CHL can now play NCAA - change everything !

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Yeah no substance here at all, sounds like those 2 teams are super happy with staying in the USHL lol

"Famed sports litigator Jeffrey Kessler of Winston & Strawn confirmed to Sportico's Michael McCann and Scott Soshnick that he has been retained by the Youngstown Phantoms and another team from the USHL".

Report: USHL teams hire anti-trust lawyer in battle to join OHL

After being denied permission to join the OHL in December, it appears two USHL teams aren't going to go down without a fight.

www.sportsnet.ca

If they wanted to leave so bad, why commit in January to return to the league you can’t stand? That seems like an awfully stupid thing to do. Almost like that premise might’ve not been true.

I’m sure they considered it. They’d be stupid to outright dismiss what was pitched to him. Doesn’t mean it was ever close or their preference like OHL fans told us.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Pavel! You sir are to be commended for making all who use this medium aware of the nefarious plot by our eternal enemy to the north (I will not mention that dastardly nation's name) to undermine all that is pure and right within the organization we so proudly call USA HOCKEY!!!

I sincerely hope that you still maintain your hotline with our commander and chief Mike Trimboli and warn him of the dire situation we are in. The breadth and scope of this operation to forever place USA Hockey in a subordinate role is breathtaking in its scope and audacity! For all who may still be ignorant of our impending doom, please allow me to summarize what our hero, Pavel, has uncovered.

All the various scouting agencies have been co-opted, through what we believe to be the most effective propaganda campaign in history. It has been a true master class in its thorough success to have most of us believe that an unworthy non-American deserves to be ranked first over-all for the upcoming draft. To further sow confusion and doubt in our minds, the vast majority of the "ranked" players are foreign nationals!!!!!

Our esteemed tier 1 junior league has also been facing heavy pressure. OHL operatives have crafted a narrative that has us almost believing that two prominent franchises want to leave the warm embrace of the, as proudly and truthfully stated by the USHL, the best junior league in the world! So thorough is this deception that the hapless owners of both Muskegon and Youngstown inadvertently and as Pavel is finding out, unknowingly hired a high priced and famed litigator to explore the possibility of suing the league!!!!!!

Yes, yes I am well aware that many of you are saying this is to fantastical, unbelievable and plain insane. I say to you, however, TRUST IN PAVEL!!!!

I, humbly and with Pavel's blessings, state that the scouting agencies must once again place James Hagens as the prohibitive and undisputed number one ranked player for the upcoming draft! We also demand that Hagens be awarded 10 extra points as his PPG totals cannot be under players, who Pavel rightly claims were overrated, such as Celebrini and Fantili!!!! Furthermore, we demand that at least 12 American born players are placed in the first round, as the current low numbers are an insult to USA Hockey!

The OHL must immediately release the hostages, known as the Saginaw Spirit, Flint Firebirds and Erie Otters so that they may fulfill their express desire to join the premier junior league in the world! The OHL must then make full restitution to both Youngstown and Muskegon for damages done to their reputation and all legal expenses incurred!

We should demand the extradition of Jeff Marek, Elliot Freedman and Bob Mkenzie in order to be tried for agents of chaos and destruction that have subverted the wellbeing of USA Hockey!

Failure to meet these demands will be a call for....WAR!!!!!

Surprised you didn’t attempt to call me mentally ill again.

You were one of those that promised us these teams were leaving. Of course you lose big from this outcome, so you’ll explain it away as best you can with plenty of excuses.

Do you want to stick to your predictions about the OHL taking the best players from the USHL or you want to do an about face about that?

 

[Corso]

Surprised you didn’t attempt to call me mentally ill again.

Well......

But I've seen the light Pavel....onward to battle against our foes!!!

P A V E L P A V E L P A V E L .....shall be our rallying cry as we seek to bring the various ranking agencies to heel and re-instate St James Hagens to his rightful place in the pantheon of greats! With you at the helm, we shall re-appropriate the money the poor hapless owners of both Youngstown and Muskegon were forced to dish out to their legal counsel as the OHL attempted to mask their evil intentions of plucking two of our fair maidens from the USHL.

