Speculation: Caps General Discussion (Coaching/FAs/Cap/Lines etc) - 2020 Offseason Pt. 3

[tenken00]

Another thing to add is that with this shortened season (and getting shorter by the week), the Trade Deadline might only be a month and a half or so in - in a 3 month season. With this whole new Canadian teams may no longer be able to play inside Canadian borders thing, the January 13th opener seems to be very much in doubt.

At the very least its going to take some time to negotiate with the Canadian/Provincial governments - and that's before they can even hammer out the details such as scheduling and format.

 

[OV Rocks]

I was on-board with Howard before Hank became available and I still am. Last year was awful, no doubt about that, but I am of the mindset that even if Carey Price was in net I don't think he would even get them 10 wins. That team was awful.

His numbers have always been pretty solid, arguably on par with Holtby so I think in a limited role, behind a great team, with something to prove, Howard would be an above average back up goalie here, which at this point is about all we can ask for.

I am forever going to live with my take...the Caps should have traded Holtby right after they won the cup and extended Grubauer.

Trade Holtby for a high first or an impact player, sign Grubauer to 3-4 years like he got, and then you switch to Samsonov down the road, and trade Grubauer for good parts as well. I said it right after they won the cup and I still believe that was the best path for the team that they did not take.

 

[The Instigator]

I like Me

 

[pman25]

Jimmy Howard was so bad in Detroit last season. Bernier played on the same team and out up some respectable numbers. If anything, Howard would probably make the team worse.

there are no options available that are more appealing than Vanecek/Copley. Just old likely injured vets / career ahlers types. We could match or exceed that type of production with guys already on the squad

 

[kicksavedave]

5 times in 34 years says it can be done. I could be wrong about Roy but its possible that not one of the five were the goalie plan for that season. At least 3 of them were back ups and Binnington wasnt even thought of as an NHL player. It can be done and has worked as an emergency in the past.

The Caps have tried this before. Varly was a rookie twice. Neuvirth. Holtby. With Ovechkin years burning I would rather not trust the net on a cup contender to a crap shoot.

No one would prefer that. Not even GMBM. No one suggested it should have been the plan or even is the plan. GMBM tried to secure a solid veteran backup and did so at a great price. Sometimes things don't work out like we planned. Only Melkor predicted that the previously ironman Lundquist would have a heart condition.

Right now the only question to be asked is, is Jimmy Howard or some other end of the road vet going to be a better option than VV.

One thing I'm not seeing thrown out is the idea of trading for a Marc Andre Fleury. He's a little like Jim Craig in the sense that, when he's on, he's unbeatable. He's no guarantee, but no one who is available is, and he might be available for a reasonable trade price.

 

[kicksavedave]

Goalies are overrated.

You should be banned from HFBoards for life for saying this. If I were a mod I'd do it myself!

 

[Ridley Simon]

No one would prefer that. Not even GMBM. No one suggested it should have been the plan or even is the plan. GMBM tried to secure a solid veteran backup and did so at a great price. Sometimes things don't work out like we planned. Only Melkor predicted that the previously ironman Lundquist would have a heart condition.

Right now the only question to be asked is, is Jimmy Howard or some other end of the road vet going to be a better option than VV.

One thing I'm not seeing thrown out is the idea of trading for a Marc Andre Fleury. He's a little like Jim Craig in the sense that, when he's on, he's unbeatable. He's no guarantee, but no one who is available is, and he might be available for a reasonable trade price.

Not sure how they could possibly absorb his 7m salary. Even at 50% retained it would be very hard. Would need to send someone like Jensen the other way and LTIR Hank (which they will do anyway.

Fleury at 50% retained probably would cost an awful lot as well in trade.

I mean, it would be nuts to see him as a Capital and it would be fun to see Shittsburgh fan head explode, but I dunno —

maybe?

 

[kicksavedave]

Not sure how they could possibly absorb his 7m salary. Even at 50% retained it would be very hard. Would need to send someone like Jensen the other way and LTIR Hank (which they will do anyway.

Fleury at 50% retained probably would cost an awful lot as well in trade.

I mean, it would be nuts to see him as a Capital and it would be fun to see Shittsburgh fan head explode, but I dunno —

maybe?

