Confirmed with Link: [COL, CAR, CHI] Rantanen-Hall to CAR, Necas-Drury-25 2nd-26 4th to COL, Chi 25 3rd to Chi (Ret 50% on Mikko)

[Vaslof]

Hmm so perhaps the Avs were negotiating with the Canes and Canes wanted a sign and trade, but Avs didn't want to let them talk to Rantanen. As a compromise Avs asked Rantanen if Canes was one of the teams that Rantanen would consider signing for in UFA. Rantanen said yes, Avs relayed this to the Canes, and the trade happened. Rantanen did not actually want to play for the Canes so when he arrived he let Rod know his 4 team list.

 

[Grigowski]

I had been saying this for a while as well. I don't think the Avs were ever serious about re-signing Mikko, and I agree, this reinforces that theory. They were mostly going through the motions for PR.

It's the one thing that makes this 'makes no sense' situation make sense.

I think they had planned in the offseason that they could only sign for what would be a low ball offer in this market with all the cap raises coming up. If he didn't take it they'd move him mid season and they didn't really think he would take it.

We heard earlier that the Avs and Carolina had been talking about a Mikko trade earlier in the year, perhaps in the off season, can't remember.

If this is true that the Avs offered $11.6M, then Mikko dropped all the way to $12M, and they moved him the next day, then I'm not sure they even wanted the $11.6M number. Maybe Mikko dropping so much scared them and they were like we gotta move him asap, not at the deadline, because he may drop further and then we won't know what to do. We'll look like assholes to our fans who want to keep him.

I know the narrative has basically set in that Mikko is the asshole, and that's very hard to change when minds get made up that way here, but I really feel bad for Mikko outside the financial aspect of all this.

He was willing to take a lot less than Nate to stay. MacK's 15.09% of the cap would be $14,410,950 under next year's cap. So Mikko was willing to stay for about $2.4M less than Nate in same market as a multi 100+ point guy.

He gets traded immediately after caving, then goes to Carolina where he doesn't produce like normal in 13 games playing a totally different style. Then Avs fans start thinking he's an asshole. NHL fans and the media start shitting on him.

Then Carolina decides to trade him again. Then Canes fans start thinking he's an asshole. Sounds like he came to a deal with Edmonton but the Canes didn't like their offer. Doesn't come to a deal immediately with the Stars, who were reportedly very close to walking away, and leaving Mikko in Carolina where he's probably miserable.

Then at one point he reportedly just goes f*** it, lets just get this shit over with, and signs for $12M again. Now he's the asshole again to Avs fans, and that 1st round series is probably either gonna end with the Stars beating the Avs (which means Mikko probably played well and he's the villain) or the Avs beat the Stars (which means Mikko might not play well and will get shit on for being overrated again).

What a crazy chain of events, and butterfly effects, likely stemming from CMac and the Avs decision to reshape the team mid season. Early results say the team is better, but man Joe and CMac have shown often they're cold customers when it comes to the business side.

Thats a really good read man.

I am with you that the AVS and MacFarland warmed up for the idea to trade Rantanen and bring in more quality depth, because this team was a mess in the bottom 6. And then Mittelstadt just flat out forget how to play hockey. And maybe they didnt want to end up like Toronto.....

What i dont think and believe: If Mikko and his camp really came down to 12 Mill x 8, i still think it would have been done and he would be still an AV. So i dont believe this narrative that MacFarland wanted Mikko traded at all cost.

And dont let yourself blind of the fact that he signed for 12x8 in Dallas. That 12 mill is 12.4 or even more in Colorado ==> Texas, No state tax! So i doubt that Rantanen and his agent really came down to 12 mill. Rather they would have settled at 12.5 right behind Mac.

MacFarland sure had this idea in mind and it became more and more popular to him the longer this negotiations went on. And when Carolina came up with this offer, he pulled the trigger and the rest is history.

I dont see Rantanen as the "asshole" or "enemy". He did whats best for him and wanted to get paid. And he had every right to do so. I mean, nearly 10 years, form the dark years to the Cup... He went with this franchise. Thats something. And he will always have a soft spot in my heart for that. And i wish him the best.. Just not against the AVS. Although i will want kill strangle him if he goes on and eleminates the AVS....

And MacFarland did what he thought would be the best for this team and decided that Mikko is the odd man out. And so far it works.

