To get the guy we keep turning downWhy does CAR consider this?
To get the guy we keep turning downWhy does CAR consider this?
Oilers 2024 1st, Bourgault or Holloway plus Ceci should be enough then.What did Ristolainen cost? 1st + 2nd + Hagg
What did Trouba cost? 1st + Pionk
Both RDs with 1yr left of their deals. Notice a common theme here?
Pesce is certainly better than Ristolainen. Trouba probably held more value at the time, but knowing he would only sign in NYR, the Jets still got value for him.
If Pesce is traded, I think the Canes can expect a 1st + plug in D, maybe more with an extension.
$4M for 1yr of Pesce is a friggin steal.
Because the Canes get something in return if they can't resign Pesce ?Why do the Canes want Girard?
I’d say $6.25-6.75M x 8 is the ballpark.
Wouldn’t touch $7.5M with any sort of term.
rattled response? lol thats funny and completely false.Delusional if you don’t think Holland wants to go out on a high note, and not be known as an over the hill GM who couldn’t succeed with McDavid. This is Holland’s last and final hurrah.
I do appreciate the rattled response though
JJ is not getting Pesce +.This thread - like so many others - seems to have descended into chaos.
I can't say the same for Kevyn Adams - but i certainly DON'T see JJ Peterka as some kind of untouchable piece. Let's not turn into Rangers fans where we are labelling every somewhat valuable player in our organisation as being untouchable & offering complete garbage for other teams' valuable assets. It's embarassing.
IMO our current untouchables are Skinner (NMC), Thompson, Tuch, Cozens, Dahlin, Power, Samuelsson, Levi. That's it. Others might be added in future - but not yet.
If Carolina offered Pesce + for JJP - I'd certainly listen.
We already know that there won't be room for all of our young forward players/prospects - even as early as next season.
If we traded JJP - we'd still have the following 10 players competing for the top 9 roster slots :
Skinner, Thompson, Cozens, Tuch, Greenway, Mitts, Krebs, Quinn, Savoie, Kulich.
That's assuming we trade Olofsson, allow Jost/Hinostroza to walk & also assuming we acquire a legit 4C to play between Girg/Okposo, bumping Krebs up into the top 9.
***
With that said - it certainly seems simpler for us to move 13OV for a guy like Pesce, before using the pick on another prospect for people to get overly attached to.
Pesce for 13 serms like a fair framework for a deal - with Carolina likely flipping that pick immediately for forward help.
This was in response to a previous post (#280)... By a Carolina fan.JJ is not getting Pesce +.
You say that as if there will be no other offers and Colorado are doing them a favourBecause the Canes get something in return if they can't resign Pesce ?
Nobody said Peterka was untouchable .. he is just untouchable in this deal because Pesce is not the type of defenseman that commands that type of return.This thread - like so many others - seems to have descended into chaos.
I can't say the same for Kevyn Adams - but i certainly DON'T see JJ Peterka as some kind of untouchable piece. Let's not turn into Rangers fans where we are labelling every somewhat valuable player in our organisation as being untouchable & offering complete garbage for other teams' valuable assets. It's embarassing.
IMO our current untouchables are Skinner (NMC), Thompson, Tuch, Cozens, Dahlin, Power, Samuelsson, Levi. That's it. Others might be added in future - but not yet.
If Carolina offered Pesce + for JJP - I'd certainly listen.
We already know that there won't be room for all of our young forward players/prospects - even as early as next season.
If we traded JJP - we'd still have the following 10 players competing for the top 9 roster slots :
Skinner, Thompson, Cozens, Tuch, Greenway, Mitts, Krebs, Quinn, Savoie, Kulich.
That's assuming we trade Olofsson, allow Jost/Hinostroza to walk & also assuming we acquire a legit 4C to play between Girg/Okposo, bumping Krebs up into the top 9.
***
With that said - it certainly seems simpler for us to move 13OV for a guy like Pesce, before using the pick on another prospect for people to get overly attached to.
Pesce for 13 serms like a fair framework for a deal - with Carolina likely flipping that pick immediately for forward help.
This thread - like so many others - seems to have descended into chaos.
I can't say the same for Kevyn Adams - but i certainly DON'T see JJ Peterka as some kind of untouchable piece. Let's not turn into Rangers fans where we are labelling every somewhat valuable player in our organisation as being untouchable & offering complete garbage for other teams' valuable assets. It's embarassing.
