Former Bruins Brad Marchand traded to Florida, Brandon Carlo to Toronto

[Blitzkrug]

I have mixed feelings about keeping Brad, but would have kept him out of sentiment, for continuity and as an example. I am as cold, unsentimental and calculating as they come but still would have kept him.

This I guessed and this I know: Sweeney dealt him at the last minute, and all but gave him away. No bueno.

"Yes but it's a 2027 first!"

There's virtually no chance where the Panthers fall off so hard in the next 2 years where that pick suddenly becomes valuable/lottery worthy.

Ekblad (assuming they re-sign him) and Forsling are only 28, Barkov turns 30 in September, Reinhart is 29, all the supporting guys like Lundell, Luostarinen are all under 30.

Bruins fans don't want to admit it, but Sweeney basically did give him away.

 

[BruinDust]

First off, you don’t know what the proposed AAV was and neither does anyone here.

Second, I think you’re omitting some pretty critical information in your description of said 37 year old.

What do we know?

We know based on the reports that the Bruins had an offer of 2-years, and the Marchand camp wanted 3. Bruins came back to the table with a 3-year offer but the value wasn't what Marchand was looking for. Marchand even tried a face-to-face meeting to try and bridge the gap, but they still said no to his number.

We also know that less than a year ago, Sweeney handed out a 7-year deal to a player outside the organization value at 7.75 million per year. That player was a lesser player than Brad Marchand was then, and a lesser player than Brad Marchand is now.

We also know that his buddy Crosby faced a similar situation in Pittsburgh, and he didn't take a pay-cut on his new 2-year deal. Exact same AAV.

We also know the cap projections have come out since those deals were signed and it's going up over the next 3 years, a lot.

As a fan, I'm going to base my assumptions on Marchand's ask being at minimum what he's making now and was likely higher than that. 7 million per. Maybe 8? From the time their first started negotiations on an extension, the bar has been raised IMO.

He shouldn't be expected to take a pay cut from what he's making now given his level of play this season. Why should he accept less than Elias Lindholm? Certainly, he shouldn't accept less just based on the fact he's older.

Meanwhile, I can see why management didn't want to hand out 6-7-8 million per for his age 37, 38, and 39 seasons. Considering this is a league with just two active forwards who are 39 (OV, Perry) and just two who are 38 (Malkin, Trevor Lewis) and just 5 who are 37 (Crosby, Nick Foligno, Giroux, Kopitar, and Zuccarello).

And they still did right by him, a player with minimal trade protection, and still took a lesser return to send him somewhere that he wanted to be. Keep him on the east coast. The team that has eliminated them from the playoffs the past two years no less. Hopefully that doesn't go unnoticed by future player acquisitions.

And who knows, maybe Marchand goes to market this summer and doesn't find what he's looking for. The door isn't permanently closed yet.

 

[JoeIsAStud]

I hope someone gives Marchand a massive overpayment, good luck to him, I just want the Bruins to stay away and move on.

I wanted Marchand to retire a Bruin, from what Dan says it seems the Bruins made him a fair offer, way more than i would have offered him.

I would not have traded him, because it will kill me to put on a Panther uniform, if that ever happens even..

Marchand is amazing. He has fought father time harder than anyone else i have seen. It really is amazing that he was able to come back from the 2 hip surgeries. His scoring has still been very good this year, but it does feel like his game has slipped.

We are now at the point where the bruins have ripped the Band-Aid off. Should the put it back on in the offseason? Honestly the trade has ruined some of the bruins for life value that was associated with him. I sure would not be comfortable going 3 years with him

 

[jahbrations]

GFor all of those defending management on this one, I don’t want to hear a single f***ing complaint about how Harry Sinden treated players.

It’s just a f***ing business, right? There it is. That’s how we’re running things. You can defend that and agree with it and whatever.

Personally, I think it’s f***ing disgraceful.

Give me a f***in break. They offered him 3 years and he chose to walk away. This pearl-clutching is so disingenuous, as if he’s not making an active choice by walking away from their offer. Sweeney would be crucified if he gave a long contract to an aging, broken down 37 year old player.

It’s hilariously out of touch to pretend that the Bruins are the only ones creating media spin when Elliot Freedman has a direct line to Marchand’s agent, and is parroting his talking points on Hockey Night in Canada.

 

[DKH]

I have mixed feelings about keeping Brad, but would have kept him out of sentiment, for continuity and as an example. I am as cold, unsentimental and calculating as they come but still would have kept him.

This I guessed and this I know: Sweeney dealt him at the last minute, and all but gave him away. No bueno.

