Confirmed with Link: Canucks sign F Jake DeBrusk to 7-Year, $5.5M AAV Contract

[VanJack]

There are players you win with in the playoff crunch time; then there are guys who can light it up in the dog-days of an NHL schedule, but are 'no-shows' in the post season.

And it's clear, both Allvin and Tocchet have a pretty clear idea in mind of the kind of players they want for the post-season, after their years in PIttsburgh.

Obviously we'll never know what Kuzmenko would do in the NHL playoffs, because he's never played in one. And if he sticks in Calgary next season, we probably won't find out again.

One thing about Allvin though. If he thinks a guy really isn't built for the post-season he's as good as gone--which is basically what happened with both Lafferty and Mikheyev this off-season.

And incoming are DeBrusk and Sherwood, who both had strong playoffs in Boston and Nashville.

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

Tocchet is too old school in his demands and too ridged in compromising. A short term coach. His message will get old quickly.

Shut up about Kuzmenko? How when the the traded items are benefiting/playing on Calgary for the next 7 years?

You think I am posting about not winning the cup? Get real. I am posting about the ramifications that now exist.
He played well with Pettersson. Pettersson was a 100 point Selke candidate.
Now the team is looking/hoping to find another player like him to play with their 11+ million dollar man and spending more to do so. Eating up cap space they don't have.
The loss of prospect depth
The loss of draft picks.

He wants to enjoy life? Ya, that's a good reason to get rid of players. Can't play unless you are miserable and unhappy.

Tocchet is simply a "my way or the highway" type of coach and in the new NHL with 32 teams, soon to be more no doubt, there are other options. Even Tortorella works out issues with players, coaches them up.

What do you think Boeser's next contract should be for? 9 mil X 8 yrs? Why not have a bunch of players in their late thirties making the majority of the cap?

Next year "we'll see" my guess is a repeat of 2016. After a surprising 2015. Now after a surprising 2023/24 next year a miss.

Although a good PP and PK should be enough to get a decent result in the easy season. And it depends on Demko's knee(s)/hip(s) and Pettersson's .....knee?

The last about Kuzmenko, many many times hockey people lament about how hard it is to find players that can score 30 or 40 goals a season, rarely are they lamenting that these players are useless because they are creative in their games. Often coaches will build lines that take advantage of skills or make up for a deficiency, it is called coaching. If every player is the same then it makes coaching so much easier because there are no changes to make, just complain about a player here or there not doing enough.

But his departure had EP scoring tank, team scoring tank, PP start to falter. Now this is not all on him, Tocchet I think changed the system to a more defensive style a 1 - 3 - 1 for the playoffs but the timing matches.

Last year when Boeser asking for a trade that no other team would do, Kuzmenko was going to take his place at a lot less money. Fans were behind that mostly because oh how he fit with EP.

Imagine, complaining about a coach who completely turned this team around, from a joke to a division winner, from a team that couldn't sniff the playoffs, to a team that was one game away from going to the WCF. A coach that also won the Jack Adams as the best coach in the league. All because he didn't pander to a player who didn't want to play a complete game and could only succeed on a team that had no discernible system, like, at all.

You win with coaches like Toch, you lose with players like Kuz, yah, I'm picking the old school coach with high demands over the hockey player who doesn't want to buy into a winning system.

 

[VanJack]

Interesting take from the Jim Rutherford interview......they apparently tried to trade for DeBrusk a half dozen times, but either got rebuffed or the demands were too high.

So in the end, they secured him for nothing as an UFA. Rutherford predicting a 30-goal season for this player.

And actually, if the Canucks could get 30 out of Debrusk; 20 out of Heinen; and 20-25 out of Sprong; it would really pump up the Canucks offensive numbers on all four lines.

 

[Callhee]

Unbelievable how Rick Tocchet comes in here and completely resets the standards, resets the culture and completely turns around the organization in a positive way, but you criticize criticize criticize. What I really think is you just like to hear yourself ramble.

Your main points are major criticisms of Rick Tocchet and congruently major praise for goal scoring Kuzmenko. You are the living embodiment of what was wrong with this organization for so many years. A backwards loser philosophy.

