Speculation: Caps Roster General Discussion (Coaching/FAs/Cap/Lines/etc) | 2023-24 Regular Season Edition

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Holtbyisms

Matt Irwin is a legit talent
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I don't see why. Sandin is 4.6 for the forseable future and they've got what, one or two more years with Fehervary at 2.7. I don't see why you'd want to bump either of them to the third pair. If they look defense, they need RD.
Sandin is a third pairing defender on a playoff team. Unfortunately we got had in that trade and then doubled down by extending him long term. As the deal ages it'll look less bad with the cap jumping and our inevitable cap space but Chychrun is in an entire different atmosphere than Sandin. The only reason I wouldn't be willing to part with a significant asset for him is the constant injuries. We've got to find a new PP QB before JC74 retires and Sandin most certainly isn't it or we're in deep trouble.
 
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usiel

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I'd be all over Rutger Hauer if I were Washington. He's ready to step into the NHL and projects to be a strong player with a good potential to be a star according to NHLe.

What would Winnipeg want in return?
tumblr_pq257hbUVS1qj6sk2o2_500.gif
 
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IafrateOvie34

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I'd be all over Rutger Hauer if I were Washington. He's ready to step into the NHL and projects to be a strong player with a good potential to be a star according to NHLe.

What would Winnipeg want in return?

It would be a nice pickup for the right price. RIP Rutger Hauer. He was a legend.
 
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Brian23

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Sandin is a third pairing defender on a playoff team. Unfortunately we got had in that trade and then doubled down by extending him long term. As the deal ages it'll look less bad with the cap jumping and our inevitable cap space but Chychrun is in an entire different atmosphere than Sandin. The only reason I wouldn't be willing to part with a significant asset for him is the constant injuries. We've got to find a new PP QB before JC74 retires and Sandin most certainly isn't it or we're in deep trouble.
Ok Nostradamus.
 

Holtbyisms

Matt Irwin is a legit talent
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Ok Nostradamus.
:rolleyes: Let's not pretend Sandin is just getting his feet wet, he's got 227 NHL games under his belt already and has played 6 professional seasons. He's already shown his cards. I don't hate the player, just disappointed we gave away a 1st round pick in a deep draft for a third pairing puck mover. He's not big enough to play physical, he's not fast enough to be a game breaker and his offensive skill lacks enough talent to run a dangerous PP. He's unfortunately a bottom 4 tweener. Can get by on the second pairing but leaves you wanting more there. Fits in nice on a third pairing with a physical defense first partner. He is what he is.
 

pman25

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Sandin is 2LD with the potential to be a fringe 1LD. Not sure where this bottom pairing narrative came from but it’s not true.
Hmmm no, he’s definitely middle pair or bottom pair. Nothing wrong with that. I’d have no issues simply pushing Sandin or Fehervary down to bottom pair if it meant a very clear upgrade coming in

I like both but I’m definitely not seeing either as a top pair 1LD.
 

Lindemann

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“Friedman on 32TP: "Someone told me too that Washington is not done, I think Washington is going to be very busy...I heard there is more coming there"
 

AlexBrovechkin8

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Hmmm no, he’s definitely middle pair or bottom pair. Nothing wrong with that. I’d have no issues simply pushing Sandin or Fehervary down to bottom pair if it meant a very clear upgrade coming in

I like both but I’m definitely not seeing either as a top pair 1LD.
Sandin is not a bottom pair defenseman. It doesn’t fit his skill set or talent level. We’ll agree to disagree on this.
 

MW6

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I honestly wouldn’t mind taking a buy-low approach on the recent high drafted Finns. I know, Caps and Finns.. but this is getting ridiculous..

Laine (2nd OA 2016), Kotkaniemi (3rd OA 2018) and Kakko (2nd OA 2019). Who all of of them could be had for Pennie’s on the dollar.

I mean, there’s so so much upside if they find an environment they’re comfortable in. My experience with Finish people (I’m Swedish) is that they’re a little introverted and drawn to their own and if they don’t have allies they can tend to isolate themselves and it can become a little destructive.
By getting them all, with similar struggles of living up to expectations and maybe adding a staff member with a degree in sports psychology and experience with Finnish athletes the Caps could potentially short track their route to contender status.
I believe in Carberry’s ability to get through to young players and the worst case scenario is they’ll suck for a few more years, collecting high draft picks while running out their contracts. Best case, well.. then they’ll have a top-9 with 6 former top-3 OA. And yes, draft pedigree is not all. But he skill is undeniable.

Ovechkin-Strome-Kakko
Laine-Dubois-Wilson
Milano-Kotkaniemi-Protas

With Miro, Leonard, Lapierre and McMichael to add when good enough/or use in a trade.

It’s a major gamble though, but it’s not Erat for Forsberg.

(Edited the sentence about the youngn’s)
To keep pushing this agenda. If Dubois is the big move, it’s a hit-or-miss. If it’s a hit, Caps upgraded substantially at no cost. If it’s a miss it’ll hamper Caps chances for the next 8 years in some capacity (low effort, cap hell, buyout or pay someone to take him in a trade). It’s either or, right? You gotta be right 100% to win.

