Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - 2022-23 season thread part III

[NJ07102]

I think they should scratch Holtz and put Johnsson into the lineup.

I also wouldn't be opposed to bringing up Pinho or Graeme Clarke.



I agree. with both Haula back at center and Johnsson into the lineup.

Mercer and Hughes should remain together with either Bratt or Tatar or Sharangovich on their other wing.

It's too bad neither Thompson nor Foote are doing good in Utica and Clarke just turned it on a bit lately. I had high hopes for Tyce, but so far this season he hasn't been great.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

It's too bad neither Thompson nor Foote are doing good in Utica and Clarke just turned it on a bit lately. I had high hopes for Tyne, but so far this season he hasn't been great.

Why would you have a shred of hope for those players if you think Holtz is already 100% a bust with no chance of being an NHL player? Take a look at their AHL stats.

 

[NJ07102]

Why would you have a shred of hope for those players if you think Holtz is already 100% a bust with no chance of being an NHL player? Take a look at their AHL stats.

Tyce showed things Holtz never could.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Tyce showed things Holtz never could.

and Holtz showed things Tyce never could, and is 3 years younger.

 

[FooteBahl]

I saw almost all of his Utica games last season and yes, he is not a good passer because he has a low hockey IQ, doesn't have good hockey vision and isn't a quick decision maker. But since everybody here seem to believe he's gonna be much better in a year or two or whenever, he'll probably turn into a good NHL player. Could happen, but imho that is highly unlikely.

Sometimes people need time. Nico needed time, Elias needed time. Not everyone is Dawson Mercer that can step right in. From the 2020 class Laf hasn’t shown “it” yet, neither has Byfield or Rossi.

 

[Unknown Caller]

I saw Holtz and Boqvist looking at bags at the Louis Vuitton store in Short Hills last week, so probably wouldn’t be the worst thing if they saved some money paying Utica rent prices.

 

[AfroThunder396]

Tyce's brother was floundering in the NHL until basically last year. He was 24 year old with 35 points in 145 games. For comparison, Jacob Josefson had 36 points in 180 games when he was 24 years old.

Now, Tage is 4th in the NHL in points. Obviously his brother is a completely different person, but giving up on young players is foolish. People (myself included) rode off Blake Coleman because of his age, and I know as recently as last fall people were totally out on Zetterlund as nothing more than career AHL fodder.

 

[Unknown Caller]

Why would you have a shred of hope for those players if you think Holtz is already 100% a bust with no chance of being an NHL player? Take a look at their AHL stats.

Not that I think Holtz is a 100% bust, but it's a completely different calculus. Players like Thompson bring a certain skill set to the table that they don't need to be filling the back of the net to contribute and impact the game.

Holtz's entire game is goal scoring and he's a liability if he can't do that. It's very possible that his processing and skating allow him to produce at lower levels, but not at the NHL level when time and space are taken away and things move too quickly.

 

[Nocashstyle]

Tyce's brother was floundering in the NHL until basically last year. He was 24 year old with 35 points in 145 games. For comparison, Jacob Josefson had 36 points in 180 games when he was 24 years old.

Now, Tage is 4th in the NHL in points. Obviously his brother is a completely different person, but giving up on young players is foolish. People (myself included) rode off Blake Coleman because of his age, and I know as recently as last fall people were totally out on Zetterlund as nothing more than career AHL fodder.

Wrote off or rode off?

Now you have me questioning myself

 

[Unknown Caller]

Wrote off or rode off?

Now you have me questioning myself

It's wrote off.

 

[njdevils1982]

It's wrote off.

“you don’t even know what a write off is"

 

[My3Sons]

It's wrote off.

It's not beyond the laws of physics that a young man can be ridden off if the person doing the riding isn't too heavy.

 

[Cheddabombs]

Holtz is a passenger, a complimentary player. That's not the worst thing in the world, he can still be an effective NHL-er but it probably has to be in the right circumstance. Next to someone like Jack or Nico he could thrive. It's no surprise he looks awful on the 4th line.

But he still has to do the little things better to be effective with top 6 talent. Winning board battles and having better compete in the offensive zone for one. You can't have a line of say Hughes-Holtz-Mercer and think Holtz can just coast in the middle while the other two do the dirty work. He has to play a part and he hasn't shown enough improvement there unfortunately.

