Post-Game Talk: Devils @ Rangers 11/12/13

[Drewbackatu*]

So, you don't like his nickname. Fine. But slandering him by the name of our rivals? Do you see Devils fans go around calling Brodeur "Fatso"? I don't think so. Really, tell us how you really feel. Why don't you go ahead and call the Rangers "Rags" and close the circle? Talk about a spoiled "what have you done for me lately?" reaction. Yeah, what has Hank done for the Rangers? Tell us what you really feel. Those Vezina nominations and Vezina Trophy must've been bogus, because you see what most others don't.

As for his goaltending strategy of playing deep in net, take that up with Benoit Allaire, I'm sure you can give him alot of great pointers how to play the goaltending position. You want to hear the philosophy behind playing deep in net and why Allaire feels it's worth it? No? Didn't think so, you just want to whine on the last part that is wrong on this roster, because you don't like him. Because he made one mistake and your world is falling apart. Oh no, Hank has played 3 bad games so far this season. Call the suicide hotline, he's done for!

Does Henrik Lundqvist much more often than not help his team win a game than folding it? Don't lie to yourself. As for your expected standard of what a "softie" is, I bet it's a whole lot stricter than for any other goalie in the league. The Henrik Lundqvist syndrome. That's what happens when you get spoiled and gain tunnel vision.

This bipolar place will never change.

My opjnion of Hank hasn't and won't change since he became the starter here and that's this:

He is in a group of 4-5 goalies who are amongst the top goalies in the league at present. I firmly believe that Hank has thrived in the defensive oriented system he has played in first under Tom Renny and then under Tortorella.

While his level of consistency since 2005/06 has been remarkable, his overall game hasn't really improved since then either.

Considering his age and his style which really isn't conducive to remaining productive into his twilight years, I wouldn't go longer than 5-6 years @ $7-7.5 mil.

Now about softies; that goal he let in the other nite was inexcusable!

 

[Drewbackatu*]

You are too old for the internet. Leave.

And you're too young and childish to be making comments about anyone or anything! Time to grow up.

 

[Thirty One]

I think that if goalies were smart, they would stop giving up weak goals.

 

[Drewbackatu*]

Mostly because every single option to Hank out there is a lot worse? And he himself is a really popular player, with is a huge bonus to the NYR organization in regards of merchandize sales and marketability.

It's not just ability that's a part of a contract. Maybe if Henrik was a fat Grinch who slept around with his sister-in-law he'd have to lower his price I guess.

What, are you in charge of the ethics committee around here?

I dislike Brodeur as much as any Rangers fan around here but I respect his status as an all time great(top 5) in the history of the game and the fact that he's been a #1 goalie for the Devils for over 20 years.

 

[Drewbackatu*]

I think that if goalies were smart, they would stop giving up weak goals.

Hank gives up way too many of what most fans would classify as soft goals during the course of a season.

 

[Ex Officer Friendly]

So with AV saying to the media Hank let in a routine goal and Hank them blaming it on a defensive breakdown, just the fact that it's still being talked about a few days later , do we have a little conflict brewing in the locker room? Personally AV should have kept his mouth shut. You can't say things like that to the NY press.

He kind of has a history of saying odd things to the media about his players. He said Ryan Kesler's serious shoulder injury shouldn't be an excuse for his poor play.

What did New York Rangers goaltender Henrik Lundqvist have to say in response to Alain Vigneault’s comments Tuesday night that the second goal surrendered to the New Jersey Devils in the team's 3-2 loss should have been a “routine save�

“I don’t have a problem with that at all,†Lundqvist said after the team’s practice Wednesday. “Because, I agree.â€

Sooo that doesn't seem like anything is brewing
http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/ra...oachs-criticism-i-agree?ex_cid=espnapi_public

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

My opjnion of Hank hasn't and won't change since he became the starter here and that's this:

He is in a group of 4-5 goalies who are amongst the top goalies in the league at present. I firmly believe that Hank has thrived in the defensive oriented system he has played in first under Tom Renny and then under Tortorella.

