Horse McHindu
They call me Horse.....
- Jun 21, 2014
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- 2,650
Proposal: Canucks 2017 1st (1st or 2nd overall) for Pierre Luc Dubois
- Thread starter Horse McHindu
- Start date
Horse McHindu
They call me Horse.....
- Jun 21, 2014
- 9,668
- 2,650
If that's the case then I would prefer Dubois, given Dubois' style (i.e. two-way player as opposed to sniper/playmaker).
My hope is that the Canucks trend towards building a defensive-first defensive-oriented team that has the potential to burn teams on turn-overs, smart positional play, etc.
I want the Canucks to trend towards building this way for the following reasons:
1) To counter their future competition (Edmonton, Calgary, Winnipeg) that are burgeoning offensive power houses.
2) To play to the Canucks' inherent strengths. Canucks should be set in net for the long term, whether it's Markstrom (that pans out) or Demko (that pans out). I believe atleast one of these guys will be among the best goalies in the league.
3) Canucks already have some young decent two-way centers in Horvat, Sutter, and Gaunce. I think adding a guy like PLD adds to that symmetry and style. If you bring in a guy like PLD, as opposed to a Nolan Patrick, the expectation right from the get go is that this teams' success will lie in shutting down the opposition while being skilled enough to capitalize on turnovers, special teams, positional play, etc. If you bring in a guy like Patrick, the Canucks might have a misguided notion that they'd be able to compete with future Edmonton and Winnipeg in terms of offense. As a result of Patrick here, the Canucks might make it a priority to start looking for scoring wingers to play with Patrick, as opposed to getting a guy like PLD, and then focusing on increasing the quality and depth on defense.
Anyway, that's just my line of thought (whether it makes sense or is non-sensical).
tony d
New poll series coming from me in June
Doesnt make any sence at all. Patrick is expected to be much better than Dubois. Theres no reasoning behind this at all.
Horse McHindu
They call me Horse.....
- Jun 21, 2014
- 9,668
- 2,650
If that's the case, then Columbus can add (assuming that it is the #1 overall that we get).
Again, Benning's overall plan is likely very different from mine, but here's my plan and thought process:
Given the Canucks' current and future strengths (goaltending), weaknesses (offense), and attributes that have the potential to strengths (i.e. two-way depth down the middle, young quality defensemen), I believe the Canucks' future success lies in becoming a defensive-oriented team that is capable of burning opponents on turnovers, smart positional play, and special teams.
If the Canucks draft a guy like Patrick for instance, it might give the Canucks a misguided notion that they'd be capable of competing with the likes of Edmonton and Winnipeg in terms of offense. As a result of having Patrick, the focus might turn to finding wingers, etc., instead of upgrading the defense.
The overall result could be that the Canucks aren't good enough offensively to compete with the future juggernauts of this team, and aren't defensively good enough to contain them. In a weird sort of way, I think the Canucks could end up being a 'jack of all trades' type that team that doesn't particularly excel at anything.
By contrast - if you bring in a guy like Pierre Luc Dubois (+) for the 1st overall pick, the dynamic changes. You look at your roster and see the following:
-PLD (projected good two-way center as a low end 1st or high end 2nd line level)
-Horvat (projected good two-way center at the 2nd line level)
-Sutter (good two-way center at the 3rd line level)
-Gaunce (projected good two-way center at the 4th line level)
Markstrom/Demko (atleast one of which will be an extremely good goalie)
Given this make-up, the "vision" and "direction" of this team becomes distinct and obvious. Hyper-target quality defensemen, and implement a defensive style system moving forward. There would be absolutely ZERO confusion as to where the future success of this team would lie. There would be ZERO aspirations of trying to misguidedly compete with the likes of Edmonton, Winnipeg, and Calgary in a gun-slinging affair.
Again, that's just how I would do things. If PLD straight up for the 1st overall is laughably lob-sided, then CJB adds on their end.
Horse McHindu
They call me Horse.....
- Jun 21, 2014
- 9,668
- 2,650
It was to my understanding that Nolan Patrick (and obviously, the subsequent #2 pick after that) are a clear-cut level BELOW Matthews/Eichel/Laine. That's just from what I read. It's to my understanding that the pecking order is....
1) McDavid
2) Matthews/Eichel/Laine
3) Patrick
Am I wrong on this? Given that Dubois was drafted right after Matthews and Laine, that's why I figured that a PLD for #1 overall or #2 overall pick might be a comparable (or, a situation where CBJ would have to add to their PLD package).
