Prospect Info: David Reinbacher

[KevSkillz4]

He could for sure. You also could hit a royal flush on the flop but the important element here are the odds of it happening. BPA is measured before you scratch your ticket.

I think the odds of Michkov being a better future hockey player than Reinbacher are extremely high. Would you rather draft Ovechkin or Sergachev if we need a D more than a wing?

Michkov and Ovechkin are not even the same profile. Ovechkin is 6"3, much bigger, much physical.

Reinbacher is way better defensively than Sergachev aswell.

Reinbacher more in the mold of Dobson//Seider.

 

[MoneyManny]

I don't think Ovechkin or Sergachev are a fair comparison to either guys.

Reinbacher was drafted for the defensive and transition part of the game which is a more important part of winning than an offense only small winger. Ekholm had more of an impact for Edmonton than Panarin did for the Rangers, as an example.

A lot of the league thought Reinbacher was BPA over Michkov, hence the appetite to try to trade up for Reinbacher, and none to get up to secure Michkov.

I was exagerating to illustrate my point. Stars are a more important part of winning than positions, and my personal opinion is that Michkov has better odds being the better player.

In the NFL, where they draft mostly 21, 22 and 23 years old players, drafting by need is a thing because the prospects are a lot less raw and a lot more projectable than 18 years old hockey prospects. A lot of them have immediate impact in the pro game in year 1. And even then it's a crapshoot!

I'll repeat, i believe micro planning specific roles for a future team multiple years down the line based on 17 years old kids seasons in junior hockey is a major fool's errand. I'd much rather hoard talent until at least a clear picture of a contending core can be drawn, then it's time for the adjustments, that are absolutely to be done OUTSIDE of the draft.

 

[MoneyManny]

Michkov and Ovechkin are not even the same profile. Ovechkin is 6"3, much bigger, much physical.

Reinbacher is way better defensively than Sergachev aswell.

Reinbacher more in the mold of Dobson//Seider.

When the sage points at the moon, all the fool looks at is the finger.

Insert defenseman vs appropriately more talented winger in your preferred flavor if you have a problem with my analogy lol.

 

[WeThreeKings]

I was exagerating to illustrate my point. Stars are a more important part of winning than positions, and my personal opinion is that Michkov has better odds being the better player.

In the NFL, where they draft mostly 21, 22 and 23 years old players, drafting by need is a thing because the prospects are a lot less raw and a lot more projectable than 18 years old hockey prospects. A lot of them have immediate impact in the pro game in year 1. And even then it's a crapshoot!

I'll repeat, i believe micro planning specific roles for a future team multiple years down the line based on 17 years old kids seasons in junior hockey is a major fool's errand. I'd much rather hoard talent until at least a clear picture of a contending core can be drawn, then it's time for adjustments.

In the end - they took the guy who was determined by a large number of scouts/NHL organizations to be the more valuable asset in terms of building a winning team, who plays a more important position and is a harder to acquire asset, and ended up getting an equivalent player, who is bigger and they feel is a better culture fit than Michkov the following draft.

If they had gone in the other direction, they would not have been able to draft a RD equivalent to Reinbacher this year.. and if the thought is they should have taken both Michkov and Demidov, I disagree because history is very lean on situations where a point scoring winger has been traded for a right shot defenseman of Reinbacher's profile. The only one I can think of is Taylor Hall for Adam Larsson.

 

[Heffyhoof]

BPA isn't just who scores the most points, though. Reinbacher could very well play a very big and more important role in winning the stanley cup than Michkov.

Would you rather have Patrice Bergeron or Mitch Marner? Mitch Marner has consistently scored higher than Bergeron's best years.

Single most frustrating part is that we're all supposed to pretend Michkov was BPA and there's no discussion to be had. Lucky considering they then use his appointed BPA status has a cudgel for the entirety of the rest of the argument. "It's the MB years all over again reaching for need and not skill."

