Brisson confirms that EP40 dealt with injury which prevented him from Off-season Training.

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Counterpoint: he was weak which caused him to develop knee pain in the first place (sorry but I refuse to call patellar tendinitis an “injury”)
Really?

He was overplayed in spring 2023 garbage time

He trained super hard in summer 2023, leading to

Putting up a 100+ point pace while being in the conversation for Selke in the fall of 2023

At which point he developed acute tendinitis in his right knee in the winter of 2024, as a result of being overplayed in the spring of 2023, when many of us pointed out the deep stupidity of such a move, because this is not a video game, overplaying players leads to overuse injuries

The lack of strength training in the summer of 2024 was a result of the mistreatment of the acute tendinitis by Canucks "medical" staff in February 2024 which lead to chronic tendonitis; instead of inflammation he is now also dealing with scarring of the tendon which can only be removed thru surgery. Except there is probably so much scarring done by now that the knee will never be nearly as strong as it was before

Along with the concerted propaganda campaign character assassination we are seeing led by the house "media", parroted by certain "fans", one could imagine his confidence is taking a beating from being unable to use full leg strength

it's ok that many posts ignore the reality of this and post putrid bullshit, it's the internet, it may not be as good as toxic, but I luuuuuv @putrid bullshit almost as much
 
Really?

He was overplayed in spring 2023 garbage time

He trained super hard in summer 2023, leading to

Putting up a 100+ point pace while being in the conversation for Selke in the fall of 2023

At which point he developed acute tendinitis in his right knee in the winter of 2024, as a result of being overplayed in the spring of 2023, when many of us pointed out the deep stupidity of such a move, because this is not a video game, overplaying players leads to overuse injuries

The lack of strength training in the summer of 2024 was a result of the mistreatment of the acute tendinitis by Canucks "medical" staff in February 2024 which lead to chronic tendonitis; instead of inflammation he is now also dealing with scarring of the tendon which can only be removed thru surgery. Except there is probably so much scarring done by now that the knee will never be nearly as strong as it was before
What’s your source for the detail about scarring? I haven’t seen that anywhere and can’t find anything via Google
 
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What’s your source for the detail about scarring? I haven’t seen that anywhere and can’t find anything via Google
I'm certainly not telling you that

You will know that I am wrong about the scar tissue when Petey does not have surgery on his right knee once his season is over
 
enjoying this mega thread tbh, Canucks won’t have this big of a thread for a while,

800 posts already, got people from all over the board joining in.

Grab a drink a quick snack , you don’t wanna miss this
 


As suspected, timeline went something like this :


- Pettersson started getting tendinitis last year
- played through it during 2nd half and playoffs
- he thought the best action was to rest through the summer and not overly train
-came to camp not in the best shape and of course no leg strength from lack of training ( pissed off Miller)
- cant gain that strength training during the season
- unsure if he is still going through tendinitis
- will need a full off-season of training to get back to where he was

He's healthy now, its been half a season, no excuses
 
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Why wouldn't EP just tell people this himself? With everyone all over him about his play in the last calendar year why not just be honest and let people know? I don't think people would say he's making excuses I think they would say that makes sense. There has to be a significant reason someone goes from a 100 pt player to a 50 pt player.
 
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Just watched the HNIC panel spend 10 minutes talking about Pettersson's lack of confidence and his poor decision making.

Those fools don't realize that he had a shortened training camp because he was resting from his tendonitis.

If only they knew this, they wouldn't be wasting time trying to figure out why he's been playing poorly.

Even McDavid would be playing like this if he had a shortened training camp.
 
Did EP ever talk about what kind of training he did over the summer?

If you have a bum knee it's not like you can't work around it... he's got access to the best trainers in the world. If he couldn't skate he could have done rehab in the pool or he could have worked on his upper body strength.

I'm baffled. I can't remember anyone who's dropped off this bad except Huberdeau.
The last and only journalist who asked Petey about his training was Botch.
I think back then he asked what Petey was going to do to get his strength up and he said he was more concerned with getting faster.
 
Why wouldn't EP just tell people this himself? With everyone all over him about his play in the last calendar year why not just be honest and let people know? I don't think people would say he's making excuses I think they would say that makes sense. There has to be a significant reason someone goes from a 100 pt player to a 50 pt player.