 

[4thline]

I think with the 05's you will see quite a few head to the NCAA in the offseason. But that will also be very dependent on what team they are on. On a projected contender where you'll get tons of exposure/points and impress someone, like the coach? Stay for an OA season. Stuck on a bottom feeder, hate the coach? Head for greener pastures. Overall the OA spot in the CHL is going to drop dramatically in quality. It won't be a guy who you're looking for 60-80 points out of anymore. It'll turn into a leadership/3rd line 40-50 pt type player.

Good post.

I also wonder how much the finances of education packages factor into it. Realistically most of these players will be 4 year NCAAers who won't see a dime of pro money,- scholarships will matter and a lot of them will only have 3 years of CHL service banked. A little quid pro quo lets the CHL keep their OA's and lets the NCAA worry a little less about financial incentives- unless it is/has been determined education packages can't go south.

 

[Wieters]

Well......

But I've seen the light Pavel....onward to battle against our foes!!!

P A V E L P A V E L P A V E L .....shall be our rallying cry as we seek to bring the various ranking agencies to heel and re-instate St James Hagens to his rightful place in the pantheon of greats! With you at the helm, we shall re-appropriate the money the poor hapless owners of both Youngstown and Muskegon were forced to dish out to their legal counsel as the OHL attempted to mask their evil intentions of plucking two of our fair maidens from the USHL.

Stick to the conjecture dressed up reporting and spare us all from the comedy routine.

 

[Corso]

Stick to the conjecture dressed up reporting and spare us all from the comedy routine.

So, you agree with Pavel that the latest rankings by CSB and Bob McKenzie are a plot to push forward Canadian dominance at the draft and that Hagens ought to clearly be seen as the prohibitive number one prospect?

You agree that both Muskegon's and Youngtown's attempt to join the OHL were just a smokescreen by that league in order to "unsettle" the USHL and that a prominent and expensive lawyer hired by both teams was really about nothing??

Well.......

WELCOME TO THE WAR WIETERS!!!!!!! With Pavel in command, we SHALL PREVAIL!!!!!!!

P A V E L P A V E L P A V E L P A V E L!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[bigdog16]

Some what surprised that more 05s have not made their intentions know. I'm assuming because most are waiting to see what spots and roles may be available for them the following season. It does stand to reason that the majority of the better ones, in time, will find their way into the D-1 ranks by their 20th birthday.

I was also made aware that O/A are paid more in stipends and are given other perks than the younger players, so this may have an impact on decisions made.

The bolded won’t sway anyone. Those “stipends” are enough to buy you a couple value meals at McDonalds.

 

[Corso]

The bolded won’t sway anyone. Those “stipends” are enough to buy you a couple value meals at McDonalds.

Less than 1000 a month....so yeah, we are not talking about a significant sum of money but there may be other "perks" like a paid apartment, use of a vehicle ect ect. Not sure if that would really sway most of them from a full ride at a D-1 school but it may persuade a couple of them to defer for a year.

 

[WarriorofTime]

It just makes geographic sense for those teams to go to the OHL. The USHL can just promote some new teams to the USHL. Remember the Indiana Ice? These teams can come and go.

Now the USHL has a full year to arrange for a replacement and those two can get ready to make their move into the OHL. It will all work out fine. It's just one dork who pretends to be an insider pretending USA Hockey is on the verge of collapse.

 

[Corso]

It just makes geographic sense for those teams to go to the OHL. The USHL can just promote some new teams to the USHL. Remember the Indiana Ice? These teams can come and go.

Now the USHL has a full year to arrange for a replacement and those two can get ready to make their move into the OHL. It will all work out fine. It's just one dork who pretends to be an insider pretending USA Hockey is on the verge of collapse.

Oh...who is the dork that predicted the collapse of the USHL??? Certainly you oh great WarriorofTime comic book loving guru can point that out....to this dork???

I'm not one to really rub posters face into their own arrogant ignorance but when

A. Both of those franchises are granted permission and acceptance into the OHL
B. The number of Americans in the CHL vastly increases
C. The CHL-NHL agreement changes
D. The majority of elite drafted prospects sign ELCs and bypass college
E. The USHL begins to resemble the NAHL and to some extent the BCHL and
F. People finally recognize the profound changes this rule change has brought

Then yeah, I'll sure be asking you and your little tinfoil hat wearing friend....what's up DICK!

 

[frontsfan67]

If they wanted to leave so bad, why commit in January to return to the league you can’t stand?