Kuzmenko is a really weird hill to die on.

With that said, I do have my issues with Tocchet's system, defensive structure should not be mutually exclusive with possession, still too much dump and chase for my liking.

 

[VanJack]

Kuzmenko is a really weird hill to die on.

With that said, I do have my issues with Tocchet's system, defensive structure should not be mutually exclusive with possession, still too much dump and chase for my liking.

The issues with a coach like Tocchet is 'sustainability' year over year. His system demands an incredible amount of energy and commitment from his players.....and if that energy dips just a little, the one-goal wins soon turn into losses.

And there are tons of examples of NHL coaches who come in and set high standards; get a buy-in from the entire roster, and help fashion a big season or two. Then slowly the roster changes; or the players start to tune out the coaches, and the backsliding begins in earnest.

But on the flip side of that argument, a lot of these overachieving teams are often lacking in gifted scorers. They get scoring by committee or slavishly commit to a tight checking system to pull out games.

The Canucks have a lot more high-end talent in form of guys like Pettersson, Miller and Hughes. And of course they've got Demko--the big stopper in goal.

So there's grounds for optimism that Tocchet and the Canucks can keep the ball rolling.

 

[arttk]

The issues with a coach like Tocchet is 'sustainability' year over year. His system demands an incredible amount of energy and commitment from his players.....and if that energy dips just a little, the one-goal wins soon turn into losses.

And there are tons of examples of NHL coaches who come in and set high standards; get a buy-in from the entire roster, and help fashion a big season or two. Then slowly the roster changes; or the players start to tune out the coaches, and the backsliding begins in earnest.

But on the flip side of that argument, a lot of these overachieving teams are often lacking in gifted scorers. They get scoring by committee or slavishly commit to a tight checking system to pull out games.

The Canucks have a lot more high-end talent in form of guys like Pettersson, Miller and Hughes. And of course they've got Demko--the big stopper in goal.

So there's grounds for optimism that Tocchet and the Canucks can keep the ball rolling.

I think there is a good portion of the roster on 1 year contracts so having a good portion of the roster turning over year over year should alleviate some of the burnout concerns.

 

[F A N]

I think there is a good portion of the roster on 1 year contracts so having a good portion of the roster turning over year over year should alleviate some of the burnout concerns.

That might not come to pass though. Among the regulars from last year who were free agents, there's really only Lafferty they didn't try to bring back? But ya there's definitely going to be some turnover given the age of the players with 1-2 years remaining on their contracts. Regardless, it's not something I worry about.

I recall many years back towards the end of AV's tenure here that there was a stat about how teams that win the Cup do so with a HC who is in his first few years of coaching the team. I think since then Cooper winning his first in year 7 and Bednar winning in his 6th year as HC is the longest.

Other recent Cup winners: Maurice won in year 2. Cassidy won in year 1. Berube won in year 1. Trotz year 4. Johnson won his first in year 1. Quenneville won his first in year 2. Sutter won in year 1. When Bruins beat us Julien was in year 4.

I would say Tocchet has another 3 more seasons to at least make it to the Cup finals. He's probably not going to finish 5 seasons here without a SC finals appearance.

 

[LordBacon]

Interesting take from the Jim Rutherford interview......they apparently tried to trade for DeBrusk a half dozen times, but either got rebuffed or the demands were too high.

So in the end, they secured him for nothing as an UFA. Rutherford predicting a 30-goal season for this player.

And actually, if the Canucks could get 30 out of Debrusk; 20 out of Heinen; and 20-25 out of Sprong; it would really pump up the Canucks offensive numbers on all four lines.

Stop stop I’m already hard

 

[VanJack]

That might not come to pass though. Among the regulars from last year who were free agents, there's really only Lafferty they didn't try to bring back? But ya there's definitely going to be some turnover given the age of the players with 1-2 years remaining on their contracts. Regardless, it's not something I worry about.

I recall many years back towards the end of AV's tenure here that there was a stat about how teams that win the Cup do so with a HC who is in his first few years of coaching the team. I think since then Cooper winning his first in year 7 and Bednar winning in his 6th year as HC is the longest.