While his level of consistency since 2005/06 has been remarkable, his overall game hasn't really improved since then either.

Considering his age and his style which really isn't conducive to remaining productive into his twilight years, I wouldn't go longer than 5-6 years @ $7-7.5 mil.

Now about softies; that goal he let in the other nite was inexcusable!

It is excusable. You know why? Because Lundqvist's track record over 8 years is beyond stellar. But more importantly, every goalie in the league throughout the history of the game, has let in a couple of those per season.

 

[Chimpradamus]

Hank gives up way too many of what most fans I would classify as soft goals during the course of a season.

Fixed. Don't you dare try to make this sound like some opinion of the majority to give your own opinion more weight. If it was as bad as you insinuate, Lundqvist wouldn't have been a Vezina nominee and considered a world class goaltender - by experts, journalists, coaches, fans, players and even fan rivals alike - basically every season he plays. Do you have any sort of reference to how many soft goals other goaltenders on other teams give up on a yearly basis? Bascially every starter get benched at times during their careers due to extended poor play and a loss in self confidence. Most goalies have bad stretches that basically last entire seasons. That has never happened with Hank. Do you understand what that means? I think you do. His consistency level is what most NHL goalies dream of.

Modern hockey and especially goaltending is a game of inches. You're bound to allow stupid goals from time to time, based on the law of averages. No one can perform the perfect season. Live with it. I repeat: You have the "Lundqvist" syndrome. Having him as the starter for 8 years now has made you extremely spoiled when it comes to goaltending. When Lundqvist retires and a most probably less stellar goaltender will be the starter, you will understand exactly what I mean. Then you will have a clear reference for "too many softies". I already feel sorry for the goalie that has to fill his gap in the Garden.

... While his level of consistency since 2005/06 has been remarkable, his overall game hasn't really improved since then either...

So, how do you improve from "world class" and as I quote a NY journalist the first time he saw Lundqvist practice: "He moved side to side faster than any goalie I've ever seen and his ability to stay onto the puck was phenomenal."? Lundqvist was the whole package the moment he signed with the Rangers. How much can you improve from that? He was the MVP in SEL during the lockout when it was packed with NHL stars and NHL goalies.

And I disagree, especially Hank's glove hand is more active now than it was at the start of his NHL career. Before, he tried to make the shot hit his - then very stiff - glove, now he's more of trying to actively catch it. Honestly, I think you're one of those people who can't appreciate a player's career until it is over. Then you appreciate it, until then, you seem to demand perfection.

As for his contract and the danger it will become bloated, that's a whole other discussion I think. Hopefully, Hank takes a discount, because the team is still too weak and too flawed not to.

 

[Drewbackatu*]

It is excusable. You know why? Because Lundqvist's track record over 8 years is beyond stellar. But more importantly, every goalie in the league throughout the history of the game, has let in a couple of those per season.

Agree, they all do. I'm sure that I'm in the minority here in stating that I feel that Hank's great numbers over the past 8 seasons are more a byproduct of the defensive oriented system he has played in.
It's the same reason why I would never rate Brodeur the #1 goalie of all- time because he played for so many years in a goalie friendly neutral zone trapping defensive system.

While Hank's numbers have been stellar, he isn't any better than Quick, Rinne, and perhaps a few others.

 

[Drewbackatu*]

Fixed. Don't you dare try to make this sound like some opinion of the majority to give your own opinion more weight. If it was as bad as you insinuate, Lundqvist wouldn't have been a Vezina nominee and considered a world class goaltender - by experts, journalists, coaches, fans, players and even fan rivals alike - basically every season he plays. Do you have any sort of reference to how many soft goals other goaltenders on other teams give up on a yearly basis? Probably not, because most starters get benched at times during their careers due to extended poor play and a loss in self confidence. That has never happened with Hank. Do you understand what that means?

Modern hockey and especially goaltending is a game of inches. You're bound to allow stupid goals from time to time, based on the law of averages. No one can perform the perfect season. Live with it.

