Do you believe in any NHL conspiracy theories? | Page 13 | HFBoards - NHL Message Board and Forum for National Hockey League

Do you believe in any NHL conspiracy theories?

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It is utterly absurd considering you have franchises after 1967 that are fast approaching 60 years in the league. A franchise is a franchise. Yes, some have more cache & history, but I know of no Pens fan that would trade the Pens for an O6 team. And to be honest, the Pens have just as much cache (if not more) as most of the O6 teams. 5 Cups, a line of some of the greatest players going back to Lemieux, etc.
This was exactly what I’m trying to prove. I understand the teams from the last few expansions not getting spotlight like the O6 but the teams from 67 and 72 deserve just as much and in some cases more. The Rags get hot dogged around as an O6 but their history as a franchise is almost as unsuccessful as CBJ or Minnesota. Just look at the outdoor games back in January. It should have been a Battle of Florida matchup. Huge recent rivalry with 2 teams that downright hate eachother.
 
I think with Florida, Tampa and Vegas the league just kinda let the LTIR situation play itself out the way it did on it's own (instead of stepping in earlier) because it served to Bettman's narrative of hockey being successful in the south. Every year another warm-weather/expansion team was benefitting from the glaring loophole that existed, all while the disaster in Arizona was rapidly unfolding (with relocation to Utah being the obvious outcome). Having Tampa, Florida and Vegas winning cups while Arizona was in full nuclear meltdown mode while playing in a 4,600 seat college rink served as a good distraction.

They didn't necessarily need to manipulate anything for those teams to have success - they just had to ignore the ever-so-obvious LTIR problem that existed (and that markets where Bettman expanded into benefitting the most by unlucky injuries). If a team like Winnipeg or Ottawa managed to win a cup by exploiting the LTIR my guess is that loophole would have been closed immediately, the team would probably have forfeited draft picks and Bettman would personally erase their cup from the record books. But because these teams were in non-traditional markets, that had existed for decades with limited success were the ones benefitting, it wasn't a problem. It wasn't a problem that teams could operate 10-18M+ over the cap in the playoffs - even though Bettman was the driving force behind the cap, parity and "cost-certainty" to begin with.

Think about this - Florida had been around a long time with just one SCF loss in 1996 & Tampa had their one cup in 2004. I'm sure Bettman was worried about the clock running out on those markets as well when Arizona was imploding. Florida's attenace was terrible leading up to Covid.

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So, because teams used a loophole that every team could use, it’s a conspiracy?
 
Do you buy into any conspiracy theories about the NHL? (E.g., rigged lotteries, Sedin twins are actually triplets and the third one rotated in periodically to keep the other two fresh, etc etc.)

I have two:

1. When the Florida Panthers tried to draft a 17 y/o Ovechkin in 2003, they didn’t actually believe in that bogus “leap year” theory.

IMO he was drafted because they thought the rumors of him being overage might be true, and they were hoping to land his rights in the event his “real” birth certificate ever surfaced.

2. Walter Gretzky orchestrated all the more unorthodox aspects of Wayne’s pre-NHL career (WHA, 20 year “personal services” contracts) solely as a means to circumvent the NHL draft and avoid Wayne being stuck with a terrible team like the “Mickey Mouse” Rockies/Devils.
I don’t think this is a conspiracy theory at all, just was Florida throwing a Hail Mary to get Ovechkin.
 
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Absurd. Why would the league place Crosby in a mid market coming out of a lockout & not New York? Plus, those Pens teams were awful. That’s why they had high lottery picks.

Are you going to discuss Edmonton’s first overall three years straight?

My guess for the reason is due to profit sharing and a desire to maintain growth.

If the league could become sustainable in markets that are not NYC, LA, Canada, then they could expand. Failing to become sustainable would have made the expansion sales pitch difficult, scaling a losing endeavor just compounds losses. They needed stl/pitt/philly/etc., this group of teams, to be successful, to earn enough so that revenue sharing worked, and then hopefully earn enough to leave revenue sharing.

After the Penguin success The league then had a huge expansionary wave bringing hundreds of millions in fees and new revenues. If all that talent had been consolidated to Montreal, Toronto, and New York - we may have a much smaller league today.

It’s normal and okay for businesses to have long term strategy. It’s typically kept private. Guessing at it is a fine exersize imo. Obviously unless somebody comes forward as a true insider and reveals - it’s just speculation.

I think we can see a new phase of the same strategy today:

The league let Vegas in and engineered a process where they could experience instant success. Previous expansion waves did not afford this at all. And now, as a result of Vegas’ success; the league can sell more teams while also likely avoiding any revenue sharing need with Vegas atleast.
 