Other recent Cup winners: Maurice won in year 2. Cassidy won in year 1. Berube won in year 1. Trotz year 4. Johnson won his first in year 1. Quenneville won his first in year 2. Sutter won in year 1. When Bruins beat us Julien was in year 4.

I would say Tocchet has another 3 more seasons to at least make it to the Cup finals. He's probably not going to finish 5 seasons here without a SC finals appearance.

It may mean something, or it may mean nothing. But if you look back over the last 30 years of Cup winners, they often had two basic elements--Vezina quality goaltending and a perpetual Norris Trophy candidate on the blueline.

And Hughes is now the reigning Norris Trophy Winner, who many believe can still get better. And a healthy Demko will regularly be in the Vezina conversation, was he was this past season when he finished second to Hellebuyck.

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

It may mean something, or it may mean nothing. But if you look back over the last 30 years of Cup winners, they often had two basic elements--Vezina quality goaltending and a perpetual Norris Trophy candidate on the blueline.

And Hughes is now the reigning Norris Trophy Winner, who many believe can still get better. And a healthy Demko will regularly be in the Vezina conversation, was he was this past season when he finished second to Hellebuyck.

I'd add a superstar or excellent 2way 1c as more important than a vezina caliber goalie. All the teams that have won a cup recently have had 1 or even 2. Which is why it is so important to have Pettersson going again next year. Pettersson-Miller both at their best is probably the 2nd best 1-2C combo in the NHL

 

[David71]

i can see debrusk hitting 30 goals with powerplay time he will be able to finish those in tight chances that mikeyev/lafftery fluttered on many times last year. he doesn't always have to play with petterson. miller/debrusk could do some damage on the scoresheet as well. i dont think hoglander is the longerterm solution for petey even though they play in spurts last year. maybe daniel sprong 2 guys who can finish a play

 

[theguardianII]

Nobody got railroaded. Kuzmenko refused to put in the work defensively. Try to keep up.

His rookie year he was the second best defensive forward on the team playing with EP and Mikheyev/whomever in every stat.

 

[theguardianII]

Unbelievable how Rick Tocchet comes in here and completely resets the standards, resets the culture and completely turns around the organization in a positive way, but you criticize criticize criticize. What I really think is you just like to hear yourself ramble.

Your main points are major criticisms of Rick Tocchet and congruently major praise for goal scoring Kuzmenko. You are the living embodiment of what was wrong with this organization for so many years. A backwards loser philosophy.

Ever played on wining teams? Ever built them?

After decades of the mushy middle and seeing how "now" is more important than building and ignoring what other teams are doing I take a more careful approach rather than blind faith.

Last year was a surprise there is no getting around that.

He ain't no choir boy. There are the optics of bigotry

IMO the team's improvement was as much or more due to the improvement of the defence.

Still no news about Boeser's clotting issue.

First preseason game is in 4 weeks and training camp in around 3 weeks.

 

[strattonius]

Ever played on wining teams? Ever built them?

After decades of the mushy middle and seeing how "now" is more important than building and ignoring what other teams are doing I take a more careful approach rather than blind faith.

Last year was a surprise there is no getting around that.

He ain't no choir boy. There are the optics of bigotry

IMO the team's improvement was as much or more due to the improvement of the defence.

Still no news about Boeser's clotting issue.

First preseason game is in 4 weeks and training camp in around 3 weeks.

Rick Tocchet was the biggest reason for our turnaround last year.

Stop rambling.

 

[Nucker101]

Ever played on wining teams? Ever Built them?

 

[EpochLink]

Ever played on wining teams? Ever built them?

After decades of the mushy middle and seeing how "now" is more important than building and ignoring what other teams are doing I take a more careful approach rather than blind faith.

Last year was a surprise there is no getting around that.

He ain't no choir boy. There are the optics of bigotry

IMO the team's improvement was as much or more due to the improvement of the defence.

Still no news about Boeser's clotting issue.

First preseason game is in 4 weeks and training camp in around 3 weeks.

My dude, NFL starts soon and the doom and gloom already starting.