He did… just not in those words, and half the board talked about it. Then you have people who didn’t even believe he was hurt last season when it was obvious. He up to the day it came out he was hurt they swore he wasn’t hurt. Now they can’t be wrong again and are sticking to whatever they can.
 
Why wouldn't EP just tell people this himself? With everyone all over him about his play in the last calendar year why not just be honest and let people know? I don't think people would say he's making excuses I think they would say that makes sense. There has to be a significant reason someone goes from a 100 pt player to a 50 pt player.


Pettersson did say he was hurt in the year end presser. Management got pissed off because they said he wasn't hurt. They were shocked he said it.

Now, with the fate of his career in the GM's hands, he can't say it. He will not risk pissing them off again. Hell, there was even an article he was upset at Brisson for disclosing his injury details this year (iirc).

He will toe the company line because that's what these foolish managers expect of him, for whatever reason. He's stuck.
 
Pettersson did say he was hurt in the year end presser. Management got pissed off because they said he wasn't hurt. They were shocked he said it.

Now, with the fate of his career in the GM's hands, he can't say it. He will not risk pissing them off again. Hell, there was even an article he was upset at Brisson for disclosing his injury details this year (iirc).

He will toe the company line because that's what these foolish managers expect of him, for whatever reason. He's stuck.
Why would management be pissed that he was honest about an injury?
 
Yzerman beat the Nucks in the playoffs years ago on basically one leg. He was all over the place in that series. As an aside Petey isn’t picking up any speed on his turns.
He also played with like a ton of hall of famers. He had guys like Hull, Chelios, Shanahan, Frederov, Lidstrom around him.
It’s one of those, pass any of them the puck and they will score situation.

Because they don't consider tendinitis an injury.

They thought he was making an excuse.
It’s going to be sad if there is long term damage to his knee because of this, you really hope that he can bounce back with a healthy offseason.
 
Agree with shutting Pettersson and Hughes down and letting the rest for next season. This season was a writeoff.

We need these two 100% healthy if these guys are our go to moving forward. No need to jeopardize their health any further.
 
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That is correct. He never provided any direct testimony on whether Pettersson was injured. So there is no conflict in evidence, or choice between direct testimony and rumours.

You mean to tell me that Pettersson confirming in May of 2024 that he was injured in the 2023-24 season should be taken as Pettersson confirming in February of 2025 that he is currently injured unless we prove otherwise? This is shockingly stupid logic and I almost don't know how to respond to it. And this is ignoring the fact that Pettersson directly spoke about his knee in September of 2025 where he said the knee was fine.

Its such a stupid premise on many levels but absolutely ignores the fact that injuries typically, and are expected to, heal overtime. If someone states they are injured at a given time, it would be beyond stupid to assume they remained injured for like 10 months after that time based on this initial statement. No one would ever think this.

It is incredible to me, the mental gymnastics you will go through, in order to somehow paint a picture where, as of today, we have both rumours that Pettersson is not injured, and direct testimony to the contrary. And that just doesn't exists and it is 100% irrelevant that Pettersson confirmed he was injured in the 2023-24 ten months ago.

And again, he may in fact be injured, and this wouldn't be terribly surprising to me.

I don't recall him citing it as a decline in his performance. I recall him disclosing the injury without any commentary on whether it caused his poor performance.

What base state are you talking about? My position last season, which I restated probably a dozen of times because posters continued to strawman me, was that on a balance of probabilities I didn't think an injury was the predominant cause of Pettersson's poor play. I have no idea what "reset" you are referring to, and frankly, I don't even know what your point is here. Again, the idea that Pettersson's statement from May of 2024 on his health in the 2023-24 season "carries over" all the way to February of 2025 (despite Pettersson's further comments on the subject in September 2024) is shockingly stupid logic.

And clearly he was right and I was wrong on that one! Or so it would at least appear.

But the reason I doubted the rumour wasn't because I dismiss all rumours as being not credible, or that I dismiss Dhaliwall as never being credible, it was the context of this rumour. And this was clear if you read the following part of my post which you seem to have conveniently not quoted:

"No one should take these rumours seriously. It’s almost as bad as reading too much into who they are taking out to dinner.

This management team has a reputation for not leaking information, and who a team wants to draft is extremely confidential given that it had real work implications in terms of pick trades. And plus, Dhaliwal’s sources are agents who at best are just speculating here.".

