Post-Game Talk: Can we leave Stu in a California Closet?

[Drivesaitl]

Why is Nurse with Bouchard even? That's been proven not to work. Just go with Nurse-Kulak. Something we know works. Walman feels like a good partner for Bouchard. Klingberg was good at least. I guess him and Emberson.

Staples was mentioning how the team has too many lines and pairings that don't know each other and haven't built chemistry. I agree there. Except, Nurse has been with Bouchard and we know that doesn't work. Nurse needs to play with a great skater, for whatever reason. At least he has done well with Kulak. Heck I'd even try Klingberg with Nurse before putting him with Bouchard.

It isn't a matter of the lines not working. Its a matter of having ONLY two forwards, McD, and Drai that ARE working. Its a roster problem more than its a coaching problem.

2yrs ago we got lucky on a Nuge season from heaven. Somehow it happened, a 100pt season. We got lucky on getting Kane when he was healthy and still able to score and put up some pts. We got extremely lucky getting an outlier whacked right out of space career year from Hyman. The regression from that was going to be extreme. Then we got guys like Skinner and Arvid who people figured would be stars here. The error in thinking was that we had a lot of offensive goods when really we didn't With time, fatigue, injury our offensive weapons have regressed to again just being two, and this being far easier to cover when we only have two.

Theres no coaches or line combos that can make gold out of only two forwards going. That just isn't possible. We need Hyman, Nuge, Kane, Skinner etc to find some semblances of their game which to this point they haven't been able to do. Apology to Kane its no fault of his own. But its the orgs fault thinking the magic was going to be here after a year off.

We needed to improve in offseasn and TDL. WE didn't get that. Now we're fairly stuck.

 

[Canovin]

Watch the games. But I’m also self-aware and know I have biases.

Your bias is you claim Bouchard is better Ekholm and Bouchard is the baysitter and Ekholm is the baby because of metrics. I can't agree with that. Watching both, Ekholm is the better defender and I would take 2 Ekholms over Ekholm and Bouchard.

 

[MessierThanThou]

We had Anthony Stolarz at one point. Gave him 5 games and kicked him to the curb I guess.

I was just reading about that. Apparently we could have kept him by making him an RFA if we played him in more games, but the team was adamant about overplaying a declining Koskinen (who had already been signed to a Cup-killing contract) and so we let him walk.

 

[oobga]

haha the base stats:
View attachment 1021731

The advanced stats:

View attachment 1021732

I mean the Oilers likely lose last night with "average" goaltending.
Basically the difference between Edmonton and Colorado are the goalies.

How could we possibly get such a goalie though? It's not like Colorado got theirs for a goalie that was playing even worse than Skinner and 2nd round pick (what we paid for a busted Frederic).

Wait a second....

 

[oobga]

We had Anthony Stolarz at one point. Gave him 5 games and kicked him to the curb I guess.

Sorry, we take no pride in this org in understanding goalies at all. Stolarz may as well been an career ECHLer.

We only have eyes for elite mustaches and shiny UFA's that no one else wants but we never take a moment to understand why.

 

[Dieseloil]

This!! People can shit in Bouchard all they want and often for good reason, but where the f*** is Nurse. Utter failure on thr PK and often no where to be seen leaving Bouchard alone.

It’s both, plus I thought I played well in goal.

 

[foshizzle]

Your bias is you claim Bouchard is better Ekholm and Bouchard is the baysitter and Ekholm is the baby because of metrics. I can't agree with that. Watching both, Ekholm is the better defender and I would take 2 Ekholms over Ekholm and Bouchard.

Nope. That wasn't my claim. My claim was that Bouchard doesn't need a babysitter. I also said Ekholm's numbers are better with Bouchard than anyone else (that may be because everyone else sucks and Bouchard is actually good). Furthermore, I think Ekholm helps Bouchard and Bouchard helps Ekholm because guess what, they are both good d-men.

 

[Canovin]

Nope. That wasn't my claim. My claim was that Bouchard doesn't need a babysitter. I also said Ekholm's numbers are better with Bouchard than anyone else (that may be because everyone else sucks and Bouchard is actually good). Furthermore, I think Ekholm helps Bouchard and Bouchard helps Ekholm because guess what, they are both good d-men.