I'm not the Cap guru, but I would like to believe GMBM can make something work if he saw fit. $7M is MAF's 80 game salary, right? They expect to play what, 40 or 50 games, so its already pro rated, no? Sending Jensen would make sense, he's a 7th D right now anyway, no?

It would be fun to see Pens fans melt down, but more importantly, he's a solid veteran who's wheels haven't fallen off entirely and who, if he gets hot at the right time, can carry a team all the way.

He's also just as likely to be this guy:

 

[Hivemind]

I was on-board with Howard before Hank became available and I still am. Last year was awful, no doubt about that, but I am of the mindset that even if Carey Price was in net I don't think he would even get them 10 wins. That team was awful.

His numbers have always been pretty solid, arguably on par with Holtby so I think in a limited role, behind a great team, with something to prove, Howard would be an above average back up goalie here, which at this point is about all we can ask for.

This wasn't just his team being bad, Howard is awful now. He was already in decline prior to last year, but he was legitimately the worst goalie with more than a handful of appearances last year.

 

[Melkor]

You should be banned from HFBoards for life for saying this. If I were a mod I'd do it myself!

Goalies are overrated, my guy. Deal with it.

 

[txpd]

Problem being that teams for this upcoming season are talking about running with 3 goalies are we going to even have options if Sammy falters. At the Trade Deadline I'm willing to bet that goalies aren't moved at all this year and if so only for a premium.

What I heard was that 3 goalies were going to be manditory with the expanded rosters

 

[txpd]

Craig Anderson would be my choice if we go the FA route, followed by Howard. Miller supposedly wants to stay out west.

I spent a good bit of time over a 3 day weekend with him and did not get the feeling he was planning on playing anymore.

 

[txpd]

Problem being that teams for this upcoming season are talking about running with 3 goalies are we going to even have options if Sammy falters. At the Trade Deadline I'm willing to bet that goalies aren't moved at all this year and if so only for a premium.

Realistically speaking if the Caps win the cup this year it will be because Samsonov is a stud and shows it right away. The short season and the reduced travel baseball series style schedule I am hearing about means that he wont be gassed by the playoffs like a typical rookie skater or young first time starter.

The reality still is that you are asking a kid with 20 NHL games, an injury since he played last and no playoff experience to carry the load on Alex Ovechkin's cup contender team with a new coach. The pressure is going to be nuts. Lundqvist just provided a little bit of legit support.

 

[kicksavedave]

Goalies are overrated, my guy. Deal with it.

Your takes are usually wrong. This one is the wrongest of all of them. No team has ever won a Cup with a goalie that wasn't on the very top of his game. Olympic gold as well.

You cannot win an NHL championship with a goalie who isn't playing well, period, end of discussion.

 

[txpd]

Hmm....Drew Miller didnt play for the Caps and broke the string but Rids needs another Caps sweater with Miller on the back for his collection. It may be Ryan Miller time

 

[txpd]

No one would prefer that. Not even GMBM. No one suggested it should have been the plan or even is the plan. GMBM tried to secure a solid veteran backup and did so at a great price. Sometimes things don't work out like we planned.

I cant agree with this. I think there are numerous posters here that are anywhere from just fine with rolling with Samsonov to eager and prefer that route. I also saw no sign that the Caps had any other legit plan to get a proven starter/playoff goalie. It was going to be a cheap veteran back up and Samsonov. Clearly there was hope that if Samsonov failed or broke that Lundqvist had one more short run in him.

Maybe I misread people. At the same time people are going to be really pissed here if this bunch hits it off with Lavy and really light it up only to have the whole thing driven into a ditch by goaltending. The Caps havent really been short on a goalie since Pete Peeters

 

[kicksavedave]

I cant agree with this. I think there are numerous posters here that are anywhere from just fine with rolling with Samsonov to eager and prefer that route. I also saw no sign that the Caps had any other legit plan to get a proven starter/playoff goalie. It was going to be a cheap veteran back up and Samsonov. Clearly there was hope that if Samsonov failed or broke that Lundqvist had one more short run in him.

