Player Discussion Brady Tkachuk (LW) - Part XI

[Nac Mac Feegle]

Matthew doesn’t seem to care if people like him, Brady does.

Matthew embraces the bad guy roll, Brady does not.

Brady wants everyone to like him, that’s why he cheats for goals. Brady plays hockey for the cheers, Matthew plays hockey for the emotion.

Brady can’t Channel his emotion, Matthew can.

I dunno. While we do overrate Brady a bit on here, I don't think any of us can say what's going on in his head or heart, or what he really wants. The kid isn't stupid. He grew up watching he dad and uncle play pro. He knows a 200 foot game is how you win a championship.

Perhaps we should lay a chunk of blame on ourselves. The organization and fans are so insecure that we throw money at these kids before they've proven anything, and shower them with love and pump their tires to the point no one can see clearly through those rose-colored glasses. We made teenagers out to be rock stars (and have already started it with Yak!!)...then we wonder why they don't give 100% when they get their bag at age 20/21. We see it in Greig, Pinto and Kleven, too...all of them are too comfortable and regressing, yet they haven't proven a thing.

 

[Tuna99]

I dunno. While we do overrate Brady a bit on here, I don't think any of us can say what's going on in his head or heart, or what he really wants. The kid isn't stupid. He grew up watching he dad and uncle play pro. He knows a 200 foot game is how you win a championship.

Perhaps we should lay a chunk of blame on ourselves. The organization and fans are so insecure that we throw money at these kids before they've proven anything, and shower them with love and pump their tires to the point no one can see clearly through those rose-colored glasses. We made teenagers out to be rock stars (and have already started it with Yak!!)...then we wonder why they don't give 100% when they get their bag at age 20/21. We see it in Greig, Pinto and Kleven, too...all of them are too comfortable and regressing, yet they haven't proven a thing.

As a fan I see there lots of “it’s not them it’s us” out there

Brad Marchand said it best to a Bruins fan online who said about the Bruins Cup “we won a Cup” and Marchand said “you didn’t win shit, we the players won the Cup”

The players kinda hate us, so does the media. Ottawa fans are the most disrespected group of fans in the NHL, dont self hate

But we are entering an ugly time to be a fan, brother will turn in brother, media will blame the fans. You’re a good fan, so am I.

 

[Big Muddy]

Those people who wanted to trade Alfie were the loud mouths who thought we needed a rugged North American captain to win. They would have traded Alfredsson for Conroy, Roberts and Brady Tkachuk too.



And come on no one really wanted Chara gone or blamed him when he left we all knew why.



Spezza he wanted a change himself, the people who didn't like him are the same ones who think Brady is the ultimate captain.

Once again, you’ve missed the point. The post was about fan reaction (some, not all of course, & not sure why something so obvious needs to be mentioned) and how media seems to carry water for the corporate message.

I think you misunderstood my initial post because of your zealous anti-Brady campaign (you assumed I was defending Brady) and now you are just flailing about.

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

Once again, you’ve missed the point. The post was about fan reaction (some, not all of course, & not sure why something so obvious needs to be mentioned) and how media seems to carry water for the corporate message.

I think you misunderstood my initial post because of your zealous anti-Brady campaign (you assumed I was defending Brady) and now you are just flailing about.

I have only ever seen Brady endlessly gassed up by the media and the organization and a lot of the fans.

Are you saying that going forward the media and organization will start being critical of Brady?

 

[BankStreetParade]

I remember in the lead-up to his contract extension the many impassioned pleas about his intangibles and how he "drags his team into the fight"....can we just admit now that was all bullshit? He's a very good player who has significant pros and significant cons to his game. Right now, the cons are sinking the pros and it feels like he's either having a neutral impact on the team's performance or a very slightly negative impact. Either way, there's no one who can say with a straight face that they've loved his game this year. And when you're talking about the captain, you shouldn't be able to say that about him.