Would you have offered him the 3/6.125 (18.375 M) like they did

And they were trying to get a deal done with him - not with someone else

 

[HumBucker]

I dunno. Maybe I'm in the minority here, but I kinda think Carlo looks right in a Maple Leaf jersey.

 

[goldenblack]

1) I have absolute no faith in these numbers we're hearing

2) Brad easily could have stayed here on a 1x6 deal for example, like Patrice was doing near the end. And they'd have given him one every year.

3) If he was going to come back next year, leaking this sort of story is exactly how you'd do it. Would prevent any risk of it looking shady later on

We'll see...

 

[HumBucker]

Amazing story by EF. Marchand met with management himself and offered compromises and they still didn’t budge. That’s why you never give these guys hometown discounts. Bruins clearly wanted to move on from him (which I think was the right move)

Context is important though, re: hometown discounts. The hometown discounts that he, Bergeron and Krejci took, happened at at time when the team was a legit contender and it allowed the team to have more $ for signing depth for a Cup run.

 

[Coach Parker]

This sounds simply like a change to clear out the leadership, allow new leaders to emerge and then bring him back if they want as an 'A' under a new 'C' in the summer.

Bottom line is, they couldn't give term and high AAV on a HHOF player at that age.

Tampa Bay did the same this summer. No one is talking about how poor they are or unhappy the players are there and I'd argue that Stamkos was a bigger move than Marchand.

I love Brad Marchand. #2 right behind Bergeron all time for me. Epic player and HHOF. One of the few guys I'd love to sit and listen to talk the game and share stories.

This team needed a major shake-up and we all knew it. I am critical of Sweeney in many instances (a lot over the last year and especially at the draft table) but this Trade Deadline he got it right IF he offered Brad 3 years.

Then again, is it a real change of culture if the captain is still there?

 

[Mainehockey33]

How about this?

Team’s second leading scorer, pacing for yet another 60+ point season. One of the team’s all time leading scorers.

Part of a leadership core that goes back 15 years and a Stanley Cup.

Old for a professional hockey player. 37.

Dedicated professional and example for every young player introduced to the team.

Coming off injury and hip surgery in the offseason.

Captain of the team. Face of the franchise charismatic media presence.

Is this a guy you’d give three years to? I would. You may not and (to be clear) that’s a fine and reasonable take. But let’s be honest about the decision and not paint it as some faceless hypothetical. There’s more to it than an injured 37-year-old.

Injuries and age will add up, but that’s not even the biggest issue. I think the change in leadership of the team is necessary. I’m ready for McAvoy and Pastrnak to be the guys. I can’t really quantify it, Marchand is one of my favorite players of all time but I’m ready for them to move on from the old core.

 

[Coach Parker]

Injuries and age will add up, but that’s not even the biggest issue. I think the change in leadership of the team is necessary. I’m ready for McAvoy and Pastrnak to be the guys. I can’t really quantify it, Marchand is one of my favorite players of all time but I’m ready for them to move on from the old core.

This was where I was at.

It actually makes sense for this team to give the team over to Charlie and David and then bring Marchand back as an A on the 3rd line in the summer if both parties wanted it.

 

[HumBucker]

We also know that less than a year ago, Sweeney handed out a 7-year deal to a player outside the organization value at 7.75 million per year. That player was a lesser player than Brad Marchand was then, and a lesser player than Brad Marchand is now.

This is a bit apples and oranges though. Lindholm signed in the free agency period, when there are also other teams bidding for his services. Teams are always going to overpay a UFA like that. It's like buying something at a store vs at an auction.

 

[AngryMilkcrates]

Good video

 

[HumBucker]

I'm still trying to understand the return for Marchand. I get that the basic essence of it is, it turns into a 1st if Marchand is healthy enough to play in the playoffs. But the details are: he has to play 50% of the games and the Panthers have to win two playoff series?

So do I have this right? It's a 2nd round pick if:

• FLA gets bounced in the 1st or 2nd round, regardless of how many games Marchand plays
• FLA wins 2 series, both series go to six games, for a total of 12 games played, but Marchand plays in fewer than 6 games (or similar math - 10 games total, he plays < 5 games, etc.)

Which also raises the question, what constitutes "playing in a game"? If he takes one shift and then exits for the rest of the game, does that count as a game played? Does the NHL have a quantified rule for this?

 

[PB37]

I wouldn’t have leaked contract negotiations to paint a narrative that Marchand was being unreasonable in his contract expectations.

I wouldn’t have made up BS about him and Pastrnak hating each other.

I wouldn’t have had public facing arguments between him and two different coaches.

