, structure and such, you can't teach vision or skill though.

I think Kindel is being overlooked and is going to be one of those picks that goes mid round and ends up being a solid top 6 player.

 

[Ryder71]

I think Kindel is being overlooked and is going to be one of those picks that goes mid round and ends up being a solid top 6 player.

I prefer Reschny, but Kindel has a similar arc IMO. I like em both. Better than the defensemen being bantered about. And McQueen with those back issues, no thanks.

Also Reschny and Kindel are April Bdays, so lots of upside and potential. Really like their respective trajectory. Vision for each is near the top of this '25 class. Reschny reminds me of Brayden Point. If each were an inch or two taller they'd be top 8 picks. Their skill is unmistakable.

I'd love JOB, Martin or Eklund, if one of them are there that'd be where I'd go. If not...

Try to get 8th OA if possible. That shouldn't be outta the realm of possibility.

 

[Zirakzigil]

Im not concerned about McQueen. Teams have his medical records at this point, its all in the open. You cant teach size. Yeah he might bust, or he might be a beast of a top 6 center. I have no problems with that pick at 11 but I highly doubt he drops.

 

[Ryder71]

Look at Reschny's vision and skill. Damn!



There's Kindel. Both he and Reschny are better than those stupid defensemen!

Im not concerned about McQueen. Teams have his medical records at this point, its all in the open. You cant teach size. Yeah he might bust, or he might be a beast of a top 6 center. I have no problems with that pick at 11 but I highly doubt he drops.

There's a couple scenarios there where by he could be a very good top six player. BUT IMO it's more likely he's a bust or a very big disappointment. I'd rather another team take that risk than us.

 

[Zirakzigil]

There's a couple scenarios there where by he could be a very good top six player. BUT IMO it's more likely he's a bust or a very big disappointment. I'd rather another team take that risk than us.

If he is the one that falls and its him or one of the defensemen I take him. I wouldnt trade up to take him though.

 

[Ryder71]

If he is the one that falls and its him or one of the defensemen I take him. I wouldnt trade up to take him though.

I'd prefer Bear but his skating is good but not great. Kinda a choppy skater. Really good though in traffic and tight spaces. Reschny and Kindel are very fluid in their skating and Reschny in particular uses his linemates exceptionally well.

 

[HandshakeLine]

There's a couple scenarios there where by he could be a very good top six player. BUT IMO it's more likely he's a bust or a very big disappointment. I'd rather another team take that risk than us.

Yeah, and honestly, as much as I’d like McQueen’s supposed game on paper, every clip of him I’ve seen seems to not support all these “big mean guy with skill” claims. it’s kinda of weird how much disconnect there is, actually.

 

[TojoP]

Is the negativity around McQueen because of the back injury or are there other concerns?

Smith I get because while he has every physical gift, no guarantee he breaks out offensively and hockey sense usually doesn't come later. He's borderline for me, won't be thrilled or upset.

Mrtka just feels kind of raw. Never had a skating or skills coach. A little awkwardness most taller kids have. So I could see him improving quite a bit even if he's not a PP1QB. I don't mind him.

But I'm sure there are people here who've done more research so I'm open to having my mind changed. Just curious. It could also be possible some of us just look for different qualities (ex size v speed).

 

[Ryder71]

Is the negativity around McQueen because of the back injury or are there other concerns?

Smith I get because while he has every physical gift, no guarantee he breaks out offensively and hockey sense usually doesn't come later. He's borderline for me, won't be thrilled or upset.

Mrtka just feels kind of raw. Never had a skating or skills coach. A little awkwardness most taller kids have. So I could see him improving quite a bit even if he's not a PP1QB. I don't mind him.

But I'm sure there are people here who've done more research so I'm open to having my mind changed. Just curious. It could also be possible some of us just look for different qualities (ex size v speed).

Mrtka is extremely raw. And he could be a solid top four, but I wouldn't count on him being much more. Not a player I'd want at 11th OA.

We need skilled forwards plain and simple.

Yeah, and honestly, as much as I’d like McQueen’s supposed game on paper, every clip of him I’ve seen seems to not support all these “big mean guy with skill” claims. it’s kinda of weird how much disconnect there is, actually.

I'm dubious of any big guy who had that severe of an injury that early on in his career. As a result You're predisposed to having back issues as you play, take contact and navigate the game at a much faster and higher level. Doesn't guarantee it necessarily but it's far more likely. At 11th OA, hard pass!

 

[HandshakeLine]

Is the negativity around McQueen because of the back injury or are there other concerns?

Smith I get because while he has every physical gift, no guarantee he breaks out offensively and hockey sense usually doesn't come later. He's borderline for me, won't be thrilled or upset.

Mrtka just feels kind of raw. Never had a skating or skills coach. A little awkwardness most taller kids have. So I could see him improving quite a bit even if he's not a PP1QB. I don't mind him.

