Post-Game Talk: Different night, same movie. 4-1 Jets over Canucks

[thepuckmonster]

I think even Benning and Linden know that this team is going nowhere and that a high draft pick is what they really need to build on going forward. But they'll never admit it because their boss wants his playoff revenue.

I don't believe it's so much playoffs revenue related as consistently having marketable interest in the team.

That's why I think there was such a push this year to plaster Horvat's face all over every ad, bus stop and skytrain station in the city.

Vancouver isn't really a die hard city about sports which is fine, but in order for the team to be profitable (which is the goal at the end of the day for any multi-million dollar investment) there has to be a hook for the people to buy into. yes we ***** about ticket prices but tickets have to be sold to make money to invest in the team. It's cyclical. Obviously playoffs rounds make the most but the team needs to constantly be of interest to make money during the season.

It used to be playoffs and now it seems to be Horvat. When you go to games now they hype the crap out of Bo, McCann and Jake. It's a transition and maybe not as obvious or immediate as some would like but it's definitely there.

 

[Intangibos]

Would they be contending for a Cup with Lack and 4 million dollars? No, then I don't care. This team is rotten and needs a lot of help. I don't care to argue about every single move anymore.

Because you have to say the same things over and over again if you do, which brings me to your next point... Waiving Kassian would have been an awful move and I'm not even sure the NHLPA would have stood for it. The Canucks would have come off terribly as the news would most certainly have come out if he was abruptly waived. Not to mention the ****-storm from Canucks fans that would have occurred and the awkward training camp...

Fehr signed cheaply to play on a Stanley Cup contender, essentially hand-picking his team, why the **** would he sign the same deal here?

Not signing Sbisa to a 3.6M contract wouldn't make us cup contenders either. That doesn't mean we should do it. It's a step in the right direction.

We shouldn't have paid a 5th to dump Kassian. I don't like trading him at all, but don't give up assets to do so.

Fehr is an example. There were multiple players who were free agents for quite some time. We paid Kassian + 5th for a year of Prust. We dumped Bonino + Clendening (trash prospect but should have been Forsling) + pick to get Sutter who was UFA in a year, then locked him up long term.

Kassian, Lack, Bonino, Corrado, Richardson, Garrison, the list goes on. None of these players are exceptional players that are going to turn the franchise around. I just don't understand how to some people like you, the answer to a player not being a 10/10 means to dump them for scraps. You are aware there is a middle ground, right? We could have had more assets, and more cap space right now, and used those assets and cap space to improve the team. Instead we use assets like Garrison to free up cap space for Luca Sbisa. We dump guys like Lack to keep Miller (instead of Lack + 4M cap space which is very important).

If you're content with Jim thinking his moves made this team a 100 point playoff team be my guest. He's quite clearly made this team worse, though, and lost assets and cap space in doing so.

This is off topic, though, so hopefully you read the reply before it gets removed. If you feel like continuing to be wrong, do so in the managerial thread please, no more infractions for me

 

[BenningHurtsMySoul]

I don't believe it's so much playoffs revenue related as consistently having marketable interest in the team.

That's why I think there was such a push this year to plaster Horvat's face all over every ad, bus stop and skytrain station in the city.

Vancouver isn't really a die hard city about sports which is fine, but in order for the team to be profitable (which is the goal at the end of the day for any multi-million dollar investment) there has to be a hook for the people to buy into.

It used to be playoffs and now it seems to be Horvat. When you go to games now they hype the crap out of Bo, McCann and Jake. It's a transition and maybe not as obvious or immediate as some would like but it's definitely there.

Problem is, they don't have a McDavid or a MacKinnon or an Ekblad to really rally behind.

Horvat, McCann and Virtanen are nice pieces going forward, but they are all supplementary. They are not top 3 picks that can jump into the NHL and dazzle, putting butts in the seats and being worth the price of admission alone. They are not the same thing and I think management believes that they are.

A Matthews or a Chychrun would provide that piece going forward. They need to realize that a young star is a marketing dream. Nobody gets excited when Derek Dorsett or Chris Higgins scores a goal because they've seen it before.

 

[thepuckmonster]

Problem is, they don't have a McDavid or a MacKinnon or an Ekblad to really rally behind.

Horvat, McCann and Virtanen are nice pieces going forward, but they are all supplementary. They are not top 3 picks that can jump into the NHL and dazzle, putting butts in the seats and being worth the price of admission alone. They are not the same thing and I think management believes that they are.

A Matthews or a Chychrun would provide that piece going forward. They need to realize that a young star is a marketing dream. Nobody gets excited when Derek Dorsett or Chris Higgins scores a goal because they've seen it before.

And that very well could happen this year.

From the impression I get when I go to games people are incredibly excited about Virtanen. Local kid, plays in a "crash bang score goal" way that's entertaining. I was at the Philly game when he scored his first and the crowd erupted louder than I've ever heard aside from SCF 2011.

