Does Doughty have the worst contract in the NHL?

[All The Kings Men]

written by Dom Luszczyszyn aka fantasy hockey guru. Wonder when the last time this dude ever watched a Kings game? never?

I actually reached out to him once in 2017 to ask that very thing after getting annoyed at something he had written.

To my surprise he replied and said that it was about 5-10 games a year.

I wasn't impressed.

 

[KingsFan7824]

It's all on the kids. There's nothing to be done about the contract. Blake has to build a team around that cap hit likely until 2027. We just have to see if his play really is about the team being bad. Give a man that has everything but hope some hope, and see what happens.

 

[raswilliam]

I actually reached out to him once in 2017 to ask that very thing after getting annoyed at something he had written.

To my surprise he replied and said that it was about 5-10 games a year.

I wasn't impressed.

I never trust anyone who lists their preferred pronouns in their twitter profile.

 

[KINGS17]

The worst? Nah.

One of the worst? Yeah, given his cap hit, his age, and the likelihood of him still being a top 1D when the Kings kids may make them contenders again. He is sliding now, and sure he is playing 30 minutes a night, 10-12 of which are mediocre.

Then you look at the lost opportunity cost of signing him instead of trading him when it was quite clear, at least to some, the Kings weren't going to win jack the first 4-5 years of his deal if not longer. Also, it's not like he is some great leader of men.

 

[Matt13]

You do realize pro athletes loophole the crap out of state taxes, right?

There is a reason NHL players get paid for only the regular season which is magically shorter than 182 actual days needed to establish statutory residency in a state, right?

Bet our bottom dollar all players rent or own a condo in FL, Tx, or NV.

NHL players pay state tax in every barn they earn money, road games and all.

The math is torturous and the agents and accountants are worth every penny.

The point is that most these guys keep formal residency in no-state-tax states and only pay state taxes on game days in the state they are playing that night.

The whole thing on Vegas having some vast advantage is bogus. TX has no income tax and I don’t see the Stars grabbing all the talent.

It all balances out.

I thought more about what you said here.

If players own or rent a condo in FL, TX, or NV is that not an extra expense? If you signed in FL, Tx, or Nv would you then not have to have an extra residence? Is that not an advantage to the no income tax state? It may not be as simple as I put it, but I still believe there is an advantage for those teams? 3 of the 4 teams in the semi finals were from FL, TX and NV. The two teams in the finals, were from no income tax states. How did TB get Stamkos to sign for 8.5 and Kuch to sign for 9.5 coming off a 100 point season? All of this is above my paygrade, I'll admit it, but I still think there is an advantage there or maybe I just listen to Biz too much on Spittin Chiclets.

 

[Sol]

His contract does suck. But I don't know if it's the worst. He's been garbage last couple years, but let's hope he turns it around. That's why I kind of hate the "you deserve it for all that you've done" contracts. But considering how bad hes been it also wouldn't surprise me if he didn't care to try or if he regressed. It's hard to know with him, id be pretty disappointed in him as a player and a person if he didn't try because the team sucked. He's supposed to be above that with that kind of money.


I do think if he has another bad year then you can make a real strong case.

 

[Token]

I thought more about what you said here.

If players own or rent a condo in FL, TX, or NV is that not an extra expense? If you signed in FL, Tx, or Nv would you then not have to have an extra residence? Is that not an advantage to the no income tax state? It may not be as simple as I put it, but I still believe there is an advantage for those teams? 3 of the 4 teams in the semi finals were from FL, TX and NV. The two teams in the finals, were from no income tax states. How did TB get Stamkos to sign for 8.5 and Kuch to sign for 9.5 coming off a 100 point season? All of this is above my paygrade, I'll admit it, but I still think there is an advantage there or maybe I just listen to Biz too much on Spittin Chiclets.

There is an advantage for sure, be it the extra expense for establishing residence or the nature of having home games comprise half of the schedule.