Also, people are fed up with bullshit seasons that get derailed before the 20-25 game mark. He's one of the leaders in the organization, alongside Green and Staios, so there's rightfully a lot of judgment being handed out to the people who are the figureheads of this team. Why would anyone be surprised about that? If you're not going to blame the leaders of the team, who are you going to blame?

 

[swiftwin]

It's sad people are turning Brady into a whipping boy. The problems with this team aren't only his fault.

They aren't only his fault, but he's still part of the problem right now.

 

[swiftwin]

I remember in the lead-up to his contract extension the many impassioned pleas about his intangibles and how he "drags his team into the fight"....can we just admit now that was all bullshit? He's a very good player who has significant pros and significant cons to his game. Right now, the cons are sinking the pros and it feels like he's either having a neutral impact on the team's performance or a very slightly negative impact. Either way, there's no one who can say with a straight face that they've loved his game this year. And when you're talking about the captain, you shouldn't be able to say that about him.

Also, people are fed up with bullshit seasons that get derailed before the 20-25 game mark. He's one of the leaders in the organization, alongside Green and Staios, so there's rightfully a lot of judgment being handed out to the people who are the figureheads of this team. Why would anyone be surprised about that? If you're not going to blame the leaders of the team, who are you going to blame?

Brady needs to learn how to be a better leader and understand when the team needs to be dragged into the fight and when it needs a calm steady presence. Sometimes, it seems like he thinks being a leader is the same as being the hero. Sometimes, that works. Think back to that Rangers game where he fought Trouba, and had a hat trick OT winner.

Sometimes, it has the opposite effect, like last night. He took a stupid roughing in the 1st and a pointless fight in the 3rd. The team doesn't need dragging into the fight right now. Effort is not the problem. The team is rattled. They need a calm steady presence, and to stick to the game plan with a hard and disciplined effort. These shenanigans only rattles the team more.

 

[armani]

Here is a likely unpopular opinion, that Tkachuk’s penalty, as ill-timed as it seemed, is exactly what the team needed to wake up, you saw the same with Stutzle following suit and the team scoring 2 after. The team followed their leader and it did bring a change to the game, albeit too late.

The problem is, Tkachuk is too valuable to be doing that, I am not surprised MacEwen has been placed on waivers, we need someone else to step up. This team is missing a Chris Neil (than again are most teams in the league). Someone who can let Tkachuk focus on staying on ice. Nobody on the team was ready or willing to do what was needed to change the complexion of the game.

Tkachuk is not a defensive beast, but you simply don’t trade him when there are other parts that are not ready to answer the bell.

 

[PlayOn]

Here is a likely unpopular opinion, that Tkachuk’s penalty, as ill-timed as it seemed, is exactly what the team needed to wake up, you saw the same with Stutzle following suit and the team scoring 2 after. The team followed their leader and it did bring a change to the game, albeit too late.

The problem is, Tkachuk is too valuable to be doing that, I am not surprised MacEwen has been placed on waivers, we need someone else to step up. This team is missing a Chris Neil (than again are most teams in the league). Someone who can let Tkachuk focus on staying on ice. Nobody on the team was ready or willing to do what was needed to change the complexion of the game.

Tkachuk is not a defensive beast, but you simply don’t trade him when there are other parts that are not ready to answer the bell.

This team never plays better than when they are down 2-3 goals in the third period. There’s always a push for a comeback that doesn’t quite materialize.

I don’t think it was because Brady lost his cool.

 

[DueDiligence]

They aren't only his fault, but he's still part of the problem right now.

Of course Brady is part of the problem but so are at least 6 other prominent guys. The thing is that the abuse Brady takes is highly disproportionate compared to those others.

 

[Relapsing]

It bears repeating that Brady has two of the best possible examples of what exemplifies a good captain in Alfie and Giroux. I could not think of better people to showcase the merits of a tenacious, never give up on a play, hard backcheck, leave it all on the ice style of play.