But if you bet on 4 recent top-3 picks (like in my scenario and 1 or 2 pan out (50%), there’s suddenly a great foundation to build your new core around. If 3 or all 4 of them hits their heights, it’s closer to a dynasty (If they can get a balanced squad around them).

So, since they’ve already put their chips on the table, they might as well play high stakes. If they lose its bottom dweller and high picks, if they win it’s looking really bright in the district.

Now I need your help to find that buy low D-man with upside? Nurse maybe, with some retention at, say 2M? Edmonton have Draisaitl and Bouchard needing new contracts. Nurse is 29 though.
 

Misery74

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I honestly wouldn’t mind taking a buy-low approach on the recent high drafted Finns. I know, Caps and Finns.. but this is getting ridiculous..

Laine (2nd OA 2016), Kotkaniemi (3rd OA 2018) and Kakko (2nd OA 2019). Who all of of them could be had for Pennie’s on the dollar.

I mean, there’s so so much upside if they find an environment they’re comfortable in. My experience with Finish people (I’m Swedish) is that they’re a little introverted and drawn to their own and if they don’t have allies they can tend to isolate themselves and it can become a little destructive.
By getting them all, with similar struggles of living up to expectations and maybe adding a staff member with a degree in sports psychology and experience with Finnish athletes the Caps could potentially short track their route to contender status.
I believe in Carberry’s ability to get through to young players and the worst case scenario is they’ll suck for a few more years, collecting high draft picks while running out their contracts. Best case, well.. then they’ll have a top-9 with 6 former top-3 OA. And yes, draft pedigree is not all. But he skill is undeniable.

Ovechkin-Strome-Kakko
Laine-Dubois-Wilson
Milano-Kotkaniemi-Protas

With Miro, Leonard, Lapierre and McMichael add/use in a trade.

It’s a major gamble though, but it’s not Erat for Forsberg.
Yeah, how I see it;

Leonard>>Laine
Miro>Kakko
Lapierre>>>>>Kotkaniemi

All these guys are/will be ELCs. Their value is incredible to the team. Two, or all three of these players could be very special. Laine has been good in the past, but some nice acquiring

I do think taking a flyer on a Kakko makes sense for the right price.

Also, trading McMichael for goal scoring or defense makes sense.
 

Todd Lazarchick

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“Friedman on 32TP: "Someone told me too that Washington is not done, I think Washington is going to be very busy...I heard there is more coming there"
I’ll believe that when I see it
 
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Hivemind

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No intention to dump on posters - virtually every article in the last 5 years or so ranking NHL prospect pools or assessing the Caps future by guys that were paid to know had the Caps ranked in the bottom 10. That’s what I was aiming at.

Again and again you see this (dare I say it) hive mind among hockey writers where they all reach the same conclusion about a player, a team, an organization, a team’s prospect pool - and reinforce each other, and nobody ever has to be accountable for the gang mentality being wrong. It’s a happy accident in the case of the Caps prospects, and here’s hoping it’s the same re. PLD.
Fair enough, I'll take your word that your intention wasn't to dunk on posters.

But I don't think the "hockey hive mind" was wrong about the Caps prospects. A low rating isn't the same as saying that "none of these guys will be NHL players." The low rating is simply because of a lack of top end talent in the caps prospect pool. Churning out depth role players isn't a distinguishing factor. No offense to guys like Protas, but every team in the league has their own version of Protas. Not literally in terms of the exact player, but in terms of overall quality. Everyone has a 23ish year old who's breaking into the NHL and looks like a solid role player. New Jersey just traded their D version of Protas (Kevin Bahl) to Calgary. Continuing to look around the division you got guys like Simon Holmstrom (NYI), Cam York and Yegor Zamula (PHI), Jack Drury and Kotkaniemi (CAR), plus Braden Schneider and Will Cuylle (NYR). And that's not even starting on the guys with higher upside like Necas, Jarvis, Svechnikov (all 24 or younger for CAR), Farabee, Tippett, Drysdale, and Frost (all 25 or younger for PHI), PO Joseph (PIT), Noah Dobson (NYI), and the ridiculous collections of young guys for the Rangers (Laf, Kakko, Chytil, Miller) and Devils (Hughes x2, Hischier, Nemec). These guys aren't prospects anymore, but they were during the time period in which the Capitals' system was rated poorly. These teams not only had their own version of a Protas, but most of them had their own version of a McMichael (23 year old establishing themselves in a top 6/top4 role), often better, and often multiple of them. Just looking through our division, it's easy to see why Washington and Pittsburgh's prospect pools were ranked at the bottom of our division. It's simply a lack of blue chip options.

