C Jack Hughes - USNTDP (2019 Draft)

[Ezekial]

Help me out with the 8 month difference thing.

Matthews is September 17th, Hughes is March 14th. He was 8 months older in his draft year.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

I think it's a bit premature to pigeonhole Hughes as wing at the NHL level. He's never going to be a physical beast like Matthews or Eichel but he can definitely grow a couple inches and put on some weight. He'll be drafted as a center and given every opportunity at that position.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

He'll be drafted as a center and given every opportunity at that position.

Just like Kane, Marner, Keller, Drouin?

 

[ijuka]

Just like Kane, Marner, Keller, Drouin?

Bad comparables, he's much better than any of these.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Bad comparables, he's much better than any of these.

Kane is a future first ballot hall of famer. He's much better than him?

Anyway, whether that would be true or not, that makes no difference on ability to play center. All these players are much better hockey players than many centers in the NHL. It doesn't mean they have a skill-set that fits the center of the ice.

Some of you are seeing what you want, which is Hughes is the next great center prospect, instead of what he is. A very iffy case to stick at center, most likely a great NHL winger. There's nothing about his game that works better at center than on the wing. In fact, I'd argue some of those others I named had better cases than Hughes to play center.

Size: Wing
Defensive capability: Wing
Defensive effort: Wing
Areas of the ice he occupies: Wing
Face-offs: Wing
Style of play: Wing

 

[Filthy Dangles]

A lot of pedantry over being a C vs a W ITT. If I had to project him as either, it would be winger. We'll see. He'll be special @ whichever one it is.

 

[Daximus]

Kane is a future first ballot hall of famer. He's much better than him?

Anyway, whether that would be true or not, that makes no difference on ability to play center. All these players are much better hockey players than many centers in the NHL. It doesn't mean they have a skill-set that fits the center of the ice.

Some of you are seeing what you want, which is Hughes is the next great center prospect, instead of what he is. A very iffy case to stick at center, most likely a great NHL winger. There's nothing about his game that works better at center than on the wing. In fact, I'd argue some of those others I named had better cases than Hughes to play center.

Size: Wing
Defensive capability: Wing
Defensive effort: Wing
Areas of the ice he occupies: Wing
Face-offs: Wing
Style of play: Wing

You think Hughes is bad at faceoffs? I think he's pretty damn good in every game I've watched he wins a lot of draws. He's actually really underrated defensively, which is another myth about small players. Not 6'3? That means he can't defend. I'll grant you the fact that Kane was never a great defensive player but Hughes is pretty damn good defensively. He's no Bergeron but he can hold his own.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

You think Hughes is bad at faceoffs? I think he's pretty damn good in every game I've watched he wins a lot of draws. He's actually really underrated defensively, which is another myth about small players. Not 6'3? That means he can't defend. I'll grant you the fact that Kane was never a great defensive player but Hughes is pretty damn good defensively. He's no Bergeron but he can hold his own.

I do think he is bad on face-offs, not that it matters right now if the rest of his game holds up. Look at McDavid. I think Hughes is bad defensively because I think he's bad defensively. I said nothing about his height. I'm not throwing about a myth. I'm commenting on his defensive play. I've watched the guy play like 15 times in the last season. He looked pretty bad defensively. Disinterested, turnovers in bad areas, double shifting himself because its junior hockey, and then even against junior players he can get thrown around by bigger players. And actually, I think Kane is an underrated defensive player. Its not his specialty, but he's not worse than average there from the wing.

In fact, I thought Clayton Keller was actually rather good defensively, and had the game to stick at center. Didn't matter, he immediately went to wing once he reached the NHL. All these guys immediately went to wing. I'm sure Hughes will start at center because of the tide in favor of it. Thats the narrative, he's a future 1C and all that, but I think eventually he'll be moved to wing if he doesn't show a very different type of game. The NHL is not junior hockey. You aren't going to lessen the impact of your team and one of your best players just to fulfill an idea of where a player should be playing. If he can't play center, he'll eventually be moved to wing. I don't currently see anywhere near a center game from Hughes.

