Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - part XXIV

[Omar Little]

If McLeod doesn’t improve, his shelf life in the NHL is 2-3 more years.

I still fundamentally can’t understand how his shot is so bad

 

[Triumph]

I'm all for a play in round - 20 teams make the playoffs, 8 teams play in the play-in round, 7 v 10, 8 v 9. The regular season is goosed up with two game states that do not exist in playoff hockey, and the real problem with the playoffs isn't who qualifies and who doesn't, but that being the number 1 seed gets you a whole one more home game than the 8 seed. There should be more of an advantage to finishing higher in the standings, and that advantage could be 'not having to play in the play-in round'. Don't want to play in the play-in round? Finish higher than 7th in the conference.

 

[Guttersniped]

Because the TV networks won't be satisfied until the regular seasons don't exist anymore; they want that sweet, sweet playoff money, so the goal will be to expand them until we basically start each season with best of 3 rounds or something.

We're seeing baseball do it this year: they're expanding to a 12-team playoff, what the NFL had until last year, but MLB is still a league with only 30 teams, so they're inching closer and closer to half the clubs qualifying and likely getting into a NBA situation where there'll be a bunch of seasons with sub-.500 teams qualifying. For a sport where the 162 game regular season is the main draw, it's ludicrous, and all but kills the entire concept of a "pennant drive" late in the season. Look at the NBA doing its new play-in round, which is a bit less egregious but still makes it so 20-of-30 teams get some kind of postseason play, even a bunch of them outright suck. And again, the NFL even just added a third wild card to each conference, a spot for some 6-8 win club to stink up the joint against a top seed.

I can at least get the argument for expanding them in the NHL a little bit more: historically the Stanley Cup playoffs have always included a higher percentage of the overall teams in the league, including some stretches where essentially everyone made it, the regular season being purely about arranging seeding. If one wants to argue that's more intrinsic to the NHL's identity, and thus the playoffs should be expanded to reflect that, I can at least see where they're coming from.

But the idea that, say, it's a bad thing that the top 8 teams in the East are so good and the bottom 8 teams just...aren't is some kind of major problem the league needs to address? How about the clubs in the bottom 8, I dunno, get better? Like you said, the Islanders are friggin' 20 points off the playoff pace; on what planet do they deserve a spot?

I guess there's the whole "it makes the end of the season less exciting without playoff races" argument, but like...yeah, that just happens some years. There are years where there's a mad scramble for the last couple of spots, there are years where there's considerably less drama. It happens.

You think networks are the ones who have money at stake here or remotely the most?

You forget that the NHL is much more of a gate driven league. Playoff teams do better in attendance and you can sell season ticket plans off signs of success like making the playoffs.

Playoff games are huge moneymakers because players are working for free (unless they win the Cup), the tickets are more expensive, games sell out and and you sell more crap.

There’s a reason all with a reasonable chance to make the playoffs often trade for something at the TDL.

Having 16 garbage non-playoff teams is a lot, considering that such a huge % used to make it. In 1991-92 there was still only five non-playoff teams. Expansion happened and two more teams were just recently added. That’s a new reality that is going to eventually cause some changes here. There’s going to be at least some sort of play-in round or teams added in some way.

The East lacks parity this season in a stark way but that’s a bit new. Good teams miss the playoffs quite a bit. Having more playoff teams means more teams are trying to win, I’m not sure what the downside is unless you liked how MLB worked in the past with so many teams living in hopelessness. (And you apparently did.)

 

[glenwo2]

Nas is probably the best of the guys behind the bench, but he's been here since 2015 so it's time for a change. He does seem to run a good PK, but I'm not sure that's enough to keep him around if we're changing coaches. It'd be kind of weird if he was an assistant that survived 2 head coaches being fired and was still here for the next one they hire.

And again, I state that "Sucking Less" isn't something to celebrate.

And he never should've "survived" the first coaching change to begin with.

That is Fitz's fault there.

Let's hope he rectifies that unforced error this offseason.

 

[glenwo2]

How much say do you think he has had in how defensive play has been taught over the last seven years? Do you think this team has developed defensemen well? Do you think this team has a passable level of situation recognition?

Whatever his role has been, I'd argue that what's been said and done, whatever progress has been made - it's been too slow and ineffective to justify on any level.

The PK that did so well for a couple of years had Zajac/Coleman/Greene/Lovejoy (collective 20+ seasons experience in that role, plus one player who cooked for a while).

Players grow in a non-linear fashion - volatility in performance is fine - but with this level of collective ups and downs, you start from scratch and get a new voice.

