Proposal: Canucks 2017 1st (1st or 2nd overall) for Pierre Luc Dubois

[93LEAFS]

There is sense to this. The 2018 and 2019 drafts will have better forwards. Makes sense to take a defense this year. The Draft Lottery might mess that notion up though..

2018 looks to be the strongest draft defenseman wise in awhile, but then again, most of the prospects just started in the CHL or with the USNDP.

I wouldn't trade Patrick for Dubios (I think he ends up a 2nd line C, and if he does develop into a first line scorer, I think its more likely on the LW). I'm not even sure Dubois will end up a significantly better prospect than Vilardi.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Patrick is expected to be at least as good as Dubois.

what little intel I have seen says he is better

 

[heilongjetsfan]

It was to my understanding that Nolan Patrick (and obviously, the subsequent #2 pick after that) are a clear-cut level BELOW Matthews/Eichel/Laine. That's just from what I read. It's to my understanding that the pecking order is....

1) McDavid
2) Matthews/Eichel/Laine
3) Patrick

Am I wrong on this? Given that Dubois was drafted right after Matthews and Laine, that's why I figured that a PLD for #1 overall or #2 overall pick might be a comparable (or, a situation where CBJ would have to add to their PLD package).

#1 for Laine = Winnipeg laughing (i.e. Laine is better, and is one year more mature.....and from what I see, is almost a CURRENT NHL Superstar anyways).

Laine almost a superstar? 1st in the league in goals, 6th in points at age 18, THAT Hatrik Laine?

 

[DeltaSwede]

*Imagine that long extended Darth Vader no*

 

[Bgav]

Gross

 

[Halla]

If its pick #2 vancouver probably check with columbus, who likely say no. If its pick #1 van probably just takes patrick. not really a great match

 

[Jarey Curry]

Are the optics of trading a #1 overall in an "ok" draft for a #3 overall in a deep draft still considered bad?......especially if the team with the #3 pick (a pick that is one more year mature by the way) is willing to add pieces? Just saying.

Depends on who we are targeting exactly and how that player will perform this season. Time will tell

 

[Jarey Curry]

Laine almost a superstar? 1st in the league in goals, 6th in points at age 18, THAT Hatrik Laine?

He's currently playing like a superstar but to me superstar is consistently playing like superstar, we haven't seen his consistent level cause he's played like what 12 games? He looks super promising though

 

[Maukkis]

He's currently playing like a superstar but to me superstar is consistently playing like superstar, we haven't seen his consistent level cause he's played like what 12 games? He looks super promising though

A Finnish Jets fan agreeing with this one. 14 games is nowhere near enough a good sample size. I generally don't think rookies should be considered as a "top 6 F" or "top 4 D", for example. Calling them rookies is enough, until we see a full season's worth of games. Most rookies hit a wall during the latter part of the season, so while they might look incredible after 20 games or so, things can be very different after that.

 

[eternalbedhead]

-PLD (projected good two-way center as a low end 1st or high end 2nd line level)
-Horvat (projected good two-way center at the 2nd line level)
-Sutter (good two-way center at the 3rd line level)
-Gaunce (projected good two-way center at the 4th line level)

Replace PLD with Patrick. You don't need 4 shutdown lines.

Either way, this trade sounds like it came out of NHL 17. Don't see Columbus doing this at all. (especially considering that this pick isn't guaranteed to be Patrick and Columbus really needs centers a lot more than defensemen)

 

[Paradise*]

so much wrong in this post



As for the potential trade Patrick and Dubois are both going to be elite #1 C's who play a complete 200ft game so if the Canucks do get the 1st pick they should just take Patrick because they're basically washes. Now if it's the 2nd pick or lower they'd be very smart to move it for Dubois as he'll be better than anyone in the 2017 draft other than potentially Patrick.

Your opinion of course, just like mine. I just don't deal in absolutes.

Now if you'd care to give a bit more than "so much wrong in this post", I could take your opinion more seriously.

 

[mikeyp24]

The CBJ passed on Puljujarvi because how strongly they felt about PLD being a great player. If you watch the videos in there scouting meetings about the draft they released they were glowing about PLD and wouldn't trade down out of fear of missing out. To put into perspective they also had a chance to trade up to get Hannifan or Provorov 2 years ago but felt that in GMJKs own words Werenski was either the best D in that draft or nearly no difference in quality between him and Hannifan. The one thing the jackets have done well at the past 3 or 4 years is scout and draft so they would likely decline.