There are so many stories and theories out there by now.... The AVS and MacFarland are the big baddies and screwed Mikko and Carolina... Mikko and his agent played hardball with the AVS and told that they would considert signing in Carolina and then told them right after the trade "f*** you"........I dont know what is really true and what really went down....

I think this trade is a perfect example of two sides not coming together. It happens and it will happen again. I also say that Marner has priced himself out of Toronto allready....

There is still a business side in this game. And its often not nice. From both sides!

In the end MacFarland strike gold, Mikko got his money and went to a real contender (of course it sucks that he went to our biggest rival in the Central/west).. Only Carolina kinda paid a hefty price in all of this.....

 

[AllAboutAvs]

Leafs to Marner: " Don't worry Mitch, go ahead and waive your NMC. We want to re-sign you anyway."
Sure Leafs. I believe you don't want to trade him.

OR

Mikko to Drai: "Hey Drai, move over. I shoot from that spot now. Go find your own spot."
Mikko is such a bad fit for Edmonton.

 

[Chiarelli]

We'll see how it goes, but there is a very good chance that Necas will end up costing something in the same ballpark, at least over 10M. Depends on how he performs in the post season, and how smart him and his agent are.

Still, it's important that he's still cheap for next year. Next year was going to be very tough still. The cap should go up, so that helps. Obviously Makar will take a huge chunk out of that too.

As a % of the cap, Necas vs Rants will be a large difference. If Mikko was due for a raise in a year or two sure. That wasn’t the case tho and the Avs can’t tie up 15% of the cap with our roster construction as is on a winger

 

[Chiarelli]

My favorite part of this is that Carolina is currently lined up to play a Hughes-less New Jersey in the 1st round.

So if Colorado (or whoever faces them) is able to take down Dallas in round 1, there’s a solid chance that Carolina has more short-term success since the trade deadline.

No one is confusing Carolina for a contender. I doubt they beat a Hughes-less NJ also

 

[Vaslof]

The idea that Cmac didn't want Mikko to accept his offer is absurd. What would even be the point, just for laughs? Carolina already showed interest in the summer, but Cmac chose to rather attempt to keep him. Clearly he wanted Mikko to stay, but Mikko played hardball and wasn't signing. With the deadline rapidly approaching, Cmac gave his final offer and told him that if he doesn't agree, then he will get traded to Carolina. Mikko said no and now he's gone.

Cmac of course had a certain number he valued Mikko at, and he thought he would get there. In hindsight he was right, if Mikko could go back in time he would take the deal. He got too greedy and complacent. What was done cannot be undone.

 

[Chiarelli]

All of Mikko/his agent/ and Tulsky come out of this looking like ass hats.

CMac looks quite smart atm, we’ll see how playoffs go tho

 

[Balthazar]

The idea that Cmac didn't want Mikko to accept his offer is absurd.

What's absurd is believing that CMac really wanted to keep him at 11.6M but not at 12M.

 

[flyfysher]

The idea that Cmac didn't want Mikko to accept his offer is absurd. What would even be the point, just for laughs? Carolina already showed interest in the summer, but Cmac chose to rather attempt to keep him. Clearly he wanted Mikko to stay, but Mikko played hardball and wasn't signing. With the deadline rapidly approaching, Cmac gave his final offer and told him that if he doesn't agree, then he will get traded to Carolina. Mikko said no and now he's gone.

Cmac of course had a certain number he valued Mikko at, and he thought he would get there. In hindsight he was right, if Mikko could go back in time he would take the deal. He got too greedy and complacent. What was done cannot be undone.

Yeah, I don’t buy into the conspiracy theory at all. If you make the offer then you’re willing to pay that price.

 

[Balthazar]

Yeah, I don’t buy into the conspiracy theory at all. If you make the offer then you’re willing to pay that price.

If you sell your car 20k and I offer you 15k because I'm not really interested in it, I'm willing to pay that price but I'm expecting you to say no. That's not a conspiracy theory.

 

[AllAboutAvs]

The idea that Cmac didn't want Mikko to accept his offer is absurd. What would even be the point, just for laughs? Carolina already showed interest in the summer, but Cmac chose to rather attempt to keep him. Clearly he wanted Mikko to stay, but Mikko played hardball and wasn't signing. With the deadline rapidly approaching, Cmac gave his final offer and told him that if he doesn't agree, then he will get traded to Carolina. Mikko said no and now he's gone.