IMO our current untouchables are Skinner (NMC), Thompson, Tuch, Cozens, Dahlin, Power, Samuelsson, Levi. That's it. Others might be added in future - but not yet.
If Carolina offered Pesce + for JJP - I'd certainly listen.
We already know that there won't be room for all of our young forward players/prospects - even as early as next season.
If we traded JJP - we'd still have the following 10 players competing for the top 9 roster slots :
Skinner, Thompson, Cozens, Tuch, Greenway, Mitts, Krebs, Quinn, Savoie, Kulich.
That's assuming we trade Olofsson, allow Jost/Hinostroza to walk & also assuming we acquire a legit 4C to play between Girg/Okposo, bumping Krebs up into the top 9.
***
With that said - it certainly seems simpler for us to move 13OV for a guy like Pesce, before using the pick on another prospect for people to get overly attached to.
Pesce for 13 serms like a fair framework for a deal - with Carolina likely flipping that pick immediately for forward help.
Lol - i think you need to better understand what type of player Pesce is.Nobody said Peterka was untouchable .. he is just untouchable in this deal because Pesce is not the type of defenseman that commands that type of return.
I've seen you make this arguement more than once:No one is saying Peterka is untouchable. It’s just a fact that young players of his caliber don’t get traded for pending UFAs. If Carolina moves Pesce, they’re getting futures offers. If they don’t want futures, then they can trade them to somebody who does for a win now player. That’s how these trades work.
And isn't the bolded to be taken more than merely in to consideration when discussing these types of moves?This thread - like so many others - seems to have descended into chaos.
I can't say the same for Kevyn Adams - but i certainly DON'T see JJ Peterka as some kind of untouchable piece. Let's not turn into Rangers fans where we are labelling every somewhat valuable player in our organisation as being untouchable & offering complete garbage for other teams' valuable assets. It's embarassing.
IMO our current untouchables are Skinner (NMC), Thompson, Tuch, Cozens, Dahlin, Power, Samuelsson, Levi. That's it. Others might be added in future - but not yet.
If Carolina offered Pesce + for JJP - I'd certainly listen.
We already know that there won't be room for all of our young forward players/prospects - even as early as next season.
If we traded JJP - we'd still have the following 10 players competing for the top 9 roster slots :
Skinner, Thompson, Cozens, Tuch, Greenway, Mitts, Krebs, Quinn, Savoie, Kulich.
That's assuming we trade Olofsson, allow Jost/Hinostroza to walk & also assuming we acquire a legit 4C to play between Girg/Okposo, bumping Krebs up into the top 9.
***
With that said - it certainly seems simpler for us to move 13OV for a guy like Pesce, before using the pick on another prospect for people to get overly attached to.
Pesce for 13 serms like a fair framework for a deal - with Carolina likely flipping that pick immediately for forward help.
I know what kind of player he is. I agree he would fit nice. I just can't think of a defensive oriented dman that brought back that type of young player with JJs upside. I agree he will get a 1st rounderLol - i think you need to better understand what type of player Pesce is.
He's absolutely everything we'd need in a potential top 4 acquisition. You might argue that in an ideal world he'd be younger - but if that were the case he wouldn't come close to being available.
The obvious assumption here is that he'd be willing to sign a reasonsble extension. By reasonsble i don't mean cheap - just not extortionately expensive.
Assuming Savoie or Kulich could step into a sheltered top 9 role sooner or later - I'd really have no problem dealing JJP for Pesce. Especially if Carolina was willing to add.
RE Adams' strategy - you could be right.And isn't the bolded to be taken more than merely in to consideration when discussing these types of moves?
And what I mean is the following: Adams is keeping last seasons forward group together, all are signed except Jost and in yesterday's press conference he said he is working to bring him back as well.
And to be quite frank, that forward group was the central piece to them being the 3rd highest scoring team in the NHL, so Adams has the cap space, the non roster pieces, to play lets make a deal with. It isnt like he has to move any of them to be honest, he can look to UFA, hes getting a D man one way or the other, and i dont see him moving an existing roster piece nor any of the high end prospects, to do it, and clearly his actions to this point solidify that line of thought. The couple of constants with Adams and Granato is "players that want to be here, locker room chemistry, breed longterm success", that's their plan, their goal, and to date they've adhered to it methodically and the results show it is working
That's not to say if a sweetheart of a deal gets put on his desk he won't, but it would have to be one hell of a sweetheart deal, think Pesce re-signed at 5 to 6 mil for 4 to 6 yrs type of deal. And I don't see that happening, do you?
