Rumor: Canucks: Should I stay or should I go? Pete stays and Miller goes!

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Produces 10% more. Cap hit is 50% more.

Add in that VAN is a much superior organization from a coaching and talent perspective and the offense is closer to a wash.
What about defensively? From what I understand, Thompson’s defensive game leaves a lot to be desired.

Kk, Ros, 1st for Miller works from the Canes.

KK at minimum will be a good 3c, at 4.875m, that's a bargain with the new cap.

We need a bonified 2C
That’s less than what the Rangers’ offer was apparently. Not good enough.
 
Mittelstadt + Rantanen for Miller + Boeser as a base.

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Produces 10% more. Cap hit is 50% more.

Add in that VAN is a much superior organization from a coaching and talent perspective and the offense is closer to a wash

Talent?
Pettersson put up a 100+ point season with (checks notes) Anthony beauvillier, kizemenko, Mikheyev as his most common line mates

superior talent indeed
 
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Agreed and that is what makes the Kot and Ros even more pathetic as its still worse.

Ros is also a nothing player and his offense for a forward is pretty bad.

...Kotkaniemi's development was absolutely destroyed by Marc Bergevin in Montreal...guy coulda been a half-decent Top 6 C if he wasn't rushed soo much because the Habs needed a Top 6 C immediately and, even though he was told by his head of scouting that KK was a PROJECT and needed time to blossum, Bergevin rushed him to the dance immediately...poor kid...
 
...Kotkaniemi's development was absolutely destroyed by Marc Bergevin in Montreal...guy coulda been a half-decent Top 6 C if he wasn't rushed soo much because the Habs needed a Top 6 C immediately and, even though he was told by his head of scouting that KK was a PROJECT and needed time to blossum, Bergevin rushed him to the dance immediately...poor kid...
No, Kotkaniemi takes as much blame as anyone for it. Habs lack of development staff played a big role but Kotkaniemi's fatal flaw was a lack of maturity more than anything.

Habs training staff sent him with an offseason training plan that was largely focused on his skating, they suggested he go work on his skating with the same skating coach that his linemate, Armia, uses. Instead, Kotkaniemi chose to bulk up during the offseason and came back larger but with his biggest flaw not adequately worked on. A lot of the reports after that mention him having issues with the coaching staff, from not listening to them fully or not taking them seriously. The Athletic reported that there was issues with Kotkanemi not listening to coaches and smirking during practice, TSN690 reported that there was tension with him not following through with game plans and not playing the forecheck the way he was asked multiple times including in the playoffs. Him being benched in the playoffs, after having 5 pts in 19 games despite being played as a third liner, and then getting entitled brat about it and announcing that had played his last game for the Habs was the kicker.

Claude Julien has said "“Kotkaniemi can become the player that he can become… if he wants to himself”, said Julien. “Everyone was trying to help him, but at some point, even if you help a player, he has to help himself too. Sometimes, it takes 2-3-4 years before a young player becomes mature enough et gets to recognize his own strengths and weaknesses, and work on that. Now, Kotkaniemi must take the next steps to help himself.”

Bergevin has publicly commented on his maturity too.

"KK didn’t show enough growth in his game/maturity issues and we were not confident with matching that offer-sheet."

Habs take a lot of responsibility for players not working out but him and Poehling are 100% on them.
 
No, Kotkaniemi takes as much blame as anyone for it. Habs lack of development staff played a big role but Kotkaniemi's fatal flaw was a lack of maturity more than anything.

Habs training staff sent him with an offseason training plan that was largely focused on his skating, they suggested he go work on his skating with the same skating coach that his linemate, Armia, uses. Instead, Kotkaniemi chose to bulk up during the offseason and came back larger but with his biggest flaw not adequately worked on. A lot of the reports after that mention him having issues with the coaching staff, from not listening to them fully or not taking them seriously. The Athletic reported that there was issues with Kotkanemi not listening to coaches and smirking during practice, TSN690 reported that there was tension with him not following through with game plans and not playing the forecheck the way he was asked multiple times including in the playoffs. Him being benched in the playoffs, after having 5 pts in 19 games despite being played as a third liner, and then getting entitled brat about it and announcing that had played his last game for the Habs was the kicker.

