Does Mitch seem different since coming back from the 4 Nations?

[Maple Leaf]

Hell I might move a couple hours east and become a senators fan too eh

I was thinking about that as the leafs are cooked might support the senators but no I will just stop watching until it I forget about this nightmare

 

[Dekes For Days]

So on the high end he eclipses Drai. On the low end everyone else except AM.

Draisaitl and Matthews were both in the 15-16% range.

 

[thewave]

Draisaitl and Matthews were both in the 15-16% range.

I would argue the following.

AM and LD are C's
AM is the Captain
AM and LD have multiple awards.
LD hugely productive in deep runs
AM has 3 Rockets - hardest achievement

I would the bring up many other wingers who are comparable in the 11-12.5% range. Based on a 96m cap, 12.5% is $12M


That would be my final offer. Equal to Rantanen

 

[ToneDog]

I would argue the following.

AM and LD are C's
AM is the Captain
AM and LD have multiple awards.
LD hugely productive in deep runs
AM has 3 Rockets - hardest achievement

I would the bring up many other wingers who are comparable in the 11-12.5% range. Based on a 96m cap, 12.5% is $12M


That would be my final offer. Equal to Rantanen

Sounds like they've already offered him $13+m. You think the Leafs have enough balls to take that offer off the table?

 

[thewave]

Sounds like they've already offered him $13+m. You think the Leafs have enough balls to take that offer off the table?

I would. It would be off and gone as of the 7th.

 

[IPS]

Sounds like they've already offered him $13+m. You think the Leafs have enough balls to take that offer off the table?

He wants to be in the Drai/Mack/Matthews bracket of pay. He will happily tarnish any good will that remains with the fanbase to try and get it too.

 

[thewave]

He wants to be in the Drai/Mack/Matthews bracket of pay. He will happily tarnish any good will that remains with the fanbase to try and get it too.

I would laugh if the Leafs walk from it and he lands a 7x11 or 11.5m

 

[Dekes For Days]

I would the bring up many other wingers who are comparable in the 11-12.5% range

There are none.

 

[Zybalto]

Draisaitl and Matthews were both in the 15-16% range.

Feels like Draisaitl is most interesting is as we all talk about guys like Rantanen and Marner, Draisaitl is also not really "the man" on his team and much like Rantanen, his numbers away from "the man" on his team (McDavid) on a line are pretty rough the last 3 years in the playoffs.

5v5 in the playoffs the last 3 years:

McDavid/Draisailtl:
Goals for: 38
Goals Against: 17

McDavid without Draisaitl:
Goals for: 31
Goals Against: 23

Draisaitl without McDavid:
Goals for: 21
Goals Against: 33

...all in roughly a close amount of minutes sample sizes.

Draisaitl goes from a 13 million dollar 5v5 player to a million dollar one with the removal of just one player in the playoffs. Edmonton better hope McDavid stays with them above all else. They do have insane chemistry together and I don't think the loss of a player will hurt a team more than the Oilers losing McDavid in maybe the history of hockey.

 

[thewave]

There are none.

Rantanen just got 12m and is better

 

[thewave]

Feels like Draisaitl is most interesting is as we all talk about guys like Rantanen and Marner, Draisaitl is also not really "the man" on his team and much like Rantanen, his numbers away from "the man" on his team (McDavid) on a line are pretty rough the last 3 years in the playoffs.

5v5 in the playoffs the last 3 years:

McDavid/Draisailtl:
Goals for: 38
Goals Against: 17

McDavid without Draisaitl:
Goals for: 31
Goals Against: 23

Draisaitl without McDavid:
Goals for: 21
Goals Against: 33

...all in roughly a close amount of minutes sample sizes.

Draisaitl goes from a 13 million dollar 5v5 player to a million dollar one with the removal of just one player in the playoffs. Edmonton better hope McDavid stays with them above all else. They do have insane chemistry together and I don't think the loss of a player will hurt a team more than the Oilers losing McDavid in maybe the history of hockey.

McDavid with Willy would be insane.

 

[IPS]

Feels like Draisaitl is most interesting is as we all talk about guys like Rantanen and Marner, Draisaitl is also not really "the man" on his team and much like Rantanen, his numbers away from "the man" on his team (McDavid) on a line are pretty rough the last 3 years in the playoffs.

5v5 in the playoffs the last 3 years:

McDavid/Draisailtl:
Goals for: 38
Goals Against: 17

McDavid without Draisaitl:
Goals for: 31
Goals Against: 23

Draisaitl without McDavid:
Goals for: 21
Goals Against: 33

...all in roughly a close amount of minutes sample sizes.

