OT: Career advice Part II

[CasusBelli]

So you bullshitted your way through?

Economies of scale, economies of scope, EBITDA and IRR. Because MBA LoLz. Black Scholes and Monte Carlo are for nerdz!

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Economies of scale, economies of scope, EBITDA and IRR. Because MBA LoLz. Black Scholes and Monte Carlo are for nerdz!

I don't think I've even heard of economies of scope. I also have never used any of those things in my interviews. Were those technical questions you brought that stuff up for?

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Also, we learned both Black Scholes and Monte Carlo in my MBA. Maybe Carnegie Mellon MBAs are bigger nerds than most.

 

[CasusBelli]

Also, we learned both Black Scholes and Monte Carlo in my MBA. Maybe Carnegie Mellon MBAs are bigger nerds than most.

Considering CM is known primarily for its engineering program, I would say so haha.

 

[CasusBelli]

I don't think I've even heard of economies of scope. I also have never used any of those things in my interviews. Were those technical questions you brought that stuff up for?

Brought up. EBITDA and IRR especially. Those pricks worship at the altar of DCF despite everything that’s wrong with it.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Considering CM is known primarily for its engineering program, I would say so haha.

Yeah, Tepper to a fault markets themselves as quant heavy, which it is. But I feel like as a result we don't get as many executives and CEOs as other schools.

 

[CasusBelli]

Yeah, Tepper to a fault markets themselves as quant heavy, which it is. But I feel like as a result we don't get ass many executives and CEOs as other schools.

Depends what you want to do. Quant traders and PMs are the future. For the first time, I’ve seen some market risk guys start to out-earn some traders. It’s bizarre — but, when you think about it, perhaps understandable.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Brought up. EBITDA and IRR especially. Those pricks worship at the altar of DCF despite everything that’s wrong with it.

Yeah, isn't that all banking is? I feel like quants are at a different level than bankers. Bankers are smart compared to the average person who doesn't know math and is bad with numbers but there's just so much more. I'm closer to a banker than a quant, haha.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Depends what you want to do. Quant traders and PMs are the future. For the first time, I’ve seen some market risk guys start to out-earn some traders. It’s bizarre — but, when you think about it, perhaps understandable.

This may be minor but shows the mindset. I remember looking at some businessweek ranking of schools and all of the top schools had a video and in the video they'd talk about the fun aspect of going to school there. CMU Tepper was the only school that was all "hey guys we're good at quant".

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

So I'm very frustrated. I interviewed with a company that does something very similar to what my current company does (subprime loans). The process was like this:

1) Phone screen that last a little more than 5 minutes

2) Interview with the hiring manager, which was more or less a regular interview, but was very chill. In the end he did something no one else did and gave me feedback and told me that he's putting me through to the next round but that the two colleagues that I'll talk to I should not get in the weeds of what I do because I lost him.

3) I spoke with two people on the hiring manager's level and both were 80% me asking them questions. They asked me a couple of softballs and then asked "what questions do you have for me?" I thought the questions were good and I made a point of showing that I have transferable experience and that I did my research on the company. So I thought I did well. One of the guys when he heard I had a marketing background almost started selling on a role on HIS team that involves marketing.

Two weeks later I got rejected. I have no idea why. I thought I did as well as I could.

I'll chime in. I've been the hiring manager for job interviews and sometimes there are just more suitable candidiates than positions to fill. Personally, I always like to get back to the ones who barely missed out and the hiring manager giving you feedback is a good sign.

You can't get them all. Job interviews are a gamble and you never know how many you are up against. One job I interviewed 35 people and 8 or 9 were on my list to hire. I had to pick one. Getting a rejection doesn't always mean you did something wrong.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I'll chime in. I've been the hiring manager for job interviews and sometimes there are just more suitable candidiates than positions to fill. Personally, I always like to get back to the ones who barely missed out and the hiring manager giving you feedback is a good sign.

You can't get them all. Job interviews are a gamble and you never know how many you are up against. One job I interviewed 35 people and 8 or 9 were on my list to hire. I had to pick one. Getting a rejection doesn't always mean you did something wrong.

Thanks, same thing the other recruiter told me.

 

[LokiDog]

I'll chime in. I've been the hiring manager for job interviews and sometimes there are just more suitable candidiates than positions to fill. Personally, I always like to get back to the ones who barely missed out and the hiring manager giving you feedback is a good sign.

You can't get them all. Job interviews are a gamble and you never know how many you are up against. One job I interviewed 35 people and 8 or 9 were on my list to hire. I had to pick one. Getting a rejection doesn't always mean you did something wrong.

Tell your company in Dublin to hire a swell new UX/UI guy for their site.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Just had an interview. A little more nerves than some other interviews and had an awkward moment in the end but I'd say it was a good B+/A- interview. Really cool company that I'd love to work for.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Tell your company in Dublin to hire a swell new UX/UI guy for their site.

How much could you make in UX/UI? When I was in tech it seemed like a really cool role.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

How much could you make in UX/UI? When I was in tech it seemed like a really cool role.