But I'm sure there are people here who've done more research so I'm open to having my mind changed. Just curious. It could also be possible some of us just look for different qualities (ex size v speed).

I just frankly don’t see this huge potential people talk about in the clips of him. Injury-woes aside, I feel like people are talking him because of size and stats. I’m willing to admit I probably haven’t seen enough of him, but that’s just the vibe I’m getting. He’s not physical in a way that translates into being a “physical” guy in the NHL where even the shorter players are far heavier and stronger, and I think people are just assuming he’s going to fill out and be huge based on the fact he’s 6’6”.

And while people say “you can’t teach size”, there’s a huge number of bigger players who never learn to use their frames and play “physical”. Being tall isn’t always an asset otherwise Bjugstad would have been a star.

And while people say “you can’t teach size”, there’s a huge number of bigger players who never learn to use their frames and play “physical”. Being tall isn’t always an asset otherwise Bjugstad would have been a star.

 

[Jared Grayden]

Is the negativity around McQueen because of the back injury or are there other concerns?

Smith I get because while he has every physical gift, no guarantee he breaks out offensively and hockey sense usually doesn't come later. He's borderline for me, won't be thrilled or upset.

Mrtka just feels kind of raw. Never had a skating or skills coach. A little awkwardness most taller kids have. So I could see him improving quite a bit even if he's not a PP1QB. I don't mind him.

But I'm sure there are people here who've done more research so I'm open to having my mind changed. Just curious. It could also be possible some of us just look for different qualities (ex size v speed).

Some opinions started souring from Marshall, St. Laurent, and Farkas all being quite negative in their breakdowns on McQueen. I view him as a higher floor and lower ceiling prospect than most others project. His handling is the only trait I see being high end. I expect more of a shutdown depth center.

Smith I do view as a high risk/reward prospect. Physical tools are really impressive and he has skill. Might end up a 7D because he can't meet the mental processing requirements for the NHL.

Mrtka I view as being pretty safe second pairing dman, likely more of a second pairing matchup dman to me. Doubt his offense will ever be much. But he doesn't have major gaps in his game. Needs to be more physical. Probably gone by #11.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think McQueen can become a strong 2-way 2C, but I agree that I don’t see the traits that suggests a higher upside than that. I could absolutely be wrong but I think he’d need to take a big step forward after being drafted.

That said, him turning into a Staal type of 2C would be a very good pick at #11. I wouldn’t be mad at all if they drafted him at that spot, they need centers so desperately that even a defensive 2C upside would be a welcome pick.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I also think I’d be much more willing to stomach drafting a guy with huge question marks with the Rangers pick than the Penguins pick. I’d be totally fine with Eklund at #11 and McQueen/Smith at #12, but I’d be pretty uncomfortable if they took high risk but high reward prospects with both of their picks.

The most ideal scenario to me is O’Brien at #11 and Eklund at #12, but any combination of 2 guys at different positions would be good with me. Any combination you could make here:

C: O’Brien and McQueen
W: Eklund, Bear and Lakovic
D: Mrtka, Aitcheson and Smith

I’d be okay with, with noting that some (namely Bear/Lakovic and Aitcheson) would be really pushing it for me. I’d probably rank my preferences as:

1. O’Brien and Eklund
2. O’Brien and Mrtka
3. McQueen and Eklund
4. McQueen and Mrtka
5. O’Brien and Smith

 

[eXile3]

Is the negativity around McQueen because of the back injury or are there other concerns?

Smith I get because while he has every physical gift, no guarantee he breaks out offensively and hockey sense usually doesn't come later. He's borderline for me, won't be thrilled or upset.

Mrtka just feels kind of raw. Never had a skating or skills coach. A little awkwardness most taller kids have. So I could see him improving quite a bit even if he's not a PP1QB. I don't mind him.

But I'm sure there are people here who've done more research so I'm open to having my mind changed. Just curious. It could also be possible some of us just look for different qualities (ex size v speed).

It seems to be internet group think. There’s a reason scouts are saying he’s a top 10 pick. He’s obviously not a perfect prospect but he’s not nearly devoid of talent as internet scouts have made it out to be.

 

[Empoleon8771]

It seems to be internet group think. There’s a reason scouts are saying he’s a top 10 pick. He’s obviously not a perfect prospect but he’s not nearly devoid of talent as internet scouts have made it out to be.

Nah this is just an appeal to authority, a lot of people here have actually taken the time to watch McQueen and have come away unimpressed. I know Jesse did a deep dive on McQueen when he was throwing together his videos of prospects and came away super unimpressed, with noting that Lakovic actually looks like what McQueen is advertised to be.

