Post-Game Talk: Come back for a pointless point.

[The Real Timo]

Don't know if this has been shared/discussed... Probably. Too many keeners on here. But looks like our KungFu Panda is getting close to coming back.

 

[Gillings]

The crowd was Wow deep in the third.

 

[HuGort]

I thought Armia played a solid game. We don't stage a comeback if not for him. He should be movable at deadline. He is good penalty killer.

Barron is evolving into our best defenseman. He just turned 22 two weeks ago, has 5 goals in 21 games.

Line of Dvorak, Slaf, Ylonen was our best line in third period.

 

[Habit11]

Couldn't watch. How was Struble?

Took an elbow to the face like a champ… and played good.

 

[Rapala]

Because 3 on 3 is filled with turnovers and odd man rushes, and it would be dumb to make a player change when there is the opportunity for an odd man rush. And obviously, having your best offensive players on the ice for odd man rushes gives you a much better chance of scoring than having your best defensive players.

Dude they changed to put Suzuki on the ice he replaced Dvorak. What exactly are you talking about? Obviously there may be instances where it isn't possible this wasn't one of them.

Dvorak lost the draw and headed directly to the bench. So you are trying to tell me Caufield if lined up even closer couldn't do that.

 

[ChesterNimitz]

The 3-0 is the worst lead in hockey came into play tonight.
Habs showed no quit in the 3rd... and that's good to see.
Justin Barron looking slick , set a Nhl career high in goals tonight (5) in only 21 games
love those pinches from the point.

The Bell Centre with under 2.00 minutes to go in the 3rd in a 4-4 game all singing Bon Jovi living on a prayer....
as the game was in progress....times sure have changed lol

We were entertained. At this stage of the ongoing re-build we cannot ask nor expect more.

 

[Pazucha]

Spoiler: Spoiler

MSL hates Slaf

 

[Kudo Shinichi]

Dude they changed to put Suzuki on the ice he replaced Dvorak. What exactly are you talking about? Obviously there may be instances where it isn't possible this wasn't one of them.

Dvorak lost the draw and headed directly to the bench. So you are trying to tell me Caufield if lined up even closer couldn't do that.

You said to not put Caufield or offensive guys on the ice if the habs don't have the puck, and I replied saying that its not a good strategy.

 

[RationalExpectations]

We were entertained. At this stage of the ongoing re-build we cannot ask nor expect more.

Depends what you call this stage… Suzuki in his D+7, Dach Caufield Newhook in their D+5, Barron Guhle in their D+4 are all supposed to be long term top 6 and top 4 players during contention window. Struble Harris are in their D+5/6. Slaf is improving but showing no offensive elite talent. Allen Monty should be an ok tandem when compared to several playoff contenders. Whether we like it or not Dvorak and Evans are bottom 6 forward NHL players, Monahan, is a good top 6/top 9. Armia Pearson are good 4th liners yet overpaid, i.e. their bottom 6 is ok compared to league average. If Suzuki & co are truly the future core, the Habs should be higher in the standings. Either they are way overrated by Habs fans or the coaching staff sucks, or a mix of both.

How many teams are bottom 10 when they have 5 of their future top 6 playing (4 counting Dach out) & 2 of their top 4 entering their prime ?

 

[ReHabs]

Depends what you call this stage… Suzuki in his D+7, Dach Caufield Newhook in their D+5, Barron Guhle in their D+4 are all supposed to be long term top 6 and top 4 players during contention window. Struble Harris are in their D+5/6. Slaf is improving but showing no offensive elite talent. Allen Monty should be an ok tandem when compared to several playoff contenders. Whether we like it or not Dvorak and Evans are bottom 6 forward NHL players, Monahan, is a good top 6/top 9. Armia Pearson are good 4th liners yet overpaid, i.e. their bottom 6 is ok compared to league average. If Suzuki & co are truly the future core, the Habs should be higher in the standings. Either they are way overrated by Habs fans or the coaching staff sucks, or a mix of both.