Where does accountability start from, the bottom, or the top?

Yes, multiple people on this team are seriously underperforming. But they don't wear the C, and most don't wear an A either.

Its not abusive to bemoan a captain that doesn't hold himself accountable, or hold himself to a standard of play that would result in success on a game by game basis. It's entirely reasonable to expect that when a captain says "enough of the bullshit excuses", he'll back that up by ridding himself of lazy play and bad habits, walk the talk, and hold everyone on the team accountable as well.

What Brady had to do is ultimately simple: play responsible hockey. If he's incapable of doing so, then what is a fan to do? What's the org to do?

 

[Blotto71]

They’ve already been setting up Brady as the fall guy since last year. Alluding to rifts in the locker room between him and Giroux, Chychrun not meshing with the guys. Even down to Staios only ever talking about the mental reasons this team sucks when it’s clear it’s not strictly mental - there are issues with the roster itself too.

It’s all leading to a “Brady needs to go” conclusion. Unlike a lot of the takes in this thread though, I don’t really blame Brady. He wasn’t put in an organization that was conducive to growth. He does it to himself in some ways, last night was an example of that, but we’ve seen this narrative before.

Star gets traded, star had character issues. The Ottawa Senators though… never their fault. It’s just that everyone wants to leave them, evil players.

I don't think it needs to be about his character. If he is traded and if Staios gets a "superstar" return (a package that reflects BT's "unicorn" status), then really it can just be about making the team better by changing the room. There are deals to be made, I'm guessing, that would fit that narrative.

 

[PlayOn]

I don't think it needs to be about his character. If he is traded and if Staios gets a "superstar" return (a package that reflects BT's "unicorn" status), then really it can just be about making the team better by changing the room. There are deals to be made, I'm guessing, that would fit that narrative.

That’s fine. I’m open to whatever. I like Tkachuk and I want it to work here but I understand what happens on losing teams. And I also understand why a billion dollar franchise has to carefully craft their messaging when a fan fav is potentially on the way out.

I still think he’s become a scapegoat for issues that are much larger, as they always are. I’m not trying to lobby for or against a trade, as always that depends on the return. I didn’t want to trade Karlsson but knowing what we got for him, I would do it again. The return is going to be the determining factor on whether this was a good thing or not.

Mostly it’s just disappointing we are having this conversation regarding one of our stars yet again but what can you do.

 

[Blotto71]

That’s fine. I’m open to whatever. I like Tkachuk and I want it to work here but I understand what happens on losing teams. And I also understand why a billion dollar franchise has to carefully craft their messaging when a fan fav is potentially on the way out.

I still think he’s become a scapegoat for issues that are much larger, as they always are. I’m not trying to lobby for or against a trade, as always that depends on the return. I didn’t want to trade Karlsson but knowing what we got for him, I would do it again. The return is going to be the determining factor on whether this was a good thing or not.

Mostly it’s just disappointing we are having this conversation regarding one of our stars yet again but what can you do.

I think that's a fair felling to have.

If the team is to get better via trade then something of value will need to be moved. Brady certainly fits the bill (and I think it would be the move that resonates the most with those that remain). I don't see anyone other than Stutzle that would command anything like what Brady could fetch - and Stutzle is the only untouchable I see on the team at this point.

 

[Senovision]

They are not trading Brady Tkachuk.
Trading Captains was the kind of crazy manoeuver Melnyk would do.

 

[DueDiligence]

It bears repeating that Brady has two of the best possible examples of what exemplifies a good captain in Alfie and Giroux

Alfie's work effort? Certainly. His on ice antics? Not at all.
And what great things did Giroux accomplish as the flyers captain? No much at all.

 

[Blotto71]

They are not trading Brady Tkachuk.
Trading Captains was the kind of crazy manoeuver Melnyk would do.

Is Brady Dorion's captain or Staios's? Not saying it will happen, but if it does it will be because he doesn't fill the role or play the way the way current management wants. If anything Brady is likely under more scrutiny than anyone else on the team.