Maybe I misread people. At the same time people are going to be really pissed here if this bunch hits it off with Lavy and really light it up only to have the whole thing driven into a ditch by goaltending. The Caps havent really been short on a goalie since Pete Peeters

Sammy was always going to be the expected starter, always. Hank was the vet backup. Everyone was fine with that. That plan changed, unforeseen.

Now some people are saying that if the choice is Jimmy Howard or Vanacek, then just roll with Vanacek... as the backup to Sammy. There just aren't any good vet backup options out there, but I promise you GMBM is exploring his options right now, given its been what, a whole day since this news broke?

I'd rather roll with the two kids than sign a clearly washed up terribad old vet who can't play. If you have some middle ground option, I'm all ears. But Sammy was always going to be the key to this season and clearly the future goalie who's time has come.

 

[OV Rocks]

This wasn't just his team being bad, Howard is awful now. He was already in decline prior to last year, but he was legitimately the worst goalie with more than a handful of appearances last year.

Thank you for posting that clip, I did some more digging and saw the highlights, I hope that you watch it as well so you can see for yourself how bad the team was around him. I count one of those 5 goals as one that Howard should have saved. Just cherry picking one clip is not fair, show the context and show me clips of how bad he is please.

1. That was an amazing team goal which undressed the entire Rew Wings team, that is tic tac toe at its finest, great goal, not Howard's fault

2. Start with the horrible turnover from the D then a deflection off of the defenseman's foot to the slot and right to a Wild player's stick with a wide open net, not Howard's fault.

3. This one Howard probably should have had, but there was traffic in front and I couldn't tell if it was a tip

4. That is shades of Ovechkin in game 5 of the finals, great cross ice pass back door for the PP goal, not Howard's fault

5. Snipe pure and simple, not to mention the fact that one Wild player had 3/4 Red Wings players around him when he broke free for the snipe, not Howard's fault.

Watch for yourself: NHL Highlights | Wild @ Red Wings 2/27/20 - YouTube

 

[Hivemind]

Thank you for posting that clip, I did some more digging and saw the highlights, I hope that you watch it as well so you can see for yourself how bad the team was around him. I count one of those 5 goals as one that Howard should have saved. Just cherry picking one clip is not fair, show the context and show me clips of how bad he is please.

1. That was an amazing team goal which undressed the entire Rew Wings team, that is tic tac toe at its finest, great goal, not Howard's fault

2. Start with the horrible turnover from the D then a deflection off of the defenseman's foot to the slot and right to a Wild player's stick with a wide open net, not Howard's fault.

3. This one Howard probably should have had, but there was traffic in front and I couldn't tell if it was a tip

4. That is shades of Ovechkin in game 5 of the finals, great cross ice pass back door for the PP goal, not Howard's fault

5. Snipe pure and simple, not to mention the fact that one Wild player had 3/4 Red Wings players around him when he broke free for the snipe, not Howard's fault.

Watch for yourself: NHL Highlights | Wild @ Red Wings 2/27/20 - YouTube

Ooof dude. This is a bad take.

First off, you're missing that it was Howard's TWENTIETH CONSECUTIVE GAME WITHOUT A WIN. I know that wins/losses are a team stat, but Bernier wasn't getting shelled nearly to the same degree, and when you manage to put together TWENTY consecutive losses in net, something is definitely up with your game. The only reason the streak wasn't longer is because that was the last game he played, thanks to COVID. Moreover, he was pulled. And not for the first time in the loss streak. It was the SIXTH time he was pulled in those 20 games.

As for the goal-by-goal breakdown, it's mostly going to come down to the 5th goal (and the fact we're talking about a 5th goal against by the mid-way mark in the 2nd period). I do not agree with your assessment of that goal at all, which is part of why I picked that highlight. That "snipe" came from outside of the scoring area, and was a bad angle shot delivered by a 10-15 goal scorer. While the scoring opportunity may have originated by the Red Wings failing to win a board battle, Howard should have easily stopped it if he was on his angle. However, Howard was off his angle and gave up the top corner of the net. This was a soft goal.

Howard was HORRENDOUS last year. The fact that you're defending him is absolutely absurd.

 

[OV Rocks]

Ooof dude. This is a bad take.

