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Player Discussion Chris Kreider Part II: Manimal

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Edge said:
I agree, the Rangers have drafted in the upper tier since 2004 and they've picked in the top 10 twice.

Jessiman was a disaster - then and now. Had the Rangers taken Getzlaf, they look fantastic.

McIlrath will play in the NHL, though admitedly both then and now Tarasenko was the better pick.

So at worst, the Rangers missed the boat on being elite with two picks they should've made and a lot of people called for. But even throwing that out, they've done well in the face of tragedy (Cherepanov) and by working with less (no pick in the top 60 in four drafts).
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And this isn't including McIlrath, Buchnevich, Duclair, etc. Then you have Cherepanov and to a lesser extent Sauer.

Korpikowski was a 19th overall and has played nearly 500 games. That's fine.

Sanguinetti was 21st overall, that's not high at all.

Del Zotto was a very nice pick, I don't get that comment.

2011
JT Miller 140GP 45Pts

2010
Jesper Fast 93GP 21Pts

2009
Chris Kreider 195GP 97Pts

2008
Michael Del Zotto 406GP 164Pts
Derek Stepan 385GP 264Pts
Dale Weise 284GP 74Pts

2007
Carl Hagelin 292GP 137Pts

2006
Artem Anisimov 437GP 208Pts

2005
Marc Staal 566GP 140Pts
Mike Sauer 98GP 18Pts

2004
Lauri Korpikowski 487GP 164Pts
Brandon Dubinsky 564GP 331Pts
Ryan Callahan 572GP 327Pts
 
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Seems like every year we expect Kreider to score 25-30 and he always fails. He had a good season last year but maybe MSL being on his line helped him more than we thought?


The same 2-3 players can't carry us all season. Eventually Kreider will need to chip in somehow, he hasn't been good at all.
 
aufheben said:
And this isn't including McIlrath, Buchnevich, Duclair, etc. Then you have Cherepanov and to a lesser extent Sauer.

Korpikowski was a 19th overall and has played nearly 500 games. That's fine.

Sanguinetti was 21st overall, that's not high at all.

Del Zotto was a very nice pick, I don't get that comment.

2011
JT Miller 140GP 45Pts

2010
Jesper Fast 93GP 21Pts

2009
Chris Kreider 195GP 97Pts

2008
Michael Del Zotto 406GP 164Pts
Derek Stepan 385GP 264Pts
Dale Weise 284GP 74Pts

2007
Carl Hagelin 292GP 137Pts

2006
Artem Anisimov 437GP 208Pts

2005
Marc Staal 566GP 140Pts
Mike Sauer 98GP 18Pts

2004
Lauri Korpikowski 487GP 164Pts
Brandon Dubinsky 564GP 331Pts
Ryan Callahan 572GP 327Pts
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I agree and also tend to factor in asset management. That would include turning Werek into Lindberg, signing Hayes, signing Talbot, and signing Zucc.
 
The terrible part about all of this is that Kreider knows he's been underperforming. Very frustrating.
 
One of the stupidest things he's been doing lately is standing to the side of the opposing goalie instead of screening the goalie and getting in his sightlines.

Is Kreider letting the silly "goalie killer" reputation get into his head to the extent that he's scared of taking a GI penalty? If so, he needs to get over it. His effectiveness is limited if he refuses to the crash the crease or be an imposing net presence.
 
OverTheCap said:
One of the stupidest things he's been doing lately is standing to the side of the opposing goalie instead of screening the goalie and getting in his sightlines.

Is Kreider letting the silly "goalie killer" reputation get into his head to the extent that he's scared of taking a GI penalty? If so, he needs to get over it. His effectiveness is limited if he refuses to the crash the crease or be an imposing net presence.
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He should embrace the goalie killer stuff - its the only way hes going to be effective. Hes not a heady player and never will be. He'll become a better player through brawn.
 
