Does Marner get Boo’d?

[Antropovsky]

The Crosby/MacKinnon pre season skates are intense as hell and it’s invitation only. The only invite guys they feel can keep up with that level of intensity. It’s not a leisure skate by any means.

The public perception of Marner isn’t ever going to be same as the players. They absolutely love the guy. The public doesn’t get to spend all day with Marner so the public can only go off what they see on TV. I think most players do agree Marner gets more shit than is deserved in Toronto but that’s what comes with the salary cap. But he’s a hell of a talent, everyone can see that, so can his peers. He’s just a little overpaid. But so is Willy and Auston.

Not sure why you and others feel like other players around the league need to lie for Marner or something lmao. There isn’t any incentive for them to speak out and defend him. They like him and think he’s a good player, that’s all that matters. If you don’t, you don’t. But to think there’s a secret agenda for Marner is outrageous.

so you think its free gamw to hit eachother in thw training?

Also you think a player who is approached by the media and just trained with another player would say the player is a bit overrated, if thats what they believed?

Ive never denied that Marner is liked by people.

 

[Bust]

I think most players do agree Marner gets more shit than is deserved in Toronto but that’s what comes with the salary cap. But he’s a hell of a talent, everyone can see that, so can his peers.

This is what happens when you play extreme hardball during contract negotiation. So you are absolutely correct when you say perception differes from the players vs the fanbase/media. We are not in the room, the contract negotiation is the only version of Marner this fanbase was exposed to, that and the combativeness with the media. This is what a majority sees Marner as, as this is all we’ve been exposed too…

Nylander got shit on endlessly for the holdout - difference being he was signed for 6.9mil. It’s easy to insulate a contract like that.

If you demand 11mil + you are opening the door for criticism. Nylander will feel it much differently this year than he ever has, and if his play begins to slip he will hear it.

 

[francis246]

so you think its free gamw to hit eachother in thw training?

Also you think a player who is approached by the media and just trained with another player would say the player is a bit overrated, if thats what they believed?

Ive never denied that Marner is liked by people.

When NHL players don't like a guy they have never been shy to speak their mind. I remember Mike Hoffmann for example, even his own teammates were blasting him in the media coming into a training camp.

The thing is, I don't think they feel is overrated. I feel like MAYBE they feel he is overpaid, but I don't think there is any player in the league that feels he is an overrated player. If they did, I don't think they even invite him to train or even comment on the matter. If anything the messaging this summer suggest that the players around the league feel he is underappreciated by Toronto fans.

 

[Fogelhund]

We all know this, Leafs fans know he is one of the best players in the league. We just are growing impatient, waiting for this level of talent to show itself in the playoffs. All the talent in the world is meaningless, if you can't deliver when it counts.

 

[Tie Domi Esquire]

Nathan MacKinnon defends Mitch Marner: 'One of the best'

Nathan MacKinnon is sticking up for one of his good friends, Mitch Marner.

www.sportsnet.ca

Is this like when Colorado played in Toronto and before the game he randomly did an interview talking about how important taking a discount is when you want to win?

 

[ACC1224]

Is this like when Colorado played in Toronto and before the game he randomly did an interview talking about how important taking a discount is when you want to win?

No it doesn't seem like that. What part of it were you confused by?

 

[Antropovsky]

When NHL players don't like a guy they have never been shy to speak their mind. I remember Mike Hoffmann for example, even his own teammates were blasting him in the media coming into a training camp.

The thing is, I don't think they feel is overrated. I feel like MAYBE they feel he is overpaid, but I don't think there is any player in the league that feels he is an overrated player. If they did, I don't think they even invite him to train or even comment on the matter. If anything the messaging this summer suggest that the players around the league feel he is underappreciated by Toronto fans.

1) Do players hit eachother during the training?

2) Ive bolded the key points in your last two posts:

The public perception of Marner isn’t ever going to be same as the players. They absolutely love the guy

When NHL players don't like a guy they have never been shy to speak their mind. I remember Mike Hoffmann

Well we've already established that Marner is liked by players. So what about players that are liked but other players but they think hes overrated? Then are players typically honest in front of the media?

 

[ACC1224]

View attachment 906435

We all know this, Leafs fans know he is one of the best players in the league. We just are growing impatient, waiting for this level of talent to show itself in the playoffs. All the talent in the world is meaningless, if you can't deliver when it counts.

Yep, and he's just one of many.

 

[francis246]

This is what happens when you play extreme hardball during contract negotiation. So you are absolutely correct when you say perception differes from the players vs the fanbase/media. We are not in the room, the contract negotiation is the only version of Marner this fanbase was exposed to, that and the combativeness with the media. This is what a majority sees Marner as, as this is all we’ve been exposed too…

Nylander got shit on endlessly for the holdout - difference being he was signed for 6.9mil. It’s easy to insulate a contract like that.

If you demand 11mil + you are opening the door for criticism. Nylander will feel it much differently this year than he ever has, and if his play begins to slip he will hear it.