 

[Daximus]

I do think he is bad on face-offs, not that it matters right now if the rest of his game holds up. Look at McDavid. I think Hughes is bad defensively because I think he's bad defensively. I said nothing about his height. I'm not throwing about a myth. I'm commenting on his defensive play. I've watched the guy play like 15 times in the last season. He looked pretty bad defensively. And actually, I think Kane is an underrated defensive player. Its not his specialty, but he's not worse than average there from the wing.

In fact, I thought Clayton Keller was actually rather good defensively, and had the game to stick at center. Didn't matter, he immediately went to wing once he reached the NHL. All these guys immediately went to wing. I'm sure Hughes will start at center. Thats the narrative, he's a future 1C and all that, but I think eventually he'll be moved to wing if he doesn't show a very different type of game.

I do think Keller could be a center if he wanted to. Was he not moved to the wing at BU? There are plenty of centers in the NHL that I wouldn't consider amazing defensively. Scheifele is a good example. He's not horrible but his skillset is far more suited to the offensive zone and he started at the wing before the Jets moved him to center. Sometimes the offence they transition and generate from being a center is far more important then how they cover defensively. Seguin is another example of a guy that works at center because of the offence he generates and how good he is in transition compared to his defensive game. None of those guys are black holes defensively but it's the way the generate offence and transition from being there that keeps them at center.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I do think Keller could be a center if he wanted to. Was he not moved to the wing at BU?

I'm not sure. I didn't watch much of him at BU. I think he played wing at the World Juniors. I remember the year prior in the NTDP he played center, and did quite well.

 

[Daximus]

I'm not sure. I didn't watch much of him at BU. I think he played wing at the World Juniors. I remember the year prior in the NTDP he played center, and did quite well.

Sorry edited my post before you got your reply in. I think Hughes will get a serious look at center in the NHL and a lot will be up to the team that drafts him for sure. But with how good he is in transition from the middle of the ice and his speed he has a very very good chance of being one of the guys that sticks.

 

[JeffreyLFC]

Hughes need to improve his defensive game/faceoff/get stronger to become a permanent center in the NHL. It will come with time.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Hughes need to improve his defensive game/faceoff/get stronger to become a permanent center in the NHL. It will come with time.

And maybe different genetics and body type. But again we'll see and people are making too big a deal of this.

 

[Breakers]

I do think Keller could be a center if he wanted to. Was he not moved to the wing at BU?

Nope
He was center at BU full-time ,
Him and Forzbecka-Karlsson or however you spell it were 1A 1B essentially.

 

[Daximus]

Nope
He was center at BU full-time ,
Him and Forzbecka-Karlsson or however you spell it were 1A 1B essentially.

I don't know why I keep thinking that..

 

[93LEAFS]

Crosby height at the 2005 Combine
"5'10.3"
True Story.

He also weighed about 30 pounds more than Hughes. It’s more how slight he is, than how short he is.

Yeah Crosby, Giroux, Briere, Koivu, Drury, Savard, Oates, Yzerman, Dionne, Mikita, Clarke..
There's been plenty of good small centers in the history of the league.

In the immortal words of Nigel Powers.
"It's not about the size mate, it's how you use it."

Only two of those are currently in the NHL, and only Briere, Drury and Koivu played post lockout. You can’t look at what guys played like in the 70s. It simply isn’t relevant to the modern NHL.

 

[Daximus]

Only two of those are currently in the NHL, and only Briere, Drury and Koivu played post lockout. You can’t look at what guys played like in the 70s. It simply isn’t relevant to the modern NHL.

I still think that just because a guy is 5'11 or under that everyone instantly says that he will never be a center at the NHL level is absurd. It's a speed game now and Hughes will be faster then a majority of centers in the game when he hits the NHL. The rest depends on the team that drafts him and how well he develops in other areas but many are writing him off before he even hits the NHL simply because Kane and Marner couldn't hack it at center.
Giroux, Crosby, Trocheck, Point, Duchene, Johnson, Jost, Pageau. There are plenty of 5'11 or shorter guys who have recently played C and has excelled there. Obviously if you have someone who is similar skill level and taller and plays C they will be there over them.

