Do we want Kessel and Phaneuf back for next year?

[hotpaws]

There's no salary cap in the offseason. This gives teams the freedom to actually make a trade on higher contract guys. Less restrictions, more flexibility. Think about it.

The salary cap excuse only go so far . There cap hits would have been greatly reduced by the t/d and it wouldn't have been that much harder to fit them under the cap then than it is now in the off season . Sure teams can go over the cap by 10% now but they still have to get down by the start of the season so it's not like teams are going to just forget about the cap in the off season when making deals .

The benefit now is there's could be more teams potentially interested but that may be offset by teams wanting to improve for a cup run by the t/d and i'm also starting to hear from some say that maybe we should wait until next t/d when they value may be higher .

basically they either have a high value or they don't , there isn't some magical time period that going to raise or lower what teams will offer , sure they value would be affected by there play but that's much different than believing we'll get much more in the off season or the t/d for these type of players

 

[dubey]

There's no salary cap in the offseason. This gives teams the freedom to actually make a trade on higher contract guys. Less restrictions, more flexibility. Think about it.

I'm pretty sure this is wrong but too lazy to back it up

You can't go over the cap by more than 10% in the offseason

 

[hotpaws]

]Funny thing is teams are happy to pay their best players, like TO did with Kessel and Phanny, because they are the difference between winning and losing [/B]and if Phanny was traded for like the reported Det. package last year TO would now have Smith, Weiss, Det's #1 maybe even Mantha. Det really doesn't want Smith so he and Weiss would be salary dumps, Mantha was a disappointment somewhat last year plus he was a low draft choice and this year's choice would also be low so what was in this transaction for TO.

I only see the Draft Choice Junkies being satisfied with this transaction, TO possibly ends up with never ready for prime time players in Mantha and Det's #1 while eating roster positions and $s for unwanted players. I think there's little chance TO's future prosperity would be assured by transactions of this sort and TO may actually regresses because of these ill conceived moves, we need far more vision and worthwhile actions that do assure us something in the future or we should continue our rebuild that is now in it's 10th year.

If TO trades away it's best assets without proper return then the scorched earth rebuild will simmer for far longer than it needs to, Phanny and Kessel are excellent pieces with which TO can continue the rebuild, give both or either the right environment and who knows what the future might bring.

TO needs to be in the driver's seat, either Phanny and Kessel are coveted or their are not but they should be valued in TO because our future Leaf teams are tied totally to them. Would we have felt better despising Weiss and Smith, I don't think so.

If we were winning no one would be talking about trading them .

Why should our future be tied to them and when did they become bigger than the organization ? No one running the team now is tied to them and they're not obliged in following Burke's blue print in building the team around these two players . They'll be gone if any sort of decent offer presents itself regardless of whether some in our fan base believe they're worth . Also had Det included a 1st and or Mantha Phaneuf would be a Wing right now.

 

[bunjay]

Wings no longer interested in Phaneuf

http://www.tsn.ca/wings-no-longer-interested-in-phaneuf-1.312595



In hindsight it may have been a mistake not to take whatever we could get for him at the deadline. Who knows the opportunity cost of having that contract on the team for another year or longer, or how much further his value will decline.

We'll be accepting scraps for him just like Calgary did.

 

[nuck]

Wings no longer interested in Phaneuf

http://www.tsn.ca/wings-no-longer-interested-in-phaneuf-1.312595



In hindsight it may have been a mistake not to take whatever we could get for him at the deadline. Who knows the opportunity cost of having that contract on the team for another year or longer, or how much further his value will decline.

We'll be accepting scraps for him just like Calgary did.

Having to take Weiss and his contract back is similar to retaining half of Dion's salary. If they are prepared to eat that kind of money there will be a better return out there than what was basically Pulkinen.

 

[Vxnation]

Having to take Weiss and his contract back is similar to retaining half of Dion's salary. If they are prepared to eat that kind of money there will be a better return out there than what was basically Pulkinen.

That was the worst call from detroits managmwnt in a long time . Adfing phaneuf to their back end and Tampa doesn't move past them... Period

 

[bunjay]

Having to take Weiss and his contract back is similar to retaining half of Dion's salary. If they are prepared to eat that kind of money there will be a better return out there than what was basically Pulkinen.

Weiss' contract is $2.1 mil/year less and ends two years earlier. Retaining half of Phaneuf's salary is only better if you pretend that filling his roster spot takes up no cap space.