I also might add that the constant harping on the PK's so-called "success"(14th rank isn't something to shout from the rooftops) is tantamount to simply seeking excuses for his presence and for Fitz's brain-dead decision to bring him back.

I can't, for the life of me, understand those that are like "oh. He's doing a great job" when his fellow coaches are horse-poo in comparison.

So he's one level above horse-poo. And that is something to hang your hat on? REALLY?

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

 

[Better Call Sal]

Certainly the most deserving nominee on this team. Hell of a year coming off of one that was a complete throw away with all of the injuries and illnesses.

Have a feeling reading the nominees that this is going to be Price's award.

 

[Blender]

 

[None Shall Pass]

Every Devil who had to deal with Dr. Zoidberg and the rest of our medical staff should be a Masterton nominee with the only qualification being, "They survived."

 

[Devs3cups]

Love this. Nico is a prototypical Devil. Hard working, responsible and can be counted on. Wouldn't want anyone else as the captain.

On that note, Nico with 62 points in 72 games. That's a 71 point pace. That's great for our #2 center playing difficult matchups and on the PK, while being with scrubs for a good part of the season.

 

[Guttersniped]

I also might add that the constant harping on the PK's so-called "success"(14th rank isn't something to shout from the rooftops) is tantamount to simply seeking excuses for his presence. I can't, for the life of me, understand those that are like "oh. He's doing a great job" when his fellow coaches are horse-poo in comparison.

The PK was shockingly excellent for a good chunk of the year, despite the goaltending, one of the best in the league for a while actually. It was very strong in underlying stats & results. It survived our goaltending in part because we’re 29th in Times Shorthanded and we took so few penalties with Jack (who took literally none).

That’s what led to a steady climb up the ranks between Dec-Feb. It’s been statistically very mediocre for at least two months now (in GA & expected GA) though. That’s how we ended up 14th after rolling for a while.

If it had stayed as strong as it was until the end of season then Nass had a much better chance to survive. We had the 7th best PK with 82.4% in 2019-20, that was the success Fitz was referring to when he kept his job. I don’t know if 14th and 80.4% is the same.

I don’t see how Recchi can be survive with the 28th best PP two years in a row and goaltending not being an excuse there.

Random assistant coaches hanging on is something that happens more than you some probably think, teams like continuity.

I think it’s it will probably happen but I need to see Ruff and Nasreddine actually gone before I believe it. I’m not sure of anything there.

 

[Blender]

The PK was shockingly excellent for a good chunk of the year, despite the goaltending, one of the best in the league for a while actually. It was very strong in underlying stats & results. It survived our goaltending in part because we’re 29th in Times Shorthanded and we took so few penalties with Jack (who took literally none).

That’s what led to a steady climb up the ranks between Dec-Feb. It’s been statistically very mediocre for at least two months now (in GA & expected GA) though. That’s how we ended up 14th after rolling for a while.

If it had stayed as strong as it was until the end of season then Nass had a much better chance to survive. We had the 7th best PK with 82.4% in 2019-20, that was the success Fitz was referring to when he kept his job. I don’t know if 14th and 80.4% is the same.

I don’t see how Recchi can be survive with the 28th best PP two years in a row and goaltending not being an excuse there.

Random assistant coaches hanging on is something that happens more than you some probably think, teams like continuity.

I think it’s it will probably happen but I need to see Ruff and Nasreddine actually gone before I believe it. I’m not sure of anything there.

I think Nas is a decent coach who should be in the NHL, but his time here may be done. Recchi has no business coaching in this league.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

How much say do you think he has had in how defensive play has been taught over the last seven years? Do you think this team has developed defensemen well? Do you think this team has a passable level of situation recognition?

Whatever his role has been, I'd argue that what's been said and done, whatever progress has been made - it's been too slow and ineffective to justify on any level.

The PK that did so well for a couple of years had Zajac/Coleman/Greene/Lovejoy (collective 20+ seasons experience in that role, plus one player who cooked for a while).

Players grow in a non-linear fashion - volatility in performance is fine - but with this level of collective ups and downs, you start from scratch and get a new voice.

I’m not saying he’s been good and I don’t even know really what his role has been. I’m just saying that from the outside looking in he is the least of our problems on the coaching staff and there appear to be things he’s done well. I’m not even advocating for keeping him. However, the obvious thing we know he controls is the PK which is currently 14th in the league. That’s pretty damn good considering we’re the 28th team in the league with the worst goaltending in the league.