 

[HairyKneel]

Imagine, complaining about a coach who completely turned this team around, from a joke to a division winner, from a team that couldn't sniff the playoffs, to a team that was one game away from going to the WCF. A coach that also won the Jack Adams as the best coach in the league. All because he didn't pander to a player who didn't want to play a complete game and could only succeed on a team that had no discernible system, like, at all.

You win with coaches like Toch, you lose with players like Kuz, yah, I'm picking the old school coach with high demands over the hockey player who doesn't want to buy into a winning system.

I don't think the guardian has participated in organized sports in his lifetime.

 

[AwesomeInTheory]

I don't even think Tocchet is that 'old school.' Maybe for current year or whatever, but I think of Torts or Keenan.

Tocchet seems a lot more open-minded and receptive to different thinking than those sorts of coaches, based on things I've heard him say in interviews.

 

[LandfiII]

I don't even think Tocchet is that 'old school.' Maybe for current year or whatever, but I think of Torts or Keenan.

Tocchet seems a lot more open-minded and receptive to different thinking than those sorts of coaches, based on things I've heard him say in interviews.

Coach Rick is a big growth and evolution guy.

 

[LordBacon]

Cant wait to see this guy score some sick goals playing with Miller and Boeser.

 

[VanJack]

I'm kind of getting 'J.T. Miller' vibes from DeBrusk. When he first came into the league with the Bruins, he drove his coaches to distraction with his inconsistencies. He'd get hot for 10 games; then go into a tailspin. As a result his name always seemed to come up in trade rumors.

Not much different than J.T. when he played for Alain Vigneault with the Rangers; or when he settled into a rather uneventful third line center position in Tampa Bay. But once he hit Vancouver at about the same age as DeBrusk, his game too took off.

That might be the totally optimistic view, but you can always hope.

 

[David71]

I'm kind of getting 'J.T. Miller' vibes from DeBrusk. When he first came into the league with the Bruins, he drove his coaches to distraction with his inconsistencies. He'd get hot for 10 games; then go into a tailspin. As a result his name always seemed to come up in trade rumors.

Not much different than J.T. when he played for Alain Vigneault with the Rangers; or when he settled into a rather uneventful third line center position in Tampa Bay. But once he hit Vancouver at about the same age as DeBrusk, his game too took off.

That might be the totally optimistic view, but you can always hope.

fingers crossed debrusk goes the similar route to jt miller at 27 years old. plus debrusk body can last longer with the style he plays compared to jt. debrusk doesnt really goes "balls to the walls" as much as jt does. but he still hits enough to knock a player down.

 

[F A N]

I'd add a superstar or excellent 2way 1c as more important than a vezina caliber goalie. All the teams that have won a cup recently have had 1 or even 2. Which is why it is so important to have Pettersson going again next year. Pettersson-Miller both at their best is probably the 2nd best 1-2C combo in the NHL

I'm not sure about importance, but having two #1Cs, a Norris trophy winner, a Vezina goalie, and an all-star calibre goal scoring winger is a lot to work with. I think Hughes ability to dominate against the other team's best alongside Hronek is the biggest change. Like Hughes' impact last season, I would say it's something we've never seen here since Bure (or maybe first year Luongo). Lots of credit to Tocchet and his coaching staff as well.

 

[Hoglander]

I just hope he is a good fit. 30+30 would be great, a Miller-like bump is highly unlikely.

I also don't get why anyone would want DeBrusk with Miller and Boeser. I get that it would make for a great line, but JT and BB are good together already, and the glaring need is a legit top 6 winger for EP. It just makes more sense.

 

[kranuck]

Imagine, complaining about a coach who completely turned this team around, from a joke to a division winner, from a team that couldn't sniff the playoffs, to a team that was one game away from going to the WCF. A coach that also won the Jack Adams as the best coach in the league. All because he didn't pander to a player who didn't want to play a complete game and could only succeed on a team that had no discernible system, like, at all.

You win with coaches like Toch, you lose with players like Kuz, yah, I'm picking the old school coach with high demands over the hockey player who doesn't want to buy into a winning system.

Curious why you think Toch even qualifies as an "old school" coach?

What would a new school coach be and how would that look different?

I hear old school and I think Torts or some of the guys who are now seen as nasty people.