Ekholm will help any defender out there. You put Bouchard with any defender outside of Ekholm, you get the real Bouchard.

 

[MessierThanThou]

Not to go back to Stu, but it really is startling how stupid his apologists are when you factor in that they usually ignore his stats (or cherry-pick good stretches while ignoring the bad) and claim to go off the "eye-test." Like what f***ing eye test would ever suggest Skinner is a good goalie? He's clearly slow, he's constantly out of position, he struggles with rebounds, he struggles tracking the puck, he's a large person who looks small in net, and he makes awkward movements that resemble a flopping fish, hence all the comical screenshots.

This is why I compare his apologists to flat earthers. It's a stubborn, relentless, unyielding stupidity in the face of all logic and in brazen defiance of common f***ing sense. I do not, did not, and will never respect their opinions on the sport of hockey. These are the kind of people who comprise cults and are scammed out of their life savings: human bots who lack the ability to think critically.

 

[Drivesaitl]

My biggest issue is if I suit up for goalie. The women will literally be all over me. I'm married. I don't need that

Check out this chic behind me giving me the look
View attachment 1021748

You gotta a laugh out of me on this one. What movie is that? Glad you're feeling better.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Sorry, we take no pride in this org in understanding goalies at all. Stolarz may as well been an career ECHLer.

We only have eyes for elite mustaches and shiny UFA's that no one else wants but we never take a moment to understand why.

Seriously, Dustin Schwartz is one of the biggest cancers on this team.

And there's a lot of them.

 

[foshizzle]

I guess sometimes the Analytics and the seen him good kind of align. I love goaltending and have always been really into analyzing it and say since Dryden, Cheevers, Tretiak etc. Just a fascination for me and I did play a bit too. But mostly I just examine the position quite a lot, and I try to focus on skillsets, tendencies. Try to analyze what makes a Quick or Vasi or Roli or Hill work.

55yrs of viewing and studying goaltending, playoffs etc, it become easier to spot goalie strengths, skills, flaws, potential etc. 2yrs ago I was immediately saying Hill was the goalie Knights should be using. Was saying it before the playoffs. He had the right block out big play in net that completed Vegas. he's more the Billy Smith or Ron Hextall that have beat us before. Uses his size, blocks or interferes with east west passes, blocks out a McD from sweeping in on side. They needed that to beat us. Adin Hill was that goalie. Logan Thompson too. But the present day hockey coaches, they don't prefer that kind of goaltending, even though team specifically it can be what you need.

I think metrics and measurements are constantly improving to try to catch all the nuances of the game. There is so much we don't see- and yep- they do align. Sometimes folks can cherry pick stats to favour the narrative- but if you look at whole picture- the skillset, movements, etc you mentioned above- and then confirm with the numbers side- more often then not- you will find alignment there.

To your point above, about studying goaltending, and how it is becoming easier to see strengths, is one of the prime reasons I dont believe in the old adage of "goalies are voodoo". They aren't. They are like any other position. Goalies are voodoo when you dont have a goalie as a scout, you don't study them and their movements, don't understand the position.

 

[CycloneSweep]

My biggest issue is if I suit up for goalie. The women will literally be all over me. I'm married. I don't need that

Check out this chic behind me giving me the look
View attachment 1021748

Shit if you are better than Skinner I’ll be all over you.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Nope. That wasn't my claim. My claim was that Bouchard doesn't need a babysitter. I also said Ekholm's numbers are better with Bouchard than anyone else (that may be because everyone else sucks and Bouchard is actually good). Furthermore, I think Ekholm helps Bouchard and Bouchard helps Ekholm because guess what, they are both good d-men.

Yep. PLus its not like we pay Ekholm a lot. If only we had him more years or maybe he can stil play awhile.

PPG D come along rarely. An org is lucky to land on one every couple decades or so. You take a D like this any time and give them what they need to succeed on back end because the juice up front is well worth it.

But nobody take my word. Ask Drai or McD what they think of having a D like Booch around.