The point is that it isn’t as drastic as it’s portrayed in the media.

Even if you don’t go digging in tax code and “jock tax”, look at Toronto. They are even higher than California but get the talent to sign.

I would think it has allot more to do with the product on the ice than a tax %.

Tampa is the darling of the tax argument but it was all about the GM building culture.

Panthers are the red-headed step child of the argument and couldn’t get Bob to take a “tax” discount in the same state.

 

[Matt13]

There is an advantage for sure, be it the extra expense for establishing residence or the nature of having home games comprise half of the schedule.

The point is that it isn’t as drastic as it’s portrayed in the media.

Even if you don’t go digging in tax code and “jock tax”, look at Toronto. They are even higher than California but get the talent to sign.

I would think it has allot more to do with the product on the ice than a tax %.

Tampa is the darling of the tax argument but it was all about the GM building culture.

Panthers are the red-headed step child of the argument and couldn’t get Bob to take a “tax” discount in the same state.

I think each city will have a unique answer. Toronto players get outside endorsement deals and the Panthers are a mess.

But it now looks like you are now agreeing with my original post that there is an advantage!

 

[kilowatt]

I never trust anyone who lists their preferred pronouns in their twitter profile.

Then you’re an idiot.

 

[kingsholygrail]

But guys, think of the potential points Karlsson could be scoring if he was still in his prime and not made of glass.

 

[kevsh]

"Doughty simply doesn’t push play anymore. Some might argue it’s because the team around him stinks, and that’s fair."

It's more than fair, that's the story.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

"Doughty simply doesn’t push play anymore. Some might argue it’s because the team around him stinks, and that’s fair."

It's more than fair, that's the story.

Only halfway imo. He was a Norris runner-up on the 2010 Kings (to Keith) and on the 2018 Kings (to Hedman, arguably should have won, no one chanting "due" hedman for...some reason), neither of which will be recognized as powerhouses.

His bad play the last 1.5 years is mostly on him.

I think what's notable is that when he was engaged he looked like the same ol 2018 Drew, i.e. Calgary games, lol. He doesn't look wholly spent the same way some other dudes do. You would think between that and literally a decade of almost wall-to-wall consistent dominance with 16 total games missed out of 1019 NHL games played including playoffs and plus Olympics/Tourneys he would have earned a little bit of rope but no, his literal first rough season means he's washed.

His contract does suck. But I don't know if it's the worst. He's been garbage last couple years, but let's hope he turns it around. That's why I kind of hate the "you deserve it for all that you've done" contracts. But considering how bad hes been it also wouldn't surprise me if he didn't care to try or if he regressed. It's hard to know with him, id be pretty disappointed in him as a player and a person if he didn't try because the team sucked. He's supposed to be above that with that kind of money.


I do think if he has another bad year then you can make a real strong case.

But I agree, if he comes out in 2020-2021 looking like he did most of last year outside of CGY games and the end of the year, then we can call it a pattern and not an aberration.

 

[Legionnaire]

I think you are pretty far off with the Dave Taylor comparisons.

But back to Blake.

You mention bad contacts, but you don't give him credit for what those contracts turned in to.

What would you have done if you were Blake after his first season of 98 points and losing in the first round to the eventual Western Conference champion?
The team looked to be a sniper away from winning a playoff round and Kovalchuk only costed cap space
He tried and it didn't work. At least he tried

Let's compare his first 3 seasons to Lombardi's though
View attachment 375381

The first season, both tried to compete with what they inherited.
Then started a rebuild.

We absolutely have a better prospect pool now than the franchise has ever had, a much better pool than we did in 2008-2009

Kings Top 20 Prospects, Fall 2008 - Hockey's Future



Sure we have the benefit on hindsight, but can you really say that 2008 is a better pool than 2020?
2008
View attachment 375382


2020
View attachment 375383

Great post. We won't know until our current crop plays. Look at the list even and where people are ranked. Some became solid to star players in the NHL and others didn't.