 

[93LEAFS]

I still think that just because a guy is 5'11 or under that everyone instantly says that he will never be a center at the NHL level is absurd. It's a speed game now and Hughes will be faster then a majority of centers in the game when he hits the NHL. The rest depends on the team that drafts him and how well he develops in other areas but many are writing him off before he even hits the NHL simply because Kane and Marner couldn't hack it at center.
Giroux, Crosby, Trocheck, Point, Duchene, Johnson, Jost, Pageau. There are plenty of 5'11 or shorter guys who have recently played C and has excelled there. Obviously if you have someone who is similar skill level and taller and plays C they will be there over them.

He needs to get significantly bigger (in weight) to handle the NHL grind. Its a must to be able to consistently win battles down low. Crosby and Duchene are both over 195 pounds. The only guy who has a build, similar to Hughes is Point. Everyone else is clearly over 180.

In my opinion, it has less to do with height, than his frame and the current demand for players to win battles down-low on both ends. That's the demand guys like Marner, Keller and Kane don't meet, and its partially fueled by the fact they are all sub-170.

 

[Daximus]

He needs to get significantly bigger (in weight) to handle the NHL grind. Its a must to be able to consistently win battles down low. Crosby and Duchene are both over 195 pounds. The only guy who has a build, similar to Hughes is Point. Everyone else is clearly over 180.

In my opinion, it has less to do with height, than his frame and the current demand for players to win battles down-low on both ends. That's the demand guys like Marner, Keller and Kane don't meet, and its partially fueled by the fact they are all sub-170.

The kind of game that Brayden Point plays is what he should aspire too. Point was always a part of the Warriors PK but he didn't really start excelling there until his final years. With Hughes speed he needs to be like Point, hungry for pucks. You don't have to be big and strong to just take the puck from other players, it's a finesse thing. Guys that can't hack it at center tend to be timid when it comes to playing in the corners and puck retrieval. You can be 6'7 and 225 and lose puck battles to smaller players all the time. It's all about using stickwork and finesse to outwork your opponent. Hughes is capable, it's the effort level that is the only thing that will stop him.

 

[Gravity]

Welcome to Montreal Jack Hughes

 

[byeyimini]

Matthews is September 17th, Hughes is March 14th. He was 8(6 actually) months older in his draft year.

Wikipedia and eliteprospects say Jack was born May 14th.

 

[Ezekial]

Wikipedia and eliteprospects say Jack was born May 14th.

My bad... read May, typed March, I edited my post to correct the months after I thought sept-March sounded less than 8

 

[Konk]

Just like Kane, Marner, Keller, Drouin?

Huh? Kane hasn't played C since Honeybaked. He played RW to Gagner in London and RW to Carman, Rust, etc. at the NTDP.

Hughes has always played center.

 

[bigdog16]

Kane is a future first ballot hall of famer. He's much better than him?

Anyway, whether that would be true or not, that makes no difference on ability to play center. All these players are much better hockey players than many centers in the NHL. It doesn't mean they have a skill-set that fits the center of the ice.

Some of you are seeing what you want, which is Hughes is the next great center prospect, instead of what he is. A very iffy case to stick at center, most likely a great NHL winger. There's nothing about his game that works better at center than on the wing. In fact, I'd argue some of those others I named had better cases than Hughes to play center.

Size: Wing
Defensive capability: Wing
Defensive effort: Wing
Areas of the ice he occupies: Wing
Face-offs: Wing
Style of play: Wing

Pre-draft yeah Hughes is better than Kane, Marner, Drouin, Keller. Kane never played center. I think a reason Marner switched to wing was because there wasnt really an immediate need for him to play center in Toronto. Drouin doesnt move well enough to be a center. And Keller is probably a bit too perimeter to play center, although i could see him switching over as his career goes forward. Hughes is a better skater than all of those 4 mentioned, and the game is turning into a skaters game. I think he could be the guy to break the stereotype that only big and strong guys can play up the middle

 

[ijuka]

Kane is a future first ballot hall of famer. He's much better than him?

Regardless of what happened after, Kane wasn't considered a great 1OA prospect. Kane wasn't even playing in NTDP u-18 as a u-17 player and it's hard to name even one thing he was better at at Jack's age(maybe shot?). How good Jack is at his size is unprecedented so past comparisons don't apply. You judge him in a vacuum.