How many teams are bottom 10 when they have 5 of their future top 6 playing (4 counting Dach out) & 2 of their top 4 entering their prime ?

I mentioned this in the Tank thread before the season started:

Either we see progress and get a lousier draft pick or we continue the tank and pick up another magic bean. Both have upsides and downsides as below:

	Pros​	Cons​
See Progress; Lousier Draft Pick​	Growth of young core players indicates we are going in the right direction	Lousier draft pick means rebuild is effectively over and we have to hope we have a critical mass of talent (or assets against which to acquire talent) to propel us to compete with the best
Lousy Season; Better Draft Pick​	Magic Bean Draft Pick! This one's gonna be special!	Young core players do not show sufficient growth, indicating they might not progress much more beyond this point.

Of course injuries derail things big time on both the team stats and individual player stats but if we look at player-by-player progression we will see very slight if no improvements overall. Look at PPG, look at the fancy stats. Some have improved -- I think I saw someone say Guhle (whose PPG has not really changed) improved his corsi -- but overall, no one seems to have earned a higher level (ie. go from a competing team's D3 to D2, or LW2 to LW1). How can we hope that this core will grow together if they don't show growth?

If Dach hadn't gone down maybe things would've shaken out differently but I don't know how far we ought to extend that.

 

[RationalExpectations]

I mentioned this in the Tank thread before the season started:

Either we see progress and get a lousier draft pick or we continue the tank and pick up another magic bean. Both have upsides and downsides as below:

	Pros​	Cons​
See Progress; Lousier Draft Pick​	Growth of young core players indicates we are going in the right direction	Lousier draft pick means rebuild is effectively over and we have to hope we have a critical mass of talent (or assets against which to acquire talent) to propel us to compete with the best
Lousy Season; Better Draft Pick​	Magic Bean Draft Pick! This one's gonna be special!	Young core players do not show sufficient growth, indicating they might not progress much more beyond this point.

Of course injuries derail things big time on both the team stats and individual player stats but if we look at player-by-player progression we will see very slight if no improvements overall. Look at PPG, look at the fancy stats. Some have improved -- I think I saw someone say Guhle (whose PPG has not really changed) improved his corsi -- but overall, no one seems to have earned a higher level (ie. go from a competing team's D3 to D2, or LW2 to LW1). How can we hope that this core will grow together if they don't show growth?

If Dach hadn't gone down maybe things would've shaken out differently but I don't know how far we ought to extend that.

On the other hand if Dach was not injury prone, if Monahan was not injury prone, would either of them be with the Habs as we speak ?

I fully agree witht the doubts regarding this core with this coaching staff. For a team that should be an offense first team, they struggle to score goals and even to outshoot their opponents. Honestly for me the problem is not them being around 0.5 PPG which was expected, it is more that without their goalies, they would be a lotbelow that.

 

[ReHabs]

On the other hand if Dach was not injury prone, if Monahan was not injury prone, would either of them be with the Habs as we speak ?

The Habs weren't in a position to pay to acquire a Big Fish. I mean, I wanted them to but it makes sense why they wouldn't spend "big money" to acquire big money players. Our core wasn't ripe.

Dach, Newhook, Matheson, and Monahan are the sort of buy-low moves that Bergevin should've done continuously and consistency in order to add to his Core players Price, Subban, Markov, and Pacioretty. Not from the discount pile like the waiver fodder with whom he'd infamously tinker.

The issue now is that we don't have established core players and we definitely don't have that superstar (Price) like we did before. I think we're in a worse position now than we were at any time during Price's prime. This isn't to blast Kent Hughes, it's just what it is.: the post-Price scene was always going to be hard.

My biggest gripe with the Optimists in the Habs commentary space is they refuse to acknowledge the myriad negative/unproductive permutations that could follow any given rebuilding move. A more stable approach would be to improve iteratively and try to have the best special teams, the best tactics, the best whatever system at all times while trying to improve the roster. Seems like a big gamble to not even try improving what can be improved outside of drafting.

