Devils discussion (news, notes and speculation) - part III

[SKNJD9]

Nor should you. IB been out there doing this for like a decade and it certainly hasn't been a common occurrence for him to be right

dude throws shit at a wall until something sticks he's a known joke...pretty sure a self admitted one too

 

[Lou Bloom]

So then do you think Casey is an elite prospect? Because I see you include him in the future plans but not Nemec, therefore its fair to assume you value him higher?

Thats all my point is. I dont see Nemec as being a trade piece simply because some value him less or see less potential in him than Casey. I value both similarly in potential and think Nemec has a better chance to be more influential defensively than Casey

I included him because he's a good, near NHL ready RD prospect which along with Hamilton, Pesce and Kovacevic shows the Devils have a lot of depth at RD, which opens up trading Nemec. The reason I prefer to keep him over Nemec is because even though I think they're of similar quality Nemec will have much more trade value due to his draft status and unlike Nemec, Casey seems to have no problem developing in Utica for another season which makes keeping him and Kovacevic an option.

And I dont ascribe my opinions to that of a prospect scout or even an avid viewer, either. If the case truly is Nemec is worse than he was a year or two ago, then so be it. I just havent heard that anywhere else other than around these parts

It's not about getting worse, It's about his development curve stalling and not improving at areas that were problems even in his draft season. If he was showcasing better defensive position, physicality or skating then I'd be more optimistic about his potential but with those warts still clearly in his game it makes you reevaluate his potential.

ersonally Id like to keep both but If I had to choose id prefer to move Casey because I feel Luke Hughes is the PP1 anchor going forward (unless we go to a two defenseman setup, thats fair too)

Nemec isn't good defensively either. They both have warts there currently but one player is on an upward development trajectory in that area and the other has largely stalled out in making defensive improvements. And if you view them equally or close to equal as prospects then trading the one with more value on the market that doesn't want to play in Utica next season makes more sense in both trade value return and roster flexibility.

 

[New Jerseys Devil]

I included him because he's a good, near NHL ready RD prospect which along with Hamilton, Pesce and Kovacevic shows the Devils have a lot of depth at RD, which opens up trading Nemec. The reason I prefer to keep him over Nemec is because even though I think they're of similar quality Nemec will have much more trade value due to his draft status and unlike Nemec, Casey seems to have no problem developing in Utica for another season which makes keeping him and Kovacevic an option.

It's not about getting worse, It's about his development curve stalling and not improving at areas that were problems even in his draft season. If he was showcasing better defensive position, physicality or skating then I'd be more optimistic about his potential but with those warts still clearly in his game it makes you reevaluate his potential.

Nemec isn't good defensively either. They both have warts there currently but one player is on an upward development trajectory in that area and the other has largely stalled out in making defensive improvements. And if you view them equally or close to equal as prospects then trading the one with more value on the market that doesn't want to play in Utica next season makes more sense in both trade value return and roster flexibility.

Fair enough! We may not see eye to eye on how to approach the situation but I feel we both just want whats best for the team. I can understand your side on how to approach things.

I am not locked into any one feeling about the team (other than Nico being a lifelong Devil!!) so Im sure if Nemec was moved id be over it within a week like everyone else before him lol. And I was wrong about the Larsson trade so I could very well be wrong here too

Either way I hope the Devils, Casey, and Nemec do well; whether together or not!

 

[None Shall Pass]

I mean our GM is on the record saying he's going to make trades, our team is fiddling with call-ups to gain cap space, etc. Rumor mongers saying "Watch out for New Jersey" aren't saying anything new at all.

 

[Emperoreddy]

I mean our GM is on the record saying he's going to make trades, our team is fiddling with call-ups to gain cap space, etc. Rumor mongers saying "Watch out for New Jersey" aren't saying anything new at all.

Yeah it's out in the open that Fitz is looking for a long term top 6 player for Jack and a bottom 6 rental.

 

[Zippy316]

I think there’s a really good chance that the Devils regret moving Nemec.

However, I am at the point where I’d absolutely put him on the table for McCann, if he’s available.

Not really sure there’s anyone out there that’s realistically available that I would say the same.

 

[glenwo2]

I think there’s a really good chance that the Devils regret moving Nemec.

However, I am at the point where I’d absolutely put him on the table for McCann, if he’s available.

