LSCII
Cup driven
They went with a guy with limited upside but NHL experience over their own youth, so why is that not valid?
And no comment on Pandolfo?
Bruins invited Ville Leino to training camp/Matt Fraser signed (1yr, two way)
- Thread starter YNWABoston
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They went with a guy with limited upside but NHL experience over their own youth, so why is that not valid?
And no comment on Pandolfo?
LSCII
Cup driven
Missed Hamilton and Soderberg
Soderberg was 27 years old when he came here, FFS. And even then, he didn't crack the lineup in the playoffs until what? Oh yeah, no other options were available. I mean Kasper ****ing Daugavins got 6 playoff games to Carl's 2 total games, and you want to hold up Soda as some great example of Julien being open to dressing young guys? I don't think you thought this one through, but hey, that's just me...
Missed Hamilton and Soderberg
Carl was like 27, and the refusal to use him lead to the Daug getting playing time.
I do think given the choice between young or vet on an equal level, Claude will go with vet...but don't think Soderberg is is a good example.
Most of those guys listed forced their way up...and the expectation of the kids now (Khoklachev, Spooner, etc.) will be the same...however my concern is if for some absured reason, say Spooner and Ville have identical camps, we'll end up with Leino in the line up and Spooner not getting the NHL reps that IMO he needs.
LouJersey
Registered User
Weren't most of those guys bottom line or pairing guys to start? I'm trying to think when a spot for a position was close and he went veteran...
I think Claude does it the right way starts em slow.
Dubi Doo
Registered User
- Aug 27, 2008
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Leino was solid for the Sabres before the lock out. He played good on the third line as a possession player. After the lock out, he had injury problems and got sucked in to the black hole that was the Buffalo Sabres. He had a lot of pressure on his shoulders, and there were rumblings that some of the team was unhappy that the free agents received so much money.
The sour environment combine with the hostility towards Leino took its toll. I think a change of scenery would be good for him. He was awesome for Philly before coming to Buffalo, and played solid for Buffalo while they were competing for the playoffs.
The sour environment combine with the hostility towards Leino took its toll. I think a change of scenery would be good for him. He was awesome for Philly before coming to Buffalo, and played solid for Buffalo while they were competing for the playoffs.
LSCII
Cup driven
Artemis
Took the red pill
Every rookie who ever plays in pro sports either makes the team because of an injury to an established player (Wally Pipp anyone?) or because he proves himself better. There is no team in any league that simply hands a job to an unproven kid. Even Lou freaking Gehrig. Julien is no different than any other coach in the NHL, and that he's constantly being accused as such makes no sense. The Bruins have had just as many if not more young players on their teams under Julien than anyone else. The way some around here go off, you'd think the Bruins' average age is over 35.
32 games of NHL experience. Thirty two.
Pandolfo was a bad idea, although somehow I don't see warming the press box and playing in a whole 18 games as being a big issue, and they thought highly enough of the guy to keep him in the organization.
Which is exactly why I have zero problem if one of these guys gets a bare min contract and sits in the press box and rotates into a few games when needed. Quite honestly I'd rather the kids get meaningful minutes in the A.
You better list all the players who got injured to make sure we all get it. Sometimes I wonder if these players either a) injure themselves on purpose to get the younger players into the lineup or b) They're all so old and fragile that an opposing player skates by them causing the injury.
Artemis
Took the red pill
Soderberg was 27 years old when he came here, FFS. And even then, he didn't crack the lineup in the playoffs until what? Oh yeah, no other options were available. I mean Kasper ****ing Daugavins got 6 playoff games to Carl's 2 total games, and you want to hold up Soda as some great example of Julien being open to dressing young guys? I don't think you thought this one through, but hey, that's just me...
I wouldn't put Soderberg in the "young" camp, but as to his not playing much, even Soderberg has said he wasn't ready to play in the NHL when he came over.
MTaylorJ1
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The issue of course being, Daugavins wasn't ready to play in the NHL either at that time and offered up zero upside.
LSCII
Cup driven
If a rookie plays as well in camp as a guy like Leino, who do you think is getting the spot?
You also talk about every team waits for injury before giving their kids a shot, but that's not true at all. Chicago let a lot of veteran players leave after their cup win in 2010, and they replaced them with young guys and prospects. You know why? Because that's what you need to do in a cap world. You need young, cheaper talent to come up and take over the bottom of the roster spots while they gain NHL experience. It paid off for Chicago too, if you recall? Instead of giving those spots to young guys though, the Bruins are bringing in stiffs and reclamation projects because they may not make as many rookie mistakes, even if they don't offer the upside.
LouJersey
Registered User
Yeah I'd pretty much go with the Ex SEL leading goal scorer over a guy the Sens waived...