Read somewhere the players or teams have to pay a fee. Same reason why Youngstown and Muskegon won’t be in the OHL for 2025/26

 

[WarriorofTime]

I'm not one to really rub posters face

Man, all you've done is act immature, state your speculation as "fact", say you know the happenings across a multitude of leagues including specifics, contradict actual journalists and then shirk down when asked about your "sources", walk back and modify your statements where "all" become "most" and so on and so forth, because you're caught up in some border war hooey.

Let's make it clear, you are to date the one and only person that has made proclamations (stated often as fact) that the net result of this is that NCAA to NHL pathline dries up considerably and there will no longer be a high level of high draft picks playing NCAA Hockey because they will always sign their ELCs if they are in the CHL. That is by far the most outlandish prediction and one you have never provided a satisfactory answer for and why you always shirk back to "well some may still... but most". That yes, the net result of CHL to NCAA being open being that hardly anybody of note plays NCAA anymore, which is not a logical or intuitive thing since any notable NCAA players *always* could have played in CHL and signed an ELC.

Then yeah, I'll sure be asking you and your little tinfoil hat wearing friend....what's up DICK!

Are you 12?

 

[Corso]

Man, all you've done is act immature, state your speculation as "fact", say you know the happenings across a multitude of leagues including specifics, contradict actual journalists and then shirk down when asked about your "sources", walk back and modify your statements where "all" become "most" and so on and so forth, because you're caught up in some border war hooey.

Let's make it clear, you are to date the one and only person that has made proclamations (stated often as fact) that the net result of this is that NCAA to NHL pathline dries up considerably and there will no longer be a high level of high draft picks playing NCAA Hockey because they will always sign their ELCs if they are in the CHL. That is by far the most outlandish prediction and one you have never provided a satisfactory answer for and why you always shirk back to "well some may still... but most". That yes, the net result of CHL to NCAA being open being that hardly anybody of note plays NCAA anymore, which is not a logical or intuitive thing since any notable NCAA players *always* could have played in CHL and signed an ELC.


Are you 12?

Man up yourself, you want to make accusations then OK prove where I'm in error. What I said was that the majority of players will sign ELCs, not all players and of course this is speculation on my part based on what I hear, see and read. I never presented it as a FACT but rather a probable outcome of these changes.
Other than that, what else have I proclaimed as FACT that has you so butthurt?


Apologies to the rest of the posters who read this thread, I will no longer let those who know so little and offer even less distract me or derail this thread.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

Oh...who is the dork that predicted the collapse of the USHL??? Certainly you oh great WarriorofTime comic book loving guru can point that out....to this dork???

I'm not one to really rub posters face into their own arrogant ignorance but when

A. Both of those franchises are granted permission and acceptance into the OHL
B. The number of Americans in the CHL vastly increases
C. The CHL-NHL agreement changes
D. The majority of elite drafted prospects sign ELCs and bypass college
E. The USHL begins to resemble the NAHL and to some extent the BCHL and
F. People finally recognize the profound changes this rule change has brought

Then yeah, I'll sure be asking you and your little tinfoil hat wearing friend....what's up DICK!

What percentage? Are you just talking about Canadian CHLers or does this include those from the States who play in the CHL? Most kids down here will still want to play NCAA for programs like Minnesota, Michigan, Boston College, Boston University, Wisconsin, etc,

If 80%+ of elite Canadian CHLers bypasses the NCAA over the next 5 years, then I'll eat crow but I don't think it'll be that high.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Personally, I’m just rubbing it in the faces of some of the OHL fans. It’s in good fun because in arrogant fashion they told us that they would essentially be able to do whatever they want with taking USHL teams and players and there was nothing that the USHL could do and it was already decided.

If the OHL fans that proclaimed these things could just admit they got ahead of themselves and didn’t understand the process and underestimated the USHL unfairly, we could all just laugh about it.

 

[Kingpin794]

-You’ve been told Muskegon and Youngstown came to the OHL first. You just say that’s false and that the OHL is trying to participate in some sort of hockey imperialism.
-You’ve been told why more USHL players haven’t moved to the OHL yet when the BCHL is seeing a mass exit. You just say that’s false propaganda again.
-You’ve been told why any possible move by Muskegon and Youngstown was delayed and that them coming back for 25/26 does not indicate that they want to or will stay in the USHL in the future. Again you just say it’s noise and of no substance.