 

[Senovision]

They are not trading Brady Tkachuk.

Is Brady Dorion's captain or Staios's? Not saying it will happen, but if it does it will be because he doesn't fill the role or play the way the way current management wants. If anything Brady is likely under more scrutiny than anyone else on the team.

The players that are underperforming are under scrutiny.
Brady is on pace for over 80 points and is the teams leading goal scorer.
And does too many other good things to list.

 

[Blotto71]

Brady is on pace for over 80 points and is the teams leading goal scorer.
And does too many other good things to list.

Look, I'm not of the mind that he MUST be traded. But this team has limited options to effect change. So I'm hoping that someone feels the same as you and is willing to pay an absolute ransom to get him - then Staios will have to make a decision.

 

[Senovision]

Look, I'm not of the mind that he MUST be traded. But this team has limited options to effect change. So I'm hoping that someone feels the same as you and is willing to pay an absolute ransom to get him - then Staios will have to make a decision.

Who are other players on our team that you think we could trade NOT named Brady Tkachuk?

 

[Tuna99]

They are not trading Brady Tkachuk.


The players that are underperforming are under scrutiny.
Brady is on pace for over 80 points and is the teams leading goal scorer.
And does too many other good things to list.

Why would he want to stick around? He’s given 8 Years for nothing. He’s entering his prime, starting a family, he’s going to want to be in a place he can call home, he might force the trade

 

[PlayOn]

Who are other players on our team that you think we could trade NOT named Brady Tkachuk?

Nobody that we want to trade is going to garner us a good return.

We’re just at the point where we can’t really do much more to change the team other than retool. Imagine a convo where you ask Brady to stick around while we sell people off and get worse… I think there’s a 0% chance he has any interest in that.

 

[Erik Alfredsson]

Who are other players on our team that you think we could trade NOT named Brady Tkachuk?

Pinto is the obvious choice. We have a surplus of centers and he's not making this team better at the moment, but has promising potential, a lot of teams would probably see him as a future top 6 center.

Not saying I'd trade Pinto right now, but I'd trade him before Brady.

 

[Blotto71]

Who are other players on our team that you think we could trade NOT named Brady Tkachuk?

Pinto, Batherson, Giroux, Jensen, Chabot (wonder if that would require retention) would bring back various returns that could be okay for the team going forward, but
outside of the first 2 I don't think you get anything but futures and roster dumps.

Greig, Gaudette, Kleven, JBD, Zub (don't know if anyone sees him as anything other than damaged atm) might fetch later picks.

Perron, Amadio, Gregor, and Cousins aren't returning anything. Neither would either goalie at this point.

Would rather not deal Sanderson, and would not deal Stutzle. Would like to see what we have in Ostapchuk.

Just my armchair GM opinion, so pretty much worthless.

EDIT: forgot Norris, or did I? Can't see anyone willing to take him with that contract and injury history - there are no more Phoenix Coyotes anymore.

 

[Senovision]

Pinto, Batherson, Giroux, Jensen, Chabot (wonder if that would require retention) would bring back various returns that could be okay for the team going forward, but
outside of the first 2 I don't think you get anything but futures and roster dumps.

Greig, Gaudette, Kleven, JBD, Zub (don't know if anyone sees him as anything other than damaged atm) might fetch later picks.

Perron, Amadio, Gregor, and Cousins aren't returning anything. Neither would either goalie at this point.

Would rather not deal Sanderson, and would not deal Stutzle. Would like to see what we have in Ostapchuk.

Just my armchair GM opinion, so pretty much worthless.

EDIT: forgot Norris, or did I? Can't see anyone willing to take him with that contract and injury history - there are no more Phoenix Coyotes anymore.

All of that seems to make sense to me fellow armchair GM.
We have a lot of interesting names for sure that could be traded.
Brady and Timmy are the only players I would not like to see traded.