McQueen is a skilled guy for his size, but he’s not that skilled in general and wouldn’t be a 1st round pick if not for his size. I think he’s more of a mid 2nd round talent that happens to be massive. I also don’t think he’s even the most skilled big guy in the draft, I think Lakovic has more natural talent than McQueen but Lakovic has major red flags that are honestly more scary to me than McQueen.

 

[eXile3]

Nah this is just an appeal to authority, a lot of people here have actually taken the time to watch McQueen and have come away unimpressed. I know Jesse did a deep dive on McQueen when he was throwing together his videos of prospects and came away super unimpressed, with noting that Lakovic actually looks like what McQueen is advertised to be.

McQueen is a skilled guy for his size, but he’s not that skilled in general and wouldn’t be a 1st round pick if not for his size. I think he’s more of a mid 2nd round talent that happens to be massive. I also don’t think he’s even the most skilled big guy in the draft, I think Lakovic has more natural talent than McQueen but Lakovic has major red flags that are honestly more scary to me than McQueen.

A lot of people who have taken time to watch him actually really like him. I’ll admit I don’t have time to watch all his shifts but I follow a lot of prospect accounts on YouTube, instagram, and Substack, and there are people who see his skills translating to the NHL.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

A few thoughts about this subject. Lots of people want to keep losing because they want greater assurances that we hit on our first-round picks. Well, the draft is always a crapshoot so there are no assurances. But the scouts are paid to hit on first-round picks. And the first-round pick is a completely different animal than the rest of the draft. The scouts need to replenish the system with the rest of the draft. Those players should be trade fodder, injury call-ups and most importantly players who can try to beat someone else out of a job with a strong training camp. But the first-rounder is different. That is a player GMs SHOULD be projecting into the lineup down the road. He has to be part of the plans. Otherwise, why are we drafting him?

Ask yourselves this: would you trade a first-round pick for the player you want to draft in the first round? If the answer is no, then never draft that player in the first round.

This comes back to Kashawn Aitcheson. I love what this player brings to the table. In fact, he sounds an awful lot like Arber Xhekaj from the reports about him as a player. And ironically, Xhekaj is a player I have been advocating we bring in this off-season. I love his skill set and I think he would be great for us. HOWEVER, Arber Xhekaj was an undrafted free agent. You could argue that teams made a mistake with him, sure. But there is no way I am drafting THIS skill set in the first round. This is the type of skill set you acquire in free agency or via trade, not with a first-round draft pick.

I want Dubas and co. to err on the side of UPSIDE. Every first-round pick should be high-upside players. For the most part, draft a forward in the first round. Your chances of hitting are far greater. If it is a defenseman, aim for the moon a la Zayne Parekh type. The D-men in the 11 range, heck the entire first round aside from No. 1 overall, are not interesting at all this year. At least for me. And do I even need to say it, NO GOALTENDERS in the first round. EVER.

ELCs are ridiculously underrated and undervalued when building a team. You cannot waste them. Make them count. I don't care if we go "off the board" because all that means is they prefer players that others do not. Stick with your identity and take the player with the most upside and ability to pan out.

For me, if the 7 centers and Eklund are all gone, I am probably going off the board. Reschny, Kindel are probably next for me. And this is why I don't mind the idea of trading down. If Mtl wants to move up from 16 to 11, for example, to draft Carter Bear or Malcom Spence or Layden Lakovic, I would move down. If you can get an Owen Beck, Oliver Kapanen, Arber Xhekaj or something like that, AND then get a guy like Kindel or Reschny, that is a win for us.

Aim high. Draft for upside above all else.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Aim high. Draft for upside above all else.

If you want to draft based on upside, Eklund probably isn’t the guy you want to pick there. At least not over Smith or Lakovic.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I think McQueen can become a strong 2-way 2C, but I agree that I don’t see the traits that suggests a higher upside than that. I could absolutely be wrong but I think he’d need to take a big step forward after being drafted.

That said, him turning into a Staal type of 2C would be a very good pick at #11. I wouldn’t be mad at all if they drafted him at that spot, they need centers so desperately that even a defensive 2C upside would be a welcome pick.

I mostly just question if drafting non-elite 2 way C’s is the best use of a 11OA pick even in a weak draft.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I mostly just question if drafting non-elite 2 way C’s is the best use of a 11OA pick even in a weak draft.

I don’t think anyone else they’d realistically take there would be any better. Unless a guy slides, I think anyone they pick either has middle-6 or middle pair upside (Eklund or Mrtka) or has massive boom/bust potential (Lakovic or Smith).

 

[deakka]

Seems a lot of us don't wanna draft Aitcheson. Which ofc means that what gonna happen.

I'm with the above poster. You don't draft for thoghness in the top half of the 1st, you just don't.

He's the oldest in the draft, early growth spurt beating up on smaller guys, wow? Home impressive!

Add to that questionable offensive upside and low hockey IQ.

My god. I'm already fuming and we haven't even drafted him yet.
Gonna have a strike when we actually pick him...