He’s not our biggest problem on the coaching staff just because he worked under John Hynes.

And you don’t just start from scratch everywhere with every down. There are times when you need a new voice but that is all dependent on how the players in the room feel and the energy around the room and members of the coaching staff. If the players respect Nas and still listen to and believe in the things he says than there’s absolutely no reason to get rid of him just for a new voice because he’s been around a while. If they feel he’s gotten old and repetitive and they no longer completely believe in the things he try’s to tell them then yes it’s time for a new voice.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

And again, I state that "Sucking Less" isn't something to celebrate.

And he never should've "survived" the first coaching change to begin with.

That is Fitz's fault there.

Let's hope he rectifies that unforced error this offseason.

I also might add that the constant harping on the PK's so-called "success"(14th rank isn't something to shout from the rooftops) is tantamount to simply seeking excuses for his presence and for Fitz's brain-dead decision to bring him back.

I can't, for the life of me, understand those that are like "oh. He's doing a great job" when his fellow coaches are horse-poo in comparison.

So he's one level above horse-poo. And that is something to hang your hat on? REALLY?

You haven’t given one good reason why he should be gone. From the outside looking in he has done pretty well with the things we know he controls. And no 14th PK in the league is t great but it’s pretty damn good considering we’re the 28th team in the league and have the worst goalies in the league. With average goaltending there’s a pretty good chance that could be top 10.

Him working with Hynes is not a remotely good reason to fire him.

Also why in the world would they have fired him last time right after he had done much better with the team as their interim head coach. I’m pretty sure he was a head coaching candidate and he’s clearly well respected.
That wouldn’t make any sense.

Hey we know you just did well taking over as head coach but you’re not good enough to stay on as an assistant coach.

 

[NjDevsRR]

So we go 3-2-1 on the road against some good
Teams.

Then 0-3 at home against two crap teams and a good team which we blew a lead to.

Stonks

 

[NjDevsRR]

You haven’t given one good reason why he should be gone. From the outside looking in he has done pretty well with the things we know he controls. And no 14th PK in the league is t great but it’s pretty damn good considering we’re the 28th team in the league and have the worst goalies in the league. With average goaltending there’s a pretty good chance that could be top 10.

Him working with Hynes is not a remotely good reason to fire him.

Also why in the world would they have fired him last time right after he had done much better with the team as their interim head coach. I’m pretty sure he was a head coaching candidate and he’s clearly well respected.
That wouldn’t make any sense.

Hey we know you just did well taking over as head coach but you’re not good enough to stay on as an assistant coach.

We talking Nas? Haven’t read the thread. I like Nas but sometimes you just need a clean slate and a new voice. Entire staff should go.

 

[NJDevs26]

Once Lindy goes, Nas has to go too, I’m sorry. This guy isn’t Larry Robinson where you can just keep him here through staff after staff. And Recchi needs to go even more than those two.

 

[Bleedred]

The idea was thrown out a few months ago by I think @ScottyK that the organization could be grooming Nas for the full time head coaching gig, but felt he wasn't ready yet and that's why he was oddly retained to be the assistant for yet another head coach after his interim stint as head coach. And this is why Fitz kept telling us ''Nas is certainly in the mix'' to be full time head coach when it was said he was interviewing other people (Gallant being one of them) for the job. Which I remember thinking ''Yeah right, they probably just don't wanna hurt his feelings''.

While I don't see it that way, it's also not the strangest or craziest suggestion.

Nas has gotta be the longest tenured (full time assistant and that doesn't include ''Special Assignment'' coach or goalie coach) assistant coach we've had since possibly ever. Not the longest tenured ever in the entire organization (Rick Kowalsky was employed in some capacity here for about 13 or 14 years and Sergei Brylin has been an assistant for the AHL team for 8 or 9 years now), but longest tenured full time assistant coach behind the bench for the NHL team.

I can't remember a single non-goalie coach assistant lasting this long for the NHL team, not consecutively. There was about a 13 year span where Larry Robinson went back and forth between assistant coach, head coach, special assignment coach. head coach again, special assignment coach again, full time assistant coach again. And he didn't work for any other organization during that time period (there was his head coaching stint in LA before this stretch and his time with the Sharks after it), but there was never a 7 year stretch where Robinson was a full time assistant or head coach here for the entire duration of those 7 years.

We've had goalie coaches last way longer, but I'm not including them.

