Classic Wrestling Discussion (as in non-current): Part II

[JackSlater]

iirc it was Prichard, I’ll try and look into it more

edit: Dustin got cut by WCW for blading in a match and got a call from Prichard who was with Vince with the idea. So it seems like a Prichard/McMahon concoction

Yes you're right, from listening to part of Prichard's amazingly long Goldust podcast it sounds like Prichard claims it as a collaborative idea with Prichard coming up with the origins of the name before Vince threw out the final name, McMahon coming up with the basis of the look and so on. He strangely says that the root of it was that Dustin was a movie buff. The lesson of course is to always be careful what you let Vince know about yourself because you never know where he will take it.

 

[CDJ]

Yes you're right, from listening to part of Prichard's amazingly long Goldust podcast it sounds like Prichard claims it as a collaborative idea with Prichard coming up with the origins of the name before Vince threw out the final name, McMahon coming up with the basis of the look and so on. He strangely says that the root of it was that Dustin was a movie buff. The lesson of course is to always be careful what you let Vince know about yourself because you never know where he will take it.

Vince finding out Cena can rap lol. vanilla ice Cena is the GOAT, I’m about a month Or so away from it in my rewatching of 2002 WWE

Right now it’s generic Cena...it’s a good thing he switched because god damn was he bland before the rapper gimmick. Don’t know if he would have made it. I think the rapper gimmick allowed Cena to get comfortable with performing then you got to see the natural charisma come out as a result of that. I’m not basing this off of anything other than watching him before the rapper gimmick. There just wasn’t a lot there that made him stand out

 

[JackSlater]

Vince finding out Cena can rap lol. vanilla ice Cena is the GOAT, I’m about a month Or so away from it in my rewatching of 2002 WWE

Right now it’s generic Cena...it’s a good thing he switched because god damn was he bland before the rapper gimmick. Don’t know if he would have made it. I think the rapper gimmick allowed Cena to get comfortable with performing then you got to see the natural charisma come out as a result of that. I’m not basing this off of anything other than watching him before the rapper gimmick. There just wasn’t a lot there that made him stand out

I've always heard that it was Stephanie who discovered his rapping while on a tour bus. Vine's reign of terror with giving gimmicks is in the mid 90s with the brilliant run of occupation gimmicks loosely tied to something in a person's past. I'm not a Cena fan by any stretch but rapper Cena was a good gimmick for him at the right time. Accentuated his positives (good natural charisma and talker if given structure) but kept him at the level his ability warranted.

 

[boredmale]

The lesson of course is to always be careful what you let Vince know about yourself because you never know where he will take it.

Does this mean Terry Taylor told Vince he likes KFC?

 

[JackSlater]

Does this mean Terry Taylor told Vince he likes KFC?

Yes, big mistake. Just like Mike Shaw shouldn't have told Vince that he liked eating. The story of the Red Rooster always amuses me because it seems like a slip up where Vince accidentally reveals his upbringing. How many people would think "rooster" when a someone is primarily described as arrogant or cocky?

 

[boredmale]

How many people would think "rooster" when a someone is primarily described as arrogant or cocky?

Not the first thing in my mind, but their always is the term "cock of the walk" which is a reference to a rooster(ie somebody who walks around all dominant thinking they are all that).

On a side note about the Red Rooster gimmick, it probably would have worked better as a heel gimmick, or even better start off as a face but do heel tactics and get the crowd against you so you can turn hell(see Honky Tonk Man)

 

[CDJ]

I've always heard that it was Stephanie who discovered his rapping while on a tour bus. Vine's reign of terror with giving gimmicks is in the mid 90s with the brilliant run of occupation gimmicks loosely tied to something in a person's past. I'm not a Cena fan by any stretch but rapper Cena was a good gimmick for him at the right time. Accentuated his positives (good natural charisma and talker if given structure) but kept him at the level his ability warranted.

Isaac Yankem DDS?

They started an all time great off as a dentist lol

 

[sabremike]

I've always heard that it was Stephanie who discovered his rapping while on a tour bus. Vine's reign of terror with giving gimmicks is in the mid 90s with the brilliant run of occupation gimmicks loosely tied to something in a person's past. I'm not a Cena fan by any stretch but rapper Cena was a good gimmick for him at the right time. Accentuated his positives (good natural charisma and talker if given structure) but kept him at the level his ability warranted.

One most people don't know: The Goon gimmick was originally designed for Chris Jericho.

 

[JackSlater]

One most people don't know: The Goon gimmick was originally designed for Chris Jericho.

I remember hearing I think Jericho talk about potentially ending up in a Goon gimmick. What's that pal? Your father played hockey? Hockey has fighting. Hockey is VIOLENT! It's like you're a ... a... a GOOOOOOOOON.