I repeat: You have the "Lundqvist" syndrome. Having him as the starter for 8 years now has made you extremely spoiled when it comes to goaltending. When Lundqvist retires, you will understand exactly what I mean.

So, how do you improve from "world class"? And I disagree, especially Hank's glove hand is much more active now than it was at the start of his NHL career. Before, he tried to make the shot hit his glove, now he's more of trying to actively catch it. Honestly, I think you're one of those people who can't appreciate a player's career until it is over. Then you appreciate it, until then, you seem to demand perfection.

Why don't you just read the posts on the game thread when he gave up the goal? Plenty of fans, with the exception of myself were ripping him for giving up a ridiculously soft goal no matter how you chose to spin it.

I'll state it again, Hank is part of a group of 4-5 goalies in the league who I would classify as the top net minders in hockey at present.

That doesn't mean that I don't appreciate him.

 

[Drewbackatu*]

Fixed. Don't you dare try to make this sound like some opinion of the majority to give your own opinion more weight. If it was as bad as you insinuate, Lundqvist wouldn't have been a Vezina nominee and considered a world class goaltender - by experts, journalists, coaches, fans, players and even fan rivals alike - basically every season he plays. Do you have any sort of reference to how many soft goals other goaltenders on other teams give up on a yearly basis? Bascially every starter get benched at times during their careers due to extended poor play and a loss in self confidence. Most goalies have bad stretches that basically last entire seasons. That has never happened with Hank. Do you understand what that means? I think you do.

Modern hockey and especially goaltending is a game of inches. You're bound to allow stupid goals from time to time, based on the law of averages. No one can perform the perfect season. Live with it. I repeat: You have the "Lundqvist" syndrome. Having him as the starter for 8 years now has made you extremely spoiled when it comes to goaltending. When Lundqvist retires and a most probably less stellar goaltender will be the starter, you will understand exactly what I mean. Then you will have a reference for "too many softies".

So, how do you improve from "world class" and as I quote a NY journalist the first time he saw Lundqvist practice: "He moved side to side faster than any goalie I've ever seen and his ability to stay onto the puck was phenomenal."? Lundqvist was the whole package the moment he signed with the Rangers. How much can you improve from that? And I disagree, especially Hank's glove hand is much more active now than it was at the start of his NHL career. Before, he tried to make the shot hit his glove, now he's more of trying to actively catch it. Honestly, I think you're one of those people who can't appreciate a player's career until it is over. Then you appreciate it, until then, you seem to demand perfection.

As for his contract and the danger it will become bloated, that's a whole other discussion I think. Hopefully, Hank takes a discount, because the team is still too weak and too flawed not to.

Great, we agree 100% with one another on your last statement.

I want what any other loyal Rangers fan wants which is to see our longest tenured and best player lead a team talented enough to compete for and ultimately win a cup!

 

[Chimpradamus]

Why don't you just read the posts on the game thread when he gave up the goal? Plenty of fans, with the exception of myself were ripping him for giving up a ridiculously soft goal no matter how you chose to spin it.

I'll state it again, Hank is part of a group of 4-5 goalies in the league who I would classify as the top net minders in hockey at present.

That doesn't mean that I don't appreciate him.

Allow me to explain my track of thought here, from what I could observe from your posts. Last game was one goal, in one game, that was considered a real softie by everyone. But somehow, it became - and I again quote you: "Hank gives up way too many of what most fans would classify as soft goals during the course of a season". Big difference. One softie transformed into a reoccuring theme, according to "most fans". That, is no correlation from reactions from one soft goal. That, is the train of thought why I think you're blowing stuff out of proportion.

I get that you're a passionate fan, but enough with this, alright? He allowed one softie, everyone agrees, but as for the rest? No, no and no. It's not the first time Lundqvist made a big mistake, neither will it be the last. Live with it. If Lundqvist allows too many softies, every goalie in the league allows too many softies and is not a problem you can correct whatsoever.

