Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - part IV

[forceten]

I would like to acquire Meier but I'm not willing to literally throw the farm at them. We cannot afford to give up goalies because we're weak as heck there depth wise. Brennan is not a guarantee. Schmid is the only one who has played well enough to be penciled in as #2 next year.

Similarly I do not want to do Holtz (who I still think will be a 25-30 goal scorer in the NHL), PLUS Sharangovich, PLUS a top 5 D prospect (and top 5 on the Devils D list is top 2 everywhere else in the NHL) PLUS a 2023 first in the deepest draft in a decade (I don't know if it's a decade but the alliteration was awesome so...)

And Mercer is right out.

So Holtz + 1st + a legitimate defense prospect from { Bahl, Okhotiuk, Walsh, McCarthy, Vilen, etc. } would be fine with me. A little more might need some real evaluation but I am not trading the following in a deal for Meier:

F: J. Hughes, Bratt, Hischier, Mercer, Palat, Bastian, Zetterlund, Bardakov, Filmon. Prefer to avoid Sharangovich but willing to do it in right situation.
D: Hamilton, Marino, Siegenthaler, L. Hughes, Nemec, Casey, and prefer to avoid Mukhamadullin but willing to do it in the right situation.
G: Vanecek, Schmid, Daws, Brennan

There are plenty of players thus interesting for a trade:

F: Holtz, Boqvist, McLeod, Wood (rental), Tatar (rental), Johansson (rental), Haula (rental), Gritsyuk, Thompson, Foote, Clarke, Stillman, Salminen, Hauser
maybes: Sharangovich
D: Bahl, Okhotiuk, Walsh, McCarthy, Vilen, Barabosha, Leddy, Misyul, Orlov, Graves (rental), Severson (rental), Smith.
maybes: Mukhamadullin
G: eh... Brady and Malek I suppose.

Plus we have most of our picks over the next three years.

Pick plus A prospect plus B/B- prospect or Pick plus B prospect and NHL player should be enough.

We also need to take back contracts I thought - and I'd love to improve the Utica C position.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

McCabe could be interesting. Signed for 2 more years $4 million AAV. Could potentially let Graves walk and have a solid, fairly cheap stop gap for 2 years.

Siegenthaler-Hamilton
Graves-Marino
McCabe-Severson

That’s a playoff ready defense.

 

[Hisch13r]

I would like to acquire Meier but I'm not willing to literally throw the farm at them. We cannot afford to give up goalies because we're weak as heck there depth wise. Brennan is not a guarantee. Schmid is the only one who has played well enough to be penciled in as #2 next year.

Similarly I do not want to do Holtz (who I still think will be a 25-30 goal scorer in the NHL), PLUS Sharangovich, PLUS a top 5 D prospect (and top 5 on the Devils D list is top 2 everywhere else in the NHL) PLUS a 2023 first in the deepest draft in a decade (I don't know if it's a decade but the alliteration was awesome so...)

And Mercer is right out.

So Holtz + 1st + a legitimate defense prospect from { Bahl, Okhotiuk, Walsh, McCarthy, Vilen, etc. } would be fine with me. A little more might need some real evaluation but I am not trading the following in a deal for Meier:

F: J. Hughes, Bratt, Hischier, Mercer, Palat, Bastian, Zetterlund, Bardakov, Filmon. Prefer to avoid Sharangovich but willing to do it in right situation.
D: Hamilton, Marino, Siegenthaler, L. Hughes, Nemec, Casey, and prefer to avoid Mukhamadullin but willing to do it in the right situation.
G: Vanecek, Schmid, Daws, Brennan

There are plenty of players thus interesting for a trade:

F: Holtz, Boqvist, McLeod, Wood (rental), Tatar (rental), Johansson (rental), Haula (rental), Gritsyuk, Thompson, Foote, Clarke, Stillman, Salminen, Hauser
maybes: Sharangovich
D: Bahl, Okhotiuk, Walsh, McCarthy, Vilen, Barabosha, Leddy, Misyul, Orlov, Graves (rental), Severson (rental), Smith.
maybes: Mukhamadullin
G: eh... Brady and Malek I suppose.