Draisaitl goes from a 13 million dollar 5v5 player to a million dollar one with the removal of just one player in the playoffs. Edmonton better hope McDavid stays with them above all else. They do have insane chemistry together and I don't think the loss of a player will hurt a team more than the Oilers losing McDavid in maybe the history of hockey.

You truly are the master at speedbagging other player's careers to try and prop up the Leafs.

If you've watched 1 second of Draistaitl in the playoffs you would not be claiming he's a "product of McDavid." He's a gamer to the core and the whole hockey world knows it.

Your takes just keep getting more awful, not sure how it was possible but you keep setting the bar.

 

[Zybalto]

You truly are the master at speedbagging other player's careers to try and prop up the Leafs.

If you've watched 1 second of Draistaitl in the playoffs you would not be claiming he's a "product of McDavid." He's a gamer to the core and the whole hockey world knows it.

Your takes just keep getting more awful, not sure how it was possible but you keep setting the bar.

He's a gamer with McDavid no doubt and they are one of the best 1-2 punches in the history of hockey. Their PP chemistry in legendary.

Pointing out the fact he has brutal numbers in the playoffs away from him isnt spin of any kind. He just has brutal numbers away from him. Im not conjuring those up out of thin air. Its a plain fact. Just because you dont want to believe it doesnt make it any less true.


I can help him out a bit if you like. Like the Leafs, the Oilers have had weak support and poor goaltending which helps make a case its not all on him. He also tends to have tougher usage away from McDavid.

His numbers are still rough.

 

[Zybalto]

McDavid with Willy would be insane.

McDavid with anyone would be insane. If there was 100% certainty McDavid was coming here, it would be Mitch who? around here. I dont think the Oilers are letting him go though.

 

[IPS]

He's a gamer with McDavid no doubt and they are one of the best 1-2 punches in the history of hockey. Their PP chemistry in legendary.

Pointing out the fact he has brutal numbers in the playoffs away from him isnt spin of any kind. He just has brutal numbers away from him. Im not conjuring those up out of thin air. Its a plain fact. Just because you dont want to believe it doesnt make it any less true.


I can help him out a bit if you like. Like the Leafs, the Oilers have had weak support and poor goaltending which helps make a case its not all on him. He also tends to have tougher usage away from McDavid.

His numbers are still rough.

And just like all the other numbers you post - you maybe post about 30% of the actual relevant data that needs to be taken into account alongside it to actually get any semblance of an accurate picture.

Just like those morons a couple years ago attributing Pastrnak's production to the Marchand-Bergeron duo he played with (I don't think it was you, it was other posters) and how his numbers were just so awful away from them that he couldn't possibly produce on his own. You go and you watch the games and you see it's not even remotely accurate, much like this claim with Draisaitl.

I love posts like those cause they always age like milk.

 

[Confucius]

I would laugh if the Leafs walk from it and he lands a 7x11 or 11.5m

7 for 11 does seem worse than 8 for 11. lol!

 

[Zybalto]

And just like all the other numbers you post - you maybe post about 30% of the actual relevant data that needs to be taken into account alongside it to actually get any semblance of an accurate picture.

Just like those morons a couple years ago attributing Pastrnak's production to the Marchand-Bergeron duo he played with (I don't think it was you, it was other posters) and how his numbers were just so awful away from them that he couldn't possibly produce on his own. You go and you watch the games and you see it's not even remotely accurate, much like this claim with Draisaitl.

I love posts like those cause they always age like milk.

Oh, you can notice when Drai and McDavid arnt together....mainly because its impossible to miss them constantly finding each other out there on the ice. It's like Gretz/Kurri chemistry.

Drai has shown signs in the regular seasons at certain points he can carry a line up to that level but the playoffs have been a different beast for him.

 

[IPS]

Oh, you can notice when Drai and McDavid arnt together....mainly because its impossible to miss them constantly finding each other out there on the ice. It's like Gretz/Kurri chemistry.

Drai has shown signs in the regular seasons at certain points he can carry a line up to that level but the playoffs have been a different beast for him.

You know what - you shouldn't even be asking me anyway, what do I know. Go post your theory on the Oil board and see how they react to it. The fans who watch every team's game every year and know Drai 10x better than we do.

One of the biggest pet peeves of Oiler's fans is Drai getting dismissed as having his production inflated by McDavid.

