Value of: Difference in value between William Nylander and Brett Pesce

[LakeLivin]

I don't think many Leafs fans are that unrealistic.

The challenge is -- there really isn't that "perfect piece"... What does Nikishin really do for the Leafs with respect to replacing some of what you lose with Nylander? First round pick? sure, but first round picks don't score goals.

It's not a matter of value, it's a matter of creating a situation where both teams come away from the deal and say "I'm better today then I was yesterday".

Sure, you could maybe do Nylander for Pesce + a 1st and flip that 1st for Scott Laughton.... but making those types of follow-up trades can be difficult to do.

Jarvis is a guy that I think comes close enough to filling that need; although I know Canes fans will rightfully say, no he's too valuable.

Ultimately, I think the "plus" between Nylander for Pesce + is too great to "bridge" with an asset that doesn't directly help. My personal feeling is that the "plus" between Nylander + for Pesce and Jarvis would be smaller, and something that could be bridged by a less than ideal asset of value.

The only way I can see the Canes dealing Jarvis is if he's part of a package for close to a perfect addition to the Canes, and Nylander isn't that. By all accounts Jarvis appears to be universally loved within the organization, has a great work ethic, and is only 21 yo with all that implies (solid floor and nice potential ceiling, prime contribution window, cap fit, contract implications, etc.) The "off ice" factors are likely a bigger impediment to him being included in most packages than his "objective value".

edit: but I do agree that if something could be worked out both teams might be better off dealing with the pending UFA status of the other team's player than with their own, even if for the Canes that means a 1 year "own rental".

 

[seanlinden]

The only way I can see the Canes dealing Jarvis is if he's part of a package for close to a perfect addition to the Canes, and Nylander isn't that. By all accounts Jarvis appears to be universally loved within the organization, has a great work ethic, and is only 21 yo with all that implies (solid floor and nice potential ceiling, prime contribution window, cap fit, contract implications, etc.) The "off ice" factors are likely a bigger impediment to him being included in most packages than his "objective value".

edit: but I do agree that if something could be worked out both teams might be better off dealing with the pending UFA status of the other team's player than with their own, even if for the Canes that means a 1 year "own rental".

Call me crazy... but I see Nylander as EXACTLY what the Canes are missing. They've got tons of guys who are solid 2-way contributors; especially in the middle of the ice. They need a guy who can drive offence at a high level. That's William Nylander.

He's 27 years old and will likely give the Canes 5-6 really high quality years; fitting in with the likes of Aho, Kotkaniemi, Svechnikov & Necas. When you look at his salary demads, it does fit in quite well with what the Canes will likely end up having to pay Sebastian Aho on his next deal.

Yes, the "plus" that the Leafs add to a Pesce & Jarvis may not be perfect (although I see some merit in a guy like Liljegren)... but ultimately, it's very rare that a player the calibre of William Nylander becomes available.

Don't get me wrong, Pesce is a valuable piece.... and a near perfect fit for the Leafs... but a lot of his value comes from the fact that he was only getting paid $4m through what is likely to be his early-prime. It's a lot easier to find a guy like Pesce (or somebody that can do what he does) with $6.5m to spend, than it is to find a guy like Nylander (or a guy that can do what he does), even if you have $9.5m to spend.

 

[SeanMoneyHands]

Canes take a risk and do it. Nylander for Pesce and Teravanein.

 

[DingDongCharlie]

Nylander = Pesce +2nd

 

[LakeLivin]

Call me crazy... but I see Nylander as EXACTLY what the Canes are missing. They've got tons of guys who are solid 2-way contributors; especially in the middle of the ice. They need a guy who can drive offence at a high level. That's William Nylander.

He's 27 years old and will likely give the Canes 5-6 really high quality years; fitting in with the likes of Aho, Kotkaniemi, Svechnikov & Necas. When you look at his salary demads, it does fit in quite well with what the Canes will likely end up having to pay Sebastian Aho on his next deal.

Yes, the "plus" that the Leafs add to a Pesce & Jarvis may not be perfect (although I see some merit in a guy like Liljegren)... but ultimately, it's very rare that a player the calibre of William Nylander becomes available.

Don't get me wrong, Pesce is a valuable piece.... and a near perfect fit for the Leafs... but a lot of his value comes from the fact that he was only getting paid $4m through what is likely to be his early-prime. It's a lot easier to find a guy like Pesce (or somebody that can do what he does) with $6.5m to spend, than it is to find a guy like Nylander (or a guy that can do what he does), even if you have $9.5m to spend.

