Coaching is a serious problem.

Habby4Life

First pick overall goes to the Montreal Canadiens
Nov 12, 2008
4,201
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Three years ago we had next to no roster. When he took over Caufield had 1 goal in half a season and then scored 48 in his next 82. Dach, Newhook, Guhle… all progressed nicely under him as well.

We’ve gotten significantly more points in each season. The progression is there. That’s just a fact,
They look like a three alarm fire in their own zone and its not just this year.

This M vs M is good for pickup hockey but not the NHL. MSL is obviously a good mentor but he is a brutal XOs coach and not very good at making in game adjustments. Team needs more skill, depth, and better coaching if they are ever to be in the mix.

The MSL love fest is old now.
 

Lafleurs Guy

Guuuuuuuy!
Jul 20, 2007
77,872
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They look like a three alarm fire in their own zone and it just not this year.
Okay, look at the roster over the past three years. What were you expecting? We were designed to be bad man. And that was before the injuries.
This M vs M is good for pickup hockey but not the NHL. MSL is obviously a good mentor but he is a brutal XOs coach and not very good at making in game adjustments. Team needs more skill, depth, and better coaching if they are ever to be in the mix.
With all due respect, you don’t know this. We have at least three super green blueliners in the lineup at any given time and as good as Matheson is offensively he’s a tire fire in his own end. That’s not a coaching issue.

If we brought in Scotty Bownan we’d still be bad in our own end. A coach doesn’t just flip a switch and fix the roster.
 
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Habby4Life

First pick overall goes to the Montreal Canadiens
Nov 12, 2008
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Okay, look at the roster over the past three years. What were you expecting? We were designed to be bad man. And that was before the injuries.

With all due respect, you don’t know this. We have at least three super green blueliners in the lineup at any given time and as good as Matheson is offensively he’s a tire fire in his own end. That’s not a coaching issue.

If we brought in Scotty Bownan we’d still be bad in our own end. A coach doesn’t just flip a switch and fix the roster.

Bad is one thing, unorganized and no clue that to do in thier own end is another. They have no structure and it shows night after night.

A decent coach can teach a team how to play without the puck.

They have one of the weakest coaching staffs in the entire league. MSL is in over his head. Won’t convince me otherwise, I see the dumpster fire every night.
 

Gaylord Q Tinkledink

Registered User
Apr 29, 2018
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This was an issue last year. Some understood that, but a lot of you are slow.

Coaching isn't the only thing to be concerned about


You should be concerned about Hughes, Molson, and what a lot of you don't want to hear the actual validity that the Habs have a top tier prospect pool because it certain doesn't look like it.
 

Guess

Registered User
Jul 16, 2010
1,280
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Brossard, QC
He had a HOF goalie who covered up for his terrible decision making.

He didn’t develop shit. He had them dead last in analytics and out of the playoffs before he got fired. And once he was fired that team went top ten the rest of the way and won the cup.

He’s the difference between winning a cup and missing the playoffs. Very few coaches are that bad. He’s one of them. The Pens are lucky they fired him in time to save a playoff spot.

The moment Therrien came on board our development cratered. He was absolute poison. Dump and chase for PK Subban. Didn’t know how to communicate, destroyed the dressing room. Absolute worst coach we’ve ever had and that includes Claude Ruel.

As for MSL, our players have developed nicely under him. This team’s the 2nd youngest in the league - it’s not surprising we’re going to struggle. We said so at the start of the year and we’ll say it at the end. This team is unlikely to make the playoffs. It doesn’t matter who the coach is. What matters for now is that we continue to see progress from key players, I see no reason why that won’t continue to happen.
Agreed with all this. I still remember when Toenails brought Subban into the video room and started scorching him on 24CH or something about him trying to do fancy plays or something. Human beings don't respond well to criticism, he wasn't able to properly educate players imo.

He might have been good for immature young players who needed a drill sergeant to keep them in line and playing hard, but that's it. Effort players with lower IQ (like Gallagher) could also thrive under this kind of simple system coach.

