Canucks & NHL News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | The Morning After

[Jerry the great]

Canucks trade pieces still available:

1st Rounder
2nd Rounder
Brock Boeser (If not resigned) (UFA)
Lankinen (If Not Resigned) (UFA)
Lekkerimaki ( only for a major package )
Pius Suter (UFA)
3Petey ( UFA, If not signed by TDL)

Needs: Top 4 D, Top 2 Center, Multiple top 6 Wingers (If Brock is moved)

I would add Forbort to that list, and if they're extending MP29, i would at least have a conversation with Soucy about his future with the team and offer him the option of moving on sooner rather than later

 

[LemonSauceD]

It would be like the Canucks trading Quinn Hughes to Edmonton for Mattias Ekholm.

Yep. I’d instantly become a Seattle fan if that happened.

 

[arttk]

We are not a better team now, let alone a much better team. Who will score goals? Doesn’t look like Pettersson will be because he’s been a ghost for a year now. Who will be winning key faceoffs? Who will replace Miller for matching up to other teams best players? Who in our top 6 has enough grit and toughness to play those hard games? We’re so soft now it’s ridiculous

Having a better transition defense probably means we will be in the ozone ozone. I don’t know if you notice but even with Miller, the defense was so shit we could barely put up 20 shots a game because anytime Quinn is not on the ice, we need our center to drop really f***ing deep to help transition the puck that we end up out numbered when we enter the zone leading to us just dumping it in.

chance generation will probably go up despite losing a key guy like Miller and conversion will come down.

 

[arttk]

Canucks trade pieces still available:

1st Rounder
2nd Rounder
Brock Boeser (If not resigned) (UFA)
Lankinen (If Not Resigned) (UFA)
Lekkerimaki ( only for a major package )
Pius Suter (UFA)
3Petey ( UFA, If not signed by TDL)

Needs: Top 4 D, Top 2 Center, Multiple top 6 Wingers (If Brock is moved)

Not sure top4D is as much of a need for now. Need a top 2 RHD C and yeah at least 2 top6 forwards. I think the too6 winger is a UFA thing so really we should just use our asset on getting at least 1 forward.

 

[Hodgy]

Christ. This is the f***ing timeline:

1. Some players had to have an intervention with Miller (and Petey) in October in hopes they'd hash it out.
2. A month later there's some sort of incident and Miller is on leave.
3. Two and half month later Miller traded.

My main question is what the hell did Miller do in training camp to reignite things? I'd bet a million dollars it wasn't Petey.

Based on Allvin’s comments and the Halford and Brough rumour, it sounds like Pettersson came into camp out of shape and unprepared. Miller and him have obviously had issues in the past, so Miller probably laid into him pretty hard (and to an extent that’s probably reasonable).

What was unreasonable was Miller continually being hard on him despite being told by everyone to layoff.

all that matters is whether the canucks could have kept the pick. they clearly could have given pittsburgh didn't send anything the rangers way in the "three way trade" you insist happened

Ya, three way may not be the best way to describe it. The point is that the Canucks felt they had to trade Miller, and that the Miller deal was contingent on the Pittsburgh deal from a Canucks perspective, so there was no net loss of futures. Could they have not made the Pittsburgh deal? Yes. But they could also trade any of their players for futures.

i like pettersson in the short(ish) term but he's not a guy i'd sign to a long contract. he relies on his mobility and he's already slowing down. he could be horror show bad in three years

Ya, I have my concerns. I’d rather they had just done a rebuild.

I don't mind holding on to Miller when trying to trade him. Time and time again we see that high end players with NMC's, especially if there's some sort of catch to the player, take a long time to trade if you want to actually get value. Rangers were sticking on retention and once they let that go the deal was done, I'm glad we hung in there an extra month to avoid retaining, an absurd demand but it is what it is.

Allvin confirmed that retention on Miller was never discussed. That was a bogus rumour.

Then a week later, Miller slashed Pettersson in practice.