I wouldn’t have lied to the media about their desire to bring him back. If I didn’t think it was best for the franchise and that I felt it needed to go in a direction that didn’t involve Brad Marchand, I would have owned it and said so. I wouldn’t have been a coward about it.

And lastly, I would have negotiated a contract with the team captain to keep him a Bruin for life.

Those are the things I would have done differently.

I gotta disagree here MMB.

- I don't think they painted Marchand in a bad light at all. They disagreed over his value and both sides attempted to compromise but they couldn't get it done. There doesn't have to always be a good guy / bad guy in these situations.

- When did they make up Pasta and Marchand hating each other? That was pure media bs started by a troll. No team is going to risk a rift in the room by making up stories about two of their most important players not getting along. Sorry, don't buy it.

- It wasn't the Bruins fault the NESN cameras caught Monty giving it to Marchand

- Where was the lie? They tried negotiating all season and it failed.

I love Marchand and wanted to see him retire a lifelong Bruin. I think it was important for Marchand too. But it didn't happen and the Bruins decieded to do him a solid and move him to a team on his list that has a legit shot at the Cup again this year. I'm willing to bet they asked him about it before pulling the trigger.

 

[quietbruinfan]

Give me a f***in break. They offered him 3 years and he chose to walk away. This pearl-clutching is so disingenuous, as if he’s not making an active choice by walking away from their offer. Sweeney would be crucified if he gave a long contract to an aging, broken down 37 year old player.

It’s hilariously out of touch to pretend that the Bruins are the only ones creating media spin when Elliot Freedman has a direct line to Marchand’s agent, and is parroting his talking points on Hockey Night in Canada.

Yes Friedman has a connection to his agent. Ok I did not know that. Furthermore, Friedman is Leaf-centric to put it mildly. Thus looking to play up any angle that makes the Bruins look bad. However i have seen no other reports with an offer over three million, which is an offer for ...Jesper boquvist et al- not Brad Marchand.

 

[DKH]

Yes Friedman has a connection to his agent. Ok I did not know that. Furthermore, Friedman is Leaf-centric to put it mildly. Thus looking to play up any angle that makes the Bruins look bad. However i have seen no other reports with an offer over three million, which is an offer for ...Jesper boquvist et al- not Brad Marchand.

I think it was 3 M in candy circus peanuts

I’m stunned Marchand didn’t take the offer with 3 kids

Jesper Boqvist is really good so Sweeney not going over his contact makes sense

 

[quietbruinfan]

This sounds simply like a change to clear out the leadership, allow new leaders to emerge and then bring him back if they want as an 'A' under a new 'C' in the summer.

Bottom line is, they couldn't give term and high AAV on a HHOF player at that age.

Tampa Bay did the same this summer. No one is talking about how poor they are or unhappy the players are there and I'd argue that Stamkos was a bigger move than Marchand.

I love Brad Marchand. #2 right behind Bergeron all time for me. Epic player and HHOF. One of the few guys I'd love to sit and listen to talk the game and share stories.

This team needed a major shake-up and we all knew it. I am critical of Sweeney in many instances (a lot over the last year and especially at the draft table) but this Trade Deadline he got it right IF he offered Brad 3 years.

Then again, is it a real change of culture if the captain is still there?

It was definitely done as part of a culture change. Frankly though he gave it all on the ice, this says management did not think much of his leadership.
Sweeney caused the problem by fouling up the Monty situation, and the roster; so I say it is somewhat unfair.

 

[Number8]

I was wrong anyways ~ appears was offered his contract no reduction, however, he’s still productive and whether it was 7 M or what Lindholm got, or more he wanted they wouldn’t go there

The 3 M AVV for 2 was basically 2 years at his 6 + he gets and Buccigross divided it and said 2 yrs at 3 M (I get it it can be confusing I’ve done it)

Pocket Jacobs gave blessings to do three years at his current contract apparently but that figure was to Brad (I agree) done almost a decade ago and below current market

I’m guessing they will end up 3 & 7?? ~ or he goes somewhere else

I would 2/7 per but see where he lands

Bucci story that’s got Bruins fans upset not correct

All of the talking heads doing players and teams a disservice.

Marner getting ripped for nixing CAR trade. (No Marner fan but would you go play for Robby the Roid if you were his style of player???????)

Bruins getting skewered as cold hearted bastards.

Meanwhile no one, including Friedman, Bucci, etc, were in room or know all details/discussions. Lots of poorly researched speculation going on. As evidenced by some Twitts (my proprietary new name that IMO beats the f*** out of Tweets these days) that have been wrong or entirely misleading.