I think it's a breath of fresh air that MSL measures progress not by wins but by improvements in the process, measured by whatever advanced stats they are showing the players. Focusing on wins is not the best idea since you will lose lots of games and many of them while playing well.
 
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Lafleurs Guy

Guuuuuuuy!
Jul 20, 2007
77,872
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This was an issue last year. Some understood that, but a lot of you are slow.

Coaching isn't the only thing to be concerned about


You should be concerned about Hughes, Molson, and what a lot of you don't want to hear the actual validity that the Habs have a top tier prospect pool because it certain doesn't look like it.
Yeah. We should just start over now.

Good call.
 
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OnTheRun

/dev/null
May 17, 2014
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This was an issue last year. Some understood that, but a lot of you are slow.

Coaching isn't the only thing to be concerned about


You should be concerned about Hughes, Molson, and what a lot of you don't want to hear the actual validity that the Habs have a top tier prospect pool because it certain doesn't look like it.

It's almost like a rebuild come with its share of uncertainty...
 

OldCraig71

Juice Arse
Feb 2, 2009
35,577
56,311
No one cares
I don’t know, I mean it’s totally expected that these years are going to be challenging. They always are.

I’m less worried about the forwards because we have more on the way. The D though is too green and we’ve got Guhle on the right side. To me, the best bang for the buck would be to get help there this year. Deal off Matheson and move Guhle back. Then next year or at the deadline deal Savard.
LG it isn't just about the D being green and although it is tough for a young group to play a full-time role in the NHL, there needs to be more attention to defense throughout the lineup, those guys are not getting support from the forwards.

It's a cluster fugg back there and I know you see it. There have been multiple occasions where D men have been trapped on the ice for up to 2 minutes, completely hemmed in which means that 5 of our guys were unable to take back possession of the puck. It looks awful and that is on the coaching staff and they need to get serious about it because sooner or later it will hamper the development of the players we are hopeful about.
 

salbutera

Registered User
Sep 10, 2019
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Bad is one thing, unorganized and no clue that to do in thier own end is another. They have no structure and it shows night after night.

A decent coach can teach a team how to play without the puck.

They have one of the weakest coaching staffs in the entire league. MSL is in over his head. Won’t convince me otherwise, I see the dumpster fire every night.
I would only offer…

I’ve been listening to quite a few former players talking about MSLs hybrid system, and there’s a unanimous sentiment that the concept / system should be familiar or very easy to digest for NHL caliber players. Again unanimously they all stated the hybrid system though is very dependent on the individual player making the “proper read” / anticipation - for example they all stated MSL can’t be blamed because Xhekaj didn’t read the play on the 2nd goal (Laferiere driving to slot for deflection), and Dvorak cleanly losing two important faceoffs with a few minutes left in the game.

Just maybe it’s not MSLs concept as it is having soldiers incapable of processing read & react (subpar defensive hockey IQ)

Should not be lost, MSL was an excellent defensive player during his playing days, he never cheated…
 
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Gaylord Q Tinkledink

Registered User
Apr 29, 2018
32,431
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Yeah. We should just start over now.

Good call.
I didn't say start over, but the way things are going in 2 years they might have to if the habs are still trending at whatever the f*** this is. No defensive structure and can't generate offense.
It's almost like a rebuild come with its share of uncertainty...
Well yeah, but one thing that shouldn't be uncertain is the progress of the players.



We're 5 games into a new season, but there's a lot of bad, or concerning things that still reside with the team these 5 games into the season that they had last year.

Again, 5 games into a season isn't a whole lot, but they look like shit.

The team last year for the most part was competitive, but just simply lost because of lack of skill, depth and experience.