Now the Capitals prospect pool is beginning to rise, and we finally have a blue chip again with Leonard, plus another two guys with arguments to try and crack the Top 50 with Lapierre and Cristall. But, simply put, there's still a bunch of other teams that have more top end talent in their pipeline than the Capitals. The turnover of prospects into NHL players this year had a lot more to do with getting a coach who would actually trust youth and opening up roster spots for them than it did with a strong prospect pool. And it's going to take both more of that, and more infusions of young talent to raise the Capitals prospect rankings. The AHL playoff scoring race isn't a real barometer of future NHL success, both because of the role of veterans/career AHL guys on the Bears' success, but also simply because Hershey has played more games than any other AHL playoff team. Is Lapierre's success really more impressive than, say, Mavrik's Bourque's 11 points in 7 games for the Texas Stars? Or David Jiricek's 11 points in 14 games as a D man for Cleveland? Both of those guys' big playoff runs are part of why they will continue to be ranked ahead of Lapierre in most scout's minds.
 
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ArmadilloThumb

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Also, trading McMichael for goal scoring or defense makes sense.

Strongly disagree. He has a history of later development at each level. He was a COVID period transition to pro. He was mismanaged by Lavi. And through all that he emerged as a responsible two-way C that scored 18 goals last year.

I'm convinced he can become a 25 - 30 goal a year guy for his prime years with maybe a couple of 30+ seasons sprinkled in.

I suggest we consider offering any of Jensen/TvR/Dowd, this years 1st or next year's 1st before moving someone who many do believe has a much higher ceiling that what seems to approach Groupthink about moving him.

I guess we may see soon which side of this debate GMBM is on. Maybe he's moved or maybe he gets a deal like Protas but for more AVV.
 

MW6

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Yeah, how I see it;

Leonard>>Laine
Miro>Kakko
Lapierre>>>>>Kotkaniemi

All these guys are/will be ELCs. Their value is incredible to the team. Two, or all three of these players could be very special. Laine has been good in the past, but some nice acquiring

I do think taking a flyer on a Kakko makes sense for the right price.

Also, trading McMichael for goal scoring or defense makes sense.
In two years when Ovie retires

Miro-Strome-Kakko
Laine-Dubois-Wilson
Lapierre/McMichael-Kotkaniemi-Leonard
Malenstyn-Protas-Sutter

That’s 22-23M€ for all 4 centermen where Strome has the shortest term. One of HL/CM is moved in a package for a D.
 

ArmadilloThumb

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Now I need your help to find that buy low D-man with upside? Nurse maybe, with some retention at, say 2M? Edmonton have Draisaitl and Bouchard needing new contracts. Nurse is 29 though.

I'd prefer Montour for someone at that age. Would only cost money - Nurse or similar costs assets + money.

I know the hockey world are down on the Panthers right now but boy did Montour make a fantastic end-to-end run with the puck and put it off the post last night. Just beautiful. I like his aggressive approach (even though the Cats are very confused right now).

I agree we want to do something significant on D. It will be interesting how the Draft goes. Maybe we load up on D in the first three rounds and then that might provide some good replacements in 3 or 4 years as JC and a Montour/Other age out
 

ArmadilloThumb

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In two years when Ovie retires

If the development goes as i expect I'd envision something like:

Miroshnichenko - PLD - Leonard
Lappy - Strome - Wilson
Cristall/Suzdalev - CMM - Funk/other
Beck - Protas - Trineyev

With the Cristall/Suzdalev/Funk options as the most uncertain and possibly the best slots for upgrades.

In a year or two we may see good development from Cristall/Suzdalev/Funk who may make good trade chips for upgrades.

Also I know people jumped on me about moving some of the above to the wing but Carbs may experiment and any of PLD, Strome, and Lappy might be part of that - IF (and only) it further improves their play.

Carbs may experiment is the takeaway, and GMBM may be on-board with trying that first before just jettisoning talent with potential for further upside.
 
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hockeykicker

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After acquiring Pierre-Luc Dubois from the Los Angeles Kings on Wednesday, general manager Brian MacLellan is expected to be “very busy” moving forward according to Sportsnet’s Elliotte Friedman.

“Someone told me too that Washington is not done,” Friedman said on Saturday’s episode of the 32 Thoughts Podcast. “I think Washington is going to be very busy. I heard there is more coming there.”

 

CapitalsCupReality

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Strongly disagree. He has a history of later development at each level. He was a COVID period transition to pro. He was mismanaged by Lavi. And through all that he emerged as a responsible two-way C that scored 18 goals last year.

I'm convinced he can become a 25 - 30 goal a year guy for his prime years with maybe a couple of 30+ seasons sprinkled in.

I suggest we consider offering any of Jensen/TvR/Dowd, this years 1st or next year's 1st before moving someone who many do believe has a much higher ceiling that what seems to approach Groupthink about moving him.

I guess we may see soon which side of this debate GMBM is on. Maybe he's moved or maybe he gets a deal like Protas but for more AVV.
He wasn’t mismanaged….he just wasn’t good enough…he’s since improved with patient development.


You have to give to get…..CMM should not be untouchable in a trade for a top end talent. That is massively overvaluing him.

The more interesting idea is trading Lappy, who every team the Caps are looking to deal with SHOULD be asking for over CMM.
 
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