First off, you're missing that it was Howard's TWENTIETH CONSECUTIVE GAME WITHOUT A WIN. I know that wins/losses are a team stat, but Bernier wasn't getting shelled nearly to the same degree, and when you manage to put together TWENTY consecutive losses in net, something is definitely up with your game. The only reason the streak wasn't longer is because that was the last game he played, thanks to COVID. Moreover, he was pulled. And not for the first time in the loss streak. It was the SIXTH time he was pulled in those 20 games.

As for the goal-by-goal breakdown, it's mostly going to come down to the 5th goal (and the fact we're talking about a 5th goal against by the mid-way mark in the 2nd period). I do not agree with your assessment of that goal at all, which is part of why I picked that highlight. That "snipe" came from outside of the scoring area, and was a bad angle shot delivered by a 10-15 goal scorer. While the scoring opportunity may have originated by the Red Wings failing to win a board battle, Howard should have easily stopped it if he was on his angle. However, Howard was off his angle and gave up the top corner of the net. This was a soft goal.

Howard was HORRENDOUS last year. The fact that you're defending him is absolutely absurd.

And all I am saying is look at the context around all of those goals and the entire games around them, I look at Howard's career stats and see last season as an outlier.

You can't harp on the 5th goal without the entire game, he was pulled because he was getting shelled, not because of his play. One goal was his fault, watch the highlights.

The 5th goal, if Kuzy had made that same exact play...he has! you would have called it a great goal, it was a great play and better shot by Greenway.

He is a career .910 goalie, for a backup what more do you want?

 

[txpd]

Sammy was always going to be the expected starter, always. Hank was the vet backup. Everyone was fine with that. That plan changed, unforeseen.

Now some people are saying that if the choice is Jimmy Howard or Vanacek, then just roll with Vanacek... as the backup to Sammy. There just aren't any good vet backup options out there, but I promise you GMBM is exploring his options right now, given its been what, a whole day since this news broke?

I'd rather roll with the two kids than sign a clearly washed up terribad old vet who can't play. If you have some middle ground option, I'm all ears. But Sammy was always going to be the key to this season and clearly the future goalie who's time has come.

Thats right. Its always been Sammy for this year. Ready or not. My point all along has been that situation is a grenade with the pin pulled.

 

[filinski77]

Just got my Reverse Retro jersey in the mail (Ovi), I absolutely love the look and design, but is anyone else also a little disappointed with how these Adidas “Authentic Pro” jerseys don’t have actual patches for the name and number etc? Looks like it’s just ironed on or something lol

 

[Hivemind]

And all I am saying is look at the context around all of those goals and the entire games around them, I look at Howard's career stats and see last season as an outlier.

You can't harp on the 5th goal without the entire game, he was pulled because he was getting shelled, not because of his play. One goal was his fault, watch the highlights.

The 5th goal, if Kuzy had made that same exact play...he has! you would have called it a great goal, it was a great play and better shot by Greenway.

He is a career .910 goalie, for a backup what more do you want?

Watch the highlights yourself dude. Multiple goals were his fault. The third goal was soft as hell, and he was way off his angle on the fifth goal. Both of those should have been saves. If you've given up two softies and three more goals on top of that by the halfway mark in the game, you're not playing well.

Howard WAS a .910 goalie. He isn't anymore. He was in decline prior to this past season, and completely fell off a cliff at that point. Both his 2017-18 and 18-19 seasons also had negative Goals Saved Above Average (GSAA). You're betting that a 36 year old who's been in decline ever since his knee injury in late December 2016 is going to rebound on an absolutely abysmal season.

I have a bridge to sell you...

 

[TheLegendOfPatPeake]

Thats right. Its always been Sammy for this year. Ready or not. My point all along has been that situation is a grenade with the pin pulled.

Agreed. Pinning the last good years of the Ovie era on Sammy seems problematic to me but I guess we will find out.

 

[txpd]

Agreed. Pinning the last good years of the Ovie era on Sammy seems problematic to me but I guess we will find out.

They really needed Samsonov a year ahead of the schedule he is on now. They very likely made salary cap decisions based on paying a young under control goalie rather than a mature free agent eligible goalie. I am hoping for the best but I have little confidence that this is going to work out.

My question is when Samsonov struggles, who will get the blame? Lavy, Ov, Backstrom, Carlson or Schultz. It wont be Sammy