Plus we have most of our picks over the next three years.

Pick plus A prospect plus B/B- prospect or Pick plus B prospect and NHL player should be enough.

We also need to take back contracts I thought - and I'd love to improve the Utica C position.

I mean I don't think anyone is saying to give that up and based on the rumors that's not what it'd be either. Pretty much everyone is in agreement that something like 1st, Holtz, Yegor/Muk is the way to go and most would prefer not to include Yegor but probably would if they twisted our arm on it.

I couldn't care less if we had to include a goalie. We don't have any goalie that we simply cannot afford to give up. If they want a goalie then fine take one. Goalies are too unpredictable for me to say I wouldn't trade on. Take one of Daws, Schmid, Brennan for all I care.

I also don't see why we'd be moving guys like Tatar or Haula. They're both complete no gos and I say this asa someone who doesn't even like Haula. SJ doesn't need them and there's other ways to make salary work.

Also Bardakhov is one of your untouchables at all? And him over Gritsyuk? Also as good as Filmon's been he's also not over Gritsyuk. We're likely already going to have to include Holtz so I'm not tossing Gritsyuk on top of that

 

[HBK27]

We're already down a 3rd round pick this upcoming draft, so if we use a 1st on Meier I'm not sure how many other picks I want to deal for depth - especially considering some of the late round gems this team has found in Bratt, Sharangovich, Gritsyuk, Vilen, & Filmon. Maybe we trade someone like Walsh who doesn't have much of a future here.

Not to mention we have no room at forward, so it would be for a defenseman and we will have Luke, Nemec & Muk all available for the playoffs as well.

 

[Hisch13r]

We're already down a 3rd round pick this upcoming draft, so if we use a 1st on Meier I'm not sure how many other picks I want to deal for depth - especially considering some of the late round gems this team has found in Bratt, Sharangovich, Gritsyuk, Vilen, & Filmon. Maybe we trade someone like Walsh who doesn't have much of a future here.

Not to mention we have no room at forward, so it would be for a defenseman and we will have Luke, Nemec & Muk all available for the playoffs as well.

I wouldn't be throwing either Nemec or Muk into the NHL at all let alone the playoffs. Either way though we wouldn't almost certainly wouldn't need to. I agree on not making depth moves if we're adding Meier. I have a hard time believing we couldn't plug someone in that would give comparable value to a guy we'd get with a mid round pick.

 

[None Shall Pass]

McCabe could be interesting. Signed for 2 more years $4 million AAV. Could potentially let Graves walk and have a solid, fairly cheap stop gap for 2 years.

Siegenthaler-Hamilton
Graves-Marino
McCabe-Severson

That’s a playoff ready defense.

I like that idea. I'll admit that I'm a little hesitant looking at next year's LD depth should Graves not re-sign; that'd virtually guarantee that either a rookie Luke Hughes, Smith, or Bahl/Okh are playing second pairing minutes, which isn't great. A two year stop gap like McCabe would be great.

 

[Hisch13r]

McCabe could be interesting. Signed for 2 more years $4 million AAV. Could potentially let Graves walk and have a solid, fairly cheap stop gap for 2 years.

Siegenthaler-Hamilton
Graves-Marino
McCabe-Severson

That’s a playoff ready defense.

I like McCabe. I’m not paying the price it’d take to get him. He’ll probably fetch a good return and we don’t need him that much.

 

[HBK27]

I wouldn't be throwing either Nemec or Muk into the NHL at all let alone the playoffs. Either way though we wouldn't almost certainly wouldn't need to. I agree on not making depth moves if we're adding Meier. I have a hard time believing we couldn't plug someone in that would give comparable value to a guy we'd get with a mid round pick.

Yeah, ideally not - and as you mentioned we almost certainly wouldn't need to as we'd have Smith/Severson on the bottom pairing with Bahl and Okhotiuk ahead of them in the pecking order (perhaps even Luke as well). Guess you just never know with injuries, but I'd lean towards not throwing a 4th or 5th rounder for a depth defenseman that would just be there as a healthy scratch in case injuries occur. I'm not sure we can even afford one with our cap situation anyway, depending on what (if anything) happens with Meier.