 

[Corso]

-You’ve been told Muskegon and Youngstown came to the OHL first. You just say that’s false and that the OHL is trying to participate in some sort of hockey imperialism.
-You’ve been told why more USHL players haven’t moved to the OHL yet when the BCHL is seeing a mass exit. You just say that’s false propaganda again.
-You’ve been told why any possible move by Muskegon and Youngstown was delayed and that them coming back for 25/26 does not indicate that they want to or will stay in the USHL in the future. Again you just say it’s noise and of no substance.

Don't bother, nothing will get through that tinfoil wrapped tightly around his head. We simply need to ignore him and others like him.

.

What percentage? Are you just talking about Canadian CHLers or does this include those from the States who play in the CHL? Most kids down here will still want to play NCAA for programs like Minnesota, Michigan, Boston College, Boston University, Wisconsin, etc,

If 80%+ of elite Canadian CHLers bypasses the NCAA over the next 5 years, then I'll eat crow but I don't think it'll be that high.

There was a reason why the prominent blueblood programs never wanted to grant eligibility to the CHL. The fear was that yes, most high end prospects would in time bypass the college route. Will this happen with absolute certainty? Of course no one can say right now but much will depend on the next CBA and the NHL-CHL agreement.

Now some here can speculate that these high end players haven't announced their commitments yet because they fear repercussion from their respective CHL club or do not want to upset the locker room vibe but do you really believe that? If Michael Misa is fully intending to go to B.U. (like that EP draft guy claimed before being debunked by people that are actually close to the program) he most likely would have announced it. What do you think Saginaw would do? Strip him of his captaincy? Bench him? Trade him? Sue him? What? The reality is that he has not committed to any program yet because he is waiting on the NHL draft and the potential of an ELC. Will he forgo the ELC to play one year of college? Well I wouldn't entirely discount the possibility but what do you honestly think? Do you believe that Mike McMahon was correct and there are currently 32 players in the NCAA right now earning 120k a year? Come on man, just go out and talk to anyone close to a college program and they will split their side over it when asked.

Now if a NHL team were to draft Misa and they explicitly state, hey we're not sure we want to sign you just yet or if we do you will be sent back to juniors, they yes I can see him saying that he's proved all he can in the OHL and will spend a year in college and then sign. Will a NHL team say that to a player of his stature though? Will he forgo that ELC in the belief that he will be given an NIL deal worth more than 100K? My bet, the team that drafts him will offer him a contract and he will sign right away.

Now I think you agree with me that the NHL-CHL agreement will change and that will allow those CHLers to play in the AHL. You don't think that will have an impact on any decisions? Add to the fact that the CHL does not want to become the new USHL and still considers itself as primarily a feeder to the pros, and you can begin to understand what direction they will push players.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

-You’ve been told Muskegon and Youngstown came to the OHL first. You just say that’s false and that the OHL is trying to participate in some sort of hockey imperialism.
-You’ve been told why more USHL players haven’t moved to the OHL yet when the BCHL is seeing a mass exit. You just say that’s false propaganda again.
-You’ve been told why any possible move by Muskegon and Youngstown was delayed and that them coming back for 25/26 does not indicate that they want to or will stay in the USHL in the future. Again you just say it’s noise and of no substance.

Why couldn't you quote my post? Funny you try to refer to me as a "little boy" and your actions are those of the child.

Essentially everything you suggested would happen didn't happen. All you're doing now is making excuses and blaming others. How about just admitting you got it wrong?

 

[Hockeyville USA]

Don't bother, nothing will get through that tinfoil wrapped tightly around his head. We simply need to ignore him and others like him.

.

There was a reason why the prominent blueblood programs never wanted to grant eligibility to the CHL. The fear was that yes, most high end prospects would in time bypass the college route. Will this happen with absolute certainty? Of course no one can say right now but much will depend on the next CBA and the NHL-CHL agreement.

Now some here can speculate that these high end players haven't announced their commitments yet because they fear repercussion from their respective CHL club or do not want to upset the locker room vibe but do you really believe that? If Michael Misa is fully intending to go to B.U. (like that EP draft guy claimed before being debunked by people that are actually close to the program) he most likely would have announced it. What do you think Saginaw would do? Strip him of his captaincy? Bench him? Trade him? Sue him? What? The reality is that he has not committed to any program yet because he is waiting on the NHL draft and the potential of an ELC. Will he forgo the ELC to play one year of college? Well I wouldn't entirely discount the possibility but what do you honestly think? Do you believe that Mike McMahon was correct and there are currently 32 players in the NCAA right now earning 120k a year? Come on man, just go out and talk to anyone close to a college program and they will split their side over it when asked.