Don't get me wrong either, lol, Nylander would bring a LOT to the Canes. But to be close enough to perfect for the Canes to include Jarvis along with Pesce, I think the player coming back would need to have one more of either 2 other things the Canes appear to be after: a lot more "grit" (think Meier or Tkachuk, both of whom the Canes pursued heavily) or be at least a 2A center. On top of that, if a young Canes player slated to be a long term regular was slated to go in a package with Pesce I'd want to be assured that we'd be able to reach a mutually agreeable extension with Nylander up front. Not necessary with other add ons, because if it came down to it I think the Canes would be better off with Nylander as a 1 year "own rental" than Pesce.

I talked about how you could differentiate "objective value" from "market value"; I'll add a third category, and that's "team value". I'd bet that the Canes view Jarvis as being more valuable to them than how other teams might objectively value him. Which I'm sure is the case with particular prospects / players on most teams.

 

[seanlinden]

Don't get me wrong either, lol, Nylander would bring a LOT to the Canes. But to be close enough to perfect for the Canes to include Jarvis along with Pesce, I think the player coming back would need to have one more of either 2 other things the Canes appear to be after: a lot more "grit" (think Meier or Tkachuk, both of whom the Canes pursued heavily) or be at least a 2A center. On top of that, if a young Canes player slated to be a long term regular was slated to go in a package with Pesce I'd want to be assured that we'd be able to reach a mutually agreeable extension with Nylander up front. Not necessary with other add ons, because if it came down to it I think the Canes would be better off with Nylander as a 1 year "own rental" than Pesce.

I talked about how you could differentiate "objective value" from "market value"; I'll add a third category, and that's "team value". I'd bet that the Canes view Jarvis as being more valuable to them than how other teams might objectively value him. Which I'm sure is the case with particular prospects / players on most teams.

Dubois would have fit all of those criteria as well, and I'd argue that he probably got "more" than Pesce / Jarvis with respect to value.... all that despite having never scored 30 goals in a season, being very restrictive on where he's willing to go, and carrying an aura of "prima donna" around him.

Vilardi likely viewed quite similar to Jarvis, IMO.

Pesce likely be viewed better than Iafallo... but the Kings added Rasmus Kupari and a 2nd round pick.

Yes, he was an RFA vs a guy with 1 year left until UFA status, but the reality of that is, Dubois could have easily taken an arbitration award to UFA.

As for signing him, I'm not an insider by any means, I just don't see it as that big of a problem. From listening to all the insiders, his primary objection seems to be not wanting to be paid $4 or $5m less than Auston Matthews, and multiple millions less than Mitch Marner. Put him on a team where the salary structure is topped by Sebastian Aho, I think it's easy to sign him for $9.25 and then turn around and give Aho $9.5m. His salary demands aren't unreasonable, they're just not practical for a team that already has 3 $11m+ forwards.

 

[MinJaBen]

Yes, he was an RFA vs a guy with 1 year left until UFA status, but the reality of that is, Dubois could have easily taken an arbitration award to UFA.

No, he was traded wit my an agreed upon contract, so he was worth a lot more.

 

[seanlinden]

No, he was traded wit my an agreed upon contract, so he was worth a lot more.

As I've mentioned a few times, I really don't think signing Nylander is all that big of a hurdle for the Hurricanes.

You also get the "benefit" of Nylander at $7m in the "flat cap" year, whereas Dubois goes straight to $8.25.

 

[LakeLivin]

Dubois would have fit all of those criteria as well, and I'd argue that he probably got "more" than Pesce / Jarvis with respect to value.... all that despite having never scored 30 goals in a season, being very restrictive on where he's willing to go, and carrying an aura of "prima donna" around him.

Vilardi likely viewed quite similar to Jarvis, IMO.

Pesce likely be viewed better than Iafallo... but the Kings added Rasmus Kupari and a 2nd round pick.

Yes, he was an RFA vs a guy with 1 year left until UFA status, but the reality of that is, Dubois could have easily taken an arbitration award to UFA.

As for signing him, I'm not an insider by any means, I just don't see it as that big of a problem. From listening to all the insiders, his primary objection seems to be not wanting to be paid $4 or $5m less than Auston Matthews, and multiple millions less than Mitch Marner. Put him on a team where the salary structure is topped by Sebastian Aho, I think it's easy to sign him for $9.25 and then turn around and give Aho $9.5m. His salary demands aren't unreasonable, they're just not practical for a team that already has 3 $11m+ forwards.