You keep Booch and give him what he needs. you won't find another one.

 

[MessierThanThou]

Seriously, Dustin Schwartz is one of the biggest cancers on this team.

And there's a lot of them.

Speaking of untouchable dead weight, why is Bob Nicholson still there and what say does he have in the organization? Shouldn't he have been made to resign after the Hockey Canada scandal?

 

[Drivesaitl]

Shit if you are better than Skinner I’ll be all over you.

Calm down he's got strepthroat. hehe

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Yep. PLus its not like we pay Ekholm a lot. If only we had him more years or maybe he can stil play awhile.

PPG D come along rarely. An org is lucky to land on one every couple decades or so. You take a D like this any time and give them what they need to succeed on back end because the juice up front is well worth it.

But nobody take my word. Ask Drai or McD what they think of having a D like Booch around.

You keep Booch and give him what he needs. you won't find another one.

It's exactly this type of thinking that led to the Nurse contract.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Speaking of untouchable dead weight, why is Bob Nicholson still there and what say does he have in the organization? Shouldn't he have been made to resign after the Hockey Canada scandal?

No you see we don't care about scandals here.

 

[CycloneSweep]

Calm down he's got strepthroat. hehe

I’ll give him some strep throat alright lol

 

[foshizzle]

Ekholm will help any defender out there. You put Bouchard with any defender outside of Ekholm, you get the real Bouchard.

So, I'm done responding. your post is just false. What Ekholm was in Nashville the last few years is not what he is in Edmonton. Career highs in everything. But, not going to debate this any longer- you are free to have your views.

 

[Drivesaitl]

It's exactly this type of thinking that led to the Nurse contract.

Nurse hasn't really been overpaid on the season. he's rebounded nicely. What you're saying had merit during the Woody years but Woody and Manson were AWFUL to D here with schemes that weren't working.

Not saying back up the brinks truck on Booch but within reason you retain him. Whether they can bridge or longterm.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Nurse hasn't really been overpaid on the season. he's rebounded nicely. What you're saying had merit during the Woody years but Woody and Manson were AWFUL to D here with schemes that weren't working.

Not saying back up the brinks truck on Booch but within reason you retain him. Whether they can bridge or longterm.

Nurse had a small stretch of good play and then he remembered who he was. He's also just not a good playoff player.

As for Bouchard, maybe they need to show him tape of last year?

 

[Canovin]

So, I'm done responding. your post is just false. What Ekholm was in Nashville the last few years is not what he is in Edmonton. Career highs in everything. But, not going to debate this any longer- you are free to have your views.

Ekholm has a career high is because of the McDrai factor

 

[iCanada]

Skinner aside. Does this team employ a shooting coach? We have the worst shooting ability of any good team in the league year after year. Everything blocked. Never even attempting to change the angle of our shots.

10+ years of trying to pass the puck into the net to score, unable to score from distance because we don't even try and don't have any snipers or shooters on our team. Why have we never addressed this? Why do we not have a single f***ing forward on this team who goes out and LOVES to fire the puck at will and LOVEs to pick a corner (like kempe or fialah)? We have NONE. We have had NONE for the McDrai era. Maybe the closes is j skins but he does most of his damage in tight.

85% of this roster can f*** off. Slow, old, incapable of playing with any intensity, incapable of scoring unless spoon fed a tap in from mcd.

Of course we're bad at shooting though - we practice on Skinner.

In practice we probably light the man up like a Christmas tree, then are confused why we can't score on real goaltenders.

 

[foshizzle]

Yep. PLus its not like we pay Ekholm a lot. If only we had him more years or maybe he can stil play awhile.

PPG D come along rarely. An org is lucky to land on one every couple decades or so. You take a D like this any time and give them what they need to succeed on back end because the juice up front is well worth it.

But nobody take my word. Ask Drai or McD what they think of having a D like Booch around.

You keep Booch and give him what he needs. you won't find another one.

Nailed it. He's also just 25 years old- hasn't even hit his prime. Set a playoff scoring record for a Dman. One of the best puck movers in the game. Successfully exiting the zone, neutral zone transition, zone denials are also characteristics of playing defence.