Value of: Claude Giroux to the Leafs at the deadline

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I was going to make this thread last night but I wanted to see what the result of tonight's games before I did.

Everybody knows the Leafs do need a top 6 LW although some may disagree after tonight's result but LW is still the weakest point on the roster.

Claude Giroux would address that it would probably take double rentention but Giroux would be a perfect fit for our top 6.

I feel like a top 6 LW might be the final piece that is needed

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[TheScandal89]

I could be wrong but isnt 50% the most a players contract could be retained, regardless of how many teams chip in? That would mean the lowest his cap hit could be is 4.13 mil. I'm sure they could figure something that works cap wise if it did happen.

With that said, I think he stays a Flyer tbh, but you never know. Flyers fans would know the teams thoughts on that better then me.

 

[ToDavid]

I could be wrong but isnt 50% the most a players contract could be retained, regardless of how many teams chip in? That would mean the lowest his cap hit could be 4.13 mil

You can do up to 50% with each transaction, but a max of two transactions.

 

[Ciao]

No, 50% of 50% if a second team retains.

 

[TheScandal89]

You can do up to 50% with each transaction, but a max of two transactions.

No, 50% of 50% if a second team retains.

Oh ok, thanks for clearing that up

 

[34]

This has the same vibe of Nick Foligno all over again. The cost would be too high anyway.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

This has the same vibe of Nick Foligno all over again. The cost would be too high anyway.

Not even close 2 VERY different players

 

[Leaf Fans]

I could be wrong but isnt 50% the most a players contract could be retained, regardless of how many teams chip in? That would mean the lowest his cap hit could be is 4.13 mil. I'm sure they could figure something that works cap wise if it did happen.

With that said, I think he stays a Flyer tbh, but you never know. Flyers fans would know the teams thoughts on that better then me.

No, we got two teams to retain 50% on Foligno just last year. That mean s we got him with 75% retention.

 

[34]

Not even close 2 VERY different players

Philly would want A LOT to move him to Toronto.

 

[Leaf Fans]

Giroux would be a fantastic add, but I think the price would be very high.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Philly would want A LOT to move him to Toronto.

As they should he's a great player and the Leafs are currently #1 in the league with a weakness at LW they should be looking to add that final piece

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Giroux would be a fantastic add, but I think the price would be very high.

I agree and it should be he's a great player and the Leafs are currently #1 in the league with a weakness at LW they should be looking to add that final piece

 

[34]

As they should he's a great player and the Leafs are currently #1 in the league with a weakness at LW they should be looking to add that final piece

Evander Kane. That is who I think. The price would be good.

 

[Leaf Fans]

I agree and it should be he's a great player and the Leafs are currently #1 in the league with a weakness at LW they should be looking to add that final piece

He is also another guy who can win a draw. I think we also need a defenceman with some snarl. However, I don't think it is the best thing to completely empty the cupboards. If I could choose, I would choose a David Savard with term for futures than Claude Giroux as a rental. Obviously both would be better.

 

[Ciao]

I think the salary cap is good for the Leafs because it forces them to develop new talent.

The can't go out and buy aging stars like Owen Nolan and Claude Giroux anymore. I would rather see them develop their own good, young players.

They didn't do that for a very long time pre-cap.

I'm sick and tired of seeing the Leaf try to take shortcuts with other teams' has-beens. Not for me.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I think the salary cap is good for the Leafs because it forces them to develop new talent.

The can't go out and buy aging stars like Owen Nolan and Claude Giroux anymore. I would rather see them develop their own good, young players.

They didn't do that for a very long time pre-cap.

I'm sick and tired of seeing the Leaf try to take shortcuts with other teams' has-beens. Not for me.

So you just don't want them to add anybody at all ever.

You can't develop everybody you have to add outside help

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Evander Kane. That is who I think. The price would be good.

Not against that either if the price is right but obviously the price I'd pay is different

 

[Deadly Dogma]

I wonder what the Claude Giroux adjusted cost would be?

 

[Ciao]

So you just don't want them to add anybody at all ever.

You can't develop everybody you have to add outside help

I'm seldom in favour of trading for older players. I generally don't like trading the future for the past.

The only fully developed players the Leafs acquired in recent memory that I liked were Joffrey Lupul and Jake Muzzin.

Before that, I suppose you could go back to Doug Gilmour, Jamie Macoun and Sylvain Lefebvre -- but even Gilmour's peak was ahead of him, and look what you gave up for Lefebvre along with the real star of that deal -- Mats Sundin.

I would do the Gilmour and Sundin deals again a thousand times over as you were getting younger players on the way up.

I can't think of any other vets acquired recently that had any significant value -- not Brian Boyle, not Thomas Plekanic, not Tyson Barrie, not Riley Nash, not nick Foligno, not any of them.

Fred Andersen was a career backup with his best days ahead. He was good value. That deal I would be happy to repeat.

The Hell with Claude Giroux, JT Miller and the double Hell with Evander Kane. The Leafs don't need them. Their best days are behind them, and the Leafs should use their cap room and roster spots to find their own young up-and-coming stars through the draft, trades and free-agency.