If you think Lundqvist actually gives up more softies than acceptable, have you considered that he plays alot more games and faces alot more shots than most goalies during the course of a season? It's like saying "men are worse drivers than women, because they are involved in more accidents." Well yes, that might happen to look true, unless you also take into account that men drive far more vehicles much further distances than women. If you look at the accidental average/ mile driven, the statement does not hold to be true. Same thing with Lundqvist compared to other goaltenders.

 

[MGF0723]

It seems like for every softee Hank gives up, he'll stand on his head for the next few games after.

 

[Drewbackatu*]

Allow me to explain my track of thought here, from what I could observe from your posts. Last game was one goal, in one game, that was considered a real softie by everyone. But somehow, it became - and I again quote you: "Hank gives up way too many of what most fans would classify as soft goals during the course of a season". Big difference. One softie transformed into a reoccuring theme, according to "most fans". That, is no correlation from reactions from one soft goal. That, is the train of thought why I think you're blowing stuff out of proportion.

I get that you're a passionate fan, but enough with this, alright? He allowed one softie, everyone agrees, but as for the rest? No, no and no. It's not the first time Lundqvist made a big mistake, neither will it be the last. Live with it. If Lundqvist allows too many softies, every goalie in the league allows too many softies and is not a problem you can correct whatsoever.

If you think Lundqvist actually gives up more softies than acceptable, have you considered that he plays alot more games and faces alot more shots than most goalies during the course of a season? It's like saying "men are worse drivers than women, because they are involved in more accidents." Well yes, that might happen to look true, unless you also take into account that men drive far more vehicles much further distances than women. If you look at the accidental average/ mile driven, the statement does not hold to be true. Same thing with Lundqvist compared to other goaltenders.

Ok, I surrender. No more comments from me on soft goals!

 

[Chimpradamus]

Ok, I surrender. No more comments from me on soft goals!

It's not your comments that are the isse, it's the unnecessary exagerrations, which all started with you slandering a fan favourite, with a rival expression ("the queen"). Granted, this is a meaningless conversation about nothing, but we're all sitting here anyway to kill time. You can say whatever you feel like, but since this is a hockey forum of all places, exagerrations is a common topic for intense discussions. Don't take it personal, which I'm sure you don't.

 

[Tawnos]

Agree, they all do. I'm sure that I'm in the minority here in stating that I feel that Hank's great numbers over the past 8 seasons are more a byproduct of the defensive oriented system he has played in.
It's the same reason why I would never rate Brodeur the #1 goalie of all- time because he played for so many years in a goalie friendly neutral zone trapping defensive system.

While Hank's numbers have been stellar, he isn't any better than Quick, Rinne, and perhaps a few others.

I think what sets Lundqvist apart from those guys is how remarkably consistent he's been. There is no doubt that he's a top goalie in the league and there is no doubt that he was helped by both Renney's and Tortorella's systems. These aren't mutually exclusive. But even guys playing behind great defensive schemes haven't been as consistent as Lundqvist has been (mostly talking about Rinne). That's what makes him so great. You've said all this, but it bears reiteration.

 

[polarbearcub]

How close is rick nash?

 

[Thirty One]

How close is rick nash?

Mid-December at the absolute earliest.

 

[Vidic15*]

Mid-December at the absolute earliest.

Rangers start a nine game home stand in early December. I have a feeling we will be seeing him then.

 

[Killem Dafoe]

Rangers start a nine game home stand in early December. I have a feeling we will be seeing him then.

He's 60% joking.

 

[Hire Sather]

If Nash is skating with the team in contact drills, I think we'll see him next week.

 

[JohnC]

If Nash is skating with the team in contact drills, I think we'll see him next week.

I thought he was retiring...

 

[Drewbackatu*]

I think what sets Lundqvist apart from those guys is how remarkably consistent he's been. There is no doubt that he's a top goalie in the league and there is no doubt that he was helped by both Renney's and Tortorella's systems. These aren't mutually exclusive. But even guys playing behind great defensive schemes haven't been as consistent as Lundqvist has been (mostly talking about Rinne). That's what makes him so great. You've said all this, but it bears reiteration.

I agree with you there. Glad we have him even though I may take him for granted. Ready to move on to the next issue when it pops up.