Management Claude Julien III - the final countdown?(ALL talk here)

[CharasLazyWrister]

I mean, he's allowed to scratch Phil Kessel in favor of Jeremy Reich in a playoff series and play Alex Khokhlachev 2 minutes in a game. So that counts for something.

My God, that actually happened.

However you feel about that particular move, it's a pretty definitive argument to the fact that you can't simply blame Sweeney for "not giving Claude the correct players/talent". Claude has shown time and time again he doesn't make the most...logical???...decisions when it comes to talent even if he has got it.

After 2011, he refused to not use Shawn Thornton as an everyday playoff player, even when he was being completely shown up by speedier teams like the Habs.

There is, without a doubt, a loyalty to the lesser skilled, heavier-game players in Claude's system. The system relies on heavy, grinding, perimeter play and if you don't buy into his system, you lose/you don't play. All of this "Claude has nothing" talk seems like some serious denial about so many obvious past cases (not just this year's ridiculous decisions like scratching Colin Miller for Liles, playing McQuaid and Kevan Miller in the same lineup despite obviously better options, etc.) No one is saying the Bruins would be world beaters without Claude. It's just that, to me, his shtick has grown stale. At some point, given the direction this team is going (they seem to be drafting almost entirely "skill" players at this point), a change has to happen.

Citing Julien's past success is a rudimentary argument. Everyone knows what he has accomplished. Even the people like me who want a change. The fact that is that he's on year three of, most likely, failing the playoffs. No, I'm not looking for a directionless Dave Lewis situation, but I'm not going to oppose something out of fear, like so many of the "keep Julien" people are.

Like...when does it end? It seems like a huge percentage of the Julien supporters are touting basically a "free ride" for him until he has an All-Star roster. As someone else said, how is it that Julien is miles above all these coaches, yet the likes of Calgary, the Leafs, the Panthers, the ****ing CANUCKS!!!!, etc. are in similar spots in the standing with easily arguable WORSE rosters.

The endless loyalty for certain individuals runs so goddamn deep in this organization, from the executive position all the way down to fans. It's really easy to see (and be pretty disgusted with) if you follow any team outside of the organization. The lack of logical decision making pisses me off big time.

There are ****ing people rooting for this team who would keep Chara signed until he was 50. Exaggeration, but not by much.

 

[CharasLazyWrister]

If Spooner gets an OT shift because of his offensive skill, I don't necessarily have a problem with Nash getting a quick OT shift because of his defensive skill. I don't even recall who he was out there against, which may have been relevant. He was out there for way too long but these things happen.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say you want to keep Claude under all circumstances.

"These things happen" Yeah, under Claude...

 

[Mount Kramer Cameras]

I'm going to go out on a limb and say you want to keep Claude under all circumstances.

"These things happen" Yeah, under Claude...

Nope.

You have to look at it from a balanced perspective though. Krug was out there for what felt like the whole OT - good decision. Nash having an extended shift - not so good. But worthy of great analysis? Gimme a break. Sometimes coaches have to try to give under-performing players confidence in these kinds of situations.

 

[CharasLazyWrister]

Nope.

You have to look at it from a balanced perspective though. Krug was out there for what felt like the whole OT - good decision. Nash having an extended shift - not so good. But worthy of great analysis? Gimme a break. Sometimes coaches have to try to give under-performing players confidence in these kinds of situations.

You are actually arguing as if this is an isolated incident.

Sorry to pull out my jump to conclusion mat, but that is why I pegged you as a Julien loyalist. This happens a ton. People have general complaints, built up over time through multiple occurrences of a similar theme. These people harp on one particular instance in the game before, and get told something along the lines of "wow, you're freaking out over this one little thing". The problem is it's not one little thing, but this is the argument that constantly seems to fit for Julien supporters.

Pretend it's a one off thing and make the complainer sound as foolish as possible by claiming they are freaking out over a tiny, unchained incident.

 

[KnightofBoston]

The biggest reason Nash was out there for as long as he was was due to Carlo throwing the puck away when he felt pressure, then Nash couldn't change out


But, I wouldn't have put him out there in the first place personally

 

[EverettMike]

Some you have Stockholm Syndrome with terrible players.

 

[remer]

If Spooner gets an OT shift because of his offensive skill, I don't necessarily have a problem with Nash getting a quick OT shift because of his defensive skill. I don't even recall who he was out there against, which may have been relevant. He was out there for way too long but these things happen.

Spooner was awesome in overtime. Riley Nash.....not so much.

 

[Fair Warning]

Member when Claude tried to make PJ Axelsson a first-line player with Marc Savard?

 

[Spooner st]

I think Koko would take those 2 minutes a game now, his KHL coach doesn't even dress him.

Some here thought Koko was going to burn the KHL.

 

[Spooner st]

Didn't do what? How long was Nash out there for overtime? It might not have been 2 minutes but it sure felt like it they way he played.

Nash could not change due to Carlo bad play. It has nothing to do with Julien.
Perfect example of confirmation bias from the haters. Wake the **** up.

 

[Blowfish]

Some here thought Koko was going to burn the KHL.

Nash schaller Hayes or koko?

 

[Spooner st]

Member when Claude tried to make PJ Axelsson a first-line player with Marc Savard?

Member wen no one could score. Member the dead wood back then.
Member the cup that follow soon after.

 

[ODAAT]

Nash schaller Hayes or koko?