#1 for Laine = Winnipeg laughing (i.e. Laine is better, and is one year more mature.....and from what I see, is almost a CURRENT NHL Superstar anyways).
Horse McHindu
They call me Horse.....
- Jun 21, 2014
- 9,668
- 2,650
Are the optics of trading a #1 overall in an "ok" draft for a #3 overall in a deep draft still considered bad?......especially if the team with the #3 pick (a pick that is one more year mature by the way) is willing to add pieces? Just saying.
would rather just keep Patrick, Valardi or Lilijgren.
no sense in doing 1 for 1 swap like that at this point. unless a trade heavily favors our side we don't move a top 2 pick.
no sense in doing 1 for 1 swap like that at this point. unless a trade heavily favors our side we don't move a top 2 pick.
Breakers
Make Mirrored Visors Legal Again
Meh....
Prospects Value's are constantly changing and PLD hasn't exactly been lighting up the scoresheet.
He was pointless in his 5 pre-season games and was -4
Plus he isn't PPG in QMJHL so far this year.
Prospects Value's are constantly changing and PLD hasn't exactly been lighting up the scoresheet.
He was pointless in his 5 pre-season games and was -4
Plus he isn't PPG in QMJHL so far this year.
izzy
go
Viqsi
"that chick from Ohio"
Your theory seems to lean on the idea that by the time it's time to do the trade, PLD will be looking even more like a future top-quality two-way center. The problem is, that's what we're after as well. So, honestly, the only circumstances under which you want to do this dictate that it only makes sense for us if Patrick is going to be noticeably better than PLD in point production (at which point we lean on Wennberg for two-way stuff and hope for the best). And that's kind of self-defeating w/r/t feasibility (EDIT: AND that tacks on the additional assumption that it would in fact be Patrick we're getting, rather than Liljgren - we've got a metric ****ton of young badass blueliners and do not need another 
- or, barring that, that Vilardi or someone else turns out to be a similar Obviously Better Scoring Prospect).
It's an interesting thought exercise, but I don't see a realistic deal happening.
- or, barring that, that Vilardi or someone else turns out to be a similar Obviously Better Scoring Prospect).It's an interesting thought exercise, but I don't see a realistic deal happening.
Patrick is a better prospect than PLD. Higher potential. Would have easily gone 3rd this year if he was 5 days older. He actually projects as a 1C, whereas PLD is being forced into that potential role. PLD has looked much better at LW than C through his CHL career.
The Canucks have never had a 1OA. If they get it, trading it away, after the Patrick hype, would look so ****ing bad for the fans. Nevermind the fact that Patrick looks better than PLD
Breakers
Make Mirrored Visors Legal Again
That's not true.
They did have it for a brief moment in what ever draft the sedins were in.
All those trades were crazy but they did have the 1st overall in that draft which they later traded.
landy92mack29
Registered User
so much wrong in this post
As for the potential trade Patrick and Dubois are both going to be elite #1 C's who play a complete 200ft game so if the Canucks do get the 1st pick they should just take Patrick because they're basically washes. Now if it's the 2nd pick or lower they'd be very smart to move it for Dubois as he'll be better than anyone in the 2017 draft other than potentially Patrick.
Hah you should watch either of them play. Patrick is way better. Saying this as a CHL fan.
That said, I could see Benning pulling an awful trade like this because he makes big, awful trades bi-annually.
https://youtu.be/hVK9lmovY_8?t=3m30s
Bob Mackenzie suggests Patrick is more of a #2 C in the mold of Ryan Kesler. I would think Patrick is above average defensively with higher offensive upside than PLD.
I would recommend watching a few Wheat Kings games. Patrick is insane on the boards/in corners and is creating chances every shift. Dubois is a battler, but he's nowhere near as good at the little things.
He's slower and simply doesn't have the fluidity to his game that Patrick does.
Killer Orcas
Registered User
Defenseman take longer to develop so taking Timothy Jijegren and pairing him with Juolevi would be the right pick. Then starting 2018 we take a centre with our pick and when Sedins contract is up in 2019 we have dollars for UFA's to fill in areas of need. If all goes well we could be contenders in 2019/20. By then Demko should be here as well to team with Markstrom.
There is sense to this. The 2018 and 2019 drafts will have better forwards. Makes sense to take a defense this year. The Draft Lottery might mess that notion up though..
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