Now if a NHL team were to draft Misa and they explicitly state, hey we're not sure we want to sign you just yet or if we do you will be sent back to juniors, they yes I can see him saying that he's proved all he can in the OHL and will spend a year in college and then sign. Will a NHL team say that to a player of his stature though? Will he forgo that ELC in the belief that he will be given an NIL deal worth more than 100K? My bet, the team that drafts him will offer him a contract and he will sign right away.

Now I think you agree with me that the NHL-CHL agreement will change and that will allow those CHLers to play in the AHL. You don't think that will have an impact on any decisions? Add to the fact that the CHL does not want to become the new USHL and still considers itself as primarily a feeder to the pros, and you can begin to understand what direction they will push players.

I still think most elite US prospects will go to the NCAA and a fair number of elite Canadian CHLers will go to the NCAA. Especially goalies and defense, who need more development time. The elite Canadian CHL forwards could go either way, depends what NHL teams want to do.

 

[Corso]

I still think most elite US prospects will go to the NCAA and a fair number of elite Canadian CHLers will go to the NCAA. Especially goalies and defense, who need more development time. The elite Canadian CHL forwards could go either way, depends what NHL teams want to do.

I agree with you about the goalies but the others, most likely not.

 

[WarriorofTime]

What percentage? Are you just talking about Canadian CHLers or does this include those from the States who play in the CHL? Most kids down here will still want to play NCAA for programs like Minnesota, Michigan, Boston College, Boston University, Wisconsin, etc,

If 80%+ of elite Canadian CHLers bypasses the NCAA over the next 5 years, then I'll eat crow but I don't think it'll be that high.

In two to three years the majority of the best American talent will be in the CHL....bookmark it!

the verbiage of "will be" makes me think it's not just talking about kids passing through when they're 17 and going into the NCAA when they're 18

There was a reason why the prominent blueblood programs never wanted to grant eligibility to the CHL. The fear was that yes, most high end prospects would in time bypass the college route.

This makes no sense, yet you say BOOKMARK it and that NCAA coaches "know" all the best players will play in the CHL?

More players bypassing NCAA entirely now that CHL players can play NCAA....

How many players on the 2029 United States U20 World Junior Ice Hockey Team (2009/10) births do you think will be playing CHL Hockey and how many do you think will be playing NCAA? Set an Over/Under.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

NCAA Commitments - Ontario Hockey League

The latest posts featuring NCAA Commitments from around the Ontario Hockey League (OHL)

chl.ca

NCAA Commitments - Western Hockey League

The latest posts featuring NCAA Commitments from around the Western Hockey League (WHL)

chl.ca

 

[wetcoast]

Approaching close to 70 O/A commitments now. My initial estimation was around 75 to 90 but it may be well over 100 by the time summer rolls around.

Yet another solid pick up by Bowling Green in Ty Higgins.....was ranked in the top 20 for all 04 born in N.A. (Juniors) by NZ.

Top 20 of what?

 

[Kingpin794]

Why couldn't you quote my post? Funny you try to refer to me as a "little boy" and your actions are those of the child.

Essentially everything you suggested would happen didn't happen. All you're doing now is making excuses and blaming others. How about just admitting you got it wrong?

Where in the world did I refer to you as a little boy?

I've used the pigeons pooping on the chessboard analogy. I've mentioned poe's law. I've said your believe in conspiracy theories. Never called you a little boy.

Nothing I've said is likely to happen can be evaluated yet. It's things that will be evaluated several years from now.

 

[OSA]

the CHL players chose the CHL route over the NCAA specifically because they wanted to focus mostly on Pro aspirations. The Pro contract is the quintessential achievement for these players.

16 of 17 players selected in the 1st Round from last year’s NHL draft who are currently in the CHL have signed their ELC. Only Cayden Lindstrom has not signed due to long-term injuries and a questionable playing future.

Things can always change, but I’d be very surprised if Misa, Martone, whoever forgoes signing their ELC (plus NHL training camp, plus exhibition games, plus possibility of regular season games) just to play a year of NCAA.