Claude Julien has said "“Kotkaniemi can become the player that he can become… if he wants to himself”, said Julien. “Everyone was trying to help him, but at some point, even if you help a player, he has to help himself too. Sometimes, it takes 2-3-4 years before a young player becomes mature enough et gets to recognize his own strengths and weaknesses, and work on that. Now, Kotkaniemi must take the next steps to help himself.”

Bergevin has publicly commented on his maturity too.

"KK didn’t show enough growth in his game/maturity issues and we were not confident with matching that offer-sheet."

Habs take a lot of responsibility for players not working out but him and Poehling are 100% on them.

...Trevor Timmins literally told Bergevin that Kotkaniemi was a PROJECT and needed a few seasons against lesser competition to start to bloom before they drafted him...maturity could also have come from taking the necessary first steps in his development...that failure is 100% on Bergevin...
 
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...Trevor Timmins literally told Bergevin that Kotkaniemi was a PROJECT and needed a few seasons against lesser competition to start to bloom before they drafted him...maturity could also have come from taking the necessary first steps in his development...that failure is 100% on Bergevin...
Timmins comments at the draft were

- He would need time in the NHL or AHL to develop, sending him back to Finland was an option too.
- The main reason they thought so highly of him was his maturity and his ability to play offensively or defensively but his lack of strength and ability to handle the pace of professional hockey were the things that made him a longer project.
- Lots of talk on his vision and hockey sense. He really hyped that up.
- They saw him as a future top 6 centre but it would take time.

Timmins never publically said Kk should be sent to play against lesser competition.

Not listening to coaches, not following trainers advice... None of that is on Bergevin. KK takes blame for his immaturity.
 
Kk, Ros, 1st for Miller works from the Canes.

KK at minimum will be a good 3c, at 4.875m, that's a bargain with the new cap.

We need a bonified 2C

Bona fide. Bona fide are the words you are looking for. Bonified is not a word.

A lot of posters in here are missing the context of a potential Miller deal. Likely a near PPG 1st or 2nd line centre for 2-4 more years, then a few years of being an overpaid 3c. Which teams should recognize, understand where they are at in the competitive cycle, and understand that veteran Miller in 2028-2029 is now your insulating leadership.

A lot of willfully obtuse posters in here. If you were getting a PPG power centre signed for 8 mil for his entire prime, the cost would be a hell of a lot higher.
 
Bona fide. Bona fide are the words you are looking for. Bonified is not a word.

A lot of posters in here are missing the context of a potential Miller deal. Likely a near PPG 1st or 2nd line centre for 2-4 more years, then a few years of being an overpaid 3c. Which teams should recognize, understand where they are at in the competitive cycle, and understand that veteran Miller in 2028-2029 is now your insulating leadership.

A lot of willfully obtuse posters in here. If you were getting a PPG power centre signed for 8 mil for his entire prime, the cost would be a hell of a lot higher.
Yeah. Miller doesn't have high-end trade value. Canucks fans expecting a big package need to get real. You move Miller because you have to move on. You're not winning the trade.

Miller will be 32 soon, has a pretty large cap hit, has a full NMC (big issue with trying to maximize trade value), and is a known malcontent that will cause issues with teammates. Those are a lot of red flags for a supposed "premium" asset.
 
carolina would be instant cup contenders with Miller. fits right in. morrow+prospect+1st + necas. dont wat jasper Kotnaknemi. hes too small and weak. tocheet might not even like him.
 
carolina would be instant cup contenders with Miller. fits right in. morrow+prospect+1st + necas. dont wat jasper Kotnaknemi. hes too small and weak. tocheet might not even like him.
I mean if you take out Necas it's probably right.

Necas is above PPG this year, swapping him for Miller doesn't really improve them, let alone the gulf in trade value in Vancouver s favor.
 
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