 

[VanJack]

If you fast forward to the end of the '16-'17 season, players gone will include Prust, Hamhuis, Vrbata, Miller, Higgins, and likely Burrows...and since Bartkowski, Baeretschi, Cracknell, Markstrom and Weber are all on one-year deals, who knows about them?...that's almost half the roster....so unless the kids can make a big progression over the next couple of seasons, or Benning pulls off some outright thievery in the trade market (unlikely)...as Yogi once said, 'the future ain't what it used to be'.

 

[kanucks25]

I'm at the point where the mounting losses and egregious turnovers don't really bother me as much as getting the big picture right....I ask you, is it better for the 'Nucks to just squeeze into the playoffs and play another one-and-done series, or would the long-term development be better served by a tough year, a series of trade-deadline day dumping of veterans; and a higher draft pick....I think the answer is pretty obvious, even if the GM and President are still spinning the playoff yarn.

I'm not exactly happy when we lose, but I do get kind of happy when I realize that each loss means a higher pick and a higher chance of Willie being fired.

During the games I want us to win as badly as ever but never upset after losses now

 

[CanaFan]

I think there's a big difference between being a rookie that's worth living with his mistakes, and one that is clearly not ready.

Hutton and McCann seem to be the former, Virtanen the latter.

Eh, I dunno. Up to and including the NJ game I thought he looked "ready" and was showing improvement each game. Since then he has looked poor, so either the game rocked his confidence or the damage to his hand was worse than let on. Because the Jake before that game and the one that played the last couple of games were not the same player.

 

[mrmyheadhurts]

Thought the Canucks were a bit unlucky not to get at least a point last night. Still making some really key mistakes in their own end, and I really believe (as I did in the off-season) the D needs to be seriously reworked over the next few seasons, it's by far the teams biggest weak spot. We really only have on top 4 pairing, all other combinations of D outside of Tanev and Edler would be a 5-6 pairing on any other team.

 

[Reign Nateo]

McCann still get rag-dolled in every physical confrontation. He's got a ways to go yet as well.

 

[StrictlyCommercial]

McCann still get rag-dolled in every physical confrontation. He's got a ways to go yet as well.

He's engaged though. Virtanen is not.

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If this is actually a stealth tank, I'm fine with that. Trade expiring contracts at the deadline (or re-sign Hamhuis because we have no possible replacement).

As long as we don't trade picks or youth to push for the playoffs I will remain calm.

 

[The Jesus*]

And that very well could happen this year.

From the impression I get when I go to games people are incredibly excited about Virtanen. Local kid, plays in a "crash bang score goal" way that's entertaining. I was at the Philly game when he scored his first and the crowd erupted louder than I've ever heard aside from SCF 2011.

Yeah a lot of more casual fans I know are super excited about Virtanen too. They're gonna be disappointed.

 

[PM]

If it was a stealth tank we would have kept Bonino to trade at the deadline and not thrown away the 2nd rounder from Anaheim instead of targeting Sutter. Tanking teams hoard picks, they don't throw them away.

 

[Nucker101]

If it was a stealth tank we would have kept Bonino to trade at the deadline and not thrown away the 2nd rounder from Anaheim instead of targeting Sutter. Tanking teams hoard picks, they don't throw them away.

The fact that this theory is even being thrown around and discussed says a lot even though it's not true.

 

[kanucks25]

Eh, I dunno. Up to and including the NJ game I thought he looked "ready" and was showing improvement each game. Since then he has looked poor, so either the game rocked his confidence or the damage to his hand was worse than let on. Because the Jake before that game and the one that played the last couple of games were not the same player.

I'm with you.

I wasn't a fan of not sending him down but soon after the decision was made, it seemed like he was improving every game.

Then that NJ game happened and it's been downhill from there.

It could just be the general inconsistencies of a young player or it could be something more. The good thing is they still have another 25 games or so to send him down before they burn one of his RFA years.

McCann still get rag-dolled in every physical confrontation. He's got a ways to go yet as well.

He does get thrown around because he still has the body of the teenager but the important thing is he's engaged and doesn't look like he's scared to go into high traffic areas.

 

[coldsteel79]

I'm with you.

I wasn't a fan of not sending him down but soon after the decision was made, it seemed like he was improving every game.

Then that NJ game happened and it's been downhill from there.

It could just be the general inconsistencies of a young player or it could be something more. The good thing is they still have another 25 games or so to send him down before they burn one of his RFA years.



He does get thrown around because he still has the body of the teenager but the important thing is he's engaged and doesn't look like he's scared to go into high traffic areas.

I really think virt is dealing with a hand injury from punching what's his nuts helmet

 

[fancouver]

Problem is, they don't have a McDavid or a MacKinnon or an Ekblad to really rally behind.

Horvat, McCann and Virtanen are nice pieces going forward, but they are all supplementary. They are not top 3 picks that can jump into the NHL and dazzle, putting butts in the seats and being worth the price of admission alone. They are not the same thing and I think management believes that they are.

A Matthews or a Chychrun would provide that piece going forward. They need to realize that a young star is a marketing dream. Nobody gets excited when Derek Dorsett or Chris Higgins scores a goal because they've seen it before.

At the rate we're going, a lottery pick is really not out of the question. After one of the worst starts for Anaheim, they are now 2 points behind us with the same amount of games....2 points. They should surpass us by next week if you take a look at our upcoming home games.