 

[The Wumpus]

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

I like McCabe. I’m not paying the price it’d take to get him. He’ll probably fetch a good return and we don’t need him that much.

I wouldn’t trade a 1st, and maybe that’s what he gets from someone like the Leafs. But something like a 2 and Bahl, maybe another prospect, I’d do that.

 

[forceten]

I don't disagree with you @Hisch13r. What I typed is an idiot's opinion but an attempt to try to structure my thinking around acquisitions at this stage of the Devils' path.

Bardakov I like because he fills a need in the prospect pool we don't have a lot of. I don't think we have enough solid forwards, so Gritsyuk would be painful to give up too. I know we have to give to get, but if we get Meier (extended) and extend Bratt we may have plenty of that type of talent.

Goalies... I think because our goalies aren't so hot is why I'm hesitant. We don't have a Wallstadt waiting in the wings. We don't have a dominant 1 like Sorokin or Shesterkin or what have you. So to me that's still very brittle. I do not expect Blackwood to be back.

But yeah, just (over?) reacting to some of the compound offers I'm seeing thrown out there.

 

[MB3]

You can't expect me to remember every new member here who comes out of nowhere just to insert himself into a conversation just to make a point.

What's wrong with inserting myself into a conversation to make a point? It's fun, you oughta try that some time!

 

[Nocashstyle]

What's wrong with inserting myself into a conversation to make a point? It's fun, you oughta try that some time!

He’s like the bouncer around these parts.
Don’t worry @glenwo2, it’s cool. He’s with me.

 

[Guttersniped]

I think most of this stuff is speculation.

But, if true, it’s not great for the Devils. Brennan hasn’t had a great year, and Daws / Schmid don’t have a lot of buzz.

I just don’t see anyone who could land Meier also having and trading a top goalie prospect.

I could see the Sharks taking a flier on a goalie as part of the deal. But I don’t think the value of that prospect would be make or break.

Buffalo has both Levi and Portillo in college but who knows how eager they are to move either since UP Luukkonen is still shaky.

They drafted Topias Leinonen at #41 in the last draft but he’s as much a work in progress as Brennan.

Buffalo doesn’t need to include a goalie to blow us out of the water, they have a better and deeper Prospect Pool. (Wheeler hasn’t gotten to Buffalo yet but in September Elite Prospects had Levi at 5, Portillo at 9, UPL at 10 and Leinonen at 15.)

Carolina has drafted what can be only described as a ridiculous number of goalies. Sure we’ve drafted a goalie every year starting in 2015 for a total of 8.

But the Canes drafted 3, yes 3, in 2019, and a total of 10 goalies in the last 8 drafts. Most aren’t good or a ?

They just signed the best one, Kochetkov, to a 4 year deal. They actually don’t have any other drafted goalie prospects signed. Not sure any of their 5 unsigned guys are particularly tantalizing but there are 5 of them to choose from. (There are no goalies, other than Kochetkov at 4, on Wheeler’s list of 15 Carolina top prospects or among his 13 (!) HM shout outs. Elite Prospects also had Kochetkov at 4 as the only goalie.)

The Rangers’ top goalie prospect, Dylan Garland (2020 Rd 4 #103), is having a rough rookie season in Hartford. (Garland is 7th on Wheeler’s list and was 5th on Elite Prospects list.)

Wheeler has Merrimack College’s Hugo Ollas (2020 Rd 7 #197) at 9.

Elite Prospects had Olof Lindbom (2018 Rd 2 #39) at 12, but they mentioned he had failed recently to meet expectations in Sweden but could bounce-back in NA. His unimpressive numbers in the ECHL this season suggest that didn’t happen.

Detroit has Sebastian Cossa, but despite his struggles, I don’t know if they trade a guy they just drafted at #15 in 2021 (and if they do it’s not a great sign because they don’t have much else). 2020 Rd 4 #104 Jan Bednar has upside but is a work in progress.

Not sure what goalie San Jose is getting that would be exciting.

 

[Bleedred]

Blackwood helps the Sharks with the tank!

