Hit the post
I have your gold medal Zippy!
In a few years - having "another Hamhuis" is hardly a bad thing in any event.
Bravo Benning. The D is pretty much rebuilt.
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In a few years - having "another Hamhuis" is hardly a bad thing in any event.
Pavel96
Registered User
- Apr 7, 2015
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Haven't heard how bad it is. Just keep hearing how much better it would have been had we not reached for this pick.
Can we really compare Virtanen to Tkachuck? Seems like we reached for Virtanen and Tkachuck would have 'fallen' to us.
Wisp
Registered User
- Nov 14, 2010
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are you fantasising or just being optimistic? hamhuis was quite the dynamic scorer in his CHL draft year himself.
Compare the two's draft year.
WHL 62 13 46 59
OHL 57 9 33 42
Pretty similar. Good CHL scoring for D means NHL calibre puck moving. Most of the guys we think as "Stay at home" (Hamonic, Vlasic, Hamhuis) in the NHL were CHL scorers.
I think OEL is a little optimistic. Hamhuis calibre seems about right. And we'd be lucky if he was - Hamhuis was a top pairing, shut down d-man for a long time.
Raistlin
Registered User
- Aug 25, 2006
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the TSN crew that also said Edmonton was going to take a D at #3? Right after Chia said there are no #1D in the draft? Why would any GM do that to the confidence of his ideal top pick by imposing a ceiling on them? Oh wait, Benning and his always yapping mouth said the same thing! Imagine how Olli feels when he discovers his new GM clearly does not see greatness in him?
Most posters know that Juolevi is a good player, but we are lacking everywhere, and our only offensive engines are 36, we have a relatively young D core that is serviceable after the Gudbranson deal. Now we have exactly 1 possibly elite offensive option in Boeser. That's it. The only way towards respectability for our forwards is by signing Stamkos, good luck doing that with 28 other teams eyeing the same carrot.
In this situation, we need BPA, and clearly, no matter what media says other teams are favoring, Juolevi is NOT BPA. You take an Elite forward, which is more projectable and develops quicker. Or you do a trade and maximize your assets, good GMs make it happen consistently, moving contracts was supposed to be extremely hard, you didn't see Holland saddled with Datsyuk's contract now? what did Benning promise after completely botching the TDL and trading #33? He's going to recoup draft picks today, he sure changed his tune pretty quickly.
Clearly, Benning tries to do all that, and clearly he fails to do so despite his best efforts. There are some people that is honest and trusting, those people manage ice cream trucks and gets all the kids' love. Unfortunately, you are competing with 30 other GMs that are smart and tactical, in a cutthroat corporate environment where every advantage has to be immediately seized, you cannot afford to be simple Jack. FINE, be true to yourself and stay out of the fray and draft yourself a powerhouse, like Poile, Holland, McPhee, but for gods sake, stop telling everyone about your simple plans!!! OMG, how did we go from Gillis the guy that tries to screw everyone, to Dim Jim? Is Aqua blind? Or does he simply want to marionette everything from the dark and is content with his dummy management?
As a passionate fan, we see the best way forward is a complete rebuild. So no, management doesn't want that, okay, retool it is, but... you need deft management of your resources to accomplish a feat like that. How are you going to manage a retool with a fool at the helm making mistakes, revealing your plans and missing opportunities? All these thousand cuts kill your fanbase in such an agonizing way that just wilts your passion like creeping gangrene. Whats left are fans that think our D is rebuilt after adding a potential #2D down the line, instead of a franchise guy which was within reach after the season. Its. Just. Beyond. Frustrating.
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Raistlin
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- Aug 25, 2006
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and FYI, Boogaard is the only NHL talent on that cougars team, no Dvorak, no Tkachuk and certainly no Marner. Hammer was picked #12, not top 5.
Yes we should follow the Oilers method... Build with forwards and forget about the D.
Cant really use hamhuis numbers in the chl to say juolevi only has his upside.
Hamhuis scored like seth jones in the chl. Hell ekblad put up similar numbers.
Ds develops differently. The positive is the hockey sense.
Juolevi is really really smart.
Hamhuis scored like seth jones in the chl. Hell ekblad put up similar numbers.
Ds develops differently. The positive is the hockey sense.
Juolevi is really really smart.
It's interesting...