Cmac of course had a certain number he valued Mikko at, and he thought he would get there. In hindsight he was right, if Mikko could go back in time he would take the deal. He got too greedy and complacent. What was done cannot be undone.

Not absurb at all. That 11.6M offer was perfectly designed to look like they wanted to keep him and bait him to counter with a 12M+ demand. Look at how quickly the Avs turned around and traded him. They still had 5 weeks of negotiation time before the TDL. If they really wanted to keep him they would have used most of that time to negotiate him down to what they "wanted". Again the Avs' offer was set up to look like they wanted to keep him. It looks like it worked because some of you still believe they wanted to keep despite trading him 5 weeks before the TDL. The decision to trade him was to keep the window open longer.

 

[flyfysher]

If you sell your car 20k and I offer you 15k, I'm willing to pay that price but I'm expecting you to say no. That's not a conspiracy theory.

It could just as easily be an offer and they accept. That’s the nature of contractual negotiations. If you think about it, your interpretation would jeopardize the Avs’ (CMac’s) credibility in future negotiations if other parties thought the management was bargaining in bad faith. Reputation wise, it’s too risky, ill conceived and just bad business practice.

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

Not absurb at all. That 11.6M offer was perfectly designed to look like they wanted to keep him and bait him to counter with a 12M+ demand. Look at how quickly the Avs turned around and traded him. They still had 5 weeks of negotiation time before the TDL. If they really wanted to keep him they would have used most of that time to negotiate him down to what they "wanted". Again the Avs' offer was set up to look like they wanted to keep him. It looks like it worked because some of you still believe they wanted to keep despite trading him 5 weeks before the TDL. The decision to trade him was to keep the window open longer.

I think they did want to keep him...at their price. From some of the stories coming out, Rants and his agent basically f***ed around and found out. They basically thought the Avs were bluffing and they were asking the world, when the Avs wouldn't budge they asked if he'd re-sign with Carolina and he said sure, maybe. He thought it was a negotiation tactic, but it was the Avs being done with the looming threat of continuing negotiations and just moving off those train tracks. It also sounds like they almost fumbled the Dallas deal as well until Mikko stepped in and just said get the deal done. If he and his agent hadn't overestimated their bargaining power, I think he'd still be an Avs player now.

 

[Balthazar]

It could just as easily be an offer and they accept. That’s the nature of contractual negotiations. If you think about it, your interpretation would jeopardize the Avs’ (CMac’s) credibility in future negotiations if other parties thought the management was bargaining in bad faith. Reputation wise, it’s too risky, ill conceived and just bad business practice.

He made him an offer he knew he'd not accept. That happens all the time.

Do you actually believe that CMac really wanted to keep Mikko but traded his ass for a difference of 400k AAV?

If CMac wanted to keep Mikko he's still be an Avalanche.

 

[JoeSakic13]

No one is confusing Carolina for a contender. I doubt they beat a Hughes-less NJ also

They’re not a contender, but I think they can take down NJ without Hughes.

So it’s not outside the realm of possibility that Carolina is in the second round, but Dallas is not.

 

[AllAboutAvs]

I think they did want to keep him...at their price. From some of the stories coming out, Rants and his agent basically f***ed around and found out. They basically thought the Avs were bluffing and they were asking the world, when the Avs wouldn't budge they asked if he'd re-sign with Carolina and he said sure, maybe. He thought it was a negotiation tactic, but it was the Avs being done with the looming threat of continuing negotiations and just moving off those train tracks. It also sounds like they almost fumbled the Dallas deal as well until Mikko stepped in and just said get the deal done. If he and his agent hadn't overestimated their bargaining power, I think he'd still be an Avs player now.

If true then why not take another 2-3 weeks to negotiate him down to their price. No, I believe the top they were willing to keep at was 11M tops. They offered 11.6M to look good and knowing he wouldn't accept it.

 

[Vaslof]

What's absurd is believing that CMac really wanted to keep him at 11.6M but not at 12M.

Okay let's follow this logic.

What's absurd is believing that CMac really wanted to keep him at 12M but not at 12.4M.
What's absurd is believing that CMac really wanted to keep him at 12.4M but not at 12.8M.
What's absurd is believing that CMac really wanted to keep him at 12.8M but not at 13.2M. etc.

