Value of: Crouse to NJD

[Guttersniped]

I really doubt Crouse is available right now.

He was one of the older players who said he wanted to stay and be part of what they’re building, so they gave him a 5 year deal.

You don’t ship guys out after that, it sends the wrong message. They have very few players signed long term, a team needs an older core. He fits their current identity.

You have to look for players teams are looking to move due to cap or aren’t interested in signing themselves.

Dvorak had 4 years left but Chayka signed him and they were pretty desperate to get extra 1sts then. Chychrun asked to be traded.

 

[Nocashstyle]

Bratt: 5'10", 175lbs, 32 goals (but 1 in playoffs), $??? cap hit.

Crouse: 6'4", 220lbs, 24 goals, $4.3M cap hit for 4 more years.

Bratt's value just went down, and the Devils (should) know they need a different kind of player for the playoffs. Not really thinking Bratt is an overpay for Crouse. In fact, if I were AZ I wouldn't make the swap straight up.

Lol

Bratt: 73 points

Crouse: 45 points

Unlike Crouse, Bratt’s best asset is his playmaking, not goal scoring. And yet, he still out-scored Crouse.

Sure, the contract status weighs heavily on Bratt’s value. But it’s insane you thought you just showed something right there.

 

[TBF1972]

We’ve watched Shara this year and in the playoffs. He’s not an important trade piece for anybody. And the Coyotes need Crouse more than what Holtz in theory would bring. Crouse fits their timeline just fine. Shara and Holtz would not be interesting to the Coyotes at all for Crouse.

i don't disagree with your assessment. but if arizona considers themselves still in the asset collecting stage and not in contender building stage it can make sense to exchange a proven asset for multiple potential assets.

 

[doublechili]

Lol

Bratt: 73 points

Crouse: 45 points

Unlike Crouse, Bratt’s best asset is his playmaking, not goal scoring. And yet, he still out-scored Crouse.

Sure, the contract status weighs heavily on Bratt’s value. But it’s insane you thought you just showed something right there.

Because total points scored is by far the most important factor that matters when determining a player's value. You'd better hope your GM doesn't think like that. BTW, Tanner Jeannot.

 

[Nocashstyle]

Because total points scored is by far the most important factor that matters when determining a player's value. You'd better hope your GM doesn't think like that. BTW, Tanner Jeannot.

You literally compared their black and white goal totals trying to prove a point, even though your “point” really didn’t do anything support your argument.

I’m not even sure what you’re trying to say here

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Because total points scored is by far the most important factor that matters when determining a player's value. You'd better hope your GM doesn't think like that. BTW, Tanner Jeannot.

It isn’t, Bratt is way better than even his point totals show. Crouse is closer in ability to Jeannot than Bratt.

Anyway, I’d much rather go after Colton than Crouse. Tampa might have to move him whereas Arizona would only consider moving Crouse for a massive haul, as they should.

 

[doublechili]

You literally compared their black and white goal totals trying to prove a point, even though your “point” really didn’t do anything support your argument.

I’m not even sure what you’re trying to say here

I included goal totals, SIZE, and salary (for Crouse anyway, which is a positive for him). I only included goal totals since that's relevant for a winger, but mostly because I figured if I just included size and salary a response from a NJD fan would require that I talk about scoring. Ironically enough. But if you don't think 5'10", 175lbs vs 6'4", 220lbs is relevant....

Whatever. Just re-sign Bratt.

 

[DVision44]

Because total points scored is by far the most important factor that matters when determining a player's value. You'd better hope your GM doesn't think like that. BTW, Tanner Jeannot.

Lol... Bratt has back to back 70 pt seasons and is only 24 his value didn't go down due to one playoff run...

 

[Nocashstyle]

I included goal totals, SIZE, and salary (for Crouse anyway, which is a positive for him). I only included goal totals since that's relevant for a winger, but mostly because I figured if I just included size and salary a response from a NJD fan would require that I talk about scoring. Ironically enough. But if you don't think 5'10", 175lbs vs 6'4", 220lbs is relevant....

Whatever. Just re-sign Bratt.

So, despite being substantially less productive in all offensive categories, “he’s big,” is your big argument in favor of Crouse?

Come on, man. At least if your main point was their contract statuses, I could see somewhat of an argument to be made. But nope, you’re just going with “he’s big.”

 

[Snarky Coyote]

There are a lot of offers that we Yotes fans will endure over the next few years. Remember that we need to see how the prospects we draft turn out, that we aren't good for a couple of years, and that we will be dumpster diving for the next couple of years IF we win the arena vote and they actually break ground. (We won many elections in Scottsdale back in the day, but the team could not get it done due to the Scottsdales NIMBYS) Most likely, we will start competing for a playoff spot in 25-26, and then the race will be on. Does Bratt fit in that timeline? Can we work the cap with all of the kids we have coming up? Also, remember GMBA likes size, grit, and strength. He is the one you need to trade with. True cup contention starts in 28-29 if everything goes right. That's when you want to acquire a player with Bratt's talent if you don't already have one. He is a great player, and probably it's a deal that favors us, except Crouse is the leader that is going to protect the kids, score 15-20 and keep them on the right path. He isn't just a hockey player to the Yotes, and Bratt doesn't fill those intangibles. Hell, Mathews doesn't, either. Crouse has a very specific set of skills. and that is why I don't see him moving anywhere.