So if he's going to be buried on the 4th line it's a waste. Not just for him but for the team. Get someone else that can play a more responsible, more grinder, type of game.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Not that I think Holtz is a 100% bust, but it's a completely different calculus. Players like Thompson bring a certain skill set to the table that they don't need to be filling the back of the net to contribute and impact the game.

Holtz's entire game is goal scoring and he's a liability if he can't do that. It's very possible that his processing and skating allow him to produce at lower levels, but not at the NHL level when time and space are taken away and things move too quickly.

None of that is known after 10 games. I also reject that goal scoring will be his only value, he can pass the puck. He’s just not ready yet.

If we sucked we could spoon feed him minutes he doesn’t deserve to have him learn on the job, but it’s not going to happen with a team in the position they’re in.

 

[AfroThunder396]

Wrote off or rode off?

Now you have me questioning myself

Yes wrote off - I am posting from my work and got autocorrected.

Apparently my device doesn't approve of 'Tage' either. It keeps correcting to Rage Thompson, which is unquestionably better.

 

[Saugus]

Yes wrote off - I am posting from my work and got autocorrected.

Apparently my device doesn't approve of 'Tage' either. It keeps correcting to Rage Thompson, which is unquestionably better.

Rage Thompson sounds like a pro wrestler.

 

[Oneiro]

If the cap only goes up by the reported 1M, think we’ll benefit. We have to re-up a lot of mid tier players who get squeezed in these situations. I could see a scenario where you get favorable hits on Wood, Bastian, Zetterlund extensions, Haula as well - players can only defer a long term deal for so long. Plus we’re turning the corner.

 

[My3Sons]

If the cap only goes up by the reported 1M, think we’ll benefit. We have to re-up a lot of mid tier players who get squeezed in these situations. I could see a scenario where you get favorable hits on Wood, Bastian, Zetterlund extensions, Haula as well - players can only defer a long term deal for so long. Plus we’re turning the corner.

The question will be what happens with Bratt? I don't doubt a slow cap can cause friction in what is already a tricky situation.

 

[Guttersniped]

 

[Nocashstyle]

Losing Wood is really going to hurt. The Devils are going to be stuck between a rock and a hard place there. 1.) sign him long term at his current market value knowing it’s going to be a bad contract eventually. 2.) lose him and his unique skillset that every NHL team covets and wants on their roster.

I don’t think there’s going to be an excess of available players that can bring what Wood does.

 

[Oneiro]

The question will be what happens with Bratt? I don't doubt a slow cap can cause friction in what is already a tricky situation.

I think it ends up being a draw in the 8-8.5M range. Uncertain, max chaos economic outlook - you can’t predict the timing of the cap jump even if it is inevitable. I think his agent has limited ammo with that argument. My guess is we foolishly may have offered below 7M before but won’t make the same mistake again. Which is why getting savings on depth guys matters even more.

 

[Capt Nico Poo]

The question will be what happens with Bratt? I don't doubt a slow cap can cause friction in what is already a tricky situation.

Well he needs to pick it up and get to 90 to ask for anything beyond 8x8. I mean if you score at ppg clip that only makes you a borderline top 50 player in the league. Whats that, in the top 8% of all players? I think 8x8 is standard for that kind of production.

 

[Japam]

I just saw Josefson's name posted.

AAAAARRRRGGGHHHHHH STOP DRAFTING SWEDES IN THE FIRST ROUND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


ok i feel better after shouting that into my pillow.

 

[JimEIV]

I wouldn't make any definitive comments on Holtz. 19 NHL games over 2 season is absolutely meaningless...even if they were spectacular performances, I would still think "need more data".

Not only is it just 19 games, it's 19 games averaging 11 minutes...what the hell could be gathered from 19 games with no ice time?

That said, I am not particularly high on Holtz but he certainly needs more time to prove himself.

 

[Stephen Gionta]

I don't understand how anyone can still be defending Holtz at this point.

He does not belong in the NHL right now. And that's okay considering he's still young, but he will be 21 in January. Players of that age that are also a top 10 draft pick should be starting to show they belong in the NHL. Holtz has done the opposite of that thus far.

There's nothing wrong with having hope for him, but we do have to recognize it's clear he is being surpassed by MANY players in his draft class, as well as players in the draft class a year later as well.

If there were to be a redraft today of the 2020 class, it's possible he wouldn't even go in the 1st round.