 

[Bonzai12]

whether it was $11M or $12M, Mikko and his agent put money over team and now seems to regret that move.........If Mikko was going to be so emotionally hurt about it, he probably should have re-considered his priorities. Whether that's maturity, bad agent, bad advice, whatever....those are all shoulda coulda woulda's now....probably a good learning experience for him in where his life priorities lie. It's for sure terrible that all this has to transpire for him to learn these things.

Mikko will likely get boo'ed in his return....and I've already seen Mikko loyalists get all up in arms about it.....but it's a business and in this case BOTH Mikko and the Avs were playing it like a business...so I don't think one side can exactly throw out the innocence card. The Avs were not likely going to go higher than Mac, and Mikko/Agent were trying to squeeze every last drop of juice out of this contract as they possibly could.

 

[AvsGuy]

The way I'm trying to look at it: Rantanen, Necas, whoever it is in that spot, they are and are always going to be a complimentary player to the godsend for this franchise that is Nathan MacKinnon. We can love the player, we can love the person, but the team and the roster is not going to revolve around that player or person.

Necas is doing Rantanen's job with aplomb, for way less. Rantanen overvalued himself, and it worked out for all parties in the end, but for what the Avs literally hired Mikko to do - we can get someone objectively better for less. Rantanen will get a fat paycheck to do what he does - snipe, coast, fall over, and put up points. He can go do it in Dallas - we've filled the position capably.

 

[Balthazar]

Okay let's follow this logic.

What's absurd is believing that CMac really wanted to keep him at 12M but not at 12.4M.
What's absurd is believing that CMac really wanted to keep him at 12.4M but not at 12.8M.
What's absurd is believing that CMac really wanted to keep him at 12.8M but not at 13.2M. etc.

You made my point. In all of those cases he'd keep him.

You don't trade an 12M guy that you want to keep for 400k AAV. Period.

Mikko and his agent put money over team and now seems to regret that move

They do?

 

[dahrougem2]

@Balthazar

I see a quoted post from you here saying among other things, you heard again on Montreal radio that the Avs didn't let Mikko talk to Carolina, but it looks like that post was deleted?

Was that part true about what you heard?

I'm still trying to figure out this CMac/Lebrun-Friedman discrepancy in reporting. Friedman seems to be sticking to that report.

I'm starting to get the feeling that the discrepancy may be that Carolina might not have talked to Mikko's agent directly, but possibly had their feeling characterized and relayed to them by the Avs.

This is the most likely scenario, given we've heard CMac apparently asked Mikko/his agent if he'd be willing to sign in Carolina and given the "uh ya sure" response, so CMac probably relayed that to the Hurricanes who likely jumped for joy that he'd be open to signing, only to find out Mikko thought the Avs were bluffing and never expected to be traded.

 

[Bonzai12]

They do?

Maybe they don't? I am not sure. If they don't regret it, then I don't see the argument for why he doesn't deserve every single boo that's gonna be aimed at him for years to come in Ball arena.

 

[The Merchant]

I mean it just lends more credence to the idea that CMac was entertaining the idea of trading Mikko from as early as the draft when trade talks were supposedly initiated with Carolina. Say what you will about CMac, but we have a very smart front office. If all of us were starting to sour on Mikko's effort level then you'd have to imagine that they were too.

 

[S E P H]

Yes but since I couldn't post a source I deleted it to avoid unnecessary drama.

Not saying your source is wrong, the initial reports were that Avs did NOT allow Carolina to talk to Rantanen and based on the events that happened, that seems the most logical from what transpired. Only recently has Friedmann come out and say that Avs went to Rantanen and gave him a three or so day period to talk to Carolina about a contract. That would make Tulsky a lot less stupid if that is what truly happened.

 

[S E P H]

I mean it just lends more credence to the idea that CMac was entertaining the idea of trading Mikko from as early as the draft when trade talks were supposedly initiated with Carolina. Say what you will about CMac, but we have a very smart front office. If all of us were starting to sour on Mikko's effort level then you'd have to imagine that they were too.

Just look what they did to Mittelstadt. Let's be honest, Casey was bloody fantastic for us in his first 30-40 games here, including the playoffs. Like, he was everything we wanted in a 2nd line centre, but Avs shot him to the moon faster than middle age bald men wiping out Pokemon cards at Costco.

They wanted to buy low on Mikko and Mikko was trying to profit at sky high. It takes two to tango and neither side was willing to.