 

[Hins77]

No you don't. Players can be traded, and unless you have a working crystal ball, nobody knows what needs the team will have even 2-3 years down the line.

Drafting by need is EXACTLY how you miss out on stars, and contrary to your claim, THAT is the Bergevin move

Out of all our drafted players recently, how many of them turned out to be centerpiece 1st liners and 1D's? Don't you realize that with how much of a hit or miss hockey prospects are, planning around prospects with little NHL experience is a fools errand?

Imagine if we drafted based on need when a tiny winger was available at 15 several years ago? Or if we picked Wright? Or maybe if we picked Tkatchuk instead of Bustkaniemi? OUR OWN TEAM'S RECENT HISTORY SCREAMS THAT BPA IS THE WAY!

It's all a probabilities game, and i'll take the prospect that has the better odds to turn into something regardless of the position rather than chase low odds for a perfect fit.

What do you think the odds would be of Michkov making it into the HHOF one day vs Reinbacher? As a gambler no way i'd put a dime on our guy.

Reinbacher is bpa over michkov if this is you want to hear

 

[montreal]

I haven't watched enough of Reinbacher, Michkov and Demidov to have a very good opinion.

I respect that and wish more would admit that to themselves instead of wasting so much time by posting nonsense just to try to show how said person on the internet knows more about a subject that likely 99% don't even know much about and you couldn't get any of them to even agree on what is tanking or development or impacts on coaching, etc...

It's been clear to me for years that most here just talk out their ass, I just don't get why, what's the point? Each person knows if they are watching say KHL, or SHL or MHL or NCAA, games and if you aren't then why the f*** do so many feel so compelled to tell strangers on a message board how despite not knowing the leagues that well how they know about said prospect over people that do watch said prospects. You notice not many people ever ask questions, it's usually just no I'm right and you are wrong because... only to be replied with no you just don't get it, I'm right and you are wrong because blah blah blah.

Why do so many enjoy telling others on a message board how wrong others are about prospects, games, leagues they don't watch or know much about. It's beyond crazy to me.

On top of all that if they just posted less and watched a little more it would help. When talking about Reinbacher, Michkov and Demidov, I have almost every game Reinbacher played this past season, full games where I edit out everything but when he's on the ice. My channel says I have 47 vids with Reinbacher in the title, 35 Demidov vids, and 4 Michkov's from the VHL and there's MHL games from when he was 15 years old playing with Hab prospect Alexander Gordin. I deleted some of the old ones as no one really watched any of the Gordin vids but Michkov is in them. So anyone could get to know Reinbacher real well, the problem is most don't want to as watching his games are tough to get through a lot of them. The Demidov vids are f***ing insane, I don't know how people are watching these like it's crack for the eyes, the stuff he pulls out there. I never cared for Michkov don't like his game but all the stuff I'm hearing (I live philly) he's saying/doing all the right things so maybe he's matured a bit and will be more of a team player if past reports are true.

 

[Jaynki]

At this point, mentionning "Michkov" outside of the out of town thread should be a 1 month ban.

Hockey fascism boards.com

 

[Mrb1p]

I love how some people have made a literal career on HFBoards of saying how professionals don't know anything and are almost always wrong and have now flip-flopped completely to the other side and keep using appeal to authority ad infinitum.

The number one reason why this world is going to shit is because the lack of integrity is massive and this is one of the many exhibit.

 

[HabsQC]

At the end, I personnally prefer well rounded player a la Barkov, Tkachuk, Vergaheghe, Stone, pietrangelo, ekblad. Over unidimensionnal player. I believe to win a stanley you need a lot of well rounded player and few uni dimensionnal a la caufield, Mithckov, Marchessault etc. Thats why im taking the Big Rd in Reinbacher over Michkovv

And it's totally understandable and probably the right choice in the long run if everything goes well.

I respect that and wish more would admit that to themselves instead of wasting so much time by posting nonsense just to try to show how said person on the internet knows more about a subject that likely 99% don't even know much about and you couldn't get any of them to even agree on what is tanking or development or impacts on coaching, etc...