 

[Stan Galiev]

Crouse should not be traded by AZ. He’s young enough to be a member of a great young core. They would be wise to keep him long term

 

[doublechili]

So, despite being substantially less productive in all offensive categories, “he’s big,” is your big argument in favor of Crouse?

Come on, man. At least if your main point was their contract statuses, I could see somewhat of an argument to be made. But nope, you’re just going with “he’s big.”

I listed goal-scoring, size and contract. You responded focusing on points. I keep on mentioning scoring, size and contract, but emphasized size as a relevant factor because you emphasized scoring. Now you say I'm talking about size only. Are you skimming or reading?

One more time, in narrative form to see if that works: Crouse is a big winger who can score goals and he's locked up for the next 4 years at $4.3M AAV. Bratt is going to be looking for what, $7M x 8? More? He's talented for sure, but looking at your roster of sub-200lb forwards do you think maybe mixing in a big guy on the wing of your small 1C or 2C would be a bad idea? Crouse - Hughes - Mercer maybe? Plus $3M in cap space, give or take? But yeah, you just keep LOLing.

 

[Nocashstyle]

I listed goal-scoring, size and contract. You responded focusing on points. I keep on mentioning scoring, size and contract, but emphasized size as a relevant factor because you emphasized scoring. Now you say I'm talking about size only. Are you skimming or reading?

One more time, in narrative form to see if that works: Crouse is a big winger who can score goals and he's locked up for the next 4 years at $4.3M AAV. Bratt is going to be looking for what, $7M x 8? More? He's talented for sure, but looking at your roster of sub-200lb forwards do you think maybe mixing in a big guy on the wing of your small 1C or 2C would be a bad idea? Crouse - Hughes - Mercer maybe? Plus $3M in cap space, give or take? But yeah, you just keep LOLing.

No it’s that literally the only argument in favor of Crouse is contract status and decided to inadvertently also highlight has inferior offensively Crouse is, which is “LOL”

 

[BKarchitect]

No it’s that literally the only argument in favor of Crouse is contract status and decided to inadvertently also highlight has inferior offensively Crouse is, which is “LOL”

Except that contract isn’t the only thing that favors Crouse. They are vastly different players with different roles.

You replace Bratt with Crouse in the Devils line-up in the playoffs and you’re not gonna convince me they aren’t harder to play against. And you likely are saving $3-4 million of cap that can be allocated elsewhere.

The Coyotes aren’t looking to deal him though. And maybe the Devils are about ready to lock up Bratt for 8 years - I’m not saying Devils fans should look to deal Bratt. But from the outside looking in - the Devils are the exact team I think that would benefit by paying a little bit of a premium in assets for a Crouse-type of player and perhaps allocate their cap space in a different way that to go all-in on both Meier and Bratt moving forward.

 

[dirtydanglez]

Bratt: 5'10", 175lbs, 32 goals (but 1 in playoffs), $??? cap hit.

Crouse: 6'4", 220lbs, 24 goals, $4.3M cap hit for 4 more years.

Bratt's value just went down, and the Devils (should) know they need a different kind of player for the playoffs. Not really thinking Bratt is an overpay for Crouse. In fact, if I were AZ I wouldn't make the swap straight up.

crouse is exactly the type of player nj needs. he comes with a very affordable contract too. people will get too caught up in the point totals tho.

If Arizona wants to have 2 Clayton Kellers, then they would trade for Jesper Bratt.

bratt isn't quite on kellers level.

 

[Nico Hischier]

bratt isn't quite on kellers level.

Last 2 seasons:

Jesper Bratt 158 games played and 146 points

Clayton Keller 149 games played and 149 points

I’d say they are basically the same level player and they both play the same style. Keller has played more nhl games and was a top 10 pick. Bratt was a 6th round pick. Both in the same draft year both are 24 years old.

 

[dirtydanglez]

Last 2 seasons:

Jesper Bratt 158 games played and 146 points

Clayton Keller 149 games played and 149 points

I’d say they are basically the same level player and they both play the same style. Keller has played more nhl games and was a top 10 pick. Bratt was a 6th round pick. Both in the same draft year both are 24 years old.

keller has been playing with largely ahl players. there is a pretty big difference in teammates between the two.

keller is a teir above bratt imo. i could easily see keller putting up 90 points if he was on a 100pt team instead of the coyotes.

 

[Billdo]

Not really thinking Bratt is an overpay for Crouse. In fact, if I were AZ I wouldn't make the swap straight up.

lol, right.

 

[MichaelJ]

I don’t see a fit for Bratt in ARZ even if the value is there. The trade market for him is probably limited due to contract, age, and skillset. I can see the Devils gathering assets from one team for Bratt to flip to the Coyotes though.

What assets (general value) would it take to get ARZ to consider moving Crouse, even if the Devils need to expand the deal?

NJD: Crouse, +
ARZ: Holtz, Sharangovic, 3rd team assets
3rd Team: Bratt