Bleed Ranger Blue said:
He should embrace the goalie killer stuff - its the only way hes going to be effective. Hes not a heady player and never will be. He'll become a better player through brawn.
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Agreed. There are some players in the league who would either embrace that reputation or brush off any criticism and not let it affect their play. Every time Kreider is scrutinized for running a goaltender or being physical, he scales back his physical play. So long as he isn't seeking to intentionally harm anyone, he needs to retain that physicality instead of eliminating it from his game entirely.
 
OverTheCap said:
Agreed. There are some players in the league who would either embrace that reputation or brush off any criticism and not let it affect their play. Every time Kreider is scrutinized for running a goaltender or being physical, he scales back his physical play. So long as he isn't seeking to intentionally harm anyone, he needs to retain that physicality instead of eliminating it from his game entirely.
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I think you have an excellent point.

When he's got an edge to his game, frankly playing right on the line between clean and dirty, he's a far more effective player.

I'm not sure if that's how anyone saw Kreider at the NHL level, maybe he didn't even see himself that way. But it certainly seems to enhance his game and make him a far more dangerous player to the opposition.
 
Edge said:
I think you have an excellent point.

When he's got an edge to his game, frankly playing right on the line between clean and dirty, he's a far more effective player.

I'm not sure if that's how anyone saw Kreider at the NHL level, maybe he didn't even see himself that way. But it certainly seems to enhance his game and make him a far more dangerous player to the opposition.
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AV & Gorton need to step in

 
He's been trying to play outside of his strengths this year, and I think a large contributor to that is the constant rotation of RW's for his line. They need a guy to play with Kreider and Stepan who can let those two guys play their own game. If he can prove he can skate in the NHL, Buchnevich is really an optimal fit. Two guys on the wings who can push back the D, and Stepan who can use his patience to support them.
 
Trxjw said:
He's been trying to play outside of his strengths this year, and I think a large contributor to that is the constant rotation of RW's for his line. They need a guy to play with Kreider and Stepan who can let those two guys play their own game. If he can prove he can skate in the NHL, Buchnevich is really an optimal fit. Two guys on the wings who can push back the D, and Stepan who can use his patience to support them.
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Agreed. He looks pretty much nothing like the Kreider of the past two years and you'll have a hard time convincing me he all of a sudden forgot how to play hockey.
 
Edge said:
I can easily see 30-35 goal production from him. That's my fear with trading him, is that it slaps him in the face and motivates him. It'd suck to see him produce elsewhere.
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He has no hands, just great size, speed and a hard shot but with terrible form and aim. He's also a stupid hockey player. I don't think he will become some 30-35 goal guy anywhere.
 
Kreider just lacks motivation or skill to let him coast the way Nash can. Kreider can only be good if he is using his speed and size.
 
nevesis said:
He has no hands, just great size, speed and a hard shot but with terrible form and aim. He's also a stupid hockey player. I don't think he will become some 30-35 goal guy anywhere.
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Agree. Never saw that upside that other people did. He's a 20-25, 20-25 guy. Good top-6 winger, not much more
 
Trade him, send a message to JT and Hayes.

He's still valuable, move him out West for a good RHD or top 6 RW and bring Buch over ASAP.

I am starting to believe what you see is what you get with Kreider with a few exceptional games. It's a shame.
 
Ail said:
Trade him, send a message to JT and Hayes.

He's still valuable, move him out West for a good RHD or top 6 RW and bring Buch over ASAP.

I am starting to believe what you see is what you get with Kreider with a few exceptional games. It's a shame.
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Trading kreider to send a message to Just Turnovers is an awful idea
 
Ail said:
Trade him, send a message to JT and Hayes.

He's still valuable, move him out West for a good RHD or top 6 RW and bring Buch over ASAP.

I am starting to believe what you see is what you get with Kreider with a few exceptional games. It's a shame.
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I'd still keep him. But if he asks for a Saad deal, he's gone.
 
i have a feeling if we trade Kreider so early in his career we're going to be lamenting it for a loooooonnngggg time.
 
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