As I've mentioned a few times, I really don't think signing Nylander is all that big of a hurdle for the Hurricanes.

You also get the "benefit" of Nylander at $7m in the "flat cap" year, whereas Dubois goes straight to $8.25.

First off, using what the Kings did as an argument as to why you think the Canes should or would do something similar misses the mark. I think it's been shown that the Canes front office often marches to the beat of a different drummer. For the record, I don't see Viardi as being comparable to Jarvis. While they put up a similar number of points last season, keep in mind that Jarvis is only 21yo and Vilardi is 2.5 years older. Those of us who've watched Jarvis expect a robust increase in his production over the next couple of years. Of course there is no guarantee, but that projection is based on actual empirical evidence we've witnessed so far. And unless Vilardi was a particular favorite in L.A. (I have no way of gauging such), you're totally overlooking the fact that Jarvis is a favorite among both fans and teammates in Carolina; that matters with respect to his availability.

And on the PLD / Nylander comparison when it comes to trades; as MinJaBen pointed out, Kings got an already extended PLD on a contract that runs from age 25-32. A max extended Nylander would go from age 27-35 (including this season). Those last 3 years of Nylander could be fine but they could just as easily be an anchor. No way to know now which, but I'd much prefer having a forward under contract from 25-32 than from 27-35. Having said that, over the next couple years I'd actually prefer Nylander to PLD. Think he might sign a $9 x 5 contract? Ignore that, I'm being facetious.

tldr: when one fan base tells you why they don't want to do something I have yet to see them change their mind when another fan base, who almost certainly doesn't know the team as well, tries to tell them why they should, lol.

 

[seanlinden]

First off, using what the Kings did as an argument as to why you think the Canes should or would do something similar misses the mark. I think it's been shown that the Canes front office often marches to the beat of a different drummer. For the record, I don't see Viardi as being comparable to Jarvis. While they put up a similar number of points last season, keep in mind that Jarvis is only 21yo and Vilardi is 2.5 years older. Those of us who've watched Jarvis expect a robust increase in his production over the next couple of years. Of course there is no guarantee, but that projection is based on actual empirical evidence we've witnessed so far. And unless Vilardi was a particular favorite in L.A. (I have no way of gauging such), you're totally overlooking the fact that Jarvis is a favorite among both fans and teammates in Carolina; that matters with respect to his availability.

And on the PLD / Nylander comparison when it comes to trades; as MinJaBen pointed out, Kings got an already extended PLD on a contract that runs from age 25-32. A max extended Nylander would go from age 27-35 (including this season). Those last 3 years of Nylander could be fine but they could just as easily be an anchor. No way to know now which, but I'd much prefer having a forward under contract from 25-32 than from 27-35. Having said that, over the next couple years I'd actually prefer Nylander to PLD. Think he might sign a $9 x 5 contract? Ignore that, I'm being facetious.

tldr: when one fan base tells you why they don't want to do something I have yet to see them change their mind when another fan base, who almost certainly doesn't know the team as well, tries to tell them why they should, lol.

The bolded is likely true... I'm using Dubois as a comparable for the type of value on can reasonably expect to need to give up when acquiring a player like that. Getting Tkachuk required the Panthers to part with a 115-point player (who had a year left at a silly $5.9m), a very highly regarded defenceman in Mackenzie Weegar, and a 1st round pick.

Getting Meier (who had a somewhat nuclear qualifying-offer situation) cost the Devils a 1st round pick, 2nd Round Pick (that can become a 1st), a former 1st (Mukhamadullin), and a young NHL player in Zetterlund.

With respect to the Vilardi/Jarvis comparison... sure, Vlilardi's a bit older, but he's also a lot bigger; and teams like size.

At the end of the day, Nylander is a talent that is certainly within the same ballpark as Dubois and Meier. All 3 have / had somewhat unique contract situations, but the only one with the really problematic contract situation was Meier.

Jarvis may be loved by the organization, however, I just don't believe that the Carolina Hurricanes are going to be able to get a player of that calibre, where the most "painful" piece they lose is the last year of Brett Pesce's deal.... no disrespect to Pesce, he's a great fit for what the Leafs need to round out their blueline and right-shot defencemen with size are all getting premiums right now. But, he's a complimentary guy. He's a quality, but unspectacular #2. He'd be an excellent #3. His future contract is likely going to turn sour a lot quicker than Nylander's will.