However you look at Miller's impact in the room in the past, and his popularity with his teammates, this clearly shows that he was unwilling to listen to the team's leadership and was out of control.

Then 3 weeks later he goes on a 10 game leave of absence for mystery reasons, and comes back and doesn't do anything to make amends?

Coming into the season, I was a huge JT Miller fan. But you just cannot compete when a player has gone rogue like this. He needed a change of address. Maybe Pettersson does too. But Miller certainly had to go.

Ya, I think it’s likely that Miller was being hard on Pettersson for coming into camp unprepared or out of shape, and that Miller was really hard on him, and that management and the core group basically told Miller he needs to knock it off and reign in his emotions, but as we know, Miller is a hot head and struggles to control his emotions, and so he continues to be hard on Pettersson and that eventually resulted in the LOA.

 

[quat]

I dont need Seravalli to tell me a slew of other none core isnt also unhappy at whats transpired.

Seems like Calgary has been drama free and just added a LW with term.

Im sure Jake is pleased we were forced to trade a centerman he was probably half promised to play with when Calgary offered more money haha.

Im sure Pius Suter is happy going into the 2nd half about to get caved in as he becomes a own rental.

Im sure Garland is happy after two years of not being able to get traded, now he watches JT force his way out while he's turned it around and been our best forward.

There's about 12 others with NHL livelyhoods affected by this fiasco.

Maybe some are team Petey but every game that goes by looking over at Elias in the lockerroom becomes one day closer to them also siding with Miller at this rate, imo.

Miller quit on his teammates because he didn't want to be here. Pettersson didn't force Miller out.

They're all pissed Miller's gone because when he's on, he's a fantastic player the gets everyone engaged. They all know he bailed on the club and on them.

We'll have to see what happens now with a respectable defence.

 

[theguardianII]

Minnesota might be calling the Canucks on Boeser very soon.
Kaprizov out
Johansson out
Brodin out

And now Hartman to be suspended longer than 5 games

They might wait until after the 4 nations though, they have enough of a lead in the playoff hunt.

 

[Tv9924]

Not sure if Isles will make him available, but if they really are entering a rebuild I'd love to go after Barzal. I wonder if Lekkerimaki/Willander (not both), our 2025 1st, and another 1st round pick (if we trade Boeser) would be enough to get it done. I can see him meshing well on Petey's wing, and it'd be nice to have an extra top 6 center given Chytil's injury risk.

Alternatively, I wonder if Preds would be open to trading Forsberg?

 

[Orr4Norris]

Blake Price on an earlier show this week had a direct source with the Canucks (most likely a player) and had a great quote:

"This room needs to be nuked."

So let’s say Petey goes on a heater down the stretch…does the management trust that?

He has a big incentive to get his act together and tow the company line. Once his NMC kicks in, he’ll control where he plays for the rest of his contract. Otherwise, they could trade him anywhere.

Personally, I don’t think he’s trustworthy. When the going gets tough, he gets going and it’s not just this season.

If I’m management, I hope he goes on a heater so I can get max value for him at the draft.

 

[ManVanFan]

Insane to think 5 out of the top 10 are defence and defence scoring 100 NHL points pretty ridiculous numbers. Until we realize that 7 different NHL D have broken the PPG mark over the past 4 seasons. NHLe numbers are still ridiculous but not as far off as one might think. 36 forwards currently on pace to be a PPG.

 

[wonton15]

Crosby for Chytil, Lekkerimaki and a 1st

 

[Quinning]

Miller is saying all the right things publicly, but it's pretty clear there's been animosity brewing behind the scenes for months now. I suspect he held Pettersson personally responsible for not showing up in the playoffs and it escalated badly.

The reason they got mediocre value for Miller is that the LOA was framed as a "mental health reset" instead of kept quiet or written off as an unknown injury. That was a bad mistake that cost management in the end.