But this may be the year for the Canucks to really rebuild around the draft, like legit rebuild and grab a future star. We are in a horrible division that is below average right now and we're STILL struggling. We got a long way to go before making Chicago admit we're their arch-nemesis again.

 

[Fat Tony]

If it was a stealth tank we would have kept Bonino to trade at the deadline and not thrown away the 2nd rounder from Anaheim instead of targeting Sutter. Tanking teams hoard picks, they don't throw them away.

The tank is so stealth, Benning didn't know it's happening.

 

[me2]

He's engaged though. Virtanen is not.

-------

If this is actually a stealth tank, I'm fine with that. Trade expiring contracts at the deadline (or re-sign Hamhuis because we have no possible replacement).

As long as we don't trade picks or youth to push for the playoffs I will remain calm.

I wish it was a stealth tank, but you don't stealth tank a 101 point team without incredible cunning and the balls to carry it off and that doesn't seem like Benning's MO. Benning is much more straightforward, if he was tanking the team he would be much more up front about it. None of Benning's moved have screamed stealth tank, nor the fact he talks about getting a better playoff team this year from his moves.

 

[y2kcanucks]

bad team is bad.

Overpaid average goalie with a big mouth.
Aging 1st line, 2 19 year old jr players, No defence depth. This team has too many plugs:bartkowski, weber, Biega, Sbisa, Dorsett, Prust, Cranknell, Higgins, Burrows.

the 3 rookies are turnover machines, they are not ready.

The rookies certainly are ready. How are you going to say McCann isn't ready when he is second on our team in goals, and led for most of the year? Ben Hutton is 1 point back of the team lead for points among defenseman, and Virtanen has been a solid Corsi cup contributor.

I think we should send Virtanen to the WJC to get some confidence scoring, but bring him back after and see how he responds.

Also doesn't help when WD is only giving the kids 10 minutes or less per game.

 

[y2kcanucks]

I wish it was a stealth tank, but you don't stealth tank a 101 point team without incredible cunning and the balls to carry it off and that doesn't seem like Benning's MO. Benning is much more straightforward, if he was tanking the team he would be much more up front about it. None of Benning's moved have screamed stealth tank, nor the fact he talks about getting a better playoff team this year from his moves.

It's not a stealth tank. This is the result of having idiots running the team.

 

[Street Hawk]

If it was a stealth tank we would have kept Bonino to trade at the deadline and not thrown away the 2nd rounder from Anaheim instead of targeting Sutter. Tanking teams hoard picks, they don't throw them away.

That Anaheim 2nd for Buffalo's 3rd didn't seem too bad when first made. Expected Ducks pick in the high 50's and Sabres pick late 60's. So about a 10 pick or so difference. Still early, but the gap could wider to be 15 or more. Still I am confused by it.

As for Prust, Kassian isn't even playing in the NHL. He's in the substance abuse program. So, we would have still needed to fill that roster spot.

Benning has had some stumbles.

But, this trade deadline is when he finally gets to really shape the future of the Canucks team. He has expiring contracts plus a few guys with 1 year left on their deals. So, plenty of trade bait.

So, really hoping that the Nucks are clearly out of the race before the deadline.

Seems like Benning and co. need a slap in the face that they are not a playoff team and that the best thing for the franchise to win a cup, not just make the playoffs and be 1 and done is to deal older veterans for younger assets.

They need a bigger collection of young assets to go along with what they have. Cause, the drafts prior to 2012 have left the Canucks with basically nothing.

 

[Street Hawk]

I wish it was a stealth tank, but you don't stealth tank a 101 point team without incredible cunning and the balls to carry it off and that doesn't seem like Benning's MO. Benning is much more straightforward, if he was tanking the team he would be much more up front about it. None of Benning's moved have screamed stealth tank, nor the fact he talks about getting a better playoff team this year from his moves.

Not a stealth tank, but when you look at the numbers, the Canucks last season won an insane percentage of 1 goal games. They won like 20 more 1 goal games than they lost.

This year, losing more than they win.

Look at Calgary, they had so many comebacks last season. Chances were not good that they could have a repeat performance this year.

No real critical changes. Out are Matthias, Bonino, Richardson, Vey, Bieksa, Lack, Kassian, Clendenning and in are Markstrom, Hutton, Bartkowski, Sutter, Virtanen, Prust, and McCann.

No superstar was moved out.

Just unlikely that the team can repeat a stat that is very difficult for an average team to repeat. Average teams don't always win close games.

 

[Hit the post]

Seems like Benning and co. need a slap in the face that they are not a playoff team and that the best thing for the franchise to win a cup, not just make the playoffs and be 1 and done is to deal older veterans for younger assets.

They need a bigger collection of young assets to go along with what they have. Cause, the drafts prior to 2012 have left the Canucks with basically nothing.

One can only hope that the Kings re-up Lucic before Benning is able to offer a mega-millions uber contract to him.

 

[Scurr]

This was a really good hockey game that we could have won. I believe the guys doing the broadcast said it was the best game they had done this season.