It's been clear to me for years that most here just talk out their ass, I just don't get why, what's the point? Each person knows if they are watching say KHL, or SHL or MHL or NCAA, games and if you aren't then why the f*** do so many feel so compelled to tell strangers on a message board how despite not knowing the leagues that well how they know about said prospect over people that do watch said prospects. You notice not many people ever ask questions, it's usually just no I'm right and you are wrong because... only to be replied with no you just don't get it, I'm right and you are wrong because blah blah blah.

Why do so many enjoy telling others on a message board how wrong others are about prospects, games, leagues they don't watch or know much about. It's beyond crazy to me.

On top of all that if they just posted less and watched a little more it would help. When talking about Reinbacher, Michkov and Demidov, I have almost every game Reinbacher played this past season, full games where I edit out everything but when he's on the ice. My channel says I have 47 vids with Reinbacher in the title, 35 Demidov vids, and 4 Michkov's from the VHL and there's MHL games from when he was 15 years old playing with Hab prospect Alexander Gordin. I deleted some of the old ones as no one really watched any of the Gordin vids but Michkov is in them. So anyone could get to know Reinbacher real well, the problem is most don't want to as watching his games are tough to get through a lot of them. The Demidov vids are f***ing insane, I don't know how people are watching these like it's crack for the eyes, the stuff he pulls out there. I never cared for Michkov don't like his game but all the stuff I'm hearing (I live philly) he's saying/doing all the right things so maybe he's matured a bit and will be more of a team player if past reports are true.

Thank you for this. Faith in HF Habs restored

 

[Jaynki]

Too much emphasis is put on Michkov lethal offensive skills and Reinbacher "limited" potential as a top pair RD, not clear-cut bonafide 1D.

Lets get some facts straight, small winger are the easiest piece to acquire and when they don't produce offensively, their worth takes an enormous drop.

Top pairing, competent RD are only available at the top spots in a draft, and not even there in every draft. There is no other way to acquire them. They are the toughest pieces to find. Every single of the last 10 draft is an evidence of that. Chicago going Levshunov over Bedard elite linemate is an evidence of that. Toronto haven't been able to bring in such a pieces. Dallas three best Ds are LD and the evidence goes on and on. Heck, we are playing Guhle on the right side. Well, our own prospect pool of D is an evidence of it. Like 8 great LD, 2 great RD.

No top pair RD was available in the top 5 of the 2018, 2019, 2020 and 2021 draft. There were many star LD tho. 2022 draft have seen Nemec goes ahead of Cooley and Wright. 2024 have seen 3 RD above dman like Buium, Silayev and Dickinson.

I mean, its easy to get lost in the debate of superstar Michkov versus #2 Reinbacher. But we are building a f***ing hockey team and getting Reinbacher at 5 in 2023 might have been our only chance at a top pair RD for the next decade.

On the other hand, we got Demidov. Caufield fell to us all the way to 15 in 2019. Benson slipped to 13. DeBrincat was easily available. As good as Michkov is, way easier to acquire a player of his profile.

We will see how it evolves but unless Reinbacher flop massively, which is dubious, its tough to see how we are a loser in the 2023 draft.

I would bet my house that Toronto have dangled the likes of Marner and Nylander for years for a top pair RD and this trade was just not available.

Hughes made lunatics angry when he said that Reinbacher being a RD played an important part in their decision, and that if he was a LD they may have considered something else but man, is he f***ing right and does it hold a lot of weight that he is a RHD. Go figure.

 

[HuGo Burner Acc]

At this point, mentionning "Michkov" outside of the out of town thread should be a 1 month ban.

He'll now be referred to as "He Who Must Not Be Named"

 

[salbutera]

He could for sure. You also could hit a royal flush on the flop but the important element here are the odds of it happening. BPA is measured before you scratch your ticket.

