Does Marleau need a cup to be a hof player

[MyBudJT]

Yeah, but the gap between Scott Stevens and Marleau is as big as the one between Orr and Stevens.

But their resepective gap in their contributions to the game of hockey isn't much different (between Scott and Marleau).

 

[Ivan13]

But their resepective gap in their contributions to the game of hockey isn't much different (between Scott and Marleau).

The hell it isn't. It's astronomical. One is a prototypical defenseman of his era, best player on an amazing Devils team, won everything and was one of the faces of the NHL whose reputation was off the charts and is still remembered as one of the game's greats, the other was riding shotgun to JT and will be an afterthought the moment he retires everywhere except in San Jose.

 

[A1LeafNation]

He sure as hell doesn't unless you think 200 points less in 300 more games played is close. Not to mention their teammates through the years.

Playing more games is an argument for HOF not against.

I don't know if PPG is a qualification for HOF.

 

[Ivan13]

Playing more games is an argument for HOF not against.

I don't know if PPG is a qualification for HOF.

You said he has comparable numbers, that is nothing but a blatant lie. I'm kind of lost for words having to explain to a Leafs fan how Sundin was better than Marleau.

 

[MyBudJT]

You said he has comparable numbers, that is nothing but a blatant lie. I'm kind of lost for words having to explain to a Leafs fan how Sundin was better than Marleau.

Sundin is a better hockey player, but they have contributed similarily to the game of hockey. Took Marleau longer to get there, but he has.

 

[Ivan13]

Sundin is a better hockey player, but they have contributed similarily to the game of hockey. Took Marleau longer to get there, but he has.

They haven't.

 

[CanadienShark]

No. He's just not good enough. He'll be in the group of players discussed on the fringe, but doesn't get in.

 

[Nick Hansen]

Sundin is a better hockey player, but they have contributed similarily to the game of hockey. Took Marleau longer to get there, but he has.

No, they haven't. Ridiculous claim.

 

[CanadienShark]

Why don't you think he should be in the HOF?

He's never been the best at anything. Not even top 3. The only reason anyone discusses him is because he's been incredibly healthy. I don't think not getting injured is a worthwhile reason. There are better players who didn't make it in.

 

[CanadienShark]

No individual awards
Never been a finalist for any awards
Never top 10 in points
Only 2x top 10 in goals
Never scored 50 in a season
No AS-1 team appearances
No AS-2 team appearances

For a player who was known as a scorer and not exactly some 2 way marvel, you better rack up elite numbers and finishes against your peers. He failed to do that.

I agree with most of what you said, but Marleau is a fantastic two way forward and has been for a very long time. About as versatile as anyone in the league. He can excel in literally any situation and any forward position.

 

[MyBudJT]

They haven't.

	Sundin	Marleau
Games Played	1346	1634
Goals	564	548
Goals Era Adj	599	620
Points	1349	1158
Points Era Adj	1410	1289
Game Winning Goals	96	106
Overtime Goals	15	10
Playoff Games Played	91	184
Playoff Goals	38	72
Playoff Points	82	125
Playof GW Goals	8	16

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Again, Sundin is obviously the better player, but they have contributed similarily to the game of hockey.

 

[MyBudJT]

He's never been the best at anything. Not even top 3. The only reason anyone discusses him is because he's been incredibly healthy. I don't think not getting injured is a worthwhile reason. There are better players who didn't make it in.

But somehow, he's top 30 in the NHL in a bunch of stats... guy's a bum

I think the fact he has remained so healthy is what makes him have a HHOF worthy career. Obviously, he's not as skilled as most if not all players currently in hte HHOF. That still doesn't deminish his contributions to the game of hockey, which is just as significant as many that are currently in the HHOF.

 

[Ivan13]

	Sundin	Marleau
Games Played	1346	1634
Goals	564	548
Goals Era Adj	599	620
Points	1349	1158
Points Era Adj	1410	1289
Game Winning Goals	96	106
Overtime Goals	15	10
Playoff Games Played	91	184
Playoff Goals	38	72
Playoff Points	82	125
Playof GW Goals	8	16

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Again, Sundin is obviously the better player, but they have contributed similarily to the game of hockey.

