Detroit Redwings Downfall

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Its absolutely unrealistic to think they pass LA or EDM next season.
Devils had a 49 point improvement 2021-22 to 2022-23. It's not the most likely of outcome by any means, but it's not crazy unrealistic. That's not a particularly strong division, the 4 teams ahead of them all have reasons to feel shaky about them as quickly as next year.

Not sure why you bothered asking if you've pre-determined the outcome.
 
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Devils had a 49 point improvement 2021-22 to 2022-23. It's not the most likely of outcome by any means, but it's not crazy unrealistic. That's not a particularly strong division, the 4 teams ahead of them all have reasons to feel shaky about them as quickly as next year.

Not sure why you bothered asking if you've pre-determined the outcome.

Weird how now all of a sudden, 176 pages into the thread, it's possible for a team to improve significantly from one season to the next.

Just not Detroit.
 
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Weird how now all of a sudden, 176 pages into the thread, it's possible for a team to improve significantly from one season to the next.

Just not Detroit.
Maybe Detroit improves rapidly, it would help if Yzerman took a more aggressive approach than passively waiting around to see if enough prospects pull through. Sounds like Anaheim is saying "we don't need the kids to learn how to play competitive hockey and come in 9th for three straight years, now that we are in a post-tank phase, we are being upfront about what our goal is and we will take steps to get there". Maybe it works, maybe it doesn't. But that's the difference, Yzerman has said that we're done tanking, but we are still preaching patience, etc.
 
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Not sure why you bothered asking if you've pre-determined the outcome.
Well I didn't ask you did I.
It's not the most likely of outcome by any means, but it's not crazy unrealistic. That's not a particularly strong division, the 4 teams ahead of them all have reasons to feel shaky about them as quickly as next year.
It's 98% unrealistic. There is this small Jim Carey meme chance of them getting remotely close to a playoff spot.

They aren't catching Vegas, LA or Edmonton.
Everyone expecting Vancouver to bounce back and they ended 10 points ahead of Anaheim this year.

Yes, they can get past Calgary, they are an unstable team so they might regress.

Winnipeg, Dallas and Colorado is not team they will catch either.
Minnesota and St. Louis seem to be improving.
Nashville should be better than this year.

So realistically fighting for 10th in the conference.
 
Veleno with 7 points in 18 games for the Hawks? I thought he'd go to the AHL.lol I was always a fan of his. Hoping he can still make full time NHL player for a few seasons.
 
What do you think ”building for the future” means?

To Yzerman, it means no set date, no urgency, and maybe they'll be ready for the playoffs by 2030.

It's also a failing strategy, considering you can't 100% build through the draft. You need established NHL talent (and we've found out the hard way that the Comphers, Copps, Tarasenkos, Petrys, and Holls of the world aren't it.)
 
"He needs to be patient, he was just a placeholder, Yzerman's plan is to not contend until Larkin is 36, etc"
Larkin is in year 2 of 8 and is now openly questioning the boss.lol Guess he didn't get the memo about waiting for Asp, Buch, MLB, Danielsson, Cossa and Augustine to all arrive, develop and become great NHL players (which I think half of them will). Patience Dylan, patience!

Next years plan is currently (to my eye):

Asp is coming next year. Kasper will be a 50 point guy. Petry is potentially resigning? So is Kane? Raymond will finally have his first .ppg season on his way to being a 100 point guy. Mrazek and Talbot got the crease. Rasmusson is back for 3 more seasons. Tarasenko is back for 1 more. Holl is back too! And a mid first round pick (with 8 more after that).

To me, time to make some good trades and a few buyouts.
 
Veleno with 7 points in 18 games for the Hawks? I thought he'd go to the AHL.lol I was always a fan of his. Hoping he can still make full time NHL player for a few seasons.
Veleno has been a full time NHL player for about four seasons now. I expect he certainly will be again to start next season. After that who knows given his contract will be up, he's in UFA years and players on 4th lines are pretty expendable. So after a certain age the league gets bored of them if they haven't made an additional step forward so there's a spot for the next guy. He was not a bad fit for the Hawks but not something that is necessarily viewed as part of the future.
 
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On a Czech media feed today.lol Larkin seems a bit pissed at his Yzerboss.lol I only wish someone told him to be patient


Well. Complaining about morale as the team captain is a bit weird.

Not to mention expecting some big add as you lost 5 out of 7 between 4 Nations and the TDL.
 