 

[kilowatt]

Only halfway imo. He was a Norris runner-up on the 2010 Kings (to Keith) and on the 2018 Kings (to Hedman, arguably should have won, no one chanting "due" hedman for...some reason), neither of which will be recognized as powerhouses.

His bad play the last 1.5 years is mostly on him.

I think what's notable is that when he was engaged he looked like the same ol 2018 Drew, i.e. Calgary games, lol. He doesn't look wholly spent the same way some other dudes do. You would think between that and literally a decade of almost wall-to-wall consistent dominance with 16 total games missed out of 1019 NHL games played including playoffs and plus Olympics/Tourneys he would have earned a little bit of rope but no, his literal first rough season means he's washed.




But I agree, if he comes out in 2020-2021 looking like he did most of last year outside of CGY games and the end of the year, then we can call it a pattern and not an aberration.

This is what I see more than anything. I'm not saying he was great last season, but he showed, on numerous occasions, that he still can be great. The Kings were a bad team last season with the stated mission of rebuilding. When Doughty wanted to step up and take over games, he did. Unlike Karlsson, Doughty's game was never built on speed and offense. I've always thought that Doughty will be able to play at an elite level until his late thirties because his game isn't built on physicality. Giordano won a Norris at 36 - why can't Doughty do the same?

 

[fivehole32]

I thought more about what you said here.

If players own or rent a condo in FL, TX, or NV is that not an extra expense? If you signed in FL, Tx, or Nv would you then not have to have an extra residence? Is that not an advantage to the no income tax state? It may not be as simple as I put it, but I still believe there is an advantage for those teams? 3 of the 4 teams in the semi finals were from FL, TX and NV. The two teams in the finals, were from no income tax states. How did TB get Stamkos to sign for 8.5 and Kuch to sign for 9.5 coming off a 100 point season? All of this is above my paygrade, I'll admit it, but I still think there is an advantage there or maybe I just listen to Biz too much on Spittin Chiclets.

One of the misnomers about Texas is that it is low tax. Yes there isn't an income tax, but property taxes can be worse than here in California because they don't have a Prop 13 freeze on those taxes. My folks found out when they bought in a neighborhood and about every couple years they were adding overlay districts on the neighborhood for all sorts of things raising the property taxes. As far as an athlete is concerned it probably beneficial because they will likely not live in the state for a long period of time so the savings on the income is larger.

 

[Martyros]

Put him on the trade block. Let's see how terrible his contract is.

 

[bouncesonly]

One of the misnomers about Texas is that it is low tax. Yes there isn't an income tax, but property taxes can be worse than here in California because they don't have a Prop 13 freeze on those taxes. My folks found out when they bought in a neighborhood and about every couple years they were adding overlay districts on the neighborhood for all sorts of things raising the property taxes. As far as an athlete is concerned it probably beneficial because they will likely not live in the state for a long period of time so the savings on the income is larger.

Property is also generally cheaper than California, by more than a few percent difference over property tax.

 

[Sol]

Put him on the trade block. Let's see how terrible his contract is.

Do you honestly think someone would take him for a decent deal?


My biggest issue with Doughty last year besides defense was also how he was atrocious on the powerplay. Turn overs, and holding on to the puck so long and allowing the opposition to regain form. Terrible shots. The guy was awful on the PP. Walker and Roy got limited PP time and you can say they were playing against the second units, but they were so much more competent on the PP.

 

[Statto]

Blake should have taken a hard line with Doughty, just like DL should have done with Kopitar. Kopitar is worth $8.9m and Doughty is the same. The comparables should have been Bergeron and Chara.

We lose both players...