 

[Nubmer6]

SJ seems pretty bad at evaluating goalies. Maybe Mac Black can be part of the trade

 

[Hisch13r]

I don't disagree with you @Hisch13r. What I typed is an idiot's opinion but an attempt to try to structure my thinking around acquisitions at this stage of the Devils' path.

Bardakov I like because he fills a need in the prospect pool we don't have a lot of. I don't think we have enough solid forwards, so Gritsyuk would be painful to give up too. I know we have to give to get, but if we get Meier (extended) and extend Bratt we may have plenty of that type of talent.

Goalies... I think because our goalies aren't so hot is why I'm hesitant. We don't have a Wallstadt waiting in the wings. We don't have a dominant 1 like Sorokin or Shesterkin or what have you. So to me that's still very brittle. I do not expect Blackwood to be back.

But yeah, just (over?) reacting to some of the compound offers I'm seeing thrown out there.

You can never have too much talent. I think Bardakov is a likely 4th liner at best. I think a likely worst case for Gritsyuk could be like a 3rd liner and I could definitely see him havinig a Kuzmeko type impact. That gap in talent is way too much for me to care about filling a need. You can find Bardakov's with relative ease. You can't find Gritsyuk's easily.

Whether Blackwood comes back or not wouldn't impact my decision on the goalies at all. So we lose Blackwood and move one of the goalies as a piece for Meier. It's not like it's that hard to find backups and none of Daws, Schmid, Brennan are guaranteed to be quality NHLers. Goalies are a crapshoot and we have 3 that maybe could be something. You can move one of them.

 

[TonySoprano]

We're never gonna get to the fireworks factory

Alot like Adrianna didn't make it to see Chrissy

 

[OmNomNom]

bad part of SJ is that grier is already familiar with our roster to an extent :|

 

[Bleedred]

SJ seems pretty bad at evaluating goalies. Maybe Mac Black can be part of the trade

It's funny because 20 years ago they produced a decent amount of NHL goalie talent. Nabokov, Kiprusoff, Toskala, Greiss a little bit later on. They had all 3 of Nabokov, Kiprusoff and Toskala at one time. Toskala didn't have quite the longevity or ceiling of the other 2, but he had some good years early on. He struggled as a starter when he got to Toronto.

They also drafted Alex Stalock who just keeps vacillating in and out of the league.

It's been all downhill since.

Overpaid for Martin Jones in the trade and overpaid even more in the extension and gave it too prematurely.

Kahkonen has been a BUST. Probably not as bad as he's been this year, but he wasn't nearly as good as Minnesota made him look either.

Adin Hill was another NOTHING acquisition. He's mediocre every organization he plays in.

 

[britdevil]

We're never gonna get to the fireworks factory

Alot like Adrianna didn't make it to see Chrissy

I’ve already consigned myself to it not happening.

My heart will be broken just like Richie’s when he sees the Polish guy wearing the jacket.

 

[Hisch13r]

bad part of SJ is that grier is already familiar with our roster to an extent :|

I mean could also be a good thing if there’s players he likes

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

We're never gonna get to the fireworks factory

Alot like Adrianna didn't make it to see Chrissy

Great episode, saw it again the other day lol.

Also if NYR lands Meier, fight pettiness with pettiness and go get Buchnevich out of St Louis or Reinhart out of Florida.

 

[Hisch13r]

Great episode, saw it again the other day lol.

Also if NYR lands Meier, fight pettiness with pettiness and go get Buchnevich out of St Louis or Reinhart out of Florida.

Didn't Staple report the Rangers don't want to move either of their 1sts? I'm really not buying the Meier rumors

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

Didn't Staple report the Rangers don't want to move either of their 1sts? I'm really not buying the Meier rumors

I mean I also saw a good point the other day about Holtz being apart of the Devils package. If the Devils were really putting him in a package, wouldn't they be playing him in the AHL to show him off and not in the press box scoffing down chicken tenders and fries? The Devils package could be a lot weaker from Fitz's side that we're thinking. Rangers add one of their kids and they probably have us beat especially if it's Chytil or Kakko considering we shouldn't add Nemec or Hughes or in the theory's case a prospect of Holtz's caliber.