We draft Horvat and fans *****
We draft Virtanen and fans *****
We draft Juolevi and fans *****
Fans ***** that we need a big 2 way centre with leadership and top line potential (Horvat)
Fans ***** that we need a offensive power forward forward (Virtanen)
Fans ***** that we need a potential top pairing D man that can do it all (Juolevi)
All three of them have great potential let them develop and let's see what they can be
We draft Horvat and fans *****
We draft Virtanen and fans *****
We draft Juolevi and fans *****
Fans ***** that we need a big 2 way centre with leadership and top line potential (Horvat)
Fans ***** that we need a offensive power forward forward (Virtanen)
Fans ***** that we need a potential top pairing D man that can do it all (Juolevi)
All three of them have great potential let them develop and let's see what they can be
Hit the post
I have your gold medal Zippy!
Not interesting with respect to Horvat considering who we gave up to get that pick (Vezina capable Schneider). It's to be expected.
With Juolevi - it's to be expected (given the anti-Benning bias of which I will admit I have - though hardly without reason).
This is possibly the most skewed analysis I've seen this month.. and that includes **** from reddit
Yossarian54
Registered User
I think you're going to run into issues if you characterise the 'fans' as having one specific reaction to everything.
For instance, I quite liked the Schneider trade and Horvat draft, hated the Virtanen pick, and am wholly ambivalent on the Juolevi pick.
So demanding consistency of message from a group of people who don't have wholly concordant opinions... When you're misrepresenting some of their views in the first place. Yeah, nah.
But sure, I agree with your last sentence.
I actually don't remember that. I remember Bieksa playing horrible and everyone hating on Garrison. I remember being satisfied with Stanton on the team.
I don't even remember breaking the bank for Gudbranson, I thought we traded a guy who will never make it a centre in the NHL and a 2nd round pick for a stud d-man. Sold the farm, how so?
Hit the post
I have your gold medal Zippy!
Stud d-man is a #4 D nowadays?
What's a #4 D worth? To Jim Benning a "2nd round pick".
(actually I'll top that last one - to Jim Benning a career #7 guy [Weber] is a #4 D!)
Ainec
Panetta was not racist
- Jun 20, 2009
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DS7
Registered User
Our defense isn't rebuilt, but we at least have a potential #1D and Elite Goalie in our pipeline for when we need them in 5-10 years time.
Because at the rate our division rivals are improving, I'm not sure our current defense can even catch them. Imagine Sbisa against McDavid and Puuljarvi from Edmonton or against Gaudreau and Tkachuk in calgary...
Because at the rate our division rivals are improving, I'm not sure our current defense can even catch them. Imagine Sbisa against McDavid and Puuljarvi from Edmonton or against Gaudreau and Tkachuk in calgary...
crazychimp
Registered User
Agreed, I honestly wouldn't mind if we drafted another d-man in the 1st in next years draft as well, we should take the opposite approach of the Oilers with building the back-end first, look at the problem they are facing now high end forwards but no d man to help them move the play up the ice and now they're in a position where they'll likely have to pay a huge price to acquire a good d-man.
Well Pool Party wasn't exactly in our control but yea Tkachuk hurts a bit going to Calgary.
My point was their definitely were more than just a few who wanted Nuke at the time... but it's pointless to really go there so nevermind lol.
BPA is who you think it is. Benning and many others didnt like Tkachuk there it's really that simple.
thenextone
Registered User
I think we are starting to get the personnel to have a competent D. I don't think we have the coaching to take it to the next level.
Seems like I'm always pointing this out to over excited fans on other teams, but having a good group of legit top 4 24-30 year old's playing in your lineup now is far more than an impressive prospect pool. From 2001-2015 we've had a strong team built like that, and only needed 1 good dman to crack the team every few years to maintain. There were a few impressive prospect pools that came and went in that time that never amounted to much in the end.
Now, Edler and Tanev are exactly the type of guys I'm talking about. Gudbranson has spent a number of years in the league already, and only last season did he hit a respectable 20 minute average ice time - bare minimum for a good top 4 guy. We'll need to see more of that and how he does as a Canuck. Similar deal with Hutton, who I really like, but it's only 1 NHL season at 20 minutes. His rookie season, but he went the college route so he's on older rookie. Tryamkin was a bright spot to finish last season and there's a lot of upside, but again we've seen so little of him. After that Juoliovi is a few years away and the rest are currently AHL players.
Right now with our D core it looks like we could have some solid depth of dependable defenders, but compared to other teams offense is a huge concern. Edler has never been able to be a 1 PP QB guy, and while Hutton is smooth at getting the puck out of the zone it's not clear if he or anyone else in the system can be any better. And with Tanev, Gudbranson, and Tryamkin, we're loaded up with a bunch of defense first guys.
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