I fully agree witht the doubts regarding this core with this coaching staff. For a team that should be an offense first team, they struggle to score goals and even to outshoot their opponents. Honestly for me the problem is not them being around 0.5 PPG which was expected, it is more that without their goalies, they would be a lotbelow that.

Something could be said about the roster effect of having a healthy Dach in the lineup. Another could be said about the general effect it has on offensive output with a better possession game, period. Whether that means a tighter system or better player(s) or superior morale -- I'm not sure which and in what proportion each.

I would've preferred to see more growth and improvement this year than not because I don't like the magic beans approach. I hope Hughes has a vision for navigation this 'stuck' roster, if not a plan.

 

[DAChampion]

Alex DeBrincat is the player people say Cauldield is.

DeBrincat is on track for 46 goals.

Caulfield is on track for 24 goals, most of them in OT.

 

[Rapala]

You said to not put Caufield or offensive guys on the ice if the habs don't have the puck, and I replied saying that its not a good strategy.

And you would be WRONG.
How in the hell is it good strategy to throw an offensive guy out there if we win the draw but not a defensive one if we don't.
Every team has the same strategy and plan in OT. Keep the puck wear the opposition down. We lost that game without touching the puck.
The guys on the ice were not suited for that role of chaser.

Our current strategy is to use someone other than Suzuki to try and win the initial draw if we win it he comes on to replace the center. What I'm saying is if we lose it he should not be getting on spending his energy chasing the puck. We have other players better suited for that. Dvorak stays on and the winger changes for Evans. Try and get the puck back before using your best offensive elements. I'm not saying it's going to work all the time I'm saying its better to have your puck retrievers on when you have to retrieve the puck. I'm not even sure what your point is questioning the logic. If you have a sounder strategy I'd sure like to hear it.

 

[StCaufield]

I mentioned this in the Tank thread before the season started:

Either we see progress and get a lousier draft pick or we continue the tank and pick up another magic bean. Both have upsides and downsides as below:

	Pros​	Cons​
See Progress; Lousier Draft Pick​	Growth of young core players indicates we are going in the right direction	Lousier draft pick means rebuild is effectively over and we have to hope we have a critical mass of talent (or assets against which to acquire talent) to propel us to compete with the best
Lousy Season; Better Draft Pick​	Magic Bean Draft Pick! This one's gonna be special!	Young core players do not show sufficient growth, indicating they might not progress much more beyond this point.

Of course injuries derail things big time on both the team stats and individual player stats but if we look at player-by-player progression we will see very slight if no improvements overall. Look at PPG, look at the fancy stats. Some have improved -- I think I saw someone say Guhle (whose PPG has not really changed) improved his corsi -- but overall, no one seems to have earned a higher level (ie. go from a competing team's D3 to D2, or LW2 to LW1). How can we hope that this core will grow together if they don't show growth?

If Dach hadn't gone down maybe things would've shaken out differently but I don't know how far we ought to extend that.

They’re always injured. You forgot about that. You’re reading too much into this

 

[BLONG7]

I wouldn't mind having Primeau losing games if Allen is traded. He's young and he will learn. We don't have a good team anyway and we can tank another year or two. This 3 starters is getting ridiculous. There is no possibilty a goalie have 2 or 3 starts if he's on an hot streak, like any normal team.

Absolutely...............go with Monty and Primo, waive Allen, he still gets his money, and then more than likely retires with a very good resume on his career. They did it to Armia!
We need the kids to play, and see what we have....I am tired of the results we get, by having Allen, and Gally, and the likes of Anderson cashing their cheques and doing so littlle and we lose anyhow even if they play well?

Developing young players....................That's the name of this time, with this new regime...........

Then Do It!!