You can post these counting stats over and over again, I'm familiar with them and I won't agree with you one bit.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

	Sundin	Marleau
Games Played	1346	1634
Goals	564	548
Goals Era Adj	599	620
Points	1349	1158
Points Era Adj	1410	1289
Game Winning Goals	96	106
Overtime Goals	15	10
Playoff Games Played	91	184
Playoff Goals	38	72
Playoff Points	82	125
Playof GW Goals	8	16

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Again, Sundin is obviously the better player, but they have contributed similarily to the game of hockey.

Sundin: 1.00 ppg
Marleau: 0.71 ppg

Sundin playoffs: 0.91 ppg
Marleau playoffs: 0.68 ppg

 

[MyBudJT]

Sundin: 1.00 ppg
Marleau: 0.71 ppg

Sundin playoffs: 0.91 ppg
Marleau playoffs: 0.68 ppg

Why does PPG matter? Show me the HHOF criteria that says PPG matters?

 

[Tad Mikowsky]

Lol, no Marleau isn’t a HoF player.

Never won any personal hardware, was never a top player in the game.

 

[Tad Mikowsky]

Why does PPG matter? Show me the HHOF criteria that says PPG matters?

You’re honestly using raw totals to say Marleau was better in the playoffs because he played more games and had more points but not PPG because it’s not impressive.

Show us the criteria where it says that PPG doesn’t matter.

 

[CanadienShark]

But somehow, he's top 30 in the NHL in a bunch of stats... guy's a bum

I think the fact he has remained so healthy is what makes him have a HHOF worthy career. Obviously, he's not as skilled as most if not all players currently in hte HHOF. That still doesn't deminish his contributions to the game of hockey, which is just as significant as many that are currently in the HHOF.

So his health is the only argument, not his ability as a hockey player. Don't get me wrong, I think he's on the fringe, but hasn't ever been a truly top player. I've watched Marleau for a lot of his career. He's always been one of those "good, but not good enough" types.

 

[MyBudJT]

You can post these counting stats over and over again, I'm familiar with them and I won't agree with you one bit.

How many players have scored an ERA adjusted 600+ goals? And how many of them are not in the HHOF?

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

Why does PPG matter? Show me the HHOF criteria that says PPG matters?

when claiming 2 players had equal impact on the game, PPG does matter.

and yes, PPG indirectly matters for the HOF as well. Guess what, the great players have great PPG. And if they dont they excel in either being a playoff performer or defensively to account for the gap (see Bergeron).

0.71 ppg with Z-E-R-O individual awards, accomplishments or stand out seasons <> a HOF player.


Here's a little piece of advice for you in life...when you are the only one that thinks a point of view is right, that means you're wrong.

 

[smitty10]

He's very good, but I don't think he's a HOFer. Maybe he gets in because of his importance to the San Jose franchise? I doubt it though.

 

[MyBudJT]

You’re honestly using raw totals to say Marleau was better in the playoffs because he played more games and had more points but not PPG because it’s not impressive.

Show us the criteria where it says that PPG doesn’t matter.

I'm not saying Marleau is better in the playoffs. I said he's contributed more in the playoffs. Big difference.

For the 5th? time this thread, this is HHOF criteria:

Playing ability, sportsmanship, character and contributions to his or her team or teams and to the game of hockey in general.

Marleau has provided this in spades.

 

[MyBudJT]

So his health is the only argument, not his ability as a hockey player. Don't get me wrong, I think he's on the fringe, but hasn't ever been a truly top player. I've watched Marleau for a lot of his career. He's always been one of those "good, but not good enough" types.

If Marleau didn't have hockey ability, he wouldn't have reached 1600+ NHL games...

 

[Ivan13]

I'm not saying Marleau is better in the playoffs. I said he's contributed more in the playoffs. Big difference.

For the 5th? time this thread, this is HHOF criteria:


Marleau has provided this in spades.

 

[Tad Mikowsky]

I'm not saying Marleau is better in the playoffs. I said he's contributed more in the playoffs. Big difference.

For the 5th? time this thread, this is HHOF criteria:


Marleau has provided this in spades.

No, it doesn’t explicitly state that PPG isn’t part of the criteria. But neither is games played, or total points. Might as well throw those arguments out of the window, because it’s not explicitly in the criteria.

You are aware how stupid the “it’s not in the criteria” argument is right?

By your logic, might as well take out Forsberg, Lafontaine, Neely and any other player who’s career was cut short due to injuries, because f*** PPG. It’s ahout raw totals.

He contributed more in the playoffs because he had more games in the playoffs. You’re leaving this out because it ruins your argument.

Marleau was renowned for no showing in the playoffs and having a choker label.