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i looked at the lottery for fun once and ended up believing it is rigged at least part of the time to help important markets. if you track who rises against major odds more than half the time it has been new york area teams, and every new york area team has won the lottery against huge odds, or moved up the max possible against the odds at least once.

here are all the teams that have moved up four or more places to be 1oa in the draft

nyrangers 2020 from 14th
islanders 2025 from 10th
leafs 2026 from 5th
devils 2017 from 5th
blackhawks 2007 from 5th
islanders 2000 from 5th

here are all the teams that under the old system before 2012 that moved up the max four places without getting to 1oa

kings 1995 (7th to 3rd)
blackhawks 1999 (8th to 4th)
devils 2011 (8th to 4th)

edit: since 2012 it has happened frequently that teams move up to a better position but not 1oa under the new system and to teams that are small market.
 
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notice that each of the devils, isles and hawks have moved up 4 positions twice. also notice the only time it has happened outside the ny area is with the leafs, hawks and the twilight of the gretzky/mcnall era kings. no small market team has done it even once in over 30 years.
Dallas and Carolina moved up from just missing the playoffs to 3/2 to get Heiskanen/Svechnikov though.
 
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So, because teams used a loophole that every team could use, it’s a conspiracy?

I think a conspiracy is just the existence of strategy without explanation. Unlawfulness is relative to the individuals in control. What was unlawful can become lawful. This can often be the end goal of a strategy.

The league is the collective will of the owners.

They’re do not necessarily agree as a group and their group majority opinion can change.
 
i looked at the lottery for fun once and ended up believing it is rigged at least part of the time to help important markets. if you track who rises against major odds more than half the time it has been new york area teams, and every new york area team has won the lottery against huge odds, or moved up the max possible against the odds at least once.

here are all the teams that have moved up four or more places to be 1oa in the draft

nyrangers 2020 from 14th
islanders 2025 from 10th
leafs 2026 from 5th
devils 2017 from 5th
blackhawks 2007 from 5th
islanders 2000 from 5th

here are all the teams that under the old system before 2012 that moved up the max four places without getting to 1oa

kings 1995 (7th to 3rd)
blackhawks 1999 (8th to 4th)
devils 2011 (8th to 4th)

edit: since 2012 it has happened frequently that teams move up to a better position but not 1oa under the new system and to teams that are small market.
Implementing the lottery then jigging the rules every year is a problem. There's not enough frequency to monitor the statistics.
One thing we have learned, however, regardless of how its messed with it hasn't stopped teams from tanking which was why it was created.
 
so more lottery conspiracy theory data adding to the previous post above..

since 2012 the following teams have moved up at least 4 spots without getting to 1oa

2016 jets 6 to 2nd
2017 flyers 13 to 2nd
2017 stars 8 to 3rd
2018 canes 11 to 2nd
2019 hawks 12 to 3rd
2019 rangers 6 to 2nd
2025 utah 14 to 4th
2026 sharks 9 to 2nd

jets, canes, and mammoth are small market teams. so adding this to the data from my previous post, small market teams have moved up 3 of the 17 times a team has moved up four spots or more in the lottery.

but i also count a couple more 4 position lottery rises for the hawks and rangers though. so that means every new york area team has moved up 4 or morepositions twice in the lottery and won the lottery moving up four spots or more at least once. the hawks have risen 4 spots 3 times.

only 13 teams in total have moved up four spots in the draft, and only 5 teams have moved up four spots to win the lottery.

at the very least the new york area teams and the hawks have been extremely lucky. those four teams have moved up more than 4 spots to win first overall in the lottery 5 of the 6 times it happened, and 9 of the 17 times teams have moved up 4 spots in the draft or more overall.

and these big rises are very long odds.
 
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Yeah, just seems way too convenient they’d win when they about to be bankrupt, had serious attendance problems, and was a behind closed doors draft.
They tue best odds or close to given their previous three seasons of shit results, so is it really weird?

And people really overestimate the league's desire to avoid franchise relocations. They hate it but it's not the end of the world either.

And Pittsburgh?

Why would all those other teams forgo a chance to get Crosby for themselves and have him save Puttsburgh?

Pittsburgh?!

😏
 
That's false:

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Very right. But he came in half-way into that season as a commissioner. After that never again.
 
Isn’t he currently a wanted fugitive? HFBoards about to get subpoenaed

Fortunately there’s no shortage of lawyers posting here.. along with all the doctors and psychologists who regularly bless us with their expertise
Didn't Luka Magnotta post here too? I always thought that was crazy.
 

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