 

[Statto]

The contract simply does not matter at this minute, it quite simply isn’t hurting us at all. He will likely step it up once the team starts to move forward and becomes competitive. He’s not lost a step, but has become punch drunk trying to cover for his partners and playing on a poor side. The talent is there still, it’s not like he’s been hampered by bad injuries or anything like that. His issues have been between the ears and playing with the likes Byfield will get him going again. If we need to move him in the future we’d still get a good return, it’s just not a problem for us for at least 2 seasons.

 

[Rusty Batch]

Doughty's poor play is completely overblown. He plays very aggressively on both ends of the ice and gets the most difficult assignments often paired with a AHL quality defenseman.

Doughty is not an excellent offensive Dman because he is a relatively weak PP D man. Just not his strength. Yet he has managed to be third on our team in scoring 2 years in a row, primarily because he makes plays at a high level.

On the garbage roster we have been fielding he would be better served to just bank the puck off the wall and play it safe. But that's not his game, he will aggressively attempt to make skilled plays and apply pressure to opponents. This hasn't worked great with the largely AHL roster that surrounds him who are incapable of playing the fast paced aggressive game that he does.

At the end of the day is he overpaid? Sure I mean our team has been trash and he hasn't been able to carry us. He doesn't have eye popping offensive numbers (although not sure how many defenseman have been top 3 in scoring on their team two years in a row) he is a minus players (but he plays 26 difficult minutes a night for a bottom feeding team) Connor McDavid was a minus player last year on a playoff team that had a positive goal differential.

Inject some talent on this team and watch how the perception of Doughty changes.

 

[YP44]

Dom hates players who do not put up a bunch of points. his models serve a purpose but I have always found them slanted.

 

[SufferingSelfCreated]

Doughty's poor play is completely overblown. He plays very aggressively on both ends of the ice and gets the most difficult assignments often paired with a AHL quality defenseman.

Doughty is not an excellent offensive Dman because he is a relatively weak PP D man. Just not his strength. Yet he has managed to be third on our team in scoring 2 years in a row, primarily because he makes plays at a high level.

On the garbage roster we have been fielding he would be better served to just bank the puck off the wall and play it safe. But that's not his game, he will aggressively attempt to make skilled plays and apply pressure to opponents. This hasn't worked great with the largely AHL roster that surrounds him who are incapable of playing the fast paced aggressive game that he does.

At the end of the day is he overpaid? Sure I mean our team has been trash and he hasn't been able to carry us. He doesn't have eye popping offensive numbers (although not sure how many defenseman have been top 3 in scoring on their team two years in a row) he is a minus players (but he plays 26 difficult minutes a night for a bottom feeding team) Connor McDavid was a minus player last year on a playoff team that had a positive goal differential.

Inject some talent on this team and watch how the perception of Doughty changes.

I'm going to refer all people I run into who doubt Doughty, to your post. I think you're spot on. Well said.

 

[DoktorJeep]

We lose both players...

So what? The Kings miss the playoffs or become a lottery team? That happened anyways, just years too late.

I’m ok with fans being sentimental about players, but I don’t agree with it because it leads to bad teams.

I’m sure the next excuse people will bring up is no one would tear down a team in its prime. I’m confident that going forward, you will see teams more mercenary with their player decisions.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

So what? The Kings miss the playoffs or become a lottery team? That happened anyways, just years too late.

I’m ok with fans being sentimental about players, but I don’t agree with it because it leads to bad teams.

I’m sure the next excuse people will bring up is no one would tear down a team in its prime. I’m confident that going forward, you will see teams more mercenary with their player decisions.

So then they become an Edmonton Oilers style rebuild with no insulation from quality vets, that's so what. Leaving sentimentality aside, even.

We also heard that after Chicago had to break down their 2010 squad and guess what? Every prominent team in the 2010s wasn't 'mercenary' with their decisions.

The COVID world may force it, but IMO you're confusing "sentimentality" for "keeping and paying excellent, borderline-irreplaceable players." There's trading the middle class and then there's trading a guy you'll spend the next two decades trying to replace just because he's a year or two out of the 'ideal' curve.