This should be a lesson in team building - you can have all the right pieces in place on paper, but if the locker room is f***ed there's realistically no amount of skill that can overcome it.

 

[krutovsdonut]

Miller quit on his teammates because he didn't want to be here. Pettersson didn't force Miller out.

They're all pissed Miller's gone because when he's on, he's a fantastic player the gets everyone engaged. They all know he bailed on the club and on them.

We'll have to see what happens now with a respectable defence.

bottom line is miller did a kesler.

and he did it right after kesler came to town and made a speech about regretting doing a kesler, and begged to get retired here.

so far he has gotten away with it way better than kesler did, which i guess is a credit to his agent who carefully avoided making an official trade demand, or limiting the demand to one team, and made sure miller played enough to keep the fans off his back yet made sure the pressure was on.

but he did a kesler.

 

[Quinning]

bottom line is miller did a kesler.

and he did it right after kesler came to town and made a speech about regretting doing a kesler, and begged to get retired here.

so far he has gotten away with it way better than kesler did, which i guess is a credit to his agent who carefully avoided making an official trade demand, or limiting the demand to one team, and made sure miller played enough to keep the fans off his back yet made sure the pressure was on.

but he did a kesler.

Yeah, he did the exact same thing Kesler did in the end. Except worse, because the Canucks were on their way down in 2014 and this core could have competed for years.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

bottom line is miller did a kesler.

and he did it right after kesler came to town and made a speech about regretting doing a kesler, and begged to get retired here.

so far he has gotten away with it way better than kesler did, which i guess is a credit to his agent who carefully avoided making an official trade demand, or limiting the demand to one team, and made sure miller played enough to keep the fans off his back yet made sure the pressure was on.

but he did a kesler.

Not quite a Kesler. Kesler was drafted and developed by the Canucks along with a lot of that core. He clearly regrets leaving and there weren’t any conflicts with Kesler and other players. Miller has moved around a decent amount and didn’t really have the same incentive to retire a Canuck.
But if you’re saying he wanted out like Kesler did you could be right. However I do think there was something personal going on with Miller this year that played into it. I’m not going to try to guess what that was.

 

[Hyzer]

Crosby for Chytil, Lekkerimaki and a 1st

Not even being hyperbolic. But I would trade Lekk and our firsts for the next 3 years for Crosby, no questions asked at all. Even Willander, just get it done. Literally ANYTHING to use Hughes during his prime

 

[krutovsdonut]

Not quite a Kesler. Kesler was drafted and developed by the Canucks along with a lot of that core. He clearly regrets leaving. Miller has moved around a decent amount and doesn’t really have the same incentive to retire a Canuck.

maybe miller will regret it too. the biggest difference i see so far is miller taking some care not to burn bridges but i do not see any difference in intent. we'll see how it plays out.

remember kesler didn't regret leaving at the time. he also asked to be traded to the hawks and would gladly have suited up with keith and kane against the sedins to try to get his cup. that's a huge f*** you to this fanbase. there's not a spec of regret or loyalty in what he did.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

maybe miller will regret it too. the biggest difference i see so far is miller taking some care not to burn bridges but i do not see any difference in intent. we'll see how it plays out.

remember kesler didn't regret leaving at the time. he also asked to be traded to the hawks and would gladly have suited up with keith and kane against the sedins to try to get his cup. that's a huge f*** you to this fanbase. there's not a spec of regret or loyalty in what he did.

Yeah I just don’t see the same degree of connection to Vancouver with Miller. He was here for a few years. He played with NYR before and will be glad to have a fresh start. I doubt he will ever regret moving on like Kesler did.

 

[VanillaCoke]

Alternatively, I wonder if Preds would be open to trading Forsberg?

Might as well go full Tre Kronor, Forsberg or Kempe would be amazing if unlikely gets.