Well. Complaining about morale as the team captain is a bit weird.

Not to mention expecting some big add as you lost 5 out of 7 between 4 Nations and the TDL.
It's not weird at all. Being a company man and standing up for the front office would be weird. Saying the players want to compete and are trying hard but that the front office should be trying hard to compete as well, is what you want from a captain.

"Nope we are totally cool with the front office eyeing 2027 for a playoff appearance." Would be weird.
 
Well. Complaining about morale as the team captain is a bit weird.

Not to mention expecting some big add as you lost 5 out of 7 between 4 Nations and the TDL.
It's an odd look. Very rare. Could be nothing. Could end in him being traded. Could end in Yzerman listening to his captain and having a great offseason via trade/UFA?
 


On a Czech media feed today.lol Larkin seems a bit pissed at his Yzerboss.lol I only wish someone told him to be patient

So the natural follow up question to that would've been: What guys? To get something you have to give up something, so were the "guys" in the room that would've been traded away also down about the fact that they weren't moved?
 
Veleno has been a full time NHL player for about four seasons now. I expect he certainly will be again to start next season. After that who knows given his contract will be up, he's in UFA years and players on 4th lines are pretty expendable. So after a certain age the league gets bored of them if they haven't made an additional step forward so there's a spot for the next guy. He was not a bad fit for the Hawks but not something that is necessarily viewed as part of the future.
I just saw 17 points in his last 2 seasons. He was one I always cheered for back in the day. Thought he was a great pick. Chicago needs to get Blumel out of Dallas!
 
To me, time to make some good trades and a few buyouts.

Buyouts only have a point if you need cap and intend to spend to it. Detroit doesn't and probably wont.

They'd be farther ahead to bury a guy like Holl for one year than buy him out for 2.

This was Buffalo's issue with Skinner. Buying him out wasn't necessarily a bad idea. Buying him out and then not using the cap space they gained made it dumb as hell.
 
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Well. Complaining about morale as the team captain is a bit weird.

Not to mention expecting some big add as you lost 5 out of 7 between 4 Nations and the TDL.
This is the natural thing when you have a 9-year rebuild. You can get Larkin on board to wait for someone like Seider, who is only five years younger than himself. Now guys like Seider and Raymond are there and somewhat "arrived" as top line level players. But now you continue to tell him "Hey, just wait around for Sandin-Pellika, wait around for Danielson" and he's going to start to wonder why he's waiting around for guys that are like 9 years younger than him to both get there and then arrive, and if he's even part of this supposed "timeline" while years of his prime continue to tick away... he watches his peers battle it out in the postseason while he sits at home.
 
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Buyouts only have a point if you need cap and intend to spend to it. Detroit doesn't and probably wont.

They'd be farther ahead to bury a guy like Holl for one year than buy him out for 2.

This was Buffalo's issue with Skinner. Buying him out wasn't necessarily a bad idea. Buying him out and then not using the cap space they gained made it dumb as hell.
I see your point but he makes 3.4 and you can only bury about 1.2 (roughly). So it'd be over 2 mill against cap. I get the not spending against the cap but when you see a team not making playoffs with cap space and the captain is saying the team was down after no TDL moves. Might be time to spend more and make a swing or two. I'm an Oiler fan so I really don't know what cap space is. And our books during the decade of darkness were always full of bad players on too long contracts and buyouts. It does bite you in the ass later.
 
It's not weird at all. Being a company man and standing up for the front office would be weird. Saying the players want to compete and are trying hard but that the front office should be trying hard to compete as well, is what you want from a captain.

"Nope we are totally cool with the front office eyeing 2027 for a playoff appearance." Would be weird.

Saying the players want to compete seems a bit dishonest when you went into 4 Nations in a playoff spot and came out of it with an 11-13-3 record.

There's blame to go in every direction.
 
It's not weird at all. Being a company man and standing up for the front office would be weird. Saying the players want to compete and are trying hard but that the front office should be trying hard to compete as well, is what you want from a captain.

"Nope we are totally cool with the front office eyeing 2027 for a playoff appearance." Would be weird.
"I looked up and down our locker room, with like 14 guys over the age of 26 and looked at each of those guys in the eye and told them that 'we're all just placeholders until Yzerman can have 15 of his own draft picks on the roster and to trust the Yzerplan', so I don't see the big deal"
 

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