We're not looking for an 8+ mil a season D man here, we're already going to have 2 of those young studs on the roster in Dahlin and Power. Adams is looking for the right RHD, not the flashiest name. And while there are rumors of inquiries on the likes of players such as Hanifin, Pesce, I don't believe for 1 second Adams is going to move any roster forward save Olofsson for those guys. As I said for the reasons above, he doesn't have to.
Krebs would be jettisoned before JJ if this was his motivationRE Adams' strategy - you could be right.
But if we're now at the point where he wants Kulich or Savoie to get NHL ice time - SOMEONE beyond Olofsson will have to be moved out. Never mind some of the other guys knocking on the door such as Rousek or Rosen.
He's also neglected D/G for too long. I'm hoping this is the offseason where he finally addresses it properly.
It's easy to plug UFA names into your lineup for next season - but the truth is that UFAs are rarely worth the contracts they earn & it's especially unlikely a team like ours has success in the UFA market. We've got the assets to acquire the perfect guy - weather its Pesce or someone else - Adams just needs to make that happen.
As i said above - we're in a somewhat unique situation with our current group of young offensive players/prospects.I know what kind of player he is. I agree he would fit nice. I just can't think of a defensive oriented dman that brought back that type of young player with JJs upside. I agree he will get a 1st rounder
It's possible - but i'd assume JJP's value is far greater.Krebs would be jettisoned before JJ if this was his motivation
It really shouldn't even need to be said at this point - but any Pesce proposal would be based on the assumption an extension is worked out.1 yeaf of Pesce for JJP makes sense if the Sabres were a contending team.
The cost to acquire one year of Pesce is too high for where the Sabres currently are. Maybe the Sabres are a year away, or three years away, for this kind of deal.
It really shouldn't even need to be said at this point - but any Pesce proposal would be based on the assumption an extension is worked out.
See, that's where opinions part ways. Your opinion is he neglected defense and goaltending, my opinion is Donny and him took the time to see who they have, if they were going to buy in to the system, what they were working with. This roster was the youngest in the league, time was needed to develop, assess. Adams even publicly stated before last season began that the playoffs weren't the primary goal.RE Adams' strategy - you could be right.
But if we're now at the point where he wants Kulich or Savoie to get NHL ice time - SOMEONE beyond Olofsson will have to be moved out. Never mind some of the other guys knocking on the door such as Rousek or Rosen.
He's also neglected D/G for too long. I'm hoping this is the offseason where he finally addresses it properly.
It's easy to plug UFA names into your lineup for next season - but the truth is that UFAs are rarely worth the contracts they earn & it's especially unlikely a team like ours has success in the UFA market. We've got the assets to acquire the perfect guy - weather its Pesce or someone else - Adams just needs to make that happen.
Or instead he could be proactive - if it leads to the biggest hole remaining on the team being filled?Eventually the Sabres will be in a situation where there are too many NHL ready forwards with legit-top 6 upside. I dont think they need to force the issue until maybe a year before waivers.
Next offseason will probably see a forward moved (one of Mitts/JJP/Krebs) if Kulich is ready for the NHL. Too soon still.
No it doesn't. There are many examples - just look at the big trades which typically happen this time of year.With the Sabres. Not necessarily with another team. Players getting traded with an extension worked out remains the exception.
I'm not even sure why Jokiharju is any deal. He is only 24 and I believe he has two years of team control not one. For sure, it's a major upgrade on D but Sabres are giving up a good 4 or 5 d man. This doesn't solve depth issues on RD at all."former 1st rounder"...and Yakupov is a former 1OA...doesn't mean shit, mediocre d-man at best (and this is as told by some of your own fans)
"2 million dollar 30 goal scorer" who probably ends up with WAY more GA due to complete lack of defensive game...not at all what we need. Negative value asset.
"tore up the AHL" I mean i'd be interested, but 14G 37PTS is definitely not "tearing up" anything...hell he was 9th on his own team.
And in return you want Pesce, 2nd, & our only G prospect worth a damn and who's signed beyond this year? yea, that's a haul of shit