A Nylander+ for Pesce & Jarvis deal does not clear out the farm for the Canes (like the Meier deal likely would have).... yes, it hurts... but even if you keep Jarvis, there's a really good chance he's going to get plumeted down the lineup by Nylander, TT, Svech, Necas and Bunting. The guy has 79 points in 150 NHL games over 2 years. He's done that while almost always playing with 1 of, and sometimes both Sebastian Aho or Andrei Svechnikov.

 

[JetsFan815]

Will Pesce consider signing in Canada? My sense is that he is not looking to sign in Canada. Nylander's value to the Leafs is much higher as he is atleast willing to re-sign with them (even if he is demanding more money than they are okay with).

 

[LakeLivin]

The bolded is likely true... I'm using Dubois as a comparable for the type of value on can reasonably expect to need to give up when acquiring a player like that. Getting Tkachuk required the Panthers to part with a 115-point player (who had a year left at a silly $5.9m), a very highly regarded defenceman in Mackenzie Weegar, and a 1st round pick.

Getting Meier (who had a somewhat nuclear qualifying-offer situation) cost the Devils a 1st round pick, 2nd Round Pick (that can become a 1st), a former 1st (Mukhamadullin), and a young NHL player in Zetterlund.

With respect to the Vilardi/Jarvis comparison... sure, Vlilardi's a bit older, but he's also a lot bigger; and teams like size.

At the end of the day, Nylander is a talent that is certainly within the same ballpark as Dubois and Meier. All 3 have / had somewhat unique contract situations, but the only one with the really problematic contract situation was Meier.

Jarvis may be loved by the organization, however, I just don't believe that the Carolina Hurricanes are going to be able to get a player of that calibre, where the most "painful" piece they lose is the last year of Brett Pesce's deal.... no disrespect to Pesce, he's a great fit for what the Leafs need to round out their blueline and right-shot defencemen with size are all getting premiums right now. But, he's a complimentary guy. He's a quality, but unspectacular #2. He'd be an excellent #3. His future contract is likely going to turn sour a lot quicker than Nylander's will.

A Nylander+ for Pesce & Jarvis deal does not clear out the farm for the Canes (like the Meier deal likely would have).... yes, it hurts... but even if you keep Jarvis, there's a really good chance he's going to get plumeted down the lineup by Nylander, TT, Svech, Necas and Bunting. The guy has 79 points in 150 NHL games over 2 years. He's done that while almost always playing with 1 of, and sometimes both Sebastian Aho or Andrei Svechnikov.

LOL, I could provide a counter to most of what you posted but we'd just be spinning our wheels as we weight things differently. I can confidently say that if we go on the presumption that Canes fans who very closely follow the team know more about what the team needs and tendencies are than you do, it's safe to say that because of how the Canes value Jarvis, a Pesce-Jarvis trade for Nylander + isn't going to happen unless the + is something stupid that the Leafs wouldn't do anyways.

Hey, I could put together a trade that includes Knies and provide a reasonably rational argument to support it, but it would be a waste of time because the Leafs aren't going to trade him, either.

edit: and given how hard you're trying to get Jarvis, I suspect that deep down you understand why he wouldn't be included and you're just horse trading, lol.

 

[Puckstuff]

The leafs should hold onto Nylander

Pesce is a nice piece but finding those big right handed shots that can also make plays on the power play is to hard to replace.

 

[Petes2424]

This is going to be a tough thread for people to agree.

First off, offense is overvalued and defense is undervalued. In a vacuum, defenseman also hold more value to their forward counterparts. Not to mention, Nylander is a one-dimensional winger that doesn't bring much more to that table other than pure offense (which is valuable, for sure).

Asking Jarvis is absurd.

Both are pending UFAs. Nylander is the more valuable player, but Pesce plays a more important position and arguably plays a larger role in the outcome.

Just a quick look at things, I would say

Pesce
Jack Drury

for

Nylander

Is more than fair. Drury doesn't really have a home on the Canes and can provide some key depth for Toronto, and still has potential. Put up good numbers in the AHL

That’s spot-on. There’s NHL managers who wouldn’t trade Jarvis for Nylander straight up, even though Nylander is a more established player. If you just took tape from both players over the last two playoffs, you’d understand why. One plays in all the tough areas, and produces.