Depends on the market and your leverage during negotiations to be honest. Ireland is the 3rd country I work and live in, in the last 4 years and it's amazing to see the differences in job markets and how it relates to pay. I was involved in interview loops for London (England), Helsinki (Finland), Zurich, Geneva (Switzerland) and Stockholm (Sweden) and the differences for the same jobs are huge, up to 50% sometimes.

 

[LokiDog]

How much could you make in UX/UI? When I was in tech it seemed like a really cool role.

As a mid level designer, 80-95k is pretty average. As a senior designer you should break 100k, directors and strategists can earn 140-200k depending on the size of the company they’re a director at. At least that’s down here near Austin, and out in Silicon Valley, where I’ve been directing most of my applications.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Depends on the market and your leverage during negotiations to be honest. Ireland is the 3rd country I work and live in, in the last 4 years and it's amazing to see the differences in job markets and how it relates to pay. I was involved in interview loops for London (England), Helsinki (Finland), Zurich, Geneva (Switzerland) and Stockholm (Sweden) and the differences for the same jobs are huge, up to 50% sometimes.

I've been interviewing for FP&A analyst and senior analyst roles for 9 months and they have ranged from 60k-130k, it's insane.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

As a mid level designer, 80-95k is pretty average. As a senior designer you should break 100k, directors and strategists can earn 140-200k depending on the size of the company they’re a director at.

Interesting, seems similar to financial analyst roles I'm interviewing for.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

I've been interviewing for FP&A analyst and senior analyst roles for 9 months and they have ranged from 60k-130k, it's insane.

Yeah, and that's where age/leverage comes into play. Let's take that range and look at 3 candidates assuming all 3 are good fits:

Candidate A is 24 years old, single, lives with his parents and currently makes 40k a year. Single life, spends weekends with his buddies. A good hire but young and inexperienced.

Offer: 70k

Candidate B is 47 years old, wife, 2 kids, mortgage, and he comes off a job where he was paid 95k a year. You have to sweeten the pot to make it worth it for that candidate.

Offer: 115k

Candidate C is 35 years old, just got engaged and has an apartment he shares with his fiancée. He has more relevant experience in the subject matter at hand than Candidate B. More likely to put in some extra hours considering his situation.

Offer: 140k

3 candidates who could do the job, on paper. But their background, current living situation, current expenses and pay all factor into how companies value them as candidates. I had an applicant give a salary indication and we offered him 20k more because that was market value. He couldn't believe it. He asked me if it was a mistake. It all factors in. If he came off a better paying job, the offer would have been even higher because you are "poaching" them, so to speak.

 

[will1066]

Yeah, and that's where age/leverage comes into play. Let's take that range and look at 3 candidates assuming all 3 are good fits:

Candidate A is 24 years old, single, lives with his parents and currently makes 40k a year. Single life, spends weekends with his buddies. A good hire but young and inexperienced.

Offer: 70k

Candidate B is 47 years old, wife, 2 kids, mortgage, and he comes off a job where he was paid 95k a year. You have to sweeten the pot to make it worth it for that candidate.

Offer: 115k

Candidate C is 35 years old, just got engaged and has an apartment he shares with his fiancée. He has more relevant experience in the subject matter at hand than Candidate B. More likely to put in some extra hours considering his situation.

Offer: 140k

3 candidates who could do the job, on paper. But their background, current living situation, current expenses and pay all factor into how companies value them as candidates. I had an applicant give a salary indication and we offered him 20k more because that was market value. He couldn't believe it. He asked me if it was a mistake. It all factors in. If he came off a better paying job, the offer would have been even higher because you are "poaching" them, so to speak.

You're the best hiring manager ever.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

And I got rejected by one of the four companies already. So 1 down 3 to go. If I don't get one of these 4 I'll be really upset. This one I was least interested in though.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

You're the best hiring manager ever.

Well, I always try to give feedback to the ones I don't hire. The last thing I want is for someone to be wondering what they did wrong. Why not tell them what to focus on?

It helped me in the past. I hope it helps others moving forward. It's like giving to charity. It's the little things that matter.

Re: offers etc. Those are usually determined by HR, not by the hiring manager. But they look at those factors. It's almost like a meat market.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Well, I always try to give feedback to the ones I don't hire. The last thing I want is for someone to be wondering what they did wrong. Why not tell them what to focus on?

It helped me in the past. I hope it helps others moving forward. It's like giving to charity. It's the little things that matter.

Re: offers etc. Those are usually determined by HR, not by the hiring manager. But they look at those factors. It's almost like a meat market.

To be fair in the US some companies (I know Amazon is one) have policies to not give feedback to not get sued.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

To be fair in the US some companies (I know Amazon is one) have policies to not give feedback to not get sued.

Yeah, we don't have those laws overhere. It's more liberal

 

[Filip Chytil]

Depends what you want to do. Quant traders and PMs are the future. For the first time, I’ve seen some market risk guys start to out-earn some traders. It’s bizarre — but, when you think about it, perhaps understandable.

Do most quant traders have masters/PhDs? Or is that more for quant research?