 

[Paradise*]

PLD has preformed at a higher PPG at C than LW. Do not post when you dont use facts, Thanks

From my views of him at LW he seems more comfortable. I don't know exactly how his transition will work at the NHL level though. Nobody does.

When you bring up "facts", you might actually want to include those.

 

[mikeyp24]

^He did say the fact that he has performed better as a C I guess he just didn't post the stats. To be fair though he is correct. He skyrocketed up the draft boards after the move because of how much his play and production went up and he was already a top 15 pick at the wing. He is currently at a ppg with a ridiculously bad team that can not score on his set ups and him passing most fans eye tests more then what the stat sheet shows.

 

[Paradise*]

^He did say the fact that he has performed better as a C I guess he just didn't post the stats. To be fair though he is correct. He skyrocketed up the draft boards after the move because of how much his play and production went up and he was already a top 15 pick at the wing. He is currently at a ppg with a ridiculously bad team that can not score on his set ups and him passing most fans eye tests more then what the stat sheet shows.

I want the breakdown of those "facts". Game by game, position by position of his career.

 

[mikeyp24]

I would suggest a yahoo search?

That's not a logical request of someone to do. Stats for total games started at C vs LW and then production at each is fair. Game by game is a bit much. I get that you are trying to argue your opinion vs another's and trying to prove a point that it's their word vs yours but actual stats show he has had better production at C.

 

[KevinRedkey]

At the time of their draft, if all were the same age:
1. McDavid
2. Matthews/Eichel
4. Laine
5. Patrick/Puljujarvi
7. Dubois

Note: Team needs aside

 

[HtG]

PLD and Patrick are about the same except PLD is a year ahead on development & is CBJ's FO #1 choice out of the options last year.

Jackets have no reason to side-grade or even an unknown quantity depending on draft position.

I don't buy arguments that Patrick is somehow better seemingly predicated on HF pinning "generational talent" on every other prospect.

 

[Cogburn]

I fail to see why Columbus gives up on Dubois, lest they already have found a flaw in his game they can't see a way to work with.

As for the Canucks, the optics of trading a pick that high ALONE would be enough to shut this proposal down.

Dubois will be a special player, and even with my limited scope, I'd prefer Patrick myself. However this is making a huge assumption that Vancouver will finish low enough to even be in the running for a top 2 pick. Benning/Desjardins will prevent us from going that low, trying for a playoff spot. If there was anything on our roster that the Blue Jackets would want in a deal for Dubois, I'd be interested. As I said Dubois will be a special player in his career.

 

[landy92mack29]

From my views of him at LW he seems more comfortable. I don't know exactly how his transition will work at the NHL level though. Nobody does.

When you bring up "facts", you might actually want to include those.

Well the last time he played LW has almost a year ago. The majority of his playing time since the start of his draft year has been C+RW

 

[Wayward Son]

Let's just keep this response simple.

If we have 1st overall, we're not likely to trade it.

If we have 2nd overall, we're not likely to trade it.

In the event that we have 1st or 2nd overall and we decide to trade it, we're not trading it for PLD.

Thank you.

 

[landy92mack29]

Your opinion of course, just like mine. I just don't deal in absolutes.

Now if you'd care to give a bit more than "so much wrong in this post", I could take your opinion more seriously.

-Patrick and Dubois are equal prospects
-Their potential is both #1 C who can be around ppg
-Patrick probably would've gone 3rd but not "easily"
-Dubois isn't being forced to play center. He started playing center long before Columbus ever drafted him
-Dubois has actually looked best at C followed by RW and then LW. You must have seen him a bunch in his draft -1 year to see him play much of LW or just don't have many viewings

 

[leaflover]

I don't think I would swap if I were Columbus. I'm not as high on Patrick as most but i'm yet to attend(going to Dec 3rd against Rockets and 4th vs Blazers) a Wheat Kings game this season.

It's an interesting idea though so full marks for creating a potential trade that's worthy of discussion.

 

[canadianmagpie]

That's not true.

They did have it for a brief moment in what ever draft the sedins were in.

All those trades were crazy but they did have the 1st overall in that draft which they later traded.

Technically true. Though it should be clarified that the Canucks have never drafted a player 1st overall. I'm sure those early Canuck years would have been better to watch Gilbert Perreault instead of Dale Tallon.

 

[Viqsi]

I want the breakdown of those "facts". Game by game, position by position of his career.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/burden-of-proof

You claim he is better at LW. The popular observation is that he has done much more at center. You are the exception. Going against orthodoxy is fine and welcomed... IF you have the information to back it, rather than just "I feel that that's not right, and you'll have to do all the research for me if you want to counter with what everybody else sees."