That aside. Every time we have a big time Dman traded in these boards, the stat watchers can’t believe it. One day they’ll figure out how important top dmen are.

The other thing here?? Nylander isnt the type of forward the Canes like. He’s just not. They like forwards who go in the corners, NOT when they have to, but by nature. Guys who do okay in the dirty areas. It’s why they signed Bunting.

Treliving knows all of this.

 

[seanlinden]

LOL, I could provide a counter to most of what you posted but we'd just be spinning our wheels as we weight things differently. I can confidently say that if we go on the presumption that Canes fans who very closely follow the team know more about what the team needs and tendencies are than you do, it's safe to say that because of how the Canes value Jarvis, a Pesce-Jarvis trade for Nylander + isn't going to happen unless the + is something stupid that the Leafs wouldn't do anyways.

Hey, I could put together a trade that includes Knies and provide a reasonably rational argument to support it, but it would be a waste of time because the Leafs aren't going to trade him, either.

edit: and given how hard you're trying to get Jarvis, I suspect that deep down you understand why he wouldn't be included and you're just horse trading, lol.

Would certainly be curious to see the bolded.

As for Jarvis specifically, I get why the Canes don't want to include him, but the Leafs are a win-now team just as much as the Hurricanes are. They don't need guys who have little-to-no NHL experience. They don't really need draft picks. They need somebody who can make at least a little bit of a difference today; and the guy has to make $3m or ideally, less.

It's not like the Leafs should really be "after" Jarvis... it's just that the Canes don't really have a ton of great options of other "plusses". TT is too expensive, Kotkaniemi going nowhere, Bunting just left, Necas going nowhere, Staal going nowhere / just signed, Fast very similar to what they already have in Jarnkrok, Martinook not enough of a potential contributor, and same story for Drury. Leafs, with Pesce, likely wouldn't be interested in any more help on the blueline, as you'd have Rielly-Pesce, Brodie-Klingberg, McCabe-Liljegren, with Giordano and Timmins in the press box.

Honestly, if the Canes retained (or got somebody else to retain) 50% on Tuevo Teravainen, that deal probably 'works' more than Jones.... at least from impacting the lineup today. The problem then becomes philosophical, where you're trading Nylander, and the return is 2 UFAs -- and keeping those UFAs is likely going to require contracts that you'll regret within 3 years.

At the end of the day, if we go by "value"; Jarvis & Pesce is a lot less "value" than what the Kings gave up for Dubois, and probably less value than what the Devils gave up for Meier. It's certainly a ton less than what Florida gave up for Tkachuk. Philosophically speaking, it's unrealistic to get players the calibre of Nylander/Dubois/Meier, and not have the deal "hurt".

 

[Chan790]

Will Pesce consider signing in Canada? My sense is that he is not looking to sign in Canada. Nylander's value to the Leafs is much higher as he is atleast willing to re-sign with them (even if he is demanding more money than they are okay with).

He's never said he won't sign in Canada. Pesce's assumed (because it has never been stated outright) destination desires are to be on the East Coast or in the Northeast because he's very close to his family who still live in his hometown of Tarrytown, NY...just outside NYC.

On that front, Toronto-NYC is an easier trip than many cities on the US East Coast. It's something like an hour flight on a very heavy transit corridor with a lot of flights. For regular travelers...there are daily/weekly business commuters between the two cities...it's possible through cross-governmental programs to streamline the customs process for pre-screened regular fliers with no luggage or declarations.

So...Toronto is probably more desireable than say Columbus, Pittsburgh or Montreal and similar to Philly, Buffalo or Boston in that respect. I'm skeptical he'd re-sign in Edmonton or Vancouver, but that's not because they're Canadian...I think the same about 4/5 of the territorial US unless the $$$ was really good.

 

[NotOpie]

These arguments pro and con on Pesce/Nylander trade values (plus the suggested pluses) go round and round because folks aren't listening to each other. All of the values discussed are purely subjective based on each team's fan's views of said players. Sure there are stats to back up certain qualities.

As a Canes fan, it is clear that many Leaf's fans do not fully understand the value of a guy like Brett Pesce to the Carolina Hurricanes and, based on comments from a number of neutral fans, his value across the league. Perhaps the same can be said about Nylander's value in the eyes of Cane's fans. While we value William Nylander's scoring ability and, to some extent, his ability to drive offense, there are other characteristics of Nylander that don't completely jibe with current Canes philosophy of play. Just like Pesce isn't going to put up 50 points from the backend, Nylander isn't going to win the board battles and battles in the corner demanded by our style of play.