The league knows exactly how good Phaneuf isn't.

 

[deletethis]

With 3 years on Weiss' deal at a $4.9M cap hit, that calculates out to the equivalent of retaining $2.45M per season over the duration of Phaneuf's 6 remaining years.

 

[Willchel Marlynder]

To Edmonto
Dion Phaneuf
65th OA

To Toronto
Benoit Pouliot
16th OA (2015)
33rd OA (2015)
2nd Rd (2016)

Oilers GM is willing to trade for NHL ready players

http://blogs.edmontonjournal.com/201...ready-players/

They are willing to trade for NHL players, not get fleeced for them

 

[tokyoite]

The scorched-earth plan is a farce, if both come back.

 

[Daisy Jane]

The scorched-earth plan is a farce, if both come back.

no it isn't.

again: it took Buffalo five years to unload their bloated/unwanted contracts and players. If the Leafs don't move them out this summer it doesn't mean we're not rebuilding, it means, they are still here until we can move them out.

 

[The_Chosen_One]

no it isn't.

again: it took Buffalo five years to unload their bloated/unwanted contracts and players. If the Leafs don't move them out this summer it doesn't mean we're not rebuilding, it means, they are still here until we can move them out.

That would make sense if we had some third-rate coaching team behind the bench. Under Babcock, our horrendous goal and shooting differentials are going to look significantly better.

Does that mean we'll contender? Probably not. Instead Kessel is likely going to see his production plummet in order to produce cleaner numbers. His value won't be increasing.

 

[Trapper]

That would make sense if we had some third rat team behind the bench. Under Babcock, our horrendous goal and shooting differentials are going to look significantly better.

Does that mean we'll contender? Probably not. Instead Kessel is likely going to see his production plummet in order to produce cleaner numbers. His value won't be increasing.

I believe the clock is ticking on Kessel.
When it strikes midnight I can't say.

 

[Daisy Jane]

I believe the clock is ticking on Kessel.
When it strikes midnight I can't say.

well considering that the Leafs have been fielding calls from deadline day and really want to get this down for draft.. it's obviously that they want him gone. i do think they are playing with Hunter/Dubas to see if they'll bite.

like i said, I would be pleased as punch if both were gone before camp - I'll probably have a rant that it didn't happen and someone may have to pat my shoulder, give me a hug, but until proven otherwise, I think going by what everyone has stated - the plan is set.

[and i know everyone's mantra is show me, don't tell me, but I do believe that words mirror your actions, and Shanagement hasn't don't things to make me feel they'll deviate].

 

[senor martinez]

With 3 years on Weiss' deal at a $4.9M cap hit, that calculates out to the equivalent of retaining $2.45M per season over the duration of Phaneuf's 6 remaining years.

LOL Mr Babcock ****in hates this Weiss player! He ain't coming to toronto hell nah man

We should get rid of both Kessel and Phaneuf. And after then some.

 

[RoyalGremlin]

I'd trade Phaneuf first because he has the higher likelihood of getting fair value while being lower than Kessel's. I wouldn't be surprised to see them both traded but kessel will require a kings ransom, which is where the fair value proposition comes into play. Kessel's value is undeniably higher than Phaneufs but because Dion is the Captin and plays a more in demand position, we have a prime opportunity to pick either Hanifin and Provorov in the backend, along with Rielly will make Phaneuf expendable but still being able to garner a significant return. Keeping kessel even though he makes 8 mil can make sense if he still performs as a PPG+ player under Babcock, am very intrigued to see if the new coach can crack his shell. And also raise his trade value. Of course, his stock could plummet and we'd be the SOL.

 

[The_Chosen_One]

I'd trade Phaneuf first because he has the higher likelihood of getting fair value while being lower than Kessel's. I wouldn't be surprised to see them both traded but kessel will require a kings ransom, which is where the fair value proposition comes into play. Kessel's value is undeniably higher than Phaneufs but because Dion is the Captin and plays a more in demand position, we have a prime opportunity to pick either Hanifin and Provorov in the backend, along with Rielly will make Phaneuf expendable but still being able to garner a significant return. Keeping kessel even though he makes 8 mil can make sense if he still performs as a PPG+ player under Babcock, am very intrigued to see if the new coach can crack his shell. And also raise his trade value. Of course, his stock could plummet and we'd be the SOL.