I think the odds of Michkov being a better future hockey player than Reinbacher are extremely high. Would you rather draft Ovechkin or Sergachev if we need a D more than a wing?

How so? He’s a cherry picker… NHL coaches don’t care for players without the wantingness to play a 200-ft game.

Torts immortal quote: “he (Duclair) doesn’t understand the game of hockey”…

 

[Mrb1p]

How so? He’s a cherry picker… NHL coaches don’t care for players without the wantingness to play a 200-ft game.

Torts immortal quote: “he (Duclair) doesn’t understand the game of hockey”…

Pavel Bure, Connor McDavid, Patrick Kane and Guy Lafleur were some of the greatest player ever and are all cherry pickers.

 

[Apfel Struble]

But why though ? Why not just go BPA every year ? We have seen with KK that drafting for needs is a terrible idea.

Take the best players and make trades later

Except if you're drafting in the top 3 (and even then), BPA in the eyes of the fans and amateur scouts is almost always a smallish winger

Then, when these get traded, they fetch low returns to the consternation of most online communities as we saw with Savoie. Smallish 1st line wingers are generally available through trade (Fiala recently) for prices that aren't that steep, large 1st pair RD, almost never

 

[Jaynki]

Except if you're drafting in the top 3 (and even then), BPA in the eyes of the fans and amateur scouts is almost always a smallish winger

Then, when these get traded, they fetch low returns as we saw with Savoie. 1st line wingers are generally available through trade (Fiala recently), 1st pair RD, almost never

Well, a 1st pair RD was traded for PPG+ Fiala.

How is that looking for the team that acquired Fiala?

Its looking like a rebuild killer, incredible, absolute blunder. I can't even fathom how lucky the Wild have been to pull such a trade.

 

[Apfel Struble]

Well, a 1st pair RD was traded for PPG+ Fiala.

How is that looking for the team that acquired Fiala?

Its looking like a rebuild killer, incredible, absolute blunder. I can't even fathom how lucky the Wild have been to pull such a trade.

Faber turned out to be a stud, but he was a mid second round pick with a solid season. The 1st round pick was 19th. We're using hindsight with the player Faber became, but it was a relatively cheap price for a PPG winger

Faber would also not have had the season he just had in LA. He benefitted from injured top dmen in Minnesota to bolster his usage and a superstar forward to help his stats. Still, what a season he had

 

[Jaynki]

Faber turned out to be a stud, but he was a mid second round pick with a solid season. The 1st round pick was 19th. We're using hindsight with the player Faber became, but it was a relatively cheap price for a PPG winger

No.

Fiala was not cheap. Its market price for those smallish winger.

They are the easiest to acquire, most available pieces.

Where as top pair RD are the most scarce, toughest to acquire along with the 1C.

Economics 101. Offer and demand.

Reinbacher and Michkov. Faber and Fiala. Nemec and Wright. Levshunov and Demidov. Etc.

 

[Apfel Struble]

No.

Fiala was not cheap. Its market price for those smallish winger.

They are the easiest to acquire, most available pieces.

Where as top pair RD are the most scarce, toughest to acquire along with the 1C.

Economics 101. Offer and demand.

Reinbacher and Michkov. Faber and Fiala. Nemec and Wright. Levshunov and Demidov. Etc.

Ah yeah I totally agree with the bolded, that was my previous point. When the time is right, you either trade for one of those or you draft them in the mid 10s. Benson, Jarvis, Caufield, that's where these guys are drafted. Their value tend to be overinflated because of their impressive numbers

You can't have too much of them in a team

 

[Jaynki]

Ah yeah I totally agree with the bolded, that was my previous point. When the time is right, you either trade for one of those or you draft them in the mid 10s. Benson, Jarvis, Caufield, that's where these guys are drafted. There values tend to be overinflated because of their impressive numbers

You can't have too much of them in a team

100% agree.