So while having some sort of independent objective valuation would be grand, it can't exist as these are two different teams who play in different ways. Yet, the Canes do need Nylander's level of scoring (hence the attempts at Tkachuk and Meier) and the Leafs do need the solid defensive play on the right side that Pesce brings. Valuing these two types of players by each team will necessarily be subjective.

The ask for Pesce and Jarvis for Nylander + without the "+" being defined is, frankly, ridiculous. Given that I think, at best, Nylander's value with respect to Pesce is an additional 2nd round pick. If Leaf's fans think Jarvis is the difference, then Canes fans will simply say, okay, the + then needs to be Knies. See how ridiculous that sounds? Because for the record, I think that's just as silly of an ask as Jarvis.

In my mind, here are the objective traits of these two players:

Nylander - pure scorer with good speed, currently on a contract with 1 year remaining that likely underpays him by around 25%, rumored ask on new contract is $10 per season, not a particularly physical player but not a total liability in his own end, is a right shot hybrid wing/center, having held out in the past, rightly or wrongly, there's a perception of not being a team player (plus the "father" factor)

Pesce - right shot #2/#3 defender, 2nd ATOI on the team, faced toughest matchups consistently, excellent stickwork, plays the body exceptionally well but isn't particularly physical, average skater who makes up for it with positioning, not a scorer will put up 27-29 points on average, currently on an excellent contract with 1 year remaining that underpays him by about 55%-60%, rumored ask is about $6.5 million per year over 8 years

The subjective value of these two players to their teams deviates a good bit from what's been discussed in this thread. As fans we likely never agree. But as I said, as a Canes fan, if we were going to trade for Nylander, the highest I'd go would be Pesce plus a 2nd round pick. And I'd be fine if that didn't get the player and we went shopping elsewhere.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

Nylander quietly outplaying Matthews while playing at a 62g 124pt pace to start this young season.

 

[McJedi]

Serious question... could Toronto even afford to trade Nylander? Some nights, he looks like their best player. This is a team with big playoff aspirations... they'd trade him in the middle of that season?

What GM would have the balls to do that?

 

[Michoulicious]

Serious question... could Toronto even afford to trade Nylander? Some nights, he looks like their best player. This is a team with big playoff aspirations... they'd trade him in the middle of that season?

What GM would have the balls to do that?

They won't do that.

They'll play the season out, lose in the 1st round then either re-sign him for 7 or 8y * 10.5 M or just let him walk.

 

[LakeLivin]

Serious question... could Toronto even afford to trade Nylander? Some nights, he looks like their best player. This is a team with big playoff aspirations... they'd trade him in the middle of that season?

What GM would have the balls to do that?

No. Keep in mind that until the post before yours this entire discussion occurred in early July. Things have changed.

 

[SeanMoneyHands]

If I’m Toronto I go after Brent Burns instead. But no way Carolina trades him.

 

[Discipline Daddy]

I get that at this point in the season, Nylander's value is way higher than Pesce's.

At the same time, it's uber rare that a UFA player gets traded for a young possible top line player on their ELC like Jarvis. Completely different era, but you worry about an Iginla / Nieuwendyk trade where you lose out on 15 years of great hockey from Jarvis to get one superb year from Nylander.

Just not the way the Canes do business. Both GMs can't find value in this deal at this point in time, in my opinion.

 

[Hobnobs]

Serious question... could Toronto even afford to trade Nylander? Some nights, he looks like their best player. This is a team with big playoff aspirations... they'd trade him in the middle of that season?

What GM would have the balls to do that?

No they can't afford to trade him. And because of the gap between him and Pesce I dont think Canes would be interested.

 

[McJedi]

No they can't afford to trade him. And because of the gap between him and Pesce I dont think Canes would be interested.

I'm sure the Canes would love to acquire Nylander for Pesce.

I can't imagine Toronto would move Nylander. They are going to self rent him and roll the dice he'll resign. I suspect he'll play playing hockey for someone like the Sharks or Blackhawks next year making a lot of money per season.

I remember people used to say his contract was a bad one... LOL... I never felt that way. Dude's ability was always there for all of us to see. He's a hell of a skater and now the puck skills and shot are right there with the skating. Dude finds the half space or negative space as well as anyone in the NHL outside of Jack Hughes.