 

[Eggtimer]

Like it’s been said before, coaching staffs like to have continuity . I can’t see them letting one assistant go and keep the others. It’s almost like they are a package deal. That’s why I didn’t understand how when Hynes was fired, the rest of the staff didn’t get fired too. More time than not , the head coach likes to pick his own assistants.
If Ruff stays , I’d like to shit can the rest of the coaching staff and have Ruff pick his own assistants. I’m not saying I want Ruff back , but if he is , then habe him pick his assistants.
I think it’s time for Ruff to go but only if we have a good replacement lined up .
At the very least Recchi has to go though. He has no excuses to not be fired.
He has been responsible for a bottom 5 PP for over 2 seasons now. There is no excuse for that . The players he has are good enough to not be bottom 5. Maybe not the ideal roster make for a perfect PP setup it still.
Shit goaltendig is not an excuse for the shit PP. It is 100% on him for not beig able to find a setup that works with what he has to work with.

The only thing that might save Recchi’s ass is if they want to see what Holtz can do on the PP…..
It better not. He has to go

 

[Setec Astronomy]

Once Lindy goes, Nas has to go too, I’m sorry. This guy isn’t Larry Robinson where you can just keep him here through staff after staff. And Recchi needs to go even more than those two.

Speaking of that, I am absolutely serious that ownership should offer Robinson a couple of million bucks a year to coach the defense.

 

[Bleedred]

I think Larry's longest consecutive stint here full time might have been between 07-08 and 11-12. It doesn't even have him listed coaching here or anywhere in 06-07, but he may have been a special assignment coach that year. I don't remember for sure. It also doesn't have him listed as a coach anywhere for 02-03 and 03-04, but I clearly remember he was still considered a special assignment coach here in 02-03, which made him a part of all 3 Stanley Cup winners and really all 5 finalists.

He was probably working from home for the most part during those ''Special assignment'' years.

 

[Eggtimer]

If Fitz keeps Recchi , I have no idea what he is doing anymore.
Fitz said last off-season in the post season interviews that the PP was a massive need to address. He said it cost them games and is one of the more important issues he needed to address.
Fast forward to this year and the PP was as bad , if not even worse. Once again the PP let us down over and over. It had nothing to do with shit goaltendig.it’s a separate issue.
We added a top 5 PP D in Hamilton , had Bratt and Hughes breakout , Nico playimg amazing , yet the PP was still garbage…..
Fitz has to know that the PP was shit and absolutely needs to be fixed need year or once again we will miss the playoffs. That’s is even if we fix the goaltending. Yes goaltending is #1 to fix but after that , PP is right up there for importance . If Recchi does NOT get fired…. I have to question if Fitz can do his job amd if he should be replaced with someone who can.
Fit’s has done very well with most issues , nut not fixing the PP should place him on the hot seat if he keeps Recchi .

 

[Bad Goalie]

Vegas is actually really close. If they close out their lead against San Jose right now they will be 2 points back but have the tiebreaker over Dallas. And they play each other Tuesday. So assuming Vegas gets the 2 tonight whichever team wins that game will be ahead essentially with 2 games left each. Could be lot closer than you think and go right down to the wire.

Edit:
Well nvm they ended up losing in shootout. Much more difficult now.

If the expanded playoffs were to happen (and I don't think they will as long as Bettman is in charge) I would hope there is some mechanism to prevent teams from qualifying for them if they are, say 5 points behind 8th place. You can't make the 82 games you just played worthless, by allowing the Islanders and Blue Jackets to play Boston and Washington this year. Yeah Boston and Washington should beat both teams, but the Islanders and Blue Jackets are 20+ points behind already from the season play and shouldn't even have a shot at playoffs.

Those lousy team point totals are also padded with all the OTL and S0 points which keep teams in close in a race they have no business being in. The powers that be made those adjustments to make it look like the league has such "parity".

 

[Camille the Eel]

If McLeod doesn’t improve, his shelf life in the NHL is 2-3 more years.

I still fundamentally can’t understand how his shot is so bad

and a shot is notoriously something a player can improve and work on. It is maybe the prime example of all examples of the element of the game that is true of.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

We talking Nas? Haven’t read the thread. I like Nas but sometimes you just need a clean slate and a new voice. Entire staff should go.

Ya we are. I am honestly fine either way. I also don’t necessarily agree that you need a new voice just for the sake of it. If the voice has become old to the players and they no longer completely believe in it than yes absolutely. If they decide to fire him along with the rest of the staff I’m good with that.

The user I was responding to however has been absolutely ripping into Nas suggesting that he’s a continuation of John Hynes somehow and acting like he’s our biggest problem on the coaching staff and that it was stupid to keep him after Hynes was fired.