But obviously Dhaliwal has good relationships with agents including Brisson, so the same logic of doubting the credibility of a rumour from Dhaliwal on a draft pick selection doesn't exist here.

And listen, I don't even feel strongly either way as to whether Dhaliwal is correct that Pettersson is not injured. Again, I wouldn't be overly surprised if he was injured. What was surprising to me is that Dhaliwal was so emphatic about it. And I mentioned you as you typically weigh heavily Dhaliwal rumours.

I think its pretty clear that management knew there was an injury last year with Pettersson. Tochett acknowledged this in the end of year press conferences. Like, there is no world where somehow only Pettersson knew, and not the coaching staff or management. The most obvious explanation to the "disconnect" is that management/coaching don't disclose players injuries, they let the players decide whether to disclose these injuries. Some players do, some players don't. That's how you end up with management or coaching not disclose and injury, and then a player disclosing it. I don't think there is much to read into it beyond that.

I do agree that the parties' very well may disagree as to the severity of the injury, or how much it should or shouldn't affect Pettersson's play or his off season training.

Again, and I have stated this multiple times, it does appear that there is a disagreement between management and Pettersson in terms of how Pettersson handled his off season training.

Here is Patrick Johnston's quote on it who interviewed Rutherford:

“Rutherford said he didn’t know if the possibility of a trade ignited Pettersson’s willingness to sign a new deal.”

How is this an implication? Seems clear that JR wasn't willing to speculate one way or another. So there wasn't any contrary primary testimony in this evidentiary debate,

How can you still not understand my argument? Its not difficult, and you are going to extraordinarily illogical lengths to try to catch me in a contradiction that doesn't exist.

I generally prefer direct testimony to rumours. This is a logical decision. When the decision was between Brisson (direct testimony) and Friedman, Servelli and Dhaliwal (rumours), I preferred the former.

In the case of Dhaliwal's rumour that Pettersson is not injured there has not been any contrary direct testimony notwithstanding your wild mental gymnastics. So thhe above preference doesn't apply. There is no contradiction.


What a mealy-mouthed post by you.

Your position: He "may in fact be injured", but look at Dhaliwal saying he's healthy!

Brisson said he had been injured last year. Pettersson confirmed the injury in camp. That's 7 months of a nagging knee injury. Further, 1 year of impaired speed data. Neither one has said that the knee is now fixed.

You say it's "stupid logic" to expect a nagging injury to still be nagging. Ok... How absolutely idiotic would it be to assert a nagging injury is healed when nothing has materially changed in the player's play? I'd call that conclusion braindead.

In the year end presser, Lalji asks Pettersson about the decline in his production. Pettersson says he suffered a knee injury in January to explain it. The frame is the decline.

So to recap:

1. You called my conclusion that Dhaliwal's intel re: Willander was legit "illogical". You were wrong.

2. You initially challenged my premise that there is likely a disconnect between management and player re: injury. You were wrong.

3. You held up management as an irreproachable authority. Wrong again.

4. Pettersson himself explains his decline in production with his knee injury. The cause. You missed it.

5. JR left the door open on an unflattering negotiation. Pettersson too was "holding his cards close". Both outline opposition, not mutual understanding (Brisson). You're wrong here too.

The insider rumours just bury you further.

Hell, CAR returned as the destination with the recent Pettersson trade rumours. That must be pure coincidence too eh?

At the 4 Nations, Pettersson was icing his knee. Another coincidence?

The people who are attempting to dunk on you here, IMO, are doing it for absolutely the right reasons. You have been inaccurate regarding Pettersson almost the whole way through, but have argued vehemently for those inaccurate positions.

Few are misrepresenting your statements. You're just too far gone to walk them back completely.
 
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Just looking for examples around the league:
Can someone explain what happen to Hubreadau and why he suddenly dropped off?
And is there another elite caliber player that dropped off, but bounced back again? (Pls don't say MacKinnon)

Just trying to see if there's another example out there, and how probable will EP40 go through this and come back as a 90/100pt player again? Or will this be first time in the history of NHL if he does actually make a turnaround?
 
Surgery for tendonitis is a TERRIBLE idea. If his tendonitis progressed to a significant degenerative tendon, he would have faaaaaar more dysfunction. If I was part of the medical staff I'd advocate for him to be shut down in order to properly strengthen and accept load into his knee again. It's not like he's even making a difference out there.
 

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