Couldn’t agree more. Either way I do think we’ll probably see the best of this group.
I’m not expecting a cup win but I think they will claw to a conference final appearance. The goal has to be to win the division this year, obtain a great matchup and ROLL. I know our core has a ton of warts but I still believe they can figure it out. They have the talent to, let’s see if Berube and co can get it out of them

 

[Bust]

Couldn’t agree more. Either way I do think we’ll probably see the best of this group.
I’m not expecting a cup win but I think they will claw to a conference final appearance. The goal has to be to win the division this year, obtain a great matchup and ROLL. I know our core has a ton of warts but I still believe they can figure it out. They have the talent to, let’s see if Berube and co can get it out of them

I respect this stance.

I want this group to win, and I hope Berube is the coach to finally get through to this rendition of the leafs.

I did want Marner traded this off-season but I won’t actively root against him. I just wholeheartedly feel those cap dollars could/should be invested in our D and G. Either way I hope we go the distance.

Short of a Stanley cup final appearance I wouldn’t chalk this coming season up to anything positive. Cup final is the standard at this stage IMO.

JT and Marner playing for contacts could be a blessing in disguise!

 

[notDatsyuk]

This is a much deeper discussion that Im happy to have.

Ill make it short for now. Glad to expand as necessary.

Marner and Nylander since 2017-2018:

Contracts - Marners contract is worth 56% more than Nylanders.

Playoffs
Marner 5v5 with:
Matthews: 439 mins
Tavares: 237 mins

Nylander 5v5 with:
Matthews: 186 mins
Tavares: 235 mins

#of pointless 5v5 games in playoff career:
Nylander 33/54 = 61%
Marner 35/57 = 61%

# of 5v5 points in last 3 games of playoff series since 2018-2019:
Nylander: 9/21
Marner: 7/21

- Marner made 56% more money than Nylander for 5 years
- Marner played 253 more mins with Matthews (136%) 5v5 mins
- Marner has played 255 mins mins more with Tavares/Matthews than Nylander.

Id expect Marner be more offensive and better defensively than Nylander, hes been paid more than 50% more and has played 255 more mins with Matthews and 257 more mins with Tavares/Matthews than Nylander.

Key is linemates, Marner with 255 more mins with Matthews and 257 more 5v5 mins with Matthews/Tavares is incredible.

both players havent been phenomenal in the playoffs (ive said this many times in the past) but at 56% less money and without the 6 blatant screw ups in critical games that led to gwg against and considering Marner had played 136% more with Matthews....

Nylander is the easy choice for me.

Even keeping it very simple, and ignoring their respective linemates, over the last 6 years:

points/60 at 5v5:
Nylander 1.80
Matthews 1.74
Marner 1.54
Tavares 1.30

 

[Tie Domi Esquire]

No it doesn't seem like that. What part of it were you confused by?

The part where his expectations for his own team are significantly higher than the expectations we're allowed to have for the Leafs.

 

[ACC1224]

The part where his expectations for his own team are significantly higher than the expectations we're allowed to have for the Leafs.

Pretty weird take. His comments don't have anything to do with his expectations for either team.

 

[ACC1224]

Show of hands who has their opening night tickets so they can head down and boo?

 

[Tie Domi Esquire]

Pretty weird take. His comments don't have anything to do with his expectations for either team.

True. It wasn't a quote, it was some nameless writer that wrote this crap.

A core that also features Auston Matthews, William Nylander, John Tavares and Morgan Rielly has faced similar questions to the ones posed to the Avalanche following a run of disappointing springs before that group finally broke through and won the Stanley Cup in 2022.

After his comments a couple of years ago about Matthews and Marner being "run out of town", I expected him to say something stupid like that again. But it was just the stupid author of that article this time.

 

[Dog]

View attachment 906435

We all know this, Leafs fans know he is one of the best players in the league. We just are growing impatient, waiting for this level of talent to show itself in the playoffs. All the talent in the world is meaningless, if you can't deliver when it counts.

Pretty much lacked secondary scoring when Matthew's was out.

 

[thewave]

View attachment 906435

We all know this, Leafs fans know he is one of the best players in the league. We just are growing impatient, waiting for this level of talent to show itself in the playoffs. All the talent in the world is meaningless, if you can't deliver when it counts.

Regardless nobody can take the opinion of a fellow union member seriously. Even if he was David Clarkson bad he would have provided a positive opinion.

It's like your mom freaking saying you're a handsome man.

 

[thusk]

This is a much deeper discussion that Im happy to have.

Ill make it short for now. Glad to expand as necessary.

Marner and Nylander since 2017-2018:

Contracts - Marners contract is worth 56% more than Nylanders.

Playoffs
Marner 5v5 with:
Matthews: 439 mins
Tavares: 237 mins

Nylander 5v5 with:
Matthews: 186 mins
Tavares: 235 mins

#of pointless 5v5 games in playoff career:
Nylander 33/54 = 61%
Marner 35/57 = 61%

# of 5v5 points in last 3 games of playoff series since 2018-2019:
Nylander: 9/21
Marner: 7/21

- Marner made 56% more money than Nylander for 5 years
- Marner played 253 more mins with Matthews (136%) 5v5 mins
- Marner has played 255 mins mins more with Tavares/Matthews than Nylander.