 

[Sigh]

I'd have given Marchy damn near anything he wanted. But admittedly I'd probably be the worst GM in history.

 

[DKH]

All of the talking heads doing players and teams a disservice.

Marner getting ripped for nixing CAR trade. (No Marner fan but would you go play for Robby the Roid if you were his style of player???????)

Bruins getting skewered as cold hearted bastards.

Meanwhile no one, including Friedman, Bucci, etc, were in room or know all details/discussions. Lots of poorly researched speculation going on. As evidenced by some Twitts (my proprietary new name that IMO beats the f*** out of Tweets these days) that have been wrong or entirely misleading.

Yeh - there is info Charlie Jacobs approved 3 years

Ok it’s 3 years

There is info no reduction in AVV which is $6.125 M

So the base offered is 3 X $6.125 M ~ $18.375

But Buccigross divides the 2 and then 3 into 6.125 M and tweeted out they offered 2 or 3 M

Less then Korpi and Peeke

Because Bruins fans hate Sweeney they suspend common sense and I’m reading they offered 2 M lol

Really folks

 

[Aussie Bruin]

that's the issue. He went directly to management. Sounds like he came down and they didn't budge. They just signed a guy for almost 8 million for 7 years that did nothing for the team. Marchand was an icon. He was the captain. He took a "hometown discount" years ago so they could try to build more pieces. The cap is going up astronomically. They passed (again, fine) then the GM lied about the trade, lied about the door not being closed (if Brad wants to bend over) and then the team put out a hit piece on him about the contract stuff (which cracks me up since people here love to say they don't do media shit like this).

Again, it's their choice, just say we are moving forward without him, we don't think we are best served with him on the team duing this rebuild/retool whatever they are calling it.

I don't see overpayments of other players as reason to go ahead any make the same mistake with someone else, even if they're the captain. Don't believe taking past discounts entitles you to future favors either.

When you say Sweeney lied about the situation, how exactly? I genuinely don't understand what you mean. What was the 'hit piece'? If saying the door is still open is indeed a lie well that's small beer to me. A fluffy statement. Perhaps better to just be bluntly honest but no big deal. What else is a problem?

One of the things I think my perspective is colored by here is that in Australia much less than 1% of pro players in contact sports make it past the age of 35. To do it you've either got to be the elite of the elite, or just have freakishly good luck with injury and a body that has held up really well through all the wear and tear. So this trend in American sports towards more players hanging around well into their late 30s and sometimes even beyond is still rather bizarre to me. Hence why I lean more towards thinking that a guy like Brad has already had a terrific run and there's little problem with leaving it at that.

Regardless, if management really screwed him over, I'd agree that's unfair and bad behavior. I'm just not quite clear as to how they have.

 

[bwunderlich]

The 3 year deal offered whether it is 15 mill, 12 mill, or 10 mill if broken down this way would anger the uber pro Brad crowd?:

Year 1 Year 2 Year 3

15 7 mill 5 mill 3 mill
12 6 mill 4 mill 2 mill
10 5 mill 3 mill 2 mill

I personally would never have offered 3

This seems fair but as GM, I still would not have liked it. 2 year - 6 mill then 4 mill = 5AAV

 

[Number8]

Yeh - there is info Charlie Jacobs approved 3 years

Ok it’s 3 years

There is info no reduction in AVV which is $6.125 M

So the base offered is 3 X $6.125 M ~ $18.375

But Buccigross divides the 2 and then 3 into 6.125 M and tweeted out they offered 2 or 3 M

Less then Korpi and Peeke

Because Bruins fans hate Sweeney they suspend common sense and I’m reading they offered 2 M lol

Really folks

If B’s really were going to go 3x$6.125 ……………….. and any Bruins fan is suggesting they’d go higher??? Yikes.

I love Marchy and will be rooting for FLA (eeeeeeew……. but thats how much I want to thank Brad with my loyalty…. again, yikes) but I’m glad we didnt do the deal. Bruins fans would be eating him alive about halfway through that contract if B’s fortunes didn’t improve and all those injuries finally called in their chits.

 

[DKH]

The 3 year deal offered whether it is 15 mill, 12 mill, or 10 mill if broken down this way would anger the uber pro Brad crowd?:

Year 1 Year 2 Year 3

15 7 mill 5 mill 3 mill
12 6 mill 4 mill 2 mill
10 5 mill 3 mill 2 mill

I personally would never have offered 3

This seems fair but as GM, I still would not have liked it. 2 year - 6 mill then 4 mill = 5AAV

Just wait till he sees what he signs for

This will be a nice read out on the deck in a summer day with a cold beer