If he produces PPG+ under Babcock's system, I doubt our 2016 pick will be that high. Babcock is a defence-first, possession-friendly coach. Unlike Carlyle and Horachek, Kessel does not have leverage over Babcock. He can easily bench Kessel and force him to play under that system.

In other words, our rebuild would start with the 2017 draft.

 

[hobarth]

I don't know why the scorched earth devotees are confining their hate to Phanny and Kessel?

I thought JVR was simply atrocious and is lifeless without Kessel, when RC was there JVR went to the opposition's net giving Kessel some space after RC was replaced rarely and had little to nothing to offer.

Kadri, well we all saw it, he's an excellent 3rd line player which we saw in the short season but even 70 points couldn't make me believe he's a proper1st/2nd line center.

Smith, is he really the only player TO has to play 3rd and 4th line minutes or more precisely, why?

Komarov for 3 more years at 3 mil, after his injury he was a shell of himself, unbelievable.

Bozak, ???

Holland is a big guy that plays like he isn't, he needs more attitude, more drive, he's totally content to coast on his talent, the ability is there but not the character.

Gardiner, I think he's going to be fine, needs to be unRCed, talent is obvious, we need the rookie Gardiner to return.

Lupul, should become the nearest hospital's captain or hall monitor, give him an IV and a leash so he never returns to NHL rinks ever again, I'm sure this would be better for him and the Leafs.

Panik. alright but consistency missing, needs to be motivated.

Booth, where were you most of the season, flame burned brightly for a brief period, way too brief.

Polak. just be yourself, entertaining always, love him.

Robidas, see Lupul.

Percy, I thought he looked better than Rielly in his too small sample time, still can't figure out why he was demoted?

Rielly, half way thru the tough initiation process that some have said is 300 games for d-men, sheesh that's a long time or is watching Rielly progress a very slow process, both I suspect.

 

[senor martinez]

I don't know why the scorched earth devotees are confining their hate to Phanny and Kessel?

I thought JVR was simply atrocious and is lifeless without Kessel, when RC was there JVR went to the opposition's net giving Kessel some space after RC was replaced rarely and had little to nothing to offer.

Kadri, well we all saw it, he's an excellent 3rd line player which we saw in the short season but even 70 points couldn't make me believe he's a proper1st/2nd line center.

Smith, is he really the only player TO has to play 3rd and 4th line minutes or more precisely, why?

Komarov for 3 more years at 3 mil, after his injury he was a shell of himself, unbelievable.

Bozak, ???

Holland is a big guy that plays like he isn't, he needs more attitude, more drive, he's totally content to coast on his talent, the ability is there but not the character.

Gardiner, I think he's going to be fine, needs to be unRCed, talent is obvious, we need the rookie Gardiner to return.

Lupul, should become the nearest hospital's captain or hall monitor, give him an IV and a leash so he never returns to NHL rinks ever again, I'm sure this would be better for him and the Leafs.

Panik. alright but consistency missing, needs to be motivated.

Booth, where were you most of the season, flame burned brightly for a brief period, way too brief.

Polak. just be yourself, entertaining always, love him.

Robidas, see Lupul.

Percy, I thought he looked better than Rielly in his too small sample time, still can't figure out why he was demoted?

Rielly, half way thru the tough initiation process that some have said is 300 games for d-men, sheesh that's a long time or is watching Rielly progress a very slow process, both I suspect.

Rielly, Polak and Komarov were all very good. Getting better all of them. Komarov played great in the international games after the season for finland. He will do great under michael babcock. Just wait and see what Kommy will be doing next season healthy under babcock. Babcock's healthy too.

Others should be fired yeah. We had the worst team ever.

 

[yubbers]

It's like people just ignore stats with Polak. He's a joke.

 

[mmalady]

heard a rumor on nhl radio...phaneuf to dallas for travis morin and/jason demers...they were vague on if leafs retained salary..this wasnt the first ive heard dallas rumors regarding phaneuf so we will see

 

[hotpaws]

It's like people just ignore stats with Polak. He's a joke.

he's not a joke but he isn't much of a player

i still have no idea why we made that deal , never mind adding

 

[Trapper]

he's not a joke but he isn't much of a player

i still have no idea why we made that deal , never mind adding

Polak is in no way shape or form meant to be a core player on your team. He is best suited on your 3rd pairing and not a top 4/top 2 as the Leafs like to/have to use players.

If this team had a proper core, players wouldn't be forced to play where they shouldn't.