Id expect Marner be more offensive and better defensively than Nylander, hes been paid more than 50% more and has played 255 more mins with Matthews and 257 more mins with Tavares/Matthews than Nylander.

Key is linemates, Marner with 255 more mins with Matthews and 257 more 5v5 mins with Matthews/Tavares is incredible.

both players havent been phenomenal in the playoffs (ive said this many times in the past) but at 56% less money and without the 6 blatant screw ups in critical games that led to gwg against and considering Marner had played 136% more with Matthews....

Nylander is the easy choice for me.

1- in wich part how much they was paid change anything in the quality of player they actually are? you really need to explain me because its over the 7M Nylander.

2- last 3 year nylander played around 74 minutes with matthews, around 5 complete game at 5v5. he scored 3 goal allowed 3 but from those 74 minutes he played, 22 was with Matthews AND Marner and they scored 2 foal vs 0 allowed in thos 22 minutes... So in the 52 minute with Matthews and wothout Marner. So the the 3 game and half he played alongside Matthews the only goal they scored was the only goal game 7 vs boston when Carlo felt on the ice and gave up a free 2v1 and they allowed 3 goal. So its so easy to produce with Mathews, tell me why nylander was unable to produce with Matthews when Marner was not there??

 

[thusk]

Very selective sample size!

Last 6 years:
Matthews 12
Nylander 8
JT and Rielly 7
Marner 6

Last 5 years:
Matthews 9
Nylander 7
JT and Rielly 6
Marner 5

Last 4 years:
Matthews 8
Nylander 7
Rielly 6
JT and Marner 5

Last 2 years:
Matthews, Nylander and Rielly 4
JT and Marner 3

Last year:
Nylander 3
Matthews and Marner 1
JT and Rielly 0

So congratulations -- you managed to find the only one of the last six time spans where Nylander wasn't second, tied for first, or first in goals scored.

If you look at several spans instead of cherry picking the one that suits your narrative, and particularly focus on the more recent, you can see that he is the one improving the most.

that's change nothing and just say basically the same thing i said.

Marner exemple at 5 goal, hes completly trash but how great nylander is at 7 goal???

focusing on last playeoff...
1 goal it was mcavoy who sent it in his own net when they miserally fail to block it

1 goal was a free 2v1 wher Carlo felt in corner and gave up an free 2v1...

So do 2 lucky goal really making nylander a better player?!?!?!

 

[Stephen]

Nathan MacKinnon defends Mitch Marner: 'One of the best'

Nathan MacKinnon is sticking up for one of his good friends, Mitch Marner.

www.sportsnet.ca

Just my opinion, but you really don't want other superstars feeling sorry for your program and rooting for your much maligned guys to have success...

When other teams look at your stars and program, you want them to do so with a mix of dread, a bit of jealousy, some schadenfreude and a lot of hatred. That's how you know you've been places, are a threat to their success and are the best of the best. Think about how people feel about Kucherov and Tampa, Florida when they're winning. Everyone hates those guys.

 

[thewave]

Even keeping it very simple, and ignoring their respective linemates, over the last 6 years:

points/60 at 5v5:
Nylander 1.80
Matthews 1.74
Marner 1.54
Tavares 1.30

This post will be conveniently ignored.

 

[thusk]

Even keeping it very simple, and ignoring their respective linemates, over the last 6 years:

points/60 at 5v5:
Nylander 1.80
Matthews 1.74
Marner 1.54
Tavares 1.30

you're right Nylander had been great to boost his stats with secondary assist

primary pts
marner 1.37
Matthews 1,32
Nylander 1.10
Tavares 0,98

secondary assist
Nylander 0,70
Matthews 0,41
Tavares 0,32
Marner 0,17

 

[HolyCrap]

Regardless nobody can take the opinion of a fellow union member seriously. Even if he was David Clarkson bad he would have provided a positive opinion.

It's like your mom freaking saying you're a handsome man.

Even my Grama’s used to say I was a handsome young man and would have to beat the ladies away.

They lied. lol.

 

[keonsbitterness]

you're right Nylander had been great to boost his stats with secondary assist

primary pts
marner 1.37
Matthews 1,32
Nylander 1.10
Tavares 0,98

secondary assist
Nylander 0,70
Matthews 0,41
Tavares 0,32
Marner 0,17

So it's bad that Nylander is a lot better at setting up the set-up man than the other three?

 

[thusk]

So it's bad that Nylander is a lot better at setting up the set-up man than the other three?

or just mean he got free pts

exemple you skating in neutral zone with the puck, you dump it and your teammate goes 1st on the puck and make a pass for a goal... you get an assist for a dump...

you skating in offensive end and just making a basic pass to a d who shoot it with someone deflected the puck, you got an assist for doing basically nothing.

At least primary assist you srt up the play most of the time.