 

[BLONG7]

Desharnais 13 goals (Fribourg Gotteron Swiss League)
Danault 4 goals
Drouin 3 goals
Lehkonen 3 goals
Toffoli 12 goals
Gallagher 5 goals
Chiarot 2 goals
Kovasevic 4 goals
Tristan Jarry (goalie) 1 goal

Anderson 0 goal

I can't beleive it

I wonder if Poppa Therrien is DD's coach? LOL..........

Anderson is beyond snake bitten right now................beyond....so far gone, it's just plain brutal.
The one thing we can admit though, he is got a ton of hustle, set up the tying goal last night, and has zero quit right now...........

 

[Naslundforever]

I wonder if Poppa Therrien is DD's coach? LOL..........

Anderson is beyond snake bitten right now................beyond....so far gone, it's just plain brutal.
The one thing we can admit though, he is got a ton of hustle, set up the tying goal last night, and has zero quit right now...........

Reminds me of this guy who I remember hoping would become a beast

Andreas Martinsen Stats and News | NHL.com

Andreas Martinsen Stats and News

www.nhl.com

 

[hvac412]

So... are Canucks for real? Amazing the difference a coach can make. They are a completely different team under Tocchet with roughly the same roster. Hmm...

Tocchet is good,meanwhile MSL can't get his team to show up for two consecutive games.Yeah like f%^&k off Gorton,you go ahead and be patient for this shit show because they're not developing anything.

 

[BLONG7]

Tocchet is good,meanwhile MSL can't get his team to show up for two consecutive games.Yeah like f%^&k off Gorton,you go ahead and be patient for this shit show because they're not developing anything.

Yes, agreed, somewhat true.
I personally think it's time for MSL and the coaching staff start to be held more accountable on many issues, having the team ready for the first two minute, and PP and PK........................the blender on lines?
WTF MSL.................I am a fan of MSL but as time moves forward, he seems to have been slipped some stupid pills that Therrien left behind.

 

[Skip Bayless]

The crowd was Wow deep in the third.

They understand we're re-building, but pretending we're in the playoffs relieves them from the current pain.

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

I wonder if Poppa Therrien is DD's coach? LOL..........

Anderson is beyond snake bitten right now................beyond....so far gone, it's just plain brutal.
The one thing we can admit though, he is got a ton of hustle, set up the tying goal last night, and has zero quit right now...........

I liked the pass he made for the tie goal I have to admitt. It's not like he was lazy doing nothing. As they say, he hold his stick too hard. Players in a slump are nervous and it gets into their heads. He's not categorized a defensive forward like Dvorak or Evans or Dano, he must produce and that become a real issue for him.

As for DD, at least he still pay hockey at the age of what? 35 yrs old? He's not quitting hockey, he must love playing wherever he can and that's ok. The thing is it was the management decision to give such role he wasn't fit for. I have nothing against the person, he never complained, never acted like a diva, never did drugs or sexual scandal.

 

[Doc McKenna]

Closing hand on the puck isn’t illegal.
He dropped it right away.

Yes it is however

Interpretation 4​

Rule 10.2 (a)(iii) General guidelines for closing the hand on the puck: When a player closes their hand on the puck and then throws the puck, stop play immediately. A Minor penalty for Handling the Puck must be assessed. When a player closes their hand on the puck and tries to maneuver around another player while holding the puck, or where a player is prevented from playing the puck by the player changing the general location of the puck while holding it, a Minor penalty for Handling the Puck must be assessed. When a player takes a stride while holding the puck in their hand, assess a Minor penalty for Handling the Puck.

 

[McGees]

I don't want to get people too excited, but if Armia's newborn has finally started sleeping through the night... get ready for One-Man-Armia at least one in every ten games rather than twenty. Destined for the first line.

Armia probably only shows up once every 10 nights to help with the baby….but when he does he’s dad of the year.

 

[Redux91]

Alex DeBrincat is the player people say Cauldield is.

DeBrincat is on track for 46 goals.

Caulfield is on track for 24 goals, most of them in OT.

Man you got up at 7 am on a Sunday to post this..? Damn

The caufield hate this year has been surreal