Let's see what Joey Anderson and Nick Roberston can do. If they don't work out, then find some more young prospects.

I hear the Leafs have plenty of those but we'll never see them if they fill the entire roster with aging vets.

This is not a criticism of current Leafs management, because I think for the most part they are trying new things. It's a criticism of those who don't want them to do that.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I'm seldom in favour of trading for older players. I generally don't like trading the future for the past.

The only fully developed players the Leafs acquired in recent memory that I liked were Joffrey Lupul and Jake Muzzin.

Before that, I suppose you could go back to Doug Gilmour, Jamie Macoun and Sylvain Lefebvre -- but even Gilmour's peak was ahead of him, and look what you gave up for Lefebvre along with the real star of that deal -- Mats Sundin.

I would do the Gilmour and Sundin deals again a thousand times over as you were getting younger players on the way up.

I can't think of any other vets acquired recently that had any significant value -- not Brian Boyle, not Thomas Plekanic, not Tyson Barrie, not Riley Nash, not nick Foligno, not any of them.

Fred Andersen was a career backup with his best days ahead. He was good value. That deal I would be happy to repeat.

The Hell with Claude Giroux, JT Miller and the double Hell with Evander Kane. The Leafs don't need them. Their best days are behind them, and the Leafs should use their cap room and roster spots to find their own young up-and-coming stars through the draft, trades and free-agency.

Let's see what Joey Anderson and Nick Roberston can do. If they don't work out, then find some more young prospects.

I hear the Leafs have plenty of those but we'll never see them if they fill the entire roster with aging vets.

This is not a criticism of current Leafs management, because I think for the most part they are trying new things. It's a criticism of those who don't want them to do that.

Would you have told Tampa not to do the Colemaan, GooDrow or Savard deals?

 

[tgo0]

Would you have told Tampa not to do the Colemaan, GooDrow or Savard deals?

Didn’t Goodrow and Coleman have 1.5 years years on their deals? That surely bumped their price and changes peoples perspective on the deals.

 

[Ciao]

Would you have told Tampa not to do the Colemaan, GooDrow or Savard deals?

I don't follow Tampa.

I thought the Islanders trade for Butch Goring was good, but then again Butch went to high school with my brother, and the Islanders won four straight Stanley Cups right after that.

I really don't give a shit what Tampa did. I only watch them when they play the Leafs.

I know this is a very poor, evasive answer to a very genuine question, but I really do not have an opinion on on that.

My opinion is that trading for Kyle Clifford the first time around was a complete waste of time. The real value in that deal was the up-and-comer, Jack Campbell. I wish they could have just acquired Campbell and left it at that.

It rather reminds me of Dave Collins saying years later that at the time, he hadn't realized he was the throw-in on the Fred McGriff deal.

Sam Pollock, by the way, was fond of trading vets for futures too. It worked out well for him that way.

PS. My sincere apologies to the wonderful Tampa Bay Lightning fans that I have surely offended, and to the rest of HFBoards outside of Leafs' Nation. From the nature of this post, I thought it was on the Leafs' boards where it belongs. You good folks don't need my slights nor to bear Leafs' fans airing our differences here. This should be in-house.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I could be wrong but isnt 50% the most a players contract could be retained, regardless of how many teams chip in? That would mean the lowest his cap hit could be is 4.13 mil. I'm sure they could figure something that works cap wise if it did happen.

With that said, I think he stays a Flyer tbh, but you never know. Flyers fans would know the teams thoughts on that better then me.

He might stay a flyer but they don't look like they have a chance to win this year and he's 33 he might want to take his shot and the Leafs do have a sport for him at LW

 

[JRichard]

Such a deal makes sense as his salary will be going to Farabee and Couturier who got 8 mil more on their next contract. I guess they could fit Giroux in if he takes a discount and teams trade another high salary.
But i see him wanting a shot at the Cup.
Great prospect + dman on roster at 3-4 mil (didnt check roster if they exist)
Late 1st does little.

 

[Stuart Little]

Does Claude Giroux give a team a better shot of winning the cup = 100% YES - ANY TEAM
- especially the leafs - where he could easily slide shotgun to matthews or tavares on the LW PLUS provide an extra faceoff guy

the only question/debate is "At what cost"?

This would be a PURE rental - for example you know he is gone next year for sure
- so does giving up a Robertson, PLUS , PLUS worth it?
well how much do you want to roll the dice?

IMO if they leafs could somehow ADD

Giroux and Giordano - they would have NO HOLES and would be one of the TOP 3-4 favourites

is it worth losing - Robertson, Amirov, 1st, and 2nd (which is what it would take)? I SAY YES


Giroux - Matthews - Marner
Bunting - Tavares - Nylander
Kase - Kampf - Kerfoot
Simmonds - Spezza - Ritchie/Mikheyev/Engvall

- some of Engvall/Mik/Ritchie to do for pick(s)


Rielly - Brodie
Giordano - Holl
Muzzin - Sandin/Liljegren/Dermott

- some to go in part of deals or reacquire assets/picks