Soderberg was 27 years old when he came here, FFS. And even then, he didn't crack the lineup in the playoffs until what? Oh yeah, no other options were available. I mean Kasper ****ing Daugavins got 6 playoff games to Carl's 2 total games, and you want to hold up Soda as some great example of Julien being open to dressing young guys? I don't think you thought this one through, but hey, that's just me...
I didn't really consider him an option at all for the playoffs in '13 because he'd only been in North America for a month and played 6 games of North American hockey. I guess look where those decisions got us though, right? Game 6 of the SCF, pfffft what a failure.
Despite age, I used him as an example of a guy who was in the B's system who was given a fairly prominent role with little experience and thrived this last season, like Bourque but actually good.
Who gives a f#$ the reason guys get in the lineup? The organization has done a terrific job of integrating players from the system into the lineup and developing them into core pieces. And guess what, it's worked. I mean unless you consider having a young core and a team that's been a legitimate contender for what the past 5 years and should be for the next few more a failure?
But hey Jay Pandolfo played 18 games ... so ....
MTaylorJ1
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I think they're way too conservative with their regular season lineups, and it hurts come playoff time when things aren't working. They don't have another look to offer anyone if a matchup (like say Montreal isn't going to fight your enforcer .....ever) dictates you need it.
Campbell played 82 mediocre games at center this year. Thornton played 64 games with a massive fork sticking out of his back. Paille played 72 through concussions.
Spooner played 23. Fraser 14, Florek 4.
On a team that won its division by 16 points, and its conference by 8.
Artemis
Took the red pill
Except that Soderberg said it wasn't simply a talent issue, but a conditioning one. He was overweight and couldn't keep up with the pace of play.
And as Double AAAA noted, they still made the SCF final, and with a healthy Bergeron and Chara, have as good a chance to win as Chicago, IMHO.
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LouJersey
Registered User
Sadly I remember the later three's contributions during the year more than the former.
That's a really good point.
LouJersey
Registered User
LSCII
Cup driven
I didn't really consider him an option at all for the playoffs in '13 because he'd only been in North America for a month and played 6 games of North American hockey. I guess look where those decisions got us though, right? Game 6 of the SCF, pfffft what a failure.
Despite age, I used him as an example of a guy who was in the B's system who was given a fairly prominent role with little experience and thrived this last season, like Bourque but actually good.
Who gives a f#$ the reason guys get in the lineup? The organization has done a terrific job of integrating players from the system into the lineup and developing them into core pieces. And guess what, it's worked. I mean unless you consider having a young core and a team that's been a legitimate contender for what the past 5 years and should be for the next few more a failure?
But hey Jay Pandolfo played 18 games ... so ....
He played 18 games in a lockout shortened season. Bourque played 18 as well. Pretty much took up that spot for the entire year with two guys who flat out stunk, no?
The reason why matters because it demonstrates a track record. People here love to talk about how open Claude is to young guys, but it's simply not accurate. He's open to playing the youth only when he's forced to. So bringing in veterans to camp to compete against the youth, coupled with his track record, tells me exactly what to expect. That's why it matters. It's just a philosophical approach that I don't agree with. Chicago was able to win a cup, drop some high priced vets, fold young guys into those spots, and then win another cup because their young guys got experience. Here, we only get the young guys if there are no other options, and we're in cap jail on top of it all. Seems to me that the solution is to move on from some overpriced vets and let the youth play, but that's just me. Young = less expensive.
Frustrating definitely because they ended up having to rely on Florek and Fraser in MAY, without getting those needed reps in October...just like a couple of guys here were preaching all throughout the year.
Therick67
Registered User
Are the nets larger in Sweden? Round instead of squared?
Soderberg would have scored there
The Dog-man should have been put to sleep after that game...
MTaylorJ1
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My problem with Double AAAA's point is that we've resided in by far the weaker conference, and we have a core (Bergeron, Chara, Rask/Thomas) that wasn't really indoctrinated in the Julien Youth Development program.
My concern is that 4-5 years from now, we'll look back and rather than saying wow, we won a cup and made a finals, we'll be saying, how did we only win 1 cup with that group in a year Thomas played out of his freaking mind.
Artemis
Took the red pill
Are the nets larger in Sweden? Round instead of squared?
Soderberg would have scored there
Or he might have been panting and leaning on his stick at the other blue line.
Bergeron and Chara are healthy and the Bruins win, IMO. But injuries are part of the game, 10x that in the playoffs, and there's no use crying over upended lactose.
MTaylorJ1
Registered User
- Sep 20, 2006
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Frustrating definitely because they ended up having to rely on Florek and Fraser in MAY, without getting those needed reps in October...just like a couple of guys here were preaching all throughout the year.
Throughout the year? Forget you man. I was preaching that while my lizard brain was still trying to process the Seguin trade.
I still maintain that the organization has fooled itself as to why it's been successful and is doubling down on those mistakes rather than rectifying them. (Hint, it's not veteran grit and punchy goodness. It's elite goaltending and the fact that Bergeron and Chara are Jedi shot differential players)