I want the habs to suck this year as I 100% believe they need another high-end prospect. Honestly, they could use another one on top of that, so if they can get Calgary and Florida to finish 11th and the other anywhere higher, the habs could get another high-end player as this draft looks to have a fair amount of good players. That could set this pool up well, especially if they can get another 1st, or some 2nds and move into the 1st to get a faller, or just use those 2nds to amass what will likely become their top prospects aside from Demidov and Hage.

Habs also need to stop drafting below average sized players with no above average skill, or trait. Habs are full of these players that will become a fringe NHLer at best. They somewhat did this this past draft, but need to continue.


Also, pass drafting goalies for a draft, or two unless it's like a 7th rounder and it's a goalie who should have gone in the 2nd, or 3rd, then maybe.
 

River Meadow

Registered User
Mar 29, 2016
6,874
9,210
I don't like how people say MSL has no plan or system.

He has concepts of a plan,

And that's good enough for me.

<3 MSL

NHL coaches are mostly a joke. I’ve said this for years. These coach problem threads are a bore. The players are on the ice and don’t have time for coaching bullshit.

This.

MSL is a legend, who actually has experience playing and being in in-game situations and scenarios.

You don't get rid of this, and players love him.

If anything you can hire a bunch of X-O guys to surround and help support him, but even thinking of firing him is insane at this point.
 

Lafleurs Guy

Guuuuuuuy!
Jul 20, 2007
77,872
49,096
LG it isn't just about the D being green and although it is tough for a young group to play a full-time role in the NHL, there needs to be more attention to defense throughout the lineup, those guys are not getting support from the forwards.

It's a cluster fugg back there and I know you see it. There have been multiple occasions where D men have been trapped on the ice for up to 2 minutes, completely hemmed in which means that 5 of our guys were unable to take back possession of the puck. It looks awful and that is on the coaching staff and they need to get serious about it because sooner or later it will hamper the development of the players we are hopeful about.
What do you think would make more of a difference?

1. Hiring Scotty Bowman
2. Trading Matheson and getting a solid veteran RD
 

Lafleurs Guy

Guuuuuuuy!
Jul 20, 2007
77,872
49,096
I didn't say start over, but the way things are going in 2 years they might have to if the habs are still trending at whatever the f*** this is. No defensive structure and can't generate offense.
You’re sitting there talking like we’ve done nothing over the past couple of years and it’s nonsense.

Compare where we were vs where we are. Compare the finishes on our teams over the years…
 

Miller Time

Registered User
Sep 16, 2004
24,044
16,821
I would only offer…

I’ve been listening to quite a few former players talking about MSLs hybrid system, and there’s a unanimous sentiment that the concept / system should be familiar or very easy to digest for NHL caliber players. Again unanimously they all stated the hybrid system though is very dependent on the individual player making the “proper read” / anticipation - for example they all stated MSL can’t be blamed because Xhekaj didn’t read the play on the 2nd goal (Laferiere driving to slot for deflection), and Dvorak cleanly losing two important faceoffs with a few minutes left in the game.

Just maybe it’s not MSLs concept as it is having soldiers incapable of processing read & react (subpar defensive hockey IQ)

Should not be lost, MSL was an excellent defensive player during his playing days, he never cheated…
yup...

posters who don't have a strong grasp of high performance level team sports won't have much capacity to understand, let alone recognize this kind of nuance.

and, as people do when they are confused and frustrated, dig their heels in with anger and certainty...
They have one of the weakest coaching staffs in the entire league. MSL is in over his head. Won’t convince me otherwise, I see the dumpster fire every night.

case in point :lol:
 

Habby4Life

First pick overall goes to the Montreal Canadiens
Nov 12, 2008
4,201
3,919
yup...

posters who don't have a strong grasp of high performance level team sports won't have much capacity to understand, let alone recognize this kind of nuance.

and, as people do when they are confused and frustrated, dig their heels in with anger and certainty...


case in point :lol:
Strong grasp of high performance level sports team's, haha. Such posters should send resume to Molson.

Pinned in their end for minutes on end, oh I understand the nuance.

MSL fanboys living with their heads in the sand, no issues at all.
 
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