 

[CDJ]

I’m watching Michaels in his return match against Triple H at summerslam 2002


He’s such an incredible worker. Great match. Trips is bleeding A LOT

 

[HandsomeHollywood]

I’m watching Michaels in his return match against Triple H at summerslam 2002


He’s such an incredible worker. Great match. Trips is bleeding A LOT

A mind blowing match considering how long Michaels had been gone. At the time most were thinking he'd have an easy match to ease back in. It was insane.

 

[CDJ]

A mind blowing match considering how long Michaels had been gone. At the time most were thinking he'd have an easy match to ease back in. It was insane.

f***ing crazy in that context


Might be an unpopular opinion but this era of wrestling I’m watching is definitely my favorite. The late spring/summer of 2002 has been ridiculous- Benoit/Guerrero/Cena/Orton/Batista/Michaels/Mysterio/The Rock/Lesnar all either emerging or returning. Flair just returned as a wrestler. Edge is a face getting massive pops. The unamericans are around. Booker T and Goldust are creating the best comedy tag team of all time. 3 minute warning is f***ing up old ladies. Angle and Jericho are GOATS. Hogan was around. Kane’s teasing his return. Undertaker is the American badass. Truly a golden age.


And one of my all time favorites William Regal is on the roster.

 

[CDJ]

What kind of old school wrestling should I watch? I’m talking 80’s-90’s. What are y’alls favorite promotions and territories?

 

[koyvoo]

I’m a mark for SMW. Maybe hasn’t aged well but it was already old school in its own era. New Jack’s entire run there is mandatory viewing IMO.

 

[Ben Grimm]

I like the AWA, but the NWA has Flair vs The Dragon.

 

[CDJ]

I’m a mark for SMW. Maybe hasn’t aged well but it was already old school in its own era. New Jack’s entire run there is mandatory viewing IMO.

holy shit I didn’t realize they had so much on YouTube, I thought I’d only have access to the 10 matches or so on the network

 

[CDJ]

I like the AWA, but the NWA has Flair vs The Dragon.

I was looking into the AWA. I was also looking into mid-atlantic

 

[CDJ]

Just watched the rock put Lesnar over at summerslam 2002. That was a really high quality PPV

 

[JackSlater]

What kind of old school wrestling should I watch? I’m talking 80’s-90’s. What are y’alls favorite promotions and territories?

Late 80s NWA is a classic but early 90s WCW is very underrated with loads of talented wrestlers around. Mid-South and then UWF are pretty solid, particularly if you're picking and choosing what you want to see, with basically lots of tough guys taking part in angles that are not elaborate but are well executed. AWA when Hennig is still there is still an interesting promotion despite its reputation for being boring. A lot of really talented wrestlers started out in the AWA during its dying years.

I’m a mark for SMW. Maybe hasn’t aged well but it was already old school in its own era. New Jack’s entire run there is mandatory viewing IMO.

SMW is strangely old fashioned but also a few years ahead of its time in terms of storylines in some cases. You definitely get some crappy matches but there is a lot of good there too.

 

[CDJ]

Just watched 3 minute warning attack Jimmy Snuka then Jericho came out and put Snuka in the walls and cut an amazing promo

awesome to watch

he killed a lady

 

[HandsomeHollywood]

I would echo the recommendation for 1992 WCW. Great, underrated stuff.

That and 1997 WWF are easily my two favorite versions of wrestling.

 

[DaaaaB's]

I loved early 90s WCW. NWO era WCW was great for a couple years before the company went to shit. 80s Jim Crockett Promotions was pretty good from what I've seen, same with early/mid 80s WCCW out of Texas. WWE had a great run for about 10 years starting in 1997. ECW was great too imo but partly because it was so fresh at the time.

 

[CDJ]

Appreciate the recs everybody. There really is so much content ohh there to consume, looking forward to diving into a bunch of these to figure out what style/era I like the most

I’m 28 so the stuff I’m watching currently from 2002 is pure nostalgia for me, I was only 10 when I was watching at the time and could barely pick up on anything lol. So basically anything before that time is completely new territory to me. I know all the greats just from what I’ve been able to see on YouTube- basically my entire familiarity with greats like Jake Roberts and prime Piper and others from the 80s and 90s is from YouTube

 

[HandsomeHollywood]

Appreciate the recs everybody. There really is so much content ohh there to consume, looking forward to diving into a bunch of these to figure out what style/era I like the most

I’m 28 so the stuff I’m watching currently from 2002 is pure nostalgia for me, I was only 10 when I was watching at the time and could barely pick up on anything lol. So basically anything before that time is completely new territory to me. I know all the greats just from what I’ve been able to see on YouTube- basically my entire familiarity with greats like Jake Roberts and prime Piper and others from the 80s and 90s is from YouTube

It helps to pick a specific show or character to follow. For WCW I recommend just going through WCW Saturday Night.
For my second recommendation I would start around the time of November 1996 and follow the Bret/Austin story from Survivor Series-ish onward. Or you could follow from the fallout of WrestleMania 12 onward, that way you still get good Shawn Michaels matches along with some Vader, Mankind and Sycho Sid.

 

[Ben Grimm]