Not really sure there’s anyone out there that’s realistically available that I would say the same.

The thing is that if Casey continues to play well for us, then that softens the blow somewhat if we moved Nemec.

 

[MadDevil]

The thing is that if Casey continues to play well for us, then that softens the blow somewhat if we moved Nemec.

Sure, if he's for real. Nemec looked really good in the beginning too. So did Mercer. Now they don't look so good, which might be something the team should look into.

 

[Lou Bloom]

Fair enough! We may not see eye to eye on how to approach the situation but I feel we both just want whats best for the team. I can understand your side on how to approach things.

I am not locked into any one feeling about the team (other than Nico being a lifelong Devil!!) so Im sure if Nemec was moved id be over it within a week like everyone else before him lol. And I was wrong about the Larsson trade so I could very well be wrong here too

Either way I hope the Devils, Casey, and Nemec do well; whether together or not!

Completely fair. I could definitely be wrong on Nemec, I still think he's a very good prospect and wouldn't be so gung ho about moving him if it wasn't for the logjam at RD and the severe lack of depth at forward.

 

[ninetyeight]

Very disappointed with Nemec. Struggled early season after the injury, was sent down and struggled in the AHL. Finally started getting back to his game, got another shot at the NHL level and absolutely blew it. While Casey seems to rising to the occasion.

I still think Nemec will be a top 4 D, it might take some time though. I doubt he'll ever live up to his draft position, but I guess most already thought this when he was drafted. He's got the talent, but him crumbling under pressure and failing to step up when he gets the chance is concerning.

I think we are spoiled with Luke, as it really isn't easy for defencemen to dominate so early on, especially when they are coming from european rinks.

I think we either deal him right now for a top6 scorer, or ride him out to the end. Don't want him to be another Zacha, Holtz etc where we trade him after his value has already plummeted. Either trade him now or stick with him.

I would love to package him and our other top prospects, to get a true star player like Caufield/Brady. But young guys like that aren't moving unless there are issues.

 

[MasterofGrond]

man if this type of season is what puts everybody on the ledge regarding Nemec how do yall deal with actual busts

 

[Better Call Sal]

The brakes 100% have to be pumped on the Nemec takes. But, if Casey can continue to be as productive as he has been and be a difference maker (in a completely different type of role granted), I will certainly be more open to listening to offers that involve him to fill the other holes in the roster.

I still am not giving up on him, because you’d be crazy to want to at this stage of his development. But if you’re offering me something spicy in return, maybe I’m more willing to listen.

 

[Triumph]

man if this type of season is what puts everybody on the ledge regarding Nemec how do yall deal with actual busts

That's what's so frustrating, though. Some guys just never really look like NHLers - and I'd argue that Holtz was one of these. Nemec was solid last season, he made his share of mistakes, but he also made some excellent reads and did so consistently.

I have absolutely no idea what Nemec was doing out there on Saturday, to me it was one of the worst games I've seen someone play. His strength is his ability to read the play, but that was absent, as was pretty much everything else. Players have turned it around from this point for sure, but it is concerning.

 

[forceten]

The problem with the quick take of Nemec blew it, Casey shines is that it focuses on offense. Casey will always be a more electric offense player. His shot has eyes and gets through everyone and everything. It's hard, accurate. He's a slick, quick skater and makes plays.

But Nemec likely is the better ceiling for defense (which is the purpose of the position). So I'm troubled at the moment. Would I like to go back in time and draft Cooley instead? YES. But that's because we're dying for NHL forwards (which is why the drunk proposal for Beniers for Nemec, Mercer, 1st, Foote doesn't work - it would have to be Beniers PLUS a forward like Gourde because we'd have a hole on the wing then). It is NOT because I think Nemec is not a top prospect.

 

[devsfan8]

I see Crouse's name out there floating around. I had mentioned him a few weeks ago how he would be a good fit. I know his numbers are down, but Fitz should get on the phone and inquire. Obviously if there are better options they should be pursued but Crouse would be a nice get.

 

[Devils731]

I see Crouse's name out there floating around. I had mentioned him a few weeks ago how he would be a good fit. I know his numbers are down, but Fitz should get on the phone and inquire. Obviously if there are better options they should be pursued but Crouse would be a nice get.

While everything looks a little lesser this year compared to be last year the big change is shooting percentage, which can be a fickle stat.