 

[Zybalto]

You know what - you shouldn't even be asking me anyway, what do I know. Go post your theory on the Oil board and see how they react to it. The fans who watch every team's game every year and know Drai 10x better than we do.

One of the biggest pet peeves of Oiler's fans is Drai getting dismissed as having his production inflated by McDavid.

In the end, what does it matter if his lines give up the most goals of any almost top line fowards in the league in the playoffs(which is the case). The fact they can outscore any defensive/goaltending issues in the playoffs works just fine (and have Skinner steal them a game or 2 like the clinching game in Dallas last year).

I catch games when I can and we'll see if Draisaitl can buck the trend this year. He may be having the best season of his career overall and his defensive numbers are solid.

 

[IPS]

In the end, what does it matter if his lines give up the most goals of any almost top line fowards in the league in the playoffs(which is the case). The fact they can outscore any defensive/goaltending issues in the playoffs works just fine (and have Skinner steal them a game or 2 like the clinching game in Dallas last year).

I catch games when I can and we'll see if Draisaitl can buck the trend this year. He may be having the best season of his career overall and his defensive numbers are solid.

When you're dealing with a player like Drai who's body of work over his career is so insanely consistent you're gonna need to provide way, way more than some simple GF/GA numbers to get the full picture of what's actually happening. For non-pandemic years he's on about a 7-year streak now of 100+ points and somehow he maintains this consistency in the postseason too, you don't end up with 108 points, 41 goals in 74 games by some fluke or being some bizarre external circumstances.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Rantanen just got 12m and is better

Rantanen got 12m and is worse.

 

[ACC1224]

Still pretty much running away with it as the team scoring leader.

 

[Zybalto]

When you're dealing with a player like Drai who's body of work over his career is so insanely consistent you're gonna need to provide way, way more than some simple GF/GA numbers to get the full picture of what's actually happening. For non-pandemic years he's on about a 7-year streak now of 100+ points and somehow he maintains this consistency in the postseason too, you don't end up with 108 points, 41 goals in 74 games by some fluke or being some bizarre external circumstances.

I don't think both teams have had great goalies in net but just compare Marner away from Matthews and Rantanen away from MacKinnon to Draisaitl away from McDavid

5v5 Over the last 3 years in the playoffs, Robin without Batman:
TOI:
Draisaitl: 476 minutes
Rantanen: 243 minutes
Marner: 149 minutes

Goals For/60:
Draisaitl: 2.63
Rantanen: 2.52
Marner: 2.39

Goals Allowed/60:
Draisaitl: 4.15
Rantanen: 3.18
Marner: 1.18

My whole point was that the Oilers should resign McDavid at any cost because its not just losing a generational player, its breaking up one of the greatest combos ever and Drai has NOT been effective in the playoffs without him. (and, yea I snuck in Marner being a lockdown defensive stud lol)

Still pretty much running away with it as the team scoring leader.

View attachment 991057

Hope McMann can hit that 20 goal mark.

 

[notDatsyuk]

I am in favour of keeping Marner, even if that means paying him a fair contract. That does not screw the team. That helps the team.

There I agree with you - if he would accept a fair contract (something around $11.5M) it would help the team.

 

[Antropovsky]

Kind of surprised if the rumors of Marner wanting $13M x 8 years are true. I didn't expect him to want an eight-year deal. Still don’t think he really does. $13M seems about market value for him. I wouldn’t give it to him, but I could see a team with cap space and limited forward talent having a reason to want him.

But if the Leafs don’t want to pay him $13M x 8, that likely means he’s not in their plans unless "MAYBE" he’s willing to take the same contract as Willy.

You can argue whose more valuable to the team, but aside from whose more valuable, paying Marner more would once again put additional pressure on him, making him the de facto #2 face of the team. As much as Marner wants that, it hasn’t gone well over the past five years. He’s too big a distraction, struggles with criticism, and isn’t a great speaker. For example look at yesterdays postgame, he could've just said, "no boys, won't be talking contract" and held firm and even just walked away, but he literally panicked and said way too much and nearly broke down in tears. Management had to come to the rescue again for him the following day and tell media to back off.

The Leafs would be doing both themselves and Marner a favor by giving him the same contract as Nylander.

Something doesn't add up though, if term isnt an issue and If Marner and Treliving are only 1.4 million apart...why would Treliving go to Marner and ask him to waive for Rantanen... and also, why would Marner "have a feeling" he might be asked to waive at the deadline?

Somethings missing.