 

[HabsQC]

In this one :

Except if you're drafting in the top 3 (and even then), BPA in the eyes of the fans and amateur scouts is almost always a smallish winger

Then, when these get traded, they fetch low returns to the consternation of most online communities as we saw with Savoie. Smallish 1st line wingers are generally available through trade (Fiala recently) for prices that aren't that steep, large 1st pair RD, almost never

In this article : Michkov is ranked 2nd best prospect, Reinbacher is 38th

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5612279/2024/07/16/nhl-prospects-ranking-celebrini-michkov/

Michkov is at the same ranking in Wheeler's rankings and Reinbacher isnot in the top 32.

I mean I get all of what you guys said, but from what is presented to us, Michkov is in a tier with Demidov whereas Reinbacher is like 2 tiers below.

I'm under the impression that many people here will go to war to defend our guy. But the truth is Michkov is ranked WAY higher right now as a prospect. We all know it can change in the long run though.

 

[WeThreeKings]

In this one :

In this article : Michkov is ranked 2nd best prospect, Reinbacher is 38th

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5612279/2024/07/16/nhl-prospects-ranking-celebrini-michkov/

Michkov is at the same ranking in Wheeler's rankings and Reinbacher isnot in the top 32.

I mean I get all of what you guys said, but from what is presented to us, Michkov is in a tier with Demidov whereas Reinbacher is like 2 tiers below.

I'm under the impression that many people here will go to war to defend our guy. But the truth is Michkov is ranked WAY higher right now as a prospect. We all know it can change in the long run though.

What is valued by public lists like that are not valued the same way by NHL teams and NHL scouts who are trying to build a cup winning team.

Demidov is ranked 3rd and well above Levshunov.. yet Chicago faced with the same decision as us, did the same thing we did.. because NHL teams get the big rangy RDs when they have the chance.

 

[Jaynki]

In this one :

In this article : Michkov is ranked 2nd best prospect, Reinbacher is 38th

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5612279/2024/07/16/nhl-prospects-ranking-celebrini-michkov/

Michkov is at the same ranking in Wheeler's rankings and Reinbacher isnot in the top 32.

I mean I get all of what you guys said, but from what is presented to us, Michkov is in a tier with Demidov whereas Reinbacher is like 2 tiers below.

I'm under the impression that many people here will go to war to defend our guy. But the truth is Michkov is ranked WAY higher right now as a prospect. We all know it can change in the long run though.

Michkov is in the same tier as Demidov in the same way that Reinbacher is in the same tiers as Nemec and Levshunov

 

[HuGo Burner Acc]

Pavel Bure, Connor McDavid, Patrick Kane and Guy Lafleur were some of the greatest player ever and are all cherry pickers.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your overall point but 2 of them haven't won anything and the other 2 played on two of the greatest dynasties in history

 

[Apfel Struble]

In this one :

In this article : Michkov is ranked 2nd best prospect, Reinbacher is 38th

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5612279/2024/07/16/nhl-prospects-ranking-celebrini-michkov/

Michkov is at the same ranking in Wheeler's rankings and Reinbacher isnot in the top 32.

I mean I get all of what you guys said, but from what is presented to us, Michkov is in a tier with Demidov whereas Reinbacher is like 2 tiers below.

I'm under the impression that many people here will go to war to defend our guy. But the truth is Michkov is ranked WAY higher right now as a prospect. We all know it can change in the long run though.

He's an amateur scout, I'm not saying they're all terrible, but they always look at players in terms of fantasy upside. Dmen, especially big ones, and even more RDs, are consistently undervalued while small wingers and small puckmoving LDs are overvalued. Rarity plays a massive role as does roster construction and compatibility

Just look at this season, the small puckmoving LD that was rumoured to go as early as 3rd went 12th. I know it's somewhat of an appeal to authority, but the scouting services with the most ressources and time consistently favour something else than the online community's perception of what the BPA are past the ultra-consensus. Maybe it's the fans who are wrong