Crouse’s career shooting percentage numbers are bizarre. He’s shot as high as 15.8% in a season and as low as 5.7%. I’m not sure I’ve seen a guy who has such wide spreads for his shooting percentage and had the highs and lows effectively repeat multiple times.

The on-ice shooting percentage for him this year is pretty bad too, obviously part of that is his own shooting woes. He also had a pretty big spread there.

He looks like a bit of an oddball when it comes to the shooting numbers; while random his numbers seem spread oddly. I think you’d want your video scouts really sitting down and trying to figure out why that might be before committing to him.

If you can’t identify a cause for his wide and repeated spreads then I think you’d want to feel like you were buying him at near his low numbers value, in which case Utah probably wouldn’t be interested.

 

[I Hate Tie DOMI]

It seems the GM and coach are following the Holtz plan where they talk about poor play and criticize them publicly to soften the blow when they trade them away for a value much lower than originally perceived by the fans. Hope I'm wrong and Nemec can become a top 4, but also expecting a return of a 3rd round pick at this point too.

 

[Triumph]

It seems the GM and coach are following the Holtz plan where they talk about poor play and criticize them publicly to soften the blow when they trade them away for a value much lower than originally perceived by the fans. Hope I'm wrong and Nemec can become a top 4, but also expecting a return of a 3rd round pick at this point too.

The GM does not give a shit what the fans think the value of a player is. You are not the most important person in the existence of the Devils.

 

[TheBeerNerd]

It seems the GM and coach are following the Holtz plan where they talk about poor play and criticize them publicly to soften the blow when they trade them away for a value much lower than originally perceived by the fans. Hope I'm wrong and Nemec can become a top 4, but also expecting a return of a 3rd round pick at this point too.

I mean, were they wrong about Holtz? He isn't exactly proving the haters wrong in Vegas.

 

[devilsblood]

We aren’t getting Brady

Certainly not this year.

 

[devsfan8]

It seems the GM and coach are following the Holtz plan where they talk about poor play and criticize them publicly to soften the blow when they trade them away for a value much lower than originally perceived by the fans. Hope I'm wrong and Nemec can become a top 4, but also expecting a return of a 3rd round pick at this point too.

I'd bet you 100 dollars to your 1 dollar Nemec yields more then a 3rd. It'll be the easiest dollar I ever won.

 

[Omar Little]

It seems the GM and coach are following the Holtz plan where they talk about poor play and criticize them publicly to soften the blow when they trade them away for a value much lower than originally perceived by the fans. Hope I'm wrong and Nemec can become a top 4, but also expecting a return of a 3rd round pick at this point too.

A worse prospect in Jiricek literally just returned a 1st round pick, 2nd round pick, 3rd round pick, a 4th round pick and a solid d prospect

Jiricek traded to Wild by Blue Jackets for Hunt, 4 draft picks | NHL.com

Defenseman was No. 6 pick in 2022; Minnesota also receives 5th-round selection

www.nhl.com

 

[AfroThunder396]

Fans almost always overrate the trade value of their players, especially young ones. If Nemec gets moved it probably won't be for as much as people think. But it won't be terrible either. Teams seem to be much more bullish on change of scenery young defensemen than change of scenery young defensemen.

If Nemec gets moved it won't be for futures like the Jiricek deal. He'll either be the main piece in a deal for a big name player or in a one-for-one hockey trade for a struggling young forward.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

I'd be interested in something like Nemec + Mercer for Beniers.

Matty Beniers would be a perfect fit to play as a high end 3C behind Jack and Nico. Dude's a high pace player who is gonna be a really strong 2 way center who

But Nemec likely is the better ceiling for defense (which is the purpose of the position). So I'm troubled at the moment. Would I like to go back in time and draft Cooley instead? YES. But that's because we're dying for NHL forwards (which is why the drunk proposal for Beniers for Nemec, Mercer, 1st, Foote doesn't work - it would have to be Beniers PLUS a forward like Gourde because we'd have a hole on the wing then). It is NOT because I think Nemec is not a top prospect.

I don't think that's necessarily true. Nemec's foot speed is likely to always be a weakness.

Seamus is such a better skater and competes much harder in his own end. Not to mention he's a lot more responsible defensively.

I really don't think your drunk proposal was really that far off honestly.