 

[PavelBure10]

After things have settled down and I had a chance to cool off. I am not minding the trades made by Allvin. Love JT but he obviously was becoming a distraction to the team. Milsy will go down as one of the best Canucks ever and I wish him the best with the Rangers, but I honestly think we will be a better team going forward.
Chytil is injury prone and only had a career high of 45 points, most people are pissed at him being the main piece coming back, and honestly I am not thrilled either, but he adds speed and untapped potential. Hearing Allvins press conference yesterday about wanting to add a impact forward, makes me think Chytil is on the top lines as a temporary option. Probably will get pushed to the 3rd line once they find another top 6 player.
Marcus Pettersson was a solid add. Gives the Canucks a solid number 3 who is a pretty good shut down defenseman. Looks to be a very vocal player who is a leader. Adding Pettersson bolsters the defense bigtime. Add in Willander later this season and the Canucks defense goes from a weakness to a strong point. Best part of the entire Pittsburgh trade is cutting off all the dead weight in Desharnais and Heinen. Giving the Canucks some decent cap space going forward to make another bold move.
O'Connor was a good add. Big forward who is a very good North/South player. Very good skater who has some untapped potential. Love the energy he will bring to the bottom 6.
Mancini is a sneaky add. Big defenseman who is a very good skater for a big man. Had put up some points in very limited action with the Rangers but is known for his shutdown ability. Probably needs some polishing in the AHL but Mancini could develop into a very good 4/5 shutdown defenseman.

The biggest win is gaining cap space. Nearing the trade deadline the Canucks will have a lot of cap space to potentially add something significant. If Allvin doesn't pull off a major trade for a impact forward near the deadline, then he can easily go big game hunting and go for Rantenen, Marner or Ehlers in the offseason.
Overall, trading JT Miller hurts, we all loved him and he is a beloved Canuck, but if you look at the bigger picture and be a little patient, I think the Canucks will be better in the long run. The deals aren't finished, the Canucks will be going after another top 6 player, maybe more if they decide to trade Boeser, but I think good things will come if we just be patient.

Having so much cap space and losing Desharnais is a win.

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

maybe miller will regret it too. the biggest difference i see so far is miller taking some care not to burn bridges but i do not see any difference in intent. we'll see how it plays out.

remember kesler didn't regret leaving at the time. he also asked to be traded to the hawks and would gladly have suited up with keith and kane against the sedins to try to get his cup. that's a huge f*** you to this fanbase. there's not a spec of regret or loyalty in what he did.

And if he stayed, the team would be in absolute purgatory more than it is for longer than it was.

That's loyalty, it's just really f***ing tough loyalty. Sometimes the hardest thing to do is say goodbye. Kes can't help but play the villain. I love him for the sacrifices to his body for younger Rev to enjoy and learn about hockey.

JT's deal was a poison pill we were about to swallow gladly.

 

[Nuckles]

DiGiuseppe clears [waivers] - Friedman

 

[ziploc]

I would add Forbort to that list, and if they're extending MP29, i would at least have a conversation with Soucy about his future with the team and offer him the option of moving on sooner rather than later

Agreed. I don't think Forbort or Soucy have too much trade utility right now, and Forbort in particular could be useful as a PKer in the playoffs if we should make it. I think the D is largely set.

The priority now is a 2C, so that Chytil can be in the 3C spot. We have some filler wingers so Hoglander and the 1st and 2nd are, imo, the main trade pieces. Which isn't great, but we CAN take on some serious cap if we need to, which is helpful.

If Boeser is traded we have a whole new issue, but I guess we cross that bridge when we get there.

DeBrusk EP Boeser (if extended)
Hoglander ? Garland
Joshua Chytil Kerwood
Suter Blueger O'Connor
(Raty, Sasson, Karlsson, Lekk, PDG)

Hughes Myers
MP Hronek
Soucy Forbort
(Mancini, EP2, Juulsen)

 

[Ernie]

However you look at Miller's impact in the room in the past, and his popularity with his teammates, this clearly shows that he was unwilling to listen to the team's leadership and was out of control.