I have no issues with Schaller`s game, issue is, he should never play above the 3rd line and IMO, is ideal for the 4th

If Spooner could show he can win a bloody faceoff and consistently be reliable in his own zone, Nash too wouldn`t be needed to play 3rd line minutes

Now, why Julien plunked him out in OT as I`ve been reading is beyond me but....the conspiracy theorist in me says it was a message at Management such as "look at what I`m forced to do"

 

[Absurdity]

I knew people would be all over Julien for the Nash shift in OT but I think it's forgivable. When they had possession he made some nice plays but once they gave up the puck he got stuck out there. It wasn't like Claude was telling him to take a 2 minute shift, they just got trapped out there with the long change. It's very hard to make a change in 3-on-3 if the other team decides to just hang on to the puck in the neutral zone like the Wings did.

Agreed. It's not like Claude told him to stay out there for 1 min.

 

[ODAAT]

Agreed. It's not like Claude told him to stay out there for 1 min.

or did he

 

[EverettMike]

Counterpoint: don't put Nash on the ice in OT ever, not for a second.

 

[Number8]

I have no issues with Schaller`s game, issue is, he should never play above the 3rd line and IMO, is ideal for the 4th

If Spooner could show he can win a bloody faceoff and consistently be reliable in his own zone, Nash too wouldn`t be needed to play 3rd line minutes

Now, why Julien plunked him out in OT as I`ve been reading is beyond me but....the conspiracy theorist in me says it was a message at Management such as "look at what I`m forced to do"

I'm with you. I think there has to be a touch of a poke at management here.

Probably in the dark recesses of his mind: "Hell, I don't have a ton to work with here anyway and Nash probably isn't going to lose me the OT. And if that pisses off those a-holes who are leaving me dangling in the wind a little bit then great."

 

[Spooner st]

I thought Nash was a good move by Julien.
I know it's not shared by many, but it was a good move.

 

[SPLBRUIN]

I thought Nash was a good move by Julien.
I know it's not shared by many, but it was a good move.

You are a funny guy, ha ha.

 

[Spooner st]

I'm with you. I think there has to be a touch of a poke at management here.

Probably in the dark recesses of his mind: "Hell, I don't have a ton to work with here anyway and Nash probably isn't going to lose me the OT. And if that pisses off those a-holes who are leaving me dangling in the wind a little bit then great."

Maybe, but the in game move was a good move.
That also contradict those saying Julien doesn’t do in game ajustments.
He had little options but still...

 

[Spooner st]

You are a funny guy, ha ha.

Not as much as you though. .. I mean beating the same drum since what... 2008? Now that's funny.

 

[Mount Kramer Cameras]

You are actually arguing as if this is an isolated incident.

Sorry to pull out my jump to conclusion mat, but that is why I pegged you as a Julien loyalist. This happens a ton. People have general complaints, built up over time through multiple occurrences of a similar theme. These people harp on one particular instance in the game before, and get told something along the lines of "wow, you're freaking out over this one little thing". The problem is it's not one little thing, but this is the argument that constantly seems to fit for Julien supporters.

Pretend it's a one off thing and make the complainer sound as foolish as possible by claiming they are freaking out over a tiny, unchained incident.

I'm not trying to push a pro or anti-Julien agenda - I'm just trying to look at the incident rationally and attempt to understand the thought process.

If you need a guy to kill 30 seconds whilst your match-winners catch a breather, so be it. It's not like we can roll Bergeron/Marchand and Pastrnak/Krejci for the whole OT. Vatrano and Spooner could lose you the game just as easily as they could win it. I'd rather see Moore out there but maybe he was gassed - who knows.

Given a choice, I'd prefer to see the more gung-ho offensive approach - but we know what Julien is by now, so it's no surprise that he opts for the safe option more often than not. I don't really have a major problem with it, and it worked out ok last night.

 

[Number8]

Maybe, but the in game move was a good move.
That also contradict those saying Julien doesn’t do in game ajustments.
He had little options but still...

Hey don't get me wrong -- they won the game and we've not done a lot of that lately! As such I have no issues with Nash on OT given the result.

I do think it does two things:

1) Highlights how few lineup options this team has.

2) Possibly (AND I HOPE IT DOES) serves as a bit of a jab at management by Claude If so, then I fully, 100% support that. If that's what it takes to get the attention of those fools at the top, then my #1 line against Pittsburgh is Hayes, Nash, and Rinaldo.

Yes, I know Rinaldo is suspended in NHL. Who cares? Pencil him in and skate with two players on top line. Then hold up a sign behind the bench: "Give me some assets or stop with the Deep Playoff Run bullcrap. I deserve better and the fans deserve better."

No -- the win last night did not make me a happier Bruins fan. I'm in Harry Sinden/Mike O'Connell -- Jacobs forcing the Lockout territory with this team.

 

[DominicT]

Counterpoint: don't put Nash on the ice in OT ever, not for a second.

Maybe Nash wasn't the right choice, but I'm thinking the coaches thinking is this:

We can't put Chara out there, we can't put K Miller out there and we can't put McQuaid out there.

So they (the coaches) are running with 3 D and they want at least one defensive (or can play defensively) forwards with one of their "scorers" out there at all times.

Bergy, Krejci, Backes and Nash.

An argument can be made that it should have been Moore instead of Nash, but I'm guessing that is their reasoning. And I think it's a solid one.

 

[b in vancouver]

I'm going to go out on a limb and say you want to keep Claude under all circumstances.

"These things happen" Yeah, under Claude...

Think of it however you want.

I don't mind if they let him coach out the year - and see how things play out.

That was just that I didn't mind him putting Nash out there in OT - as it didn't look like Bergeron or Backes had anything left in the tank - but it's supposed to be a 20 second shift where Spooner skates around with it. Nash got caught out there a bit. But I don't blame Julien for it being a